fairlycrazy23
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Post by fairlycrazy23 on Apr 3, 2011 20:12:57 GMT -5
I think Krugman is a self delusional nut.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Apr 3, 2011 21:08:21 GMT -5
I'm not discussing national debt, since the national debt ignores the $113 trillion of liabilities we have related to our social programs.
I'm not saying $1 trillion over a 7 year period [$900 bn through Nov 2010 in Iraq spending] in and of itself is insignificant but when looking at a budget, I try and focus on the 80% [over 99% in this case] instead of the 20%.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Apr 3, 2011 21:10:08 GMT -5
Two peas in a pod with the one quoting him... [/size]
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hello fromWarsaw
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Post by hello fromWarsaw on Apr 3, 2011 21:35:35 GMT -5
So you think a Nobel Prize winner is a self delusional nut, but I suppose you think high school grad disc jockey/demagogues like Beck and Rush are geniuses. That's quite a tribute from ignorant pomposities. ;D
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Post by ed1066 on Apr 3, 2011 21:37:11 GMT -5
Jimmy Carter (bigot, anti-semite) Yasser Arafat (terrorist) Barack Obama (megalomaniacal war monger, economic dolt)
Short answer, yes.
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hello fromWarsaw
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Post by hello fromWarsaw on Apr 3, 2011 21:38:35 GMT -5
Do you see Krugman suffering at Will's inane, bought off pomposities on ABC Sunday morning?- worth the price. Will ought to stick to baseball. My brother had him at Trinity- self important doofus.
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hello fromWarsaw
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Post by hello fromWarsaw on Apr 3, 2011 21:45:33 GMT -5
Palin/ Beck 2012!! Ed, thanks for helping, LOL!
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hello fromWarsaw
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Post by hello fromWarsaw on Apr 3, 2011 21:50:22 GMT -5
I suppose you think high school grad disc jockey/demagogues like Beck and Rush are geniuses? ;D
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Apr 3, 2011 21:57:49 GMT -5
The Nobel peace prize is a joke. Ghandi never received one. Hitler got nominated in 39. The Gore and IPCC awards were clearly politically motivated, and incorrect when using science. Obama achieved nothing, yet was awarded. Mr Oil for Food Annan, the UN...do I really need to go on about how much of a joke this prize is???
I'm not a fan of either Beck or Rush.
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hello fromWarsaw
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Post by hello fromWarsaw on Apr 3, 2011 22:23:15 GMT -5
Where were you an expat? I was,almost, in Spain and France, for a couple years each, but ya can't stay really... The Nobel Prize is not a joke. Obama had months to prove he was no Bush- that was enough...didn't have much competition. They do like Dems, most do
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floridayankee
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Post by floridayankee on Apr 4, 2011 7:39:22 GMT -5
The trillion or two of dollars borrowed to finance the wars are legally owed money. Social security and medicare/medicaid debt can be lowered today with the sufficient political will. So it's ok to screw US Citizens out of the money promised by the US Government but not a foreign country? A liability is a legal debt no matter who it's owed to. Sure, it's be easier to screw elderly US citizens because they don't have ICBM's they can use in lieu of payment.
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floridayankee
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Post by floridayankee on Apr 4, 2011 8:06:11 GMT -5
What legal document says the federal govt has to give Aunt Matilda $1400 a month? If a law was passed saying social security outlays could not exceed social security taxes how would that be screwing someone? Liability: An obligation that legally binds an individual or company to settle a debt. Just because congress can write a new law and legally screw Aunt Matilda out of what she is owed means nothing. They can likely declare BK and legally owe nothing to anybody. It's just easier to screw Aunt Matilda because she's not likely to lob explosive ordinance at the white house like China probably would.
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Post by Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ on Apr 4, 2011 8:15:57 GMT -5
Sure, it's be easier to screw elderly US citizens because they don't have ICBM's they can use in lieu of payment.
Ever wonder why the left is so hell bent on disarming the citizenry?
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fairlycrazy23
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Post by fairlycrazy23 on Apr 4, 2011 10:02:25 GMT -5
So you think a Nobel Prize winner is a self delusional nut, but I suppose you think high school grad disc jockey/demagogues like Beck and Rush are geniuses. That's quite a tribute from ignorant pomposities. ;D No they are good at what they do, but I don't think they are economic geniuses.
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fairlycrazy23
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Post by fairlycrazy23 on Apr 4, 2011 10:04:10 GMT -5
I am not really sure that SS is a legal liability; I think the payouts can be changed at anytime, you are not entitled to the money you put it, it is strictly a tax, ultimately to be spent at the whim of congress.
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Post by Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ on Apr 4, 2011 10:09:59 GMT -5
I am not really sure that SS is a legal liability; I think the payouts can be changed at anytime, you are not entitled to the money you put it, it is strictly a tax, ultimately to be spent at the whim of congress.
This is what the uneducated population of the country do not understand. The SS system, when proposed in the 1930s by FDR, only passed Supreme Court scrutiny, because it was argued before them that SS was only a tax and not a retirement program. Later the SC also ruled there is no legal right to receive SS benefits. I forget the SC decision and when it was...someone posted it here some time ago.
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floridayankee
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Post by floridayankee on Apr 4, 2011 12:18:10 GMT -5
I am not really sure that SS is a legal liability; I think the payouts can be changed at anytime, you are not entitled to the money you put it, it is strictly a tax, ultimately to be spent at the whim of congress. You are correct in the sense that a contractual liability cannot be changed without the agreement of both parties involved. With SS, they force you to pay for the carrot they dangle in front of you with no contractual obligation to actually allow you to eat that carrot. But, just like my personal bankruptcy 15+ years ago, just because you can legally get out of paying a debt doesn't mean nobody got screwed.
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fairlycrazy23
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Post by fairlycrazy23 on Apr 4, 2011 14:28:56 GMT -5
I am not really sure that SS is a legal liability; I think the payouts can be changed at anytime, you are not entitled to the money you put it, it is strictly a tax, ultimately to be spent at the whim of congress. You are correct in the sense that a contractual liability cannot be changed without the agreement of both parties involved. With SS, they force you to pay for the carrot they dangle in front of you with no contractual obligation to actually allow you to eat that carrot. But, just like my personal bankruptcy 15+ years ago, just because you can legally get out of paying a debt doesn't mean nobody got screwed. True, there is an expectation (erroneous though it may be) that you are paying in to SS so you will be able to get money back when you are old, so if you don't get what you expected you will certainly feel screwed.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Apr 4, 2011 14:44:28 GMT -5
Not sure how you see it as selfish. I'm pretty darn sure that I'm going to be one of the ones royally screwed in this SS mess. High earning Gen Y...yep - prime candidate for reductions in the future to weasel out of the obligations.
I like how people try to blow it off by saying it's not an obligation of the country to pay SS to the people. Wonder what would happen if an insurance company unilaterally decided to stop paying or reduce the deferred annuity benefits it pays to the policyholders.
For the record, I want to cut ALL spending by the government, including defense spending [as I've said before]. I'm sorry if you see my post as dishonest - I just simply took the total liabilities that are owed, including those that are off balance sheet and divided them by annual defense spending.
I can cut 40% of defense spending and 40% of the SS liability [by adjusting future benefits] and STILL owe nearly $70 TRILLION for social program spending [in addition to the national debt of $14 TR] while paying $600bn a year in defense spending.
What's the answer that you'd like to hear that would bring you to the table? [/size]
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fairlycrazy23
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Post by fairlycrazy23 on Apr 4, 2011 15:00:01 GMT -5
I don't mean to be blowing it off, but stating that is not a definite liability since the government can change it at anytime, it goes more to show why government should never provide these type of services. I don't think governments should have any sizable future liabilities, since this is putting a burden on future tax payers, not current tax payers. And the 'future tax payers' didn't get a chance to vote in the people that created the burden.
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floridayankee
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Post by floridayankee on Apr 4, 2011 15:29:16 GMT -5
True, there is an expectation (erroneous though it may be) that you are paying in to SS so you will be able to get money back when you are old, so if you don't get what you expected you will certainly feel screwed. Every one will feel screwed....those actually expecting to live off their ss check will actually be screwed. Personally, I won't be screwed be cause I'm not expecting it. If I actually do get anything, I'll consider it a bonus check.
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Post by rockeeraccoon on Apr 4, 2011 16:25:53 GMT -5
Social Security will be just fine unless Republicans get their hands on it. Don't listen to them. Yes, the ex-druggie high school grads Beck and Rush are great at what they do, as are Republican politicians: fear monger and lie. For 140 years. Debt at 95% of GDP is much better than a recovery that never comes until we have a world war, like the last time Hooverites were in charge. Bvvvvvvv!
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fairlycrazy23
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Post by fairlycrazy23 on Apr 4, 2011 16:44:54 GMT -5
Social Security will be just fine unless Republicans get their hands on it. Don't listen to them. Yes, the ex-druggie high school grads Beck and Rush are great at what they do, as are Republican politicians: fear monger and lie. For 140 years. Debt at 95% of GDP is much better than a recovery that never comes until we have a world war, like the last time Hooverites were in charge. Bvvvvvvv! WW2 did not end the depression, the allocation of labor during the war was not good for the economy, labor used to produce warships, tanks and other war materiel was not available to produce normal consumer items and destroyed tanks and ships represent real lost capital. The recovery was spurred post war by lowering business taxes and a lessening of uncertainty that had in part caused the great depression to drag on for as long as it did.
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Post by ed1066 on Apr 4, 2011 16:46:06 GMT -5
Social Security will be just fine unless Republicans get their hands on it. Don't listen to them. Yes, the ex-druggie high school grads Beck and Rush are great at what they do, as are Republican politicians: fear monger and lie. For 140 years. Debt at 95% of GDP is much better than a recovery that never comes until we have a world war, like the last time Hooverites were in charge. Bvvvvvvv! Uh-oh, Warsaw you have competition!
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Post by rockeeraccoon on Apr 4, 2011 17:03:29 GMT -5
Republicans rewriting history as we speak! Unbelievable....1984 was correct, just taking a little time to enroll the zombies.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Apr 4, 2011 17:47:01 GMT -5
One in the same if I had to guess. Completely incoherent rubbish that is not substantiated with support. I thought we were only allowed a single log on name. [/size]
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Post by ed1066 on Apr 4, 2011 17:52:27 GMT -5
One in the same if I had to guess. Completely incoherent rubbish that is not substantiated with support. I thought we were only allowed a single log on name. [/size][/quote] I won't come right out and say it, but the posting style is awfully similar - blunt and stupid...
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vonnie6200
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Adopt a Shelter Pet
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Post by vonnie6200 on Apr 4, 2011 17:54:23 GMT -5
One in the same if I had to guess. Completely incoherent rubbish that is not substantiated with support. I thought we were only allowed a single log on name. [/size][/quote] I won't come right out and say it, but the posting style is awfully similar - blunt and stupid...[/quote] I was just going to say welcome back.
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Post by rockeeraccoon on Apr 4, 2011 19:25:29 GMT -5
People who listen to high school grad philosophers are soooo smart!! Most arrogant, deluded, RACIST, fundamentalist, fear mongered, regressive party in the modern world. Here's more from the delusional nut Krugman, who's been right about everything for years while your heroes have given us a depression and idiotic wars, and have now damaged the recovery for political gain only. You would be hilarious is you weren't so tragic: "It's too bad, then, that these days you're not considered serious in Washington unless you profess allegiance to the same doctrine that's failing so dismally in Europe. It was not always thus. Two years ago, faced with soaring unemployment and large budget deficits -- both the consequences of a severe financial crisis -- most advanced-country leaders seemingly understood that the problems had to be tackled in sequence, with an immediate focus on creating jobs combined with a long-run strategy of deficit reduction. Why not slash deficits immediately? Because tax increases and cuts in government spending would depress economies further, worsening unemployment. And cutting spending in a deeply depressed economy is largely self-defeating even in purely fiscal terms: any savings achieved at the front end are partly offset by lower revenue, as the economy shrinks. So jobs now, deficits later was and is the right strategy. Unfortunately, it's a strategy that has been abandoned in the face of phantom risks and delusional hopes. On one side, we're constantly told that if we don't slash spending immediately we'll end up just like Greece, unable to borrow except at exorbitant interest rates. On the other, we're told not to worry about the impact of spending cuts on jobs because fiscal austerity will actually create jobs by raising confidence. How's that story working out so far? Self-styled deficit hawks have been crying wolf over U.S. interest rates more or less continuously since the financial crisis began to ease, taking every uptick in rates as a sign that markets were turning on America. But the truth is that rates have fluctuated, not with debt fears, but with rising and falling hope for economic recovery. " Keep praying to the "confidence fairy". And try to remember, WWII had nothing to do with the end of the depression. It was Taft-Hartley. Unbelievable...
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Apr 4, 2011 19:35:18 GMT -5
Is rockeeraccoon a metaphor for Warsaw?
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