Is Bill Cosby a Sociopath?

[billisonboard]

If you are the type that likes to label, sociopath isn't a bad one to use for him. 

[Deleted]

I think you have to have a bit of narcissism to be a successful.entertainer/actor. Narcissism.is a trait that mos5 sociopaths have, no? When my uneducated brain makes those kind.of leaps, I can see how it's "possible that Bill Cosby could be a sociopath.

[Artemis Windsong]

Yes.  Narcissist. 

Untouchable, above everyone and any laws.

[Deleted]

I was in Reno, NV back in the 1980s when Cosby used to do comedy there. The blackjack dealers all seemed to mention versions of "he's an asshat" when you mentioned he was there.

We heard everything from he is a perverted pig to the fact that he refused to have anyone who was not black do anything for him while he was there.

[MN-Investor]

I'd just go with Evil.

[msventoux]

Sociopath.  Asshole.  King of the douchebags.  A lot of labels seem to fit him well.   

[Peace Of Mind]

All I know is that he is as ugly inside as he is outside.   I find him disgusting and always have - both in his behavior/personality and his looks.   I never watched his show because of him and have always found him repulsive.    People who liked him never understood why I didn't like him and I really couldn't explain it.  Arnold Schwartzenegger (sp?) was another one but I did like Terminator.  But him personally?  Bleh!!

[happyhoix]

I don't know if he's a sociopath - there have been so many conflicting accounts of what he did and said, kind of hard to figure out what really happened.

Maybe he feels that he invited women to 'party' with him and they willingly agreed, and he gave them 'party' drugs so they would have a really great time, which is why he doesn't consider this rape - but if that's what he thinks happened, I think he must be a narcissist who thinks all the women in the world would love to jump in the sack with him.

If, on the other hand, he was a predator who lured women to his room and snuck drugs into their drinks so that they would be unable to defend themselves against him, then yeah, he's probably getting into sociopathic territory.

Very surprising for me, I remember growing up listening to his comedy albums, he always came across as a clean cut family man.

[Value Buy]

Are all sociopaths rapists?
No.

[zibazinski]

Yes indeed. My Ex is a sociopath, he is NOT a rapist.

[NancysSummerSip]

Definition of sociopath:
noun, Psychiatry.
a person with a psychopathic personality whose behavior is antisocial, often criminal, and who lacks a sense of moral responsibility or social conscience.

Definition of psychopath:
noun, Psychiatry
a person with a psychopathic personality, which manifests as amoral and antisocial behavior, lack of ability to love or establish meaningful personal relationships, extreme egocentricity, failure to learn from experience, etc.

The first two are from Dictionary.com
****************************************
This third one is from the Mayo Clinic:

Narcissistic personality disorder is a mental disorder in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance, a deep need for admiration and a lack of empathy for others. But behind this mask of ultraconfidence lies a fragile self-esteem that's vulnerable to the slightest criticism.

A narcissistic personality disorder causes problems in many areas of life, such as relationships, work, school or financial affairs. You may be generally unhappy and disappointed when you're not given the special favors or admiration you believe you deserve. Others may not enjoy being around you, and you may find your relationships unfulfilling.


I'd say he's some sociopath with a lot of narcissistic personality disorder. But actually, he manifests traits of all three. You have to wonder at what happened early in his life to get him to this point. I'm not blaming his behavior on any outside factors, nor holding anyone other than him responsible, you understand. But still, where the heck did his road get so horribly twisted that he could appear normal to most of the world, yet behave so callously, so badly and with such disregard to personal dignity in private? How do you do that and live with yourself, your wife and kids?

 I've worked in the criminal justice system and seen this kind of thing, especially among so-called professional criminals (gang members, drug dealers, white-collar embezzlers) and found that they seem to have a remarkable way of disassociating their two lives: the picket-fence-and-family existence versus the criminal activity. One has no impact on the other, in their minds. Crime is their paycheck, their nine-to-five, their office. They don't see it as criminal activity as much as they see it as opportunity presenting itself. I think Cosby looked at the women the same way: opportunity presenting itself that he was entitled to have. 

[Tiny]

IDK,  I do think actors create a "persona"  for when they are out in public that may or may not be linked to a character they play.  

I think comedians do the same thing but maybe more so...since they need to be that "persona" on the stage and EVERY time they are in the public view.  

I think actors need to be a bit of Narcissist to be successful.   I also think that successful people (not just celebrities) get constantly pummeled for money or help from their adoring public.   I think that last bit is what makes some of them stand offish... you never know when you are going to be 'assualted' by a fan who wants something from you.    Combine a bit of narcissism with "people only want stuff from me" and I think you get someone who's willing to use other people (or who feel entitled, or who feel they are above the law).      

I'm not sure how I ultimately 'feel' about Crosby... I pretty much assume he's human, male, and in a position of power... so I'm not that surprise by what he might have done.   I add in the male part - becasue I think a woman in a position of power might be a bit more 'careful' with her sexual encounters because of the pervasive double standard.  

As for comedians and their various personas --  Bob Sagat (full house) does some pretty horrible sleazy stand up comedy.... 

[Virgil Showlion]

If I had to guess, he doesn't consider his sexual sins to have meaningfully harmed anybody. For acts he believes are genuinely harmful, he probably feels guilt and remorse like the rest of us.

I've read that sociopathy is ranked on a spectrum. Hence the more appropriate question might be: To what degree is he a sociopath?

[Deleted]

Jul 20, 2015 16:55:32 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

If I had to guess, he doesn't consider his sexual sins to have meaningfully harmed anybody. For acts he believes are genuinely harmful, he probably feels guilt and remorse like the rest of us.

I've read that sociopathy is ranked on a spectrum. Hence the more appropriate question might be: To what degree is he a sociopath?

The behavior of the pathological is purely situational and dependent on how much resistance they face from their chosen victim and what resources they have available to them.

A person once considered a narcissist, does something that convinces us he is a sociopath, and then it’s revealed that he has done something even more diabolical which elevates him to the ultimate status of psychopath, this is where Mr. Cosby lives. IMO

[TheOtherMe]

As far as I am concerned, he is a rapist who doesn't consider the women he raped to be human beings.

[Virgil Showlion]

Jul 20, 2015 17:01:12 GMT -5 @joey said:

Jul 20, 2015 16:55:32 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

If I had to guess, he doesn't consider his sexual sins to have meaningfully harmed anybody. For acts he believes are genuinely harmful, he probably feels guilt and remorse like the rest of us.

I've read that sociopathy is ranked on a spectrum. Hence the more appropriate question might be: To what degree is he a sociopath?

The behavior of the pathological is purely situational and dependent on how much resistance they face from their chosen victim and what resources they have available to them.

A person once considered a narcissist, does something that convinces us he is a sociopath, and then it’s revealed that he has done something even more diabolical which elevates him to the ultimate status of psychopath, this is where Mr. Cosby lives. IMO

I'm partly in the billisonboard camp of wondering whether labels really matter all that much, but if we go the labeling route, there are clinical standards that have to be met. It's not a matter of looking at a guy and figuring "he seems really, really evil, hence: psychopath".

We also have to resist the urge to slot criminal individuals into either "pure evil" or "slightly evil" archetypes. I think it would be premature to conclude that Mr. Cosby feels no love, empathy or remorse whatsoever.

Our society unfortunately suffers from a "Curious George" mentality wherein we tend to view an individual's good deeds as compensating for any wrong (s)he may have committed. One of the side effects is that we tend to deny the good attributes of wicked individuals. We innately think of acknowledging any goodness as annulling evil acts we don't want to forgive.

In short, I don't think we can draw any reliable conclusions about Mr. Cosby. He obviously has very sick sexual appetites, and I agree he's probably narcissistic to a degree. If we exclude these elements, what's left over might be a depraved monster or it might be a caring, loving spouse, neighbour, parent... just like any of us. We would need a lot more objective info about him to draw more rigorous conclusions.

[Opti]

The only conclusion I can draw is, I was right.  Cosby was/is a sleaze bucket.   I am glad the truth with proof finally came out. Its rare the public ever gets to see some conclusion of icky news stories.

[Opti]

Jul 20, 2015 17:57:36 GMT -5 @southernsusana said:

There's definitely narcissism involved, but I think it is the lack of remorse or acknowledgement that he did anything wrong that really bothers me.

I never was a fan of The Bill Cosby Show, but I thought Fat Albert was a pretty good Sat. morning cartoon for teaching kids values, etc. 

I liked the Bill Cosby show and Fat Albert. However when the initial stories first broke and I discovered Cosby was a star prior to the Bill Cosby show, and he was a known frequenter of night clubs, etc. ... I was prepared to discover, he was most definitely not a nice guy.

FWIW.

[Deleted]

Jul 20, 2015 19:09:21 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

Jul 20, 2015 17:01:12 GMT -5 @joey said:

The behavior of the pathological is purely situational and dependent on how much resistance they face from their chosen victim and what resources they have available to them.

A person once considered a narcissist, does something that convinces us he is a sociopath, and then it’s revealed that he has done something even more diabolical which elevates him to the ultimate status of psychopath, this is where Mr. Cosby lives. IMO

I'm partly in the billisonboard camp of wondering whether labels really matter all that much, but if we go the labeling route, there are clinical standards that have to be met. It's not a matter of looking at a guy and figuring "he seems really, really evil, hence: psychopath".

We also have to resist the urge to slot criminal individuals into either "pure evil" or "slightly evil" archetypes. I think it would be premature to conclude that Mr. Cosby feels no love, empathy or remorse whatsoever.

Our society unfortunately suffers from a "Curious George" mentality wherein we tend to view an individual's good deeds as compensating for any wrong (s)he may have committed. One of the side effects is that we tend to deny the good attributes of wicked individuals. We innately think of acknowledging any goodness as annulling evil acts we don't want to forgive.

In short, I don't think we can draw any reliable conclusions about Mr. Cosby. He obviously has very sick sexual appetites, and I agree he's probably narcissistic to a degree. If we exclude these elements, what's left over might be a depraved monster or it might be a caring, loving spouse, neighbour, parent... just like any of us. We would need a lot more objective info about him to draw more rigorous conclusions.

I believe the public has enough information on Cosby's misdeeds to make an informed opinion. Again, it is an opinion not a legal judgement but one of public opinion.

Cosby's acts that were illegal and lacking in ethics are what he is being judged on, not his performance as an actor. I personally don't believe his acts were sexual in as much as it was a control scenario. He drugged even the willing so it was his desire to be in COMPLETE control of the event(s) that is particularly alarming.

[Virgil Showlion]

Jul 21, 2015 11:32:01 GMT -5 @joey said:

Jul 20, 2015 19:09:21 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

I'm partly in the billisonboard camp of wondering whether labels really matter all that much, but if we go the labeling route, there are clinical standards that have to be met. It's not a matter of looking at a guy and figuring "he seems really, really evil, hence: psychopath".

We also have to resist the urge to slot criminal individuals into either "pure evil" or "slightly evil" archetypes. I think it would be premature to conclude that Mr. Cosby feels no love, empathy or remorse whatsoever.

Our society unfortunately suffers from a "Curious George" mentality wherein we tend to view an individual's good deeds as compensating for any wrong (s)he may have committed. One of the side effects is that we tend to deny the good attributes of wicked individuals. We innately think of acknowledging any goodness as annulling evil acts we don't want to forgive.

In short, I don't think we can draw any reliable conclusions about Mr. Cosby. He obviously has very sick sexual appetites, and I agree he's probably narcissistic to a degree. If we exclude these elements, what's left over might be a depraved monster or it might be a caring, loving spouse, neighbour, parent... just like any of us. We would need a lot more objective info about him to draw more rigorous conclusions.

I believe the public has enough information on Cosby's misdeeds to make an informed opinion. Again, it is an opinion not a legal judgement but one of public opinion.

Cosby's acts that were illegal and lacking in ethics are what he is being judged on, not his performance as an actor. I personally don't believe his acts were sexual in as much as it was a control scenario. He drugged even the willing so it was his desire to be in COMPLETE control of the event(s) that is particularly alarming.

If that's indeed why he used the drugs.

There were several unusual fetishistic components to the rapes. Having a woman unconscious might just be another such component.

In other words, it may not really have a defined purpose (as we would understand), it's just what he finds sexually pleasing.

[Deleted]

Jul 21, 2015 13:07:00 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

Jul 21, 2015 11:32:01 GMT -5 @joey said:

I believe the public has enough information on Cosby's misdeeds to make an informed opinion. Again, it is an opinion not a legal judgement but one of public opinion.

Cosby's acts that were illegal and lacking in ethics are what he is being judged on, not his performance as an actor. I personally don't believe his acts were sexual in as much as it was a control scenario. He drugged even the willing so it was his desire to be in COMPLETE control of the event(s) that is particularly alarming.

If that's indeed why he used the drugs.

There were several unusual fetishistic components to the rapes. Having a woman unconscious might just be another such component.

In other words, it may not really have a defined purpose (as we would understand), it's just what he finds sexually pleasing.

Is rape a fetish? 

[quince]

Jul 21, 2015 15:42:04 GMT -5 @joey said:

Jul 21, 2015 13:07:00 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

If that's indeed why he used the drugs.

There were several unusual fetishistic components to the rapes. Having a woman unconscious might just be another such component.

In other words, it may not really have a defined purpose (as we would understand), it's just what he finds sexually pleasing.

Is rape a fetish? 

Yes, but for people who are responsible, and have empathy and value other humans, it is indulged with role-play.

[beergut]

Jul 20, 2015 8:47:49 GMT -5 NancysSummerSip said:

 I've worked in the criminal justice system and seen this kind of thing, especially among so-called professional criminals (gang members, drug dealers, white-collar embezzlers) and found that they seem to have a remarkable way of disassociating their two lives: the picket-fence-and-family existence versus the criminal activity. One has no impact on the other, in their minds. Crime is their paycheck, their nine-to-five, their office. They don't see it as criminal activity as much as they see it as opportunity presenting itself. I think Cosby looked at the women the same way: opportunity presenting itself that he was entitled to have. 

I would say those criminals are very good at compartmentalizing, and separating the parts of their life that they did not feel defined who they are. If you view yourself as a good family man, how you provide for your family may be completely separate from the person who interacts with his kids, goes to their sporting events, goes to PTA meetings, goes out on date-nights with his wife, etc. The method with which you provide for your family, criminal or not, does not define who you are, it is just a necessary part of your life so you can be who you are, which is a good father and family man. 

[Virgil Showlion]

Jul 21, 2015 15:42:04 GMT -5 @joey said:

Jul 21, 2015 13:07:00 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

If that's indeed why he used the drugs.

There were several unusual fetishistic components to the rapes. Having a woman unconscious might just be another such component.

In other words, it may not really have a defined purpose (as we would understand), it's just what he finds sexually pleasing.

Is rape a fetish?

fetish (n). Something, such as a material object or a nonsexual part of the body, that arouses sexual desire and may become necessary for sexual gratification.

Based on the definition and quince's observation that many people engage in rape fantasies and digest pornographic material depicting non-consensual acts, it's reasonable to conclude the answer is 'it can be'.

In Mr. Cosby's case, I was suggesting that unconsciousness specifically might be a fetishistic component of the crimes, unrelated to control.

[Deleted]

I think deep down inside, Bill Cosby really wanted to be who he pretended to be, but the real Bill won.

[Deleted]

I'm glad that the truth is becoming known. I do wonder what made people suddenly take the accusations seriously. Women have been accusing him of this stuff for a long time. It only became a big media story this year. I wonder why. I watch The Nightly Show with Larry Wilmore and he has a real hate on for Bill Cosby and has since before he got his show. His anger seems kinda personal to me, I think someone Larry knows well was raped by Cosby. I think there is even more information out there known to some people that the general public is still not getting.

[Virgil Showlion]

Jul 21, 2015 23:30:14 GMT -5 @tbird said:

Hey - is there any irony in the fact that bill cosby is now a punchline to a million jokes?

It's ironic, and sad.

He was a strong male role model for black Americans... or at least his public persona was. His various shows/charitable works are credited with tearing down barriers.

If it turns out Denzel Washington is secretly a rotter too, I'm starting a whitehouse.gov petition to burn down Hollywood.

[Opti]

Jul 22, 2015 2:53:08 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

Jul 21, 2015 23:30:14 GMT -5 @tbird said:

Hey - is there any irony in the fact that bill cosby is now a punchline to a million jokes?

It's ironic, and sad.

He was a strong male role model for black Americans... or at least his public persona was. His various shows/charitable works are credited with tearing down barriers.

If it turns out Denzel Washington is secretly a rotter too, I'm starting a whiteh arouse.gov petition to burn down Hollywood.  You are willing to burn down Hollywood, over two actors, because you are wrong about their RL persona matching what characters they played in their acting gigs?

I should rephrase, but really Virgil? Because you and most people were wrong about Cosby being like the man he portrayed in his hit TV show AND if Denzel is a sleaze in RL and not like most of the characters he played, you will petition the US government even though you are from Canada? Are they having water quality issues in your part of Toronto? I think it has to be more than just a mild overdose of ummm Flouride.

[NancysSummerSip]

Jul 21, 2015 17:37:33 GMT -5 beergut said:

Jul 20, 2015 8:47:49 GMT -5 NancysSummerSip said:

 I've worked in the criminal justice system and seen this kind of thing, especially among so-called professional criminals (gang members, drug dealers, white-collar embezzlers) and found that they seem to have a remarkable way of disassociating their two lives: the picket-fence-and-family existence versus the criminal activity. One has no impact on the other, in their minds. Crime is their paycheck, their nine-to-five, their office. They don't see it as criminal activity as much as they see it as opportunity presenting itself. I think Cosby looked at the women the same way: opportunity presenting itself that he was entitled to have. 

I would say those criminals are very good at compartmentalizing, and separating the parts of their life that they did not feel defined who they are. If you view yourself as a good family man, how you provide for your family may be completely separate from the person who interacts with his kids, goes to their sporting events, goes to PTA meetings, goes out on date-nights with his wife, etc. The method with which you provide for your family, criminal or not, does not define who you are, it is just a necessary part of your life so you can be who you are, which is a good father and family man. 

Good point. I remember watching interviews with members of John Gotti Sr.'s family and they said the same thing. His working life as a mobster did not cross the threshold of the house. He was a wonderful dad and always there for his kids and grandkids. Ditto the Ice Man, Richard Kuklinski, one of the most prolific contract killers in history. Although his widow Barbara has said that Kuklinski had many moments of rage directed at her during their marriage, he never touched their three kids and was a genial and generous host and friend; everyone in his neighborhood liked the guy.

[Virgil Showlion]

Jul 22, 2015 3:34:14 GMT -5 Ratchets said:

What's a "rotter?" And give me all the juicy details please! My wife is infatuated with him, so all the dirt I can find for ammo is much appreciated .

"Rotter" is British slang meaning "rotten person". See my comment to Optimist below, and then this.

Jul 22, 2015 3:45:42 GMT -5 Opti said:

Jul 22, 2015 2:53:08 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

It's ironic, and sad.

He was a strong male role model for black Americans... or at least his public persona was. His various shows/charitable works are credited with tearing down barriers.

If it turns out Denzel Washington is secretly a rotter too, I'm starting a whiteh arouse.gov petition to burn down Hollywood.  You are willing to burn down Hollywood, over two actors, because you are wrong about their RL persona matching what characters they played in their acting gigs?

I should rephrase, but really Virgil? Because you and most people were wrong about Cosby being like the man he portrayed in his hit TV show AND if Denzel is a sleaze in RL and not like most of the characters he played, you will petition the US government even though you are from Canada? Are they having water quality issues in your part of Toronto? I think it has to be more than just a mild overdose of ummm Flouride.

You misunderstand. Back in November, I was lamenting that Hollywood is a cesspit where the prospect of finding a celebrity living by Christian values grows slimmer by the day. DJ explained to me that Denzel Washington is a Christian and well-known for his upright conduct, hence Mr. Washington has become my new glimmer of hope post-Cosby.

I'm saying that if he turns out to secretly be a rotter too, my last shred of faith in Hollywood dies with him. It's time the US feds burned the place down and started anew. New celebrities. New producers. New values. It will be the Renaissance of the 21st Century.