Time to start thinking about college

[Anne_in_VA]

Fantastic!

[TheOtherMe]

Congratulations!!!

[skeeter]

Oct 4, 2019 18:23:28 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

OMG!  He got into University of Minnesota College of Science and Engineering!     I really was not expecting that.  
  

WOW, really great news!! Very happy for you and your son

[ners]

Great News

[giramomma]

Woo Hoo MPL and kiddo!

[finnime]

Awesome, minnesotapaintlady!

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

🎉🎉⭐️⭐️👏👏

[wvugurl26]

Congratulations to your DS mpl!!

[Deleted]

Depressing is realizing if you lived 40 miles south your kid could attend one of his top choice schools for free. I wish I hadn't looked into that. 😭

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

So, just got the announcement that ODS' college is going with the "start early, finish everything including finals by Thanksgiving, see you in February" deal.  They are also breaking the 14 week semester into 2 @ 7 week semesters with students taking 2 intensive classes each session.  The majority of upper level courses are either online, or a hybrid (small groups seeing the professor once per week with the rest of instruction online). Students can choose to live on campus, or not.  No discount on tuition or room and board.  

I am posting, because while all of that is newsworthy in and of itself, I want to spread the word that this college, and likely others, has a new, additional, financial aid form for those impacted financially by the virus.  In other words, they are offering additional financial aid to those who need it.  It might be something for us all to check out with our respective schools.  ODS was unable to find a job for pay this summer, so will not be able to contribute to his college expenses.  He already submitted his form (such a good boy) and we'll see how much more aid he gets.  Fingers crossed.  

[oped]

I think that was the other thread? Maybe? 

As for extra CARE aid... daughter’s school sent her $900 automatically... son wasn’t even eligible to apply as he didn’t owe 15k for the term... every school seems to be making their own rules for how it is distributed. 

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

Jun 17, 2020 17:55:36 GMT -5 oped said:

I think that was the other thread? Maybe? 

As for extra CARE aid... daughter’s school sent her $900 automatically... son wasn’t even eligible to apply as he didn’t owe 15k for the term... every school seems to be making their own rules for how it is distributed. 

No, this seems to be different from CARE money. I think schools are digging deep to try and keep students enrolled with so many out of work.

[oped]

Cool! 

[jelloshots4all]

GRG how did you find this?  Unfortunately my daughter hasn't ben getting financial aid, but if I could apply because of Covid I'll put in the work and see if we can get it.  Thanks!

[GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl]

Jun 18, 2020 6:03:01 GMT -5 jelloshots4all said:

GRG how did you find this?  Unfortunately my daughter hasn't ben getting financial aid, but if I could apply because of Covid I'll put in the work and see if we can get it.  Thanks!

.

There seems to be 2 different sources of additional aid these days. There is the CARES Act money which requires schools to pay 85% out directly to students and then there is new money the schools are paying out of their own pockets (endowments? Sinking funds? Generous alumni?) to help retain students who might have to drop out now due to the Covid financial crisis. Different schools are handling the sudden financial struggles of their students differently. Some are requiring those seeking assistance due to Covid (whether CARES Act or school money) to file a FAFSA application (ODS) and others are just giving it out (YDS last Spring) — every student got a cash payout based on credits regardless whether or not they were receiving financial aid. ODS also had a special form to submit to apply for money directly from the school (not CARES Act money). Have your DD call the Bursar and ask if there is CARES Act money or other funds available for students whose families have been impacted by Covid-19. They might handle it themselves (like YDS’ school) or tell her to call Financial Aid. If she has to deal with Financial Aid they will probably tell her to file a FAFSA form. Quickly file FAFSA!!! It will use your 2018 income but don’t worry about that. Once you get the email in a couple of days that it has been accepted, have your daughter email financial aid and clearly explain that there has been a SIGNIFICANT change in circumstances because your family has had a devastating drop in income due to your job loss and that while she very much wants to return to school in the Fall (to finish her degree?) she will no longer have your financial support. (Sorry for the run-on sentence. I’m typing this while WFH). She should point out her accomplishments at school (Dean’s List?, acceptance into a challenging program of study, activities on campus, etc. to point out how engaged and invested in school she is. She should ask if there are grants, scholarships, awards, CARES Act funds, emergency funds or any other financial aid she could be eligible for. We’ve asked twice for each kid for various reasons before this pandemic hit and each time received more aid even if it was just another $1,000 although one kiddo got another $4,000/semester!! My point is, you’ll never get any money if you don’t ask and the schools usually grant even just small amounts for the asking. Heck, even $500 is $500 she doesn’t have to pay out of pocket, right?

Note: I intentionally left out loans because the goal should be to avoid or at least minimize them. But don’t be surprised if loans are part of their offer — they often go there first. If they suggest you take out a Parent Plus loan you’re could try and be clear about being unemployed and having limited income so that hey will reject you. She would then go back to her school’s financial aid office and let them know and they will increase her Federal loans by $5,000. Obviously loans have to be paid back with interest but wise use of them isn’t necessarily a financial ball and chain. Both of my kids have some Federal loans just to make them have some skin in the game.

Good luck!!

[anciana]

I saw this thread pop up over the last couple of years but haven't read much. I am looking for the information on what to look for when doing a college tour so I will be skim-reading through it now. We'll probably do a regular tour that they offer and the kid will talk to the soccer coach which is all scheduled.

Would any of you have advice on the topic, what else should we look at or ask about? Like, please, ELI5, since my in my time college was totally different.
Thank you while I go search through the posts 

[azucena]

My household now has a hs freshman.  Not sure how that happened, it's impossible that I'm old enough.

Those with recent college kids, what do you wish you had known?  Particularly about choosing a college and funding.

DD is a great student with strengths in English/Lit/Writing.  Current career goal is to teach hs literature.  She'll be taking honors English this year.  I'm also hoping that she finds a love for Spanish.  She's had a little bit of instruction once a week so far, but only a good teacher this past year.

[azucena]

Jun 6, 2022 15:52:36 GMT -5 anciana said:

I saw this thread pop up over the last couple of years but haven't read much. I am looking for the information on what to look for when doing a college tour so I will be skim-reading through it now. We'll probably do a regular tour that they offer and the kid will talk to the soccer coach which is all scheduled.

Would any of you have advice on the topic, what else should we look at or ask about? Like, please, ELI5, since my in my time college was totally different.
Thank you while I go search through the posts 

This question was just asked on "Paying for College for High-Income Families 101" fb page that someone (maybe mpl) mentioned here.
-  percentage of freshman who return and percentage that graduate in 4-5 years
- Alumni network
- career center/internship and job placements
- Cost/time/ease to travel to and from home(which includes things like needing a storage unit vs bringing stuff home), cost and availability of off campus housing, walkability of campus if not taking a car
-Ask many current students how happy they are with their choice

[pulmonarymd]

I would put happy at the top of the list.
Internship opportunities
How easy is it to get required courses so they can stay on time and graduate in 4 years
Advising- helping students figure out courses, majors, and how to see how that can be put together over the years. Where my youngest went, they met with the dean their first semester, and plotted out the next 3 years. If you want to go abroad this is how you can work it. Ensure they fit in required courses. When would it be good to do an internship. It puts a little structure on a schedule, especially if they are not in a major that does not have a clear structure

[anciana]

Thank you both very much for your responses! It is nice to hear from people who had kids go through the process. Really appreciate all the info!

[Sharon]

If possible meet with people in the department for the projected major.  There are college wide scholarships/grants and then there are departmental scholarships.  These are usually funded by previous grads etc.  The department advisors can get you information on those scholarships, the requirements, the deadlines etc. 

[pulmonarymd]

I would also forget any preconceived notions you have. What you think is not likely what your child thinks. You need to decide where you draw the line. You have only 1 real hammer: how much you will pay. You need to decide what you will pay, but keep in mind that financial aid may make a more expensive school cheaper.

Most importantly, they aren’t you. They will have their own opinion about what they want. I had 3 children: 1 went to a small liberal arts school, then to medical school. 1 went to a flagship state school(not ours🙁), and now lives in Washington,DC. Last one went to my alma mater, a midsize private school. And you know what: they all made the correct choice for them, even though I would not have made the first 2 choices. The middle one hated his school the first time he went. Where he thought he wanted to go he passed on. Dealing with teenagers is challenging.

I enjoyed the process and visiting schools. There are many great educational institutions in the US. Seeing them and spending quality time with my kids was one of the highlights of those years

[tractor]

My youngest just graduated this spring with his mechanical engineering degree. My oldest graduated three years ago and after staying home for the past three years, is now headed to grad school.

I would say set realistic expectations on career goals. The schools like to sell programs that have limited real world applications. I would strongly suggest you ask your child to spend some time figuring out what they will do with a degree after they get it. They should have some idea where they will head once they are done (in a real general sense).

I would also challenge the school to demonstrate they have the tools to help your child succeed, and make connections so they can find a job when done. Then hold them to it, encourage your child to engage with their professors and advisors right from the start, there's much more to be learned than simply getting good grades in class.

Finally, give your kids time to work things out, you will be amazed at what they can accomplish when they only have themselves to rely on.

[gs11rmb]

Jun 8, 2022 7:45:55 GMT -5 tractor said:

My youngest just graduated this spring with his mechanical engineering degree. My oldest graduated three years ago and after staying home for the past three years, is now headed to grad school.

I would say set realistic expectations on career goals. The schools like to sell programs that have limited real world applications. I would strongly suggest you ask your child to spend some time figuring out what they will do with a degree after they get it. They should have some idea where they will head once they are done (in a real general sense).

I would also challenge the school to demonstrate they have the tools to help your child succeed, and make connections so they can find a job when done. Then hold them to it, encourage your child to engage with their professors and advisors right from the start, there's much more to be learned than simply getting good grades in class.

Finally, give your kids time to work things out, you will be amazed at what they can accomplish when they only have themselves to rely on.

I understand the wisdom of this sentiment but I'm not sure it's practical for many students.  I had zero ideas of what kind of job I would like or get after college and I even went to grad school without a career plan.  I studied what I found interesting (B.A. in Social Sciences and M.A. in Political Science).  I ended up in nonprofit fundraising but that's not something I would have even considered at 18.  If I had had to study something very specific for a lucrative career I may never have gone to college.  I have a solid career and six figure salary and no-one cares about my fields of study but simply that I was able to obtain the degrees.

I have no intention in dictating what my daughters can study in college.  At the same time, I think it's insanity when students (and their parents) take on huge amounts of debt for undergraduate degrees.  You can walk to Emory University from our house and the 2022-2023 cost of attendance is $75,000.  To pay $300,000 for a degree in sociology or history or social sciences  , etc. is ridiculous.

Our girls will be given the in-state schools budget but are welcome to attend any institution that matches those costs.  Even then, they may still have to take out some loans in their own names.

[TheOtherMe]

I also don't think it's realistic to expect high school kids to know exactly what they want to be when they grow up.  I don't have kids but based on my own experience, I don't think most kids that age know.

In high school, I wanted to be a shorthand and typing teacher.  I didn't go to go right away but became a clerk-typist for the federal government.  

Working there I quickly realized I didn't want to be a clerk-typist, clerk-steno or any type of clerical employee for the rest of my life.  I was doing a lot of support work for people working on the accounting side of things at the IRS.  I realized that if I wasn't do that work, they would be doing that work and they got paid a lot more money than I did.

So I went to college in the evenings.  4 classes a week, 2 on M-W and 2 on T-Th.  After doing that for two years, I decided that was going to take forever so I enrolled at a local 4 year college and worked part time.  

I had 3 years of classes left and I finished those in 2 years and one summer session.  

I would not recommend what I did because it didn't leave much room for fun.

I didn't figure out I could go to college and have fun until I went to grad school.

However, I still don't know what I want to be when I grow up and I'm retired.  It would definitely be something with numbers but I don't know what.

[giramomma]

Jun 8, 2022 7:45:55 GMT -5 tractor said:

My youngest just graduated this spring with his mechanical engineering degree. My oldest graduated three years ago and after staying home for the past three years, is now headed to grad school.

I would say set realistic expectations on career goals. The schools like to sell programs that have limited real world applications. I would strongly suggest you ask your child to spend some time figuring out what they will do with a degree after they get it. They should have some idea where they will head once they are done (in a real general sense).

I would also challenge the school to demonstrate they have the tools to help your child succeed, and make connections so they can find a job when done. Then hold them to it, encourage your child to engage with their professors and advisors right from the start, there's much more to be learned than simply getting good grades in class.

Finally, give your kids time to work things out, you will be amazed at what they can accomplish when they only have themselves to rely on.

Maybe because I went to a huge school (40K students) or my personality. But, of course the schools have tools HELP kids succeed. I'm a product of the school of L&S. There were tools 25 years ago. Not as many as there are now.

The difference now, is that there is much more hand-holding than there used to be. When I went to school, no one made sure you were involved in extra curricular activities, etc.

As an undergraduate, no one told me to go get some transferable skills. You just knew to do that. It started out by joining a student music group. Then I met someone there that was like "hey, we should do this." I was like "Cool." Then we realized it would cost money. So we started writing grants. All told, we got about 10K of grants over a few years for our project.

We put on an event, which required some basic project management. Of course, folks in L&S don't talk about that as much. But, it's what it was. We also had to hone our practical communication skills. Press releases are not the same as your typical research paper requirements for English.

I'd also argue that setting the stage that teaching your kids that there's more to life than a GPA starts far, far before college. We like our kids to find their groove by the time middle school starts.

My 8th grader is on staff for youth leadership training this summer. Meaning, she's going to be helping train kiddos a little younger than her about leadership.

We also expect our kids to work things out now. My 18 year old had to get a job at 15. He had to figure out how to get a job that he could mostly get himself to. And he did. We also only pretty much pay for his basics. I'm sorry, but I'm not working two jobs so my high school son can eat out for lunch every day with his friends. Or so that he can have $200 Nikes. My son also knows we aren't going to pay for all of his launching.  He needed to save part of his job for rent deposits and what not. I didn't check up on him very much. If the money isn't saved...he's going to have to figure out what to do next.

I guess my point partly, is no need to wait until kids are 25 to start teaching them all these things.

[anciana]

Thank you all for your experiences and info, I am learning a lot. I want to be able to guide him a bit but he yearns to be as independent as possible so we play that game of "two steps forward and one step back". Yes, dealing with teenagers can definitely be challenging.

Kid knows himself enough to know that he would be better off going to a smaller school. I think he would get lost going to a big one, at least in the beginning. He is only 16 so has a vague idea of what he wants to study at this point but the way things are now, he needs to start deciding on it pretty soon. As of right now, he says he wants to study biology. All I could tell him was to find schools that have a pretty good biology department and he'll figure it out more after a while.

I know it would mean more time and money if he ends up changing directions or schools, but in the great scheme of things, I know I need to be prepared that it just might happen. It is more important to me that he knows that he has options. Yes, there is price to pay for them, but I wouldn't want him to feel stuck or trapped in life because of the decisions he made at 16. Many of us went to school for one thing and ended up doing something quite different, so anything is possible. All I can hope is that he figures out at least the general direction he wants to go. It's just so hard when they need to make these decisions way too young (in my opinion). So, we will be looking for contacts in the desired departments for the projected major as suggested, thank you for mentioning that.

[seriousthistime]

Oldest took the 5 1/2 year plan trying to find himself.  Luckily, he went to community college for 3 1/2 of those years. Got an AA certificate that was not sufficient to transfer to a 4-year school so he had to spend more time there to get the requirements to transfer.  He's doing great now, and has developed a real niche for his work, not just locally but somewhat nationally.

Middle kid took 3 2/3 years in a very challenging major while working 3 part time jobs. Hers was the most expensive b/c she went to a prestigious out-of-state public school.  She managed to get merit scholarships, but still... oof. $$$

Youngest was a HS drama kid, often got lead or co-lead roles in their plays and musicals and was convinced he wanted to major in drama.  I talked him into going to a small college that allowed non-drama majors to try out for drama productions. He did appear in a few and was great.  His stated major was English but by the time he started sophomore year he'd decided to major in computer science. He has done quite well for himself. 

----
What I learned from the oldest child: he enjoyed high school too much, and at that time I was starting a new job and was not on top of details.  When I thought to ask him about it, the deadline to take the ACT had passed, leaving CC the only option.  We did go to see a counselor at the CC and they assured me he would be able to transfer to a 4-year school.  They didn't say, "but not with the AA track he's on."

With middle child, her HS was very focused on getting kids into the pipeline for the best college match for the student and the most bragging rights for the high school.  We made one mistake, and that is not having her ACT score reported directly to the high school.  My thinking was we could only report once, and what if she wanted to take it again?  I think she did take it again and got the same score. But it was not reported to the HS, so when they sent in students' scores for state recognition, a list of which was published in the local paper, she was not on it.  She should have been. 

With youngest, he went to a no-name school in the next state over. It was small (4,000 students) but gave really good financial aid to out-of-state students.  And because it was small, he got excellent attention, recognition, and opportunities to work with his professors. At graduation, he got an award for being top student in his major.  They really set him up to succeed, and he made the most of it. Grad school, then consistent advancement at big tech.

---

Let me add that XH thought this was the wrong track for each of the kids. In his opinion, Oldest should have gone to military school for HS, and that would have shaped him up.  Middle should have gone to a different prestigious out-of-state school where there were more professors who were members in the National Academy of Science (though not in my daughter's chosen field). Youngest should have gone to the flagship state school 15 miles away from our house. He would not have been accepted into computer science and had he majored in English there would have been no route to transfer because that computer science was a "weed out" major, not a "transfer in" major. 

As someone said, you hold the power of the purse on this one, but within that constraint you have to guide them and trust them to make the decision for themselves.  And they are so young to do that!  But you don't want to answer the late night phone call to hear "the only reason I came to this stupid school is because you made me!" They need to own the decision they make. 

[TheOtherMe]

Jun 9, 2022 11:02:58 GMT -5 seriousthistime said:

 

As someone said, you hold the power of the purse on this one, but within that constraint you have to guide them and trust them to make the decision for themselves.  And they are so young to do that!  But you don't want to answer the late night phone call to hear "the only reason I came to this stupid school is because you made me!" They need to own the decision they make. 

[anciana]

Jun 9, 2022 11:02:58 GMT -5 seriousthistime said:

Oldest took the 5 1/2 year plan trying to find himself.  Luckily, he went to community college for 3 1/2 of those years. Got an AA certificate that was not sufficient to transfer to a 4-year school so he had to spend more time there to get the requirements to transfer.  He's doing great now, and has developed a real niche for his work, not just locally but somewhat nationally.

Middle kid took 3 2/3 years in a very challenging major while working 3 part time jobs. Hers was the most expensive b/c she went to a prestigious out-of-state public school.  She managed to get merit scholarships, but still... oof. $$$

Youngest was a HS drama kid, often got lead or co-lead roles in their plays and musicals and was convinced he wanted to major in drama.  I talked him into going to a small college that allowed non-drama majors to try out for drama productions. He did appear in a few and was great.  His stated major was English but by the time he started sophomore year he'd decided to major in computer science. He has done quite well for himself. 

----
What I learned from the oldest child: he enjoyed high school too much, and at that time I was starting a new job and was not on top of details.  When I thought to ask him about it, the deadline to take the ACT had passed, leaving CC the only option.  We did go to see a counselor at the CC and they assured me he would be able to transfer to a 4-year school.  They didn't say, "but not with the AA track he's on."

With middle child, her HS was very focused on getting kids into the pipeline for the best college match for the student and the most bragging rights for the high school.  We made one mistake, and that is not having her ACT score reported directly to the high school.  My thinking was we could only report once, and what if she wanted to take it again?  I think she did take it again and got the same score. But it was not reported to the HS, so when they sent in students' scores for state recognition, a list of which was published in the local paper, she was not on it.  She should have been. 

With youngest, he went to a no-name school in the next state over. It was small (4,000 students) but gave really good financial aid to out-of-state students.  And because it was small, he got excellent attention, recognition, and opportunities to work with his professors. At graduation, he got an award for being top student in his major.  They really set him up to succeed, and he made the most of it. Grad school, then consistent advancement at big tech.

---

Let me add that XH thought this was the wrong track for each of the kids. In his opinion, Oldest should have gone to military school for HS, and that would have shaped him up.  Middle should have gone to a different prestigious out-of-state school where there were more professors who were members in the National Academy of Science (though not in my daughter's chosen field). Youngest should have gone to the flagship state school 15 miles away from our house. He would not have been accepted into computer science and had he majored in English there would have been no route to transfer because that computer science was a "weed out" major, not a "transfer in" major. 

As someone said, you hold the power of the purse on this one, but within that constraint you have to guide them and trust them to make the decision for themselves.  And they are so young to do that!  But you don't want to answer the late night phone call to hear "the only reason I came to this stupid school is because you made me!" They need to own the decision they make. 

Yes, thank you for saying that. I do want him to make the choice himself, but if he's not quite sure, I want to be able to provide some guidance.