Getting my stuff together

[raeoflyte]

Nov 21, 2018 18:06:18 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Nov 21, 2018 18:03:11 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

I don't know if I'm not typing clearly or if you think I'm arguing for her to stay married.  I'm not saying she shouldn't file for child support.  I'm just not sure how much he's actually going to end up paying. 

Since he has family and probably friends who are likely to buy the sob story, I'm guessing he'll be able to stay rent free for quite a while and keep his care-free lifestyle going.   

His mama spoils him. They will take him back in. Poor, poor Mike. They already feel bad for him since I've become the liberal athiest. Hes a saint for staying married. He will me a martyr when we divorce.

Hugs Sam.  I pretty much figured that was how they viewed it.  And the comment I saw about what a keeper he was that he worked on 1 mat, after 3 years of you busting your ass.  No matter how many (perfectly kind and not calling him out) but obvious posts you have made that you do EVERYTHING around and outside the house.  

[Sam_2.0]

Nov 21, 2018 18:12:47 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

Nov 21, 2018 18:06:18 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

His mama spoils him. They will take him back in. Poor, poor Mike. They already feel bad for him since I've become the liberal athiest. Hes a saint for staying married. He will me a martyr when we divorce.

Hugs Sam.  I pretty much figured that was how they viewed it.  And the comment I saw about what a keeper he was that he worked on 1 mat, after 3 years of you busting your ass.  No matter how many (perfectly kind and not calling him out) but obvious posts you have made that you do EVERYTHING around and outside the house.  

I normally "like" every post on the BOB page to keep people engaged. I couldn't even bring myself to do it on those. He had come home drunk and I was working on the mat. He pushed me out of the way and said he wanted to do it, and insisted that I show him how. I only did to make him leave me alone.

[TheOtherMe]

Nov 21, 2018 18:05:02 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Why the f did I pull his bank transactions. Looking at them makes me want to cry. Up to $200/day for food and drinks. At least, all tabs at restaurants.

Fortunately for him, his student loans will be paid off soon. Mine still have $5k [img src="http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/sad.png" src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/sad.png" class="smile" alt=""]

$200 a day?  Sam, keep track of this spending, too.  The bills should be paid by him.

I'm so sorry.  I hope you kick him out on December 26.  

I'm angry for you.

[justme]

Nov 21, 2018 18:05:02 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Why the f did I pull his bank transactions. Looking at them makes me want to cry. Up to $200/day for food and drinks. At least, all tabs at restaurants.

Fortunately for him, his student loans will be paid off soon. Mine still have $5k

I hope you're not sending one more cent to his student loans!!!

[raeoflyte]

Nov 21, 2018 18:17:22 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Nov 21, 2018 18:12:47 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

Hugs Sam.  I pretty much figured that was how they viewed it.  And the comment I saw about what a keeper he was that he worked on 1 mat, after 3 years of you busting your ass.  No matter how many (perfectly kind and not calling him out) but obvious posts you have made that you do EVERYTHING around and outside the house.  

I normally "like" every post on the BOB page to keep people engaged. I couldn't even bring myself to do it on those. He had come home drunk and I was working on the mat. He pushed me out of the way and said he wanted to do it, and insisted that I show him how. I only did to make him leave me alone.

That's terrible Sam.  I'm so sorry.  You always present him in the most positive light, which says such wonderful beautiful things about who you are.  I hope that your circle there realizes that sooner rather than later instead of being swept up into the martyr-dom that he will spin.  

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Nov 21, 2018 17:32:33 GMT -5 NastyWoman said:

Nov 21, 2018 17:19:47 GMT -5 NoNamePerson said:

I said not to add child support in my papers since son was 16 and just didn't want the hassle in case it came up. Now mind you we used the same attorney so pretty ok on all stuff. But the attorney said if I didn't put some amount judge would not sign off on it. Maybe a state specific thing and long long ago. I said OK and put $50 week paid into court.  So wonder if that might come into play not that he will pay it but it's on record that he owes it. 

So many I's to dot and so many T's to cross but attention to detail eases a lot of crap down the road if that makes sense. Having said that, I have to remind myself that I was just shy of 40 when I divorced and had lots of "living/responsibilities" under my belt. Don't' know how I would have been if in my 20's and two or three kids.

Sam and H have 3 kids though and I believe her oldest is 7yo (or pretty close to that). So she has to add/ask for child support. There are too many future expenses that can't be predicted in raising three kids.  Besides the kids are his too so even if she can do it without his financial input, she shouldn't. If there is enough money for him to party, Sam should have enough to raise her kids and save for her own future as well.

Doesn't matter. People get out of paying child support all the time. 

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Nov 21, 2018 18:05:02 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Why the f did I pull his bank transactions. Looking at them makes me want to cry. Up to $200/day for food and drinks. At least, all tabs at restaurants.

Fortunately for him, his student loans will be paid off soon. Mine still have $5k [img src="http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/sad.png" src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/sad.png" class="smile" alt=""]

Stop paying his students loans. 
Now. Stop it. 

[NastyWoman]

Nov 21, 2018 18:31:32 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

Nov 21, 2018 17:32:33 GMT -5 NastyWoman said:

Sam and H have 3 kids though and I believe her oldest is 7yo (or pretty close to that). So she has to add/ask for child support. There are too many future expenses that can't be predicted in raising three kids.  Besides the kids are his too so even if she can do it without his financial input, she shouldn't. If there is enough money for him to party, Sam should have enough to raise her kids and save for her own future as well.

Doesn't matter. People get out of paying child support all the time. 

Not even dischargeable in BK, so I would go after him. But unlike Sam, I can actually be a cold-hearted B*tch and I would do it even if I ended up in exactly the same place as I was before I made him pay up due to my lawyer fees.

[TheHaitian]

Lord hold the wheels!!!

$1,200/month? $200/day ?

Lord let me bite my tongue before I get my account deactivated.

Girl! WTF?

Lord take the wheels!!! Let me stop before I say exactly how I feel!!!

[NastyWoman]

Nov 21, 2018 18:34:40 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Lord hold the wheels!!!

$1,200/month? $200/day ?

Lord let me bite my tongue before I get my account deactivated.

Girl! WTF?

Lord take the wheels!!! Let me stop before I say exactly how I feel!!!

 . Just a thumbs up is not sufficient for this well written rant

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

Nov 21, 2018 18:34:37 GMT -5 NastyWoman said:

Nov 21, 2018 18:31:32 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

Doesn't matter. People get out of paying child support all the time. 

Not even dischargeable in BK, so I would go after him. But unlike Sam, I can actually be a cold-hearted B*tch and I would do it even if I ended up in exactly the same place as I was before I made him pay up due to my lawyer fees.

I'm not trying to be disagreeable with you specifically. 

I've done this. My XH flat out lied to the judge about how much he makes per month. He refused to work more than 20 hours per week. I seriously get $86/month per child for CS. When I had it garnished against his tax refunds, he manipulated his tax refunds so I didn't get much. 
Then he told my kids that I was stealing his money. That the reason he wouldn't give them the car he promised for their bday was because I said he had to pay child support instead of paying their car insurance. That I, on my teacher salary, am rich and left him broke. That...That...That..
I am a cold-hearted bitch. It doesn't make the money appear. 


A friend of mine's husband flat out refused to get a W-2 job and refused to file taxes. Last I heard, she had a court-ordered $60K lien for arrears against her XH. It's never going to get paid. 

[Sam_2.0]

Nov 21, 2018 18:32:52 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

Nov 21, 2018 18:05:02 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Why the f did I pull his bank transactions. Looking at them makes me want to cry. Up to $200/day for food and drinks. At least, all tabs at restaurants.

Fortunately for him, his student loans will be paid off soon. Mine still have $5k [img src="http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/sad.png" src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/sad.png" class="smile" alt=""]

Stop paying his students loans. 
Now. Stop it. 

They are auto drafted from my acct. I am scared to change anything like that at the moment.

I'll grab the $$ from his acct later.

[justme]

Add a processing fee too and get you something that makes you smile! He prob doesn't know his exact payment anyways. 😉

[Sam_2.0]

Nov 21, 2018 18:34:40 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Lord hold the wheels!!!

$1,200/month? $200/day ?

Lord let me bite my tongue before I get my account deactivated.

Girl! WTF?

Lord take the wheels!!! Let me stop before I say exactly how I feel!!!

Hes on a roll this month. It's only the 21st and hes spent $1200. I excluded the Saturday family donut run and when we went out the other night ($40/total for both).

[raeoflyte]

Nov 21, 2018 18:34:37 GMT -5 NastyWoman said:

Nov 21, 2018 18:31:32 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

Doesn't matter. People get out of paying child support all the time. 

Not even dischargeable in BK, so I would go after him. But unlike Sam, I can actually be a cold-hearted B*tch and I would do it even if I ended up in exactly the same place as I was before I made him pay up due to my lawyer fees.

Sure, so can I.  But they're also stuck together for the rest of their lives.  I'm not going to judge anyone who decides that going after the ex for an extra $200 a month isn't worth the ill-will it will cause.  Or the person who never got her child support owed, and got the ex to agree to letting her claim both kids every year instead of fighting him on it even though it doesn't actually even out.  

If they sucked at finances when you were together and had a reason to want to work with you, there isn't a lot of reason to think that is going to get better after a divorce.  IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT YOU DON'T FILE FOR IT.  But if quality of life doesn't go up by trying to collect on it...I totally get not going after it.  If it were me, I'd just want him gone.  Not angry, just done and not worth the hassle.  

[cktc]

Nov 21, 2018 18:05:02 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Why the f did I pull his bank transactions. Looking at them makes me want to cry. Up to $200/day for food and drinks. At least, all tabs at restaurants.

Fortunately for him, his student loans will be paid off soon. Mine still have $5k [img src="http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/sad.png" class="smile" src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/sad.png" alt=""]

If he is going to keep spending like that, maybe you should file for separation immediately. You can still pretend this might not head to divorce until after the holidays, but it will freeze the amounts you divvy up when it is time for divorce. So if you get a bonus, he might not be able to touch it, and if he runs up another $6k on the credit card, that's all on him. Might at least be worth mentioning to your lawyer.

[Sam_2.0]

It's not only about the money. But I need to be able to do this on my own since clearly I cant rely on him for anything.

We are so lucky my mom does childcare. And I will pay Js next semester of preschool first thing in Jan.

Hes clearly going to come out on the better end of this deal. I know it. Not to mention the inheritance hes in line to get (fucking ridiculous). I just hope he finally steps up to take care of the kids.

[raeoflyte]

Nov 21, 2018 18:47:55 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

Nov 21, 2018 18:32:52 GMT -5 Knee Deep in Water Chloe said:

Stop paying his students loans. 
Now. Stop it. 

They are auto drafted from my acct. I am scared to change anything like that at the moment.

I'll grab the $$ from his acct later.

I agree with this too.  Keep everything on the down low.  Don't fight about stuff now.  Your decisions are made for good reasons and you can't change his mind or his actions.  You've already done everything possible on that front. 

Be ready to make the financial changes, but wait to pull the trigger.  Maybe mid December change up your direct deposit and if it goes through before January you can blame it on your company?  That way in case it takes 1 or 2 pay cycles you won't have your paycheck going into a joint account after you pull the trigger.  

ETA:  I don't think you're in a community property state, but I could be completely wrong.  You should freeze your credit, and freeze any cards in your name (joint or not).  

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Nov 21, 2018 11:22:55 GMT -5 andi9899 said:

Nov 21, 2018 11:18:36 GMT -5 Works4me said:

Aside from commission sales, is this the first real adult job he's ever had making semi adult money?

Does he really understand what it costs to run the household and raise the kids?

Unfortunately, many adults are totally clueless about the true cost of living.

This is a good question. IIRC, he's never lived on his own. I think he lived with his parents until they got married. That may explain some of it, but a man his age cannot possibly be that clueless as to not know that you can't spend that kind of money st a bar when you have 3 little kids at home.

And no man his age should be whining and grilling his wife when she needs to take a part of his check for HOUSEHOLD bills.  It should be a given that if you have a household and a family you help pay the bills.  Anyone who behaves like him deliberately has their head up their ass.

[cktc]

Nov 21, 2018 18:52:26 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

It's not only about the money. But I need to be able to do this on my own since clearly I cant rely on him for anything.

We are so lucky my mom does childcare. And I will pay Js next semester of preschool first thing in Jan.

Hes clearly going to come out on the better end of this deal. I know it. Not to mention the inheritance hes in line to get (fucking ridiculous). I just hope he finally steps up to take care of the kids.

Nope, not by a long-shot. Go read the "Debt: A love story" thread. He is probably going to come out ahead in the short term, and have some very nice windfalls that let him live it up for a bit, but he is an absolute financial train-wreck and you are freeing yourself from an albatross. You are going to soar. 

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Nov 21, 2018 18:52:26 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

It's not only about the money. But I need to be able to do this on my own since clearly I cant rely on him for anything.

We are so lucky my mom does childcare. And I will pay Js next semester of preschool first thing in Jan.

Hes clearly going to come out on the better end of this deal. I know it. Not to mention the inheritance hes in line to get (fucking ridiculous). I just hope he finally steps up to take care of the kids.

Doubt it.  He might for the short term but let's look at the facts

#1 this is the first "real" job he's ever had at his age

#2 at said rael job he cannot be bothered to sign up for benefits because that would mean having to track his hours.   Which means in event of divorce he'll either have to sign up (and will suddenly find his employer expecting him to have his ass in his seat) or he will do something really stupid and NOT sign up which means he's only a few doctor's/ER trips away from deep doo.

#3 tagging onto #2 you can't self insure if you are spending $200+ on fast food and $1200 on bar tabs.

#4 He's going to find it very hard to keep a roof over his head once you're not there to cover that for him.   He's going to have to be an adult for once in his life

Which I am going to guess will make him pretty damn miserable.    Unfortunately you cannot prevent his parents from picking up the slack but look on the bright side. . he'll be their burden now.

YOU are a smart educated talented adult.   Money is just a number and it's not like you have much anyhow with the lion's share of his paycheck going down his gullet.   You are already prepared to face the music.   He's going to get a major kick in the ass which he rightly deserves.   

[Deleted]

Nov 21, 2018 18:34:40 GMT -5 TheHaitian said:

Lord hold the wheels!!!

$1,200/month? $200/day ?

Lord let me bite my tongue before I get my account deactivated.

Girl! WTF?

Lord take the wheels!!! Let me stop before I say exactly how I feel!!!

I so understand! I'm trying to be supportive of Sam without going completely off about what I think about some of the stuff her husband does, because I try not to bash spouses (too much) and he's not here to defend himself, but GOOOOOOOD GRIEF!

[gracendignity]

Why the f did I pull his bank transactions. Looking at them makes me want to cry. Up to $200/day for food and drinks. At least, all tabs at restaurants.

Sam, please pull those records and print them or save them somewhere he can't access your copies.  Financial infidelity is a real thing and it is the first thing that made me start to think of the D word.  My lawyer had me go back through all our accounts and print them and note where my husband had been diverting funds.  (It took me 19 hours to do that and when I took them and my summary of his spending in I mentioned that fact to my lawyer and she quipped, "Better on your time than my dime!"  It's been 3 years and that still makes me laugh.)

You need to access the records and highlight EVERY single transaction for bars, eating out, and any suspicious charges that make you say WTF is that one!?  When the time is right those records can be used to show the judge that he can easily afford $1200-plus a month for fun, so he can take on some of the debt and pay child support.  In the meantime you are legally entitled to spend some of "his" money on  the bills, and document with your own records.  There is no more Sam and Mr. Sam anymore.  There is only Sam and there is Mr. Sam.  You must look out for your own best interests and those of the children.  The very best financial advise as relates to a divorce that I received is this:  Fight for and expect what is your right, and accept nothing less.  If you feel like you're being "mean" or "not fair" (and she said it is usually the woman who feels that way) then take the money and put it into a money market account and don't touch it for 2 years.  If at the end of 2 years you still feel like you were greedy, spiteful, and all those words, then give it all to him then.  I was assured that no one ever waited the 2 years--usually she saw things more clearly and that was it. 

I'm sorry you are dealing with it.  It is no fun at all.  My children were adults when I filed papers against my husband, but it was still a very difficult time.  I can promise you, however, that when all is said and done you will be amazed at how much better you will feel, both physically and emotionally, when you are not dealing with the stress of a failing marriage.

ETA:  In re the large inheritance he will one day receive:  In my state an inheritance is not marital property.  My husband received a tidy little sum from his parents and I got none of it.  Within 1 1/2 years he had spent every penny of it.  So, while you will want to share that info with your lawyer, I wouldn't really think too much about it.  I hope your state is different but your lawyer will your best source of information there.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

And on student loans IDK if the are private or federal but if they are federal it takes them FOREVER before they put a loan in defaulted.   Not saying to do it but you could get away with not paying the next couple of months before anyone notices.

How do I know this?  DH about 10 years ago almost defaulted on his because he was a dumbass and thought since he was unemployed he didn't have to pay.   Well yeah but that's only if you CALL them first!   Fortunately I found the warning letter and we got it cleared up.

[ners]

Sam_2.0  Hugs on getting thru until end of year.

I would absolutely make sure child support is part of your agreement, even if you are not going to count on the support.  You mentioned the inheritance- at least in my state my ex FIL did not receive his inheritance as it went to paying the state (for the period of time his children from his second wife were on welfare)  and his ex wife for back child support.  I felt sorry for wife number 3 who worked hard to make sure her child were never on welfare because she received pennies on the dollar. 

[oped]

Nov 21, 2018 17:50:02 GMT -5 Sam_2.0 said:

100% of my income goes to paying bills. I am about $200 short each month, hence the cards or taking money from him. I've been trying to go grocery shopping all together to get him to pay for stuff. Some of the stuff is almost paid off, so that will help. Trading in the car for another one would help too [img src="http://syonidv.hodginsmedia.com/vsmileys/smile.gif" src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png" class="smile" alt=""]

And I have EVERYTHING detailed in a spreadsheet so theres no excuse to not know what needs paid or when.

This is ridiculous. His paycheck needs to come to joint account and he gets an allowance. I can’t believe he thinks this is acceptable. 

[chapeau]

While I know this isn’t new behavior for him, I wonder if he’s using restaurant transactions to stash cash. Put the table’s bill on his card, they pay him in cash, now he has money that can’t be tracked.
Of course, that is the kind of thing a planner who is good with money would do, and we know he isn’t that...

[muttleynfelix]

Nov 21, 2018 17:09:40 GMT -5 raeoflyte said:

Nov 21, 2018 16:51:30 GMT -5 NastyWoman said:

Anyone who has enough money to spend $1,200 a month on a bar tab, has enough money to pay at least some child support.  Things will get really interesting if he finds someone else to "do for him" and they have kids → that still won't get him out from under.

If he wants to go back to couch surfing, that's his problem; and if others want to blame Sam that is theirs.  You cannot and should not live your live to please everyone else. All you will end up doing is losing yourself and be forever unhappy.  It's time to say enough and quote Poe "nevermore"!!!

I definitely agree.  The goal isn't for him to be unhappy, but for Sam to not be unhappy.  Having realistic expectations of what is to come usually helps me with that, although I think Sam is well aware of where the chips are going to fall.

I don't know how long he's had this job where he makes consistent money.  I don't know how much time they look at to calculate who pays what and he's had some really tough years on commission.  Right or wrong I know more women who who have left child support uncollected/under collected to keep the peace rather than go back to court and I can't say that I would do any differently.  

I have a friend trying to get a custody agreement in place on her 2 year old and she was willing to forgo child support to have full custody. Her baby daddy makes 3 times what she does and the judge said no. They couldn't reach an agreement, so they have a trial scheduled in Feb of 2020. They are going to see if the judge accepts baby daddy paying $50 a month, but at the same time it isn't fair to the little girl and my friend has the legal fees which means she can't afford a house until this is set.

[andi9899]

Nov 21, 2018 20:20:58 GMT -5 chapeau said:

While I know this isn’t new behavior for him, I wonder if he’s using restaurant transactions to stash cash. Put the table’s bill on his card, they pay him in cash, now he has money that can’t be tracked.
Of course, that is the kind of thing a planner who is good with money would do, and we know he isn’t that...

I wondered that too, but I don't know any restaurant around here that would do that.

[muttleynfelix]

Nov 21, 2018 21:47:42 GMT -5 andi9899 said:

Nov 21, 2018 20:20:58 GMT -5 chapeau said:

While I know this isn’t new behavior for him, I wonder if he’s using restaurant transactions to stash cash. Put the table’s bill on his card, they pay him in cash, now he has money that can’t be tracked.
Of course, that is the kind of thing a planner who is good with money would do, and we know he isn’t that...

I wondered that too, but I don't know any restaurant around here that would do that.

The restaurant wouldn't but if he is out with friends, they might pay him cash and he puts it on the CC.