Are some cuts penny wise,but dollar foolish?

[ugonow]

"In the past year, California has experienced the worst whopping cough outbreak in more than 50 years, an epidemic that has killed 10 infants and resulted in 6,400 reported cases. But even as the state's public health officials have struggled to curb the disease, Republicans in Congress have proposed slashing millions in federal funding for immunization programs. Public health advocates warn that these cuts threaten efforts across the country to prevent and contain infectious and sometimes fatal diseases. And they add that lower vaccination rates could eventually result in more outbreaks that endanger public health at a major cost to taxpayers.

The House GOP's 2011 budget would chop $156 million from the Centers for Disease Control's funding for immunization and respiratory diseases. The GOP reductions are likely to hit the CDC's support for state and local immunization programs, the agency's ability to evaluate which vaccines are working, and its work to educate the public about recommended vaccines for children, teenagers, and other susceptible populations. The CDC especially focuses on serving lower-income families who receive vaccines at state and local health offices and community health clinics, rather than a private doctor's office.



I sometimes get the sense the entire congressional Republican caucus is trying to do an imitation of C. Montgomery Burns.

Also note, we discussed the other day how some GOP spending cuts actually end up costing us more money, and this would very likely fall into the same category.

Health advocates tout vaccines as one of the most cost-effective preventive health strategies, warning that pinching pennies to achieve short-term cost savings could end up costing taxpayers plenty more down the road. [...]

Advocates warn that cutting back on vaccine education and availability could help increase the likelihood of future outbreaks of such diseases -- and reduce the government's ability to respond effectively to contain such outbreaks when they occur. "It's false savings," concludes APHA's Benjamin. While other public health experts argue the impact of such cutbacks might not be immediately apparent, there could be risks down the road if funding for vaccines is undermined. "In the short term, you're not going to see a difference, but [the question is] whether in three to five years, we're going to maintain our high immunization levels," says Dr. William Schaffner, chair of Vanderbilt University's preventive medicine department and an advisor to the CDC.



To date, Democrats have resisted Republican demands for these cuts. For all our sakes, here's hoping it's one of the many parts of the budget fight Dems win.

Postscript: I would assume that GOP leaders would defend these cuts with the same line they always use: "We're broke." But we're not, and if Republicans believe we can afford tax cuts and wars, but not immunizations for low-income children, that's pretty twisted."

www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2011_03/028552.php

[Deleted]

I think this outbreak is less about $ available for immunization and more about people choosing to opt out of immunization...
I agree though, that we need to think thru the true cost and benefits of any cuts... I am not happy with proposed cuts to planned parenthood, WIC, Head Start, education etc... It does not paint a pretty picture for 10+ years down the road...

[ugonow]

How about the poisin control call centers? Are we coming out ahead by cutting them and having people be treated at emergency rooms instead? www.usatoday.com/money/industries/retail/2011-03-02-safetycuts0303_N.htm

[ugonow]

I think this outbreak is less about $ available for immunization and more about people choosing to opt out of immunization...

Keep in mind most of these needy in the case of an outbreak,would be treated at tax payers expense.

[Deleted]

probably, but where do we cut then? Military? Then we better quick get out of these wars and stay out of new ones. Fraud? A fraction. SS, medicare? No. Education? No. Health care? No. So where? Someone really needs to hop to it and spell out where. So where?

[safeharbor37]

The problem is that if you start making exceptions the list is endless. As deep as the hole is there can be no sacred cows or third rails. There is no federal program that can't either be made more efficient or done away with entirely.

[Deleted]

Defense is like a third of our budget... it can stand some trimming... How about we start with some of our bases in other countries? Or redundant programs and unnecessary things like that extra engine program which i think is finally gone... etc.

We also negotiate with pharma/re-import drugs from canada... let medi pay for end of life planning appointments with a doctor, increase surtax on the 1 million 5 million 10 million a year sets... restructure social security so its still paying for itself... age and benefit adjustments...

There are places in all that which can be cut... Education... yeah, lets get rid of NCLB testing mandates... spend more money on instruction and less on standardized testing... Health Care... again, cut pharma and not immunizations and communicable disease prevention through the CDC... If the choice is between funding Ebola prevention or an elderly hard on... lets vote for Ebola prevention...

Etc...

[Deleted]

Probably some good ideas in there but I see you had to throw taxes in there where I was specifically asking for ideas on cuts.

[privateinvestor]

Paul Ryan has a roadmap that reforms (1) Health Care, (2) Medicare, (3) Medicaid, (4) Social Security, (5) Income Taxes and cuts spending by another 20%... CBO scoring of his proposal over the next ten years agrees with his estimates to reduce our deficit but most think his proposals are too draconian or too harsh...

But may be needed if we want to prevent the deficits from being a tremendous burden to our grand kids The Dems think Ryan's plan is too big of a hardship on the middle class or the poor and most oppose it. And some Repubs don't want to touch it for political reasons that it would mean they would not be re elected if they tried to cut Social Security or Medicare..

[Deleted]

Yes, i think it has to be both... if you look at it realistically...

[Deleted]

Ryans plan is harsh, but it's a real plan not just a stab in the dark.
I'm not convinced that we are not willing to throw this massive debt on top of our children. It seems we are quite willing.

[Deleted]

My mom had a really, really fat cat once... she fed all the cats the same food, so she just swiched them all over to diet. The other two cats hated it... the fat cat ended up eating almost everything, and gained 2 lb...

The point being, you can't just cut those things without also considering what will rise up in their place.

Poverty increases... crime increases... we have to deal with that.. and it costs money too...
Sometimes when an indivdiual's Health care costs more and people don't go until they are sicker and then it costs more to treat and the whole thing is actually more expensive...
etc.

[Deleted]

Yeah, debt to children... horrible... but lets cut their nutrition, health care and education and that's a responsible move ...

[privateinvestor]

States have to cut state employee wages and benefits and the Federal Government has to cut entitelments including Social Security, Medicare, and Defense...according to Allan Simpson who co chaired the Presidential Commission on Deficits. But Simpson says the politicians in the state capitals and in Washington DC are afraid to make tough choices and he calls them all a bunch of whimps..and has no confidence in congress to tackle the deficits..


Obama did review Paul Ryan's "Roadmap To Recovery" but rejected most of his proposals athough he agreed with the reform needed for income taxes, & defense, but not a 20% spending cut that would cripple education .. Would not touch health care, social security, medicare, or medicaid..as you can imagine..

[Deleted]

I don't think a worthless dollar will provide much education, health care, nutrition for anyone either.

[vonnie6200]

Yeah, debt to children... horrible... but lets cut their nutrition, health care and education and that's a responsible move ... [image]

Maybe their parents can step up to the plate and take care of their own children

[Deleted]

And if they don't... the kids should starve... right vonnie? Or we should put them in foster care? cause we got such a great foster care system (which also costs us a lot of $$... especially in psych drugs... )... or we should neuter all people who don't make 2X the poverty line? ... what's the answer Vonnie... ?

[Deleted]

Stop letting the illegals in and the whooping cough crap will end. Just like other diseases we are all immunized against in the USA. These people sneak in here with their unvaccinated bodies and kids and pregnancies-- then they enroll in our schools, etc.
Does that sound mean to some of you? Sue me. Better yet, come live in AZ where dead diseases are making a comeback. WHY? Could it all be unvaccinated homeschooled kids, (does that make SENSE, really, since they are HOME??) or could it be illegals in PUBLIC school??

[vonnie6200]

Mar 21, 2011 19:21:27 GMT -5 oped said:

And if they don't... the kids should starve... right vonnie? Or we should put them in foster care? cause we got such a great foster care system (which also costs us a lot of $$... especially in psych drugs... )... or we should neuter all people who don't make 2X the poverty line? ... what's the answer Vonnie... ?

Well I guess I am just very old - we didn't have much money when I was little and there was no school cafeteria - but we didn't starve - my parents worked very hard to take care of us and I learned some incredible skills - we never ate out, unless you count the Sunday dinner at my grandparents -

I think if you have kids, you should be the one responsible for taking care of them - asking or expecting the government to be responsible for your kids is just wrong and fosters a sense of entitlement and a lack of initiative

[Deleted]

The whooping cough thing is about people choosing NOT to IMMUNIZE... i've been watching the trend and we've had in depth discussions about it in homeschooling/unschooling groups i'm part of, in which quite a few of the mothers are adamently anti-vaccine...

And some of the anti-vaccine people DO send to public school... I have kids in our group now that did public school when they were younger and they did not have vaccines...

Anyway... the whooping cough thing was definately linked to anti-vaccine movement in cali and boulder... It has also been documented in Britain and Japan... vaccinations drop and epidemics spike...

Here is but one source... do a google... its well documented. motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2010/06/vaccines-california-whooping-cough-epidemic#

Oh... and my 'home'schooled kids... are rarely 'at home' .... they are in chorale and dance and book club and group school and ice skate and bowl and go to the library and play sports etc. etc. etc.

[Deleted]

Oh... they also rode the train last week... and go on airplanes and the mall... and museums and tours and grocery stores and the bank... etc. etc. etc.

[Deleted]

How old are you vonnie?

[vonnie6200]

Mar 21, 2011 19:45:01 GMT -5 oped said:

How old are you vonnie?

60

[Deleted]

School lunch program started in 46. So, 65 years ago... Maybe it took awhile to go into effect everywhere?

[vonnie6200]

Mar 21, 2011 19:50:18 GMT -5 oped said:

School lunch program started in 46. So, 65 years ago... Maybe it took awhile to go into effect everywhere?

Well it did - we had a lunch room - we had to brown bag it - school lunches didn't hit the grade schools in my home town until I was out of grade school.

Jr. high - we had a cafeteria - the first one I had ever seen - I signed up to work in it the first week of school - we got two perks: a free lunch and we got to leave for lunch 15 minutes before the class was dismissed (not sure which I liked the best)

[marjar]

Back in the day, when the measles vaccine first came out, I recall standing in lines at our local high school to be vaccinated. I don't recall who paid for them. Did the government foot the bill for these, or did our parents?

[marjar]

Vonnie - I was in 4th grade when we got our cafeteria and I also was asked to help. My job was to assist the younger kids. Didn't get a free lunch, but did get to leave class early.

[vonnie6200]

Mar 21, 2011 20:14:29 GMT -5 @marjar said:

Vonnie - I was in 4th grade when we got our cafeteria and I also was asked to help. My job was to assist the younger kids. Didn't get a free lunch, but did get to leave class early.

LOL - I do think leaving class early was the best part.

[vonnie6200]

Mar 21, 2011 20:12:37 GMT -5 @marjar said:

Back in the day, when the measles vaccine first came out, I recall standing in lines at our local high school to be vaccinated. I don't recall who paid for them. Did the government foot the bill for these, or did our parents?

The sugar cube in a Dixie cup?

I think it was either the government or the school PTA

[marjar]

Yes, the sugar cube