tcu2003
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Post by tcu2003 on Mar 3, 2021 21:57:06 GMT -5
I got offered the job. Its a $35,000 per year raise. Plus other goodies. I like where i am. I interviewed at this place as a lark. This new place looks fun too. I think I'm going to jump. Is it strange i feel bad? I really like my current people. I’m behind, but congrats!! And I’ve only ever jumped ship once, but I felt bad - I really liked my boss and team, but was offered in my home state and really wanted to move there, so I did.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Mar 22, 2021 8:56:45 GMT -5
I'm struggling. Outside of the usual bullying, out of control workload and company culture I found out Saturday B is seriously considering leaving.
I don't blame him. He is a transplant to the area and has really been struggling especially with the pandemic going on. He wants to move back to where his support network is.
However that means even more work on my shoulders and I go back to being Peacock's sole target. I know that's petty but having someone else who understands because they are also a target helps.
Plus it's getting really tiring to make a work friend only to lose them less than a year later. It's nice to have someone amongst the crazy. The position has become a revolving door and I'm not much interested in getting to know person #4 at this rate.
I am not sure how to process or handle work anymore. Reminding myself of what you guys said that I'm in a holding position this isn't forever helps but finding out I'm going to be alone again rocked me hard.
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buystoys
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Post by buystoys on Mar 22, 2021 9:24:06 GMT -5
Hugs, Drama. Lots and lots of hugs.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2021 11:03:05 GMT -5
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Mar 22, 2021 14:59:57 GMT -5
So sorry Drama.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Apr 4, 2021 9:24:36 GMT -5
So B is leaving next week. He has an exit interview and HR wants him to comment on what is going on in our department.
Got a little salty because that means they know but have done NOTHING. IDK if this will just go in a drawer or if they are building a case.
So we were debating on what's the point if three previous people and two still in the department have said something and no change.
That was until Friday when our manager pulled the ultimate childish bitch move.
It's on. I said first make sure they agree he can use HR or the owner as a reference or us me or R because if he's honest no way can he use our manager or peacock. I fed him a lot of information.
HR said they can't get a straight answer because the three Heathers all have a different story. He's going to point out that me and R are scared of retaliation. From all three of them.
HR in my opinion knows what needs to be done yet doesn't do it. There is no amount of sensitivity training or group therapy that will fix this. So much for the code of conduct training I just had to take. I laughed at the irony of it.
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buystoys
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Post by buystoys on Apr 4, 2021 16:23:27 GMT -5
I'm sorry you're losing your partner, Drama. Hopefully his visit with HR will result in positive action for you.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Apr 7, 2021 15:18:32 GMT -5
HR is 100% on our manager's side. Everyone else is wrong and disrespectful. Okay go ahead and continue to lose people then. Cynical me knew that Code of Conduct training was a bunch of shit. The company is NEVER on your side. This area of the country is so backwards. It's still very much the manager is God you just consider yourself blessed they haven't fired you doesn't matter how badly you are treated or how hostile it is. You have a job so be grateful! And then we wonder why the area doesn't attract "fresh young talent" and what little there is here is leaving in droves.
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buystoys
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Post by buystoys on Apr 7, 2021 16:55:48 GMT -5
So sorry to hear that, Drama. If HR won't step in, then you are just screwed, as you already know. I hope things start to look up for you soon. You've just not had any luck with this job.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2021 18:12:18 GMT -5
Y'all know this, but I'll say it anyway. HR works for the company. Ain't nobody works for the employee unless there's a union.
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tcu2003
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Post by tcu2003 on Apr 8, 2021 10:53:41 GMT -5
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Apr 8, 2021 11:50:15 GMT -5
I learned that lesson back in 2009. I don't regret blowing the whistle on that person at all and I was incredibly lucky to have a PI that backed me 100%. She made my life a living nightmare until the lab shut down. She's still working there and the compliance office is full of her BFFs. The only "punishment" she got was a slap on the wrist.
My boss and I talked when we had nothing to lose and he said unfortunately he knew this would happen. She couldn't touch him so she was going to go after me for tattling. He did his best to shield me from it but could only do so much because the university took her side. She couldn't touch him he brought in 60%+ of the money for the whole department. She COULD go after his employees though.
I'm pretty sure I am black listed there not that I would ever work there again so long as I lived.
Which is why I don't pay one ounce of attention to Code of Conduct meetings. It's a bunch of crap they have to say in order to be able to claim "Well we trained people not to do that" when they get called out for doing it. They will always fire you over solving the problem. That's why the hospital had gone through 25 employees in three years. That's why we're a revolving door.
Now I know I should have worked my way to becoming a supervisor or manager. Apparently there is nothing you can do that gets you in trouble/fired. You have immunity and unlimited power.
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CCL
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Post by CCL on Apr 8, 2021 21:27:46 GMT -5
Y'all know this, but I'll say it anyway. HR works for the company. Ain't nobody works for the employee unless there's a union. And sometimes they don't either.
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buystoys
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Post by buystoys on Apr 9, 2021 9:02:15 GMT -5
An interesting article I thought I'd share. It's about loving your job. ETA: I had one job I really did love. I wish now that I'd accepted the move package and stayed with it a couple more years. But you only know what you know at the time.
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ajmom
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Post by ajmom on Apr 25, 2021 20:28:30 GMT -5
I’m sorry, Drama. I don’t really know your situation, but I hope you can find something soon that is a lot more tolerable. It sucks to have a job where you don’t feel safe or validated. I wish you great karma and luck in finding something a much better job.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on May 5, 2021 16:11:29 GMT -5
Just got blind-sided by being asked to take on a newly created higher profile role for no title change or extra money. Every bullet of it made me want to say no, no, nopity nope. Trying to break into new markets, run cost-benefit analysis, coral the internal players, assign resources, etc. No clear decision making rights - IMO this is the true problem they are trying to solve with this position. With the promise of it not boiling over into more than a 40 hour work week. Those types of projects are non-stop fires, so that promise carries no weight.
I'm basically being recognized for doing a great job on several projects in 2020 and into 2021. No I have to figure out how to tactfully sidestep.
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jerseygirl
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Post by jerseygirl on May 5, 2021 16:39:54 GMT -5
Don’t sidestep, make them help you jump into a new higher paying position
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azucena
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Post by azucena on May 5, 2021 21:26:27 GMT -5
I don't want any more pay. I want to left alone to continue to do a great job in my current role plus continue to grow as a mentor. I've got 18 more years til my early retirement goal of having the option to FIRE at 60.
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tcu2003
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Post by tcu2003 on May 5, 2021 22:00:52 GMT -5
I don't want any more pay. I want to left alone to continue to do a great job in my current role plus continue to grow as a mentor. I've got 18 more years til my early retirement goal of having the option to FIRE at 60. You may not want it now, but don’t close the door on forever. I can’t imagine staying in the same role for 18 years, and while we’re in different industries/professions, I think we’re at similar levels in our careers. I totally get saying no to it now, but staying open to the possibility of advancement in the future.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on May 6, 2021 6:24:18 GMT -5
Any higher move I make will mean more mtgs and managing projects and way less of the technical work. I like the technical work. I really could do it for 20 more years.
I wonder if part of it is dealing with my husband's health issues all those years and being a caretaker makes me way more inclined to "coast". There really is no amount of money that would make me consider moving higher. We're able to save for retirement, do most everything we want, and still save about $30k/yr.
This request did prompt me to set up coffee this weekend with the grandboss whom I'm known/worked for for almost 15 yrs. She's too removed from the day to day work and is addressing the wrong problems IMO. Now I need to compile my thoughts for that mtg.
It is tricky because this is the 3rd request that I've turned down in the last 5 yrs. But I don't regret the first two and feel strongly about this one as well. My msg will be I'm a lifer, you know I do good work, and I can lead in this current role (if only my newish boss would let me). It's funny, one of his positives for the new role is that I'd still report to him. He's just that clueless - if I were to consider it, I'd insist on reporting to grandboss.
ETA - Before I sound like you-know-who, I do appreciate the responses as they are helping me clarify my position.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on May 6, 2021 14:31:38 GMT -5
Any higher move I make will mean more mtgs and managing projects and way less of the technical work. I like the technical work. I really could do it for 20 more years. I wonder if part of it is dealing with my husband's health issues all those years and being a caretaker makes me way more inclined to "coast". There really is no amount of money that would make me consider moving higher. We're able to save for retirement, do most everything we want, and still save about $30k/yr. This request did prompt me to set up coffee this weekend with the grandboss whom I'm known/worked for for almost 15 yrs. She's too removed from the day to day work and is addressing the wrong problems IMO. Now I need to compile my thoughts for that mtg. It is tricky because this is the 3rd request that I've turned down in the last 5 yrs. But I don't regret the first two and feel strongly about this one as well. My msg will be I'm a lifer, you know I do good work, and I can lead in this current role (if only my newish boss would let me). It's funny, one of his positives for the new role is that I'd still report to him. He's just that clueless - if I were to consider it, I'd insist on reporting to grandboss. ETA - Before I sound like you-know-who, I do appreciate the responses as they are helping me clarify my position. Don't consider not moving up as the same as coasting. You know what you enjoy and what you are good at. You also have two young kids you would like to see while they are still kids. All good reasons to not go for that next level. My youngest was CTO and COO at his previous company until he told them that this was not how he wanted to spend his life, he wanted to get back to his actual work and not just "manage". They wanted to keep him so badly that they created a new job for him at the same salary. He kept that job for a few more years even after his move abroad -for that last part it helped that he is a night owl and awake most of the time when his colleagues in the US were.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on May 7, 2021 10:06:49 GMT -5
My jump off the management track was forced by circumstance, but I'm so glad it happened. I'm making more than I was then, and I'm responsible mostly for things I can control.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 7, 2021 10:11:29 GMT -5
Not everyone wants or is cut out to be management. I think it's silly that the attitude is if you aren't making every attempt to soar into the highest office you can you are a slacker/coasting. As long as I do my job and adapt with the times why should it matter if I decide to stay in a position I like and am good at? Not everyone who doesn't move on is an old fart who is stuck in the 1950s and refuses to learn those new fangled computer thingies. I have zero desire to ever be management. It's not in my temperment and would take A LOT of coaching/hand holding to get me where I would need to be. Why when they can hire someone who wants it and is (hopefully) already good at it? I don't think I'd be a BAD manager as far as people management goes it's the office/admin bullshit I'd really struggle with. I wish more people would realize they suck at management before reaching for that rung, maybe there would be less crazy ones.
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Mardi Gras Audrey
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Post by Mardi Gras Audrey on May 7, 2021 18:15:39 GMT -5
Not everyone wants or is cut out to be management. I think it's silly that the attitude is if you aren't making every attempt to soar into the highest office you can you are a slacker/coasting. As long as I do my job and adapt with the times why should it matter if I decide to stay in a position I like and am good at? Not everyone who doesn't move on is an old fart who is stuck in the 1950s and refuses to learn those new fangled computer thingies. I have zero desire to ever be management. It's not in my temperment and would take A LOT of coaching/hand holding to get me where I would need to be. Why when they can hire someone who wants it and is (hopefully) already good at it? I don't think I'd be a BAD manager as far as people management goes it's the office/admin bullshit I'd really struggle with. I wish more people would realize they suck at management before reaching for that rung, maybe there would be less crazy ones. So this. I don’t know why everyone who is good at their job is supposed to be good at management. Management skills are very different than technical skills. We should appreciate that people have different skill sets and interests and try to put them in jobs that match that. This would keep the employee happy and get the business someone who does a better job. The sad part is when someone good technically gets promoted to management and doesn’t do a good job. Then they get fired/discarded. Instead of returning them to the job they were a superstar at, they get fired for being “incompetent”. Yet, if they refuse the promotion since they are self aware enough to know they won’t do a good job, they get treated like slackers. The employee can’t win here.
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tcu2003
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Post by tcu2003 on May 7, 2021 19:29:28 GMT -5
I hope I didn’t come off as indicating everyone should want to be in management/career should head that direction. It’s more the idea of continuing to grow and learn new things. My company has a technical track, so there are specific opportunities for employees who would not be good managers but are great technically (and consequently really valuable employees) to become technical leaders/subject matter experts and be trusted resources for our clients, do internal training (if that’s their thing), etc.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on May 8, 2021 6:11:20 GMT -5
Thanks for setting me straight on the coasting. That was the over-achiever in me shining thru.
Coffee with the grandboss at 9 this morning. Wish me luck. For better or worse, I've decided to tell her more rather than less; professionally of course. She's too removed from what's going on in the dept, and we're going to start losing good people soon. I have my notes all ready.
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tcu2003
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Post by tcu2003 on May 8, 2021 9:40:28 GMT -5
Good luck, azucena!! Let us know how it goes!
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azucena
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Post by azucena on May 9, 2021 8:09:51 GMT -5
Two and a half hour discussion including comparing family updates. I really don't think it could have gone better. She was impressed with my notes, and I had written them in such a way that I could give them to her (extra points for me!).
I'm off the hook for the new position - I may have gone into too much detail about DH's health history but I don't feel bad about that. It's made me who I am, including at work, in a good way. She was vaguely aware of his last surgery but had no idea it was so serious and point blank said obviously I handled my workload above and beyond even in that situation.
She's been asking downstream in my direction for at least a couple of years if we have enough people and keeps hearing yes, we're managing. I'm pretty sure she would have asked my current boss and the boss of the analyst pool who are both workaholics for whom a 50-60 hour work week is typical. Both are married without children and have stay at home spouses. I said here's the deal, yes we are keeping up but only because we truly have a group of extremely loyal over-achievers. If we were ever at a tipping point, this is it. It helped that she saw a mtg scheduled at 8 pm last week (ridiculous!). I also had a list of internal projects that were due in 2020 and got extended into 2021 because my work group cannot complete them and keep up with everything else. And these are just the projects I wasn't able to veto outright as immaterial/inefficient/etc. She encouraged me to spread the word to answer completely honestly in the currently open engagement survey because our company really does take those seriously and this will help her case to increase head count. Of course this will take a while but even knowing it's coming will be a huge morale boost.
I also pointed out that no one is taking true PTO anymore. It's I'm going to be on PTO next week, but I'm still available if you need me. That should be the exception at the VP level and should not be happening at all lower - we don't pay our analysts enough. We need to manage client deadlines as best we can around PTO. The analysts see the rest of us dialing back in and can't help but think that's the expectation. I told her to specifically spell out that it's not and she agreed - again she had no idea. This is the level we will lose good people soon and they will take years to truly replace.
My other key points were that we don't have a clear strategy as our industry is rapidly evolving, no consistent way to determine what senior level thinks makes a good deal, and no clear decision makers. At the VP level, I've felt so stifled this past couple of years by what I can approve and what I must run up the chain. In the past six months, I've gotten my hands slapped multiple times for items I feel where within my purview. I just keep trying to do my job and cover my bases but I feel like I'm playing without rules.
She ended by asking that I keep coming fwd directly to her with these types of things.
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finnime
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Post by finnime on May 9, 2021 8:49:33 GMT -5
So glad it went so well, azucena. This should lighten your load even psychologically.
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buystoys
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Post by buystoys on May 9, 2021 8:52:16 GMT -5
Wonderful meeting from the sounds of it, azucena! Kudos to you for managing it so well.
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