Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Mar 14, 2011 0:22:37 GMT -5
pbp-stop with the 'We see you." stuff. It's down-right creepy and could be considered threatening.
Tennesseer/Moderator
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 14, 2011 0:34:57 GMT -5
Tenn- I'm simply making the point to the lefties and Democrats out there that we see them. Their mask is off. We know what their real agenda and strategy is, and what they DO now speaks so loudly, what they SAY no longer matters. We see them. And if they weren't trying to hide- in the first place, something I find creepy and threatening, I we wouldn't have to look for them. I'm simply saying that they are out in the open now. We see them. Now that I've explained it- there should't be a problem. Or, maybe I'll just attach THEIR OWN CREST to my posts to let them know? We see the wolf in sheep's clothing-- an image concocted by the Fabian Socialists, and acknowledged by Saul Alinsky who stressed the need for revolutionaries to mask the extremism of their objectives and to present themselves as moderates until they could gain some control over the machinery of political power, and then later adapted by former advisor to President Obama, Communist, Van Jones who said, "I'm willing to forgo the cheap satisfaction of the radical pose for the deep satisfaction of radical ends."' Added Jones: "I realized that there are a lot of people who are capitalists -- shudder, shudder -- who are really committed to fairly significant change in the economy, and were having bigger impacts than me and a lot of my friends with our protest signs."
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Deleted
Joined: Apr 25, 2024 2:22:59 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2011 20:51:02 GMT -5
"YOU might not, but TEACHERS do get paid quite a bit, and teachers (including YOU) get paid for the two months off in the summer. Your pay is ANNUALIZED and it is considered pay because you have a JOB WHEN YOU GET BACK."
Not true... teachers get paid for the days worked, as stipulated in their contract. The contract is written for so many days, so many hours, those are mandatory, but like with most salary jobs, its expected that you will complete all of the necessary duties and requirements to complete the job...
I have no idea what you are talking about? But it is not based on any reality...
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SweetVirginia
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Joined: Dec 24, 2010 17:56:15 GMT -5
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Post by SweetVirginia on Mar 15, 2011 22:58:56 GMT -5
That would be part of the reason eddie, lets not forget that we have the highest illegal alien population. Illegals cost us an estimated 10 to 13 billion per year. This plays right into the public school problems. We are spending a staggering amount to educate and accommodate the children of illegal aliens. I know this first hand. 90 percent of my students' parents are here illegally. We spend so much on these kids. 100% of my school's students are on free breakfast and lunch. We provide 100% of their school supplies (which I now have to purchase because the district is out of money) We spend tons on providing private therapy sessions, in house probation officers, special education services, private school tuition when we cant meet their special needs, including taxi service to and from the private school, all kinds of expensive services. I do not agree with raising property taxes in order to accommodate these kids if the parents are not themselves paying property taxes (which the vast majority are not) This a a major problem that most of CA is ignoring. You're 100% correct sweet, I was trying to stay on the topic but as all reasonable people know, illegal aliens are a massive burden and drag on our economy and on our society. I hope the open-borders crowd saw this part of your post: 90 percent of my students' parents are here illegally That's terrifying... Those on this board who do support illegal aliens and amnesty, already know where I stand on the issue of illegal immigration. It is a huge problem here in CA, and I believe it is one of the main reasons that CA is in economic ruins. Not many in the CA government are willing to admit it, however.
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SweetVirginia
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Post by SweetVirginia on Mar 15, 2011 23:03:52 GMT -5
SV- you lost the argument. I posted facts, and you have no response to them except to say that they are somehow union busting propaganda. That may in fact be true, but it isn't true merely because you say so. You have to back up the claim. You want to use the anecdote of your own pay, but then you want to make broad arguments about the hours and pay of teachers generally. The same job for 30 years isn't an accomplishment. It's like your earlier post about showing up to work early and leaving late. In the private sector, we call that "doing minimums". This is no different-- there's a big difference between 30 years experience and 1 year of experience repeated 30 times. Most of the teachers I know personally (since we can sometimes use anecdotes in this discussion, and sometimes not) fall in the latter category. Stop- just stop- trying to say you don't get paid for the time off in the summer. Just quit it. You retain all of the benefits of your job during the summer, you're still employed during that time, and you have a job when you get back. We're smart enough to figure out that it's just math. If I make $100K in January, and no money February - December, I make $100K a year. I only work 1 month, and I only get paid for the month I work, but nobody is falling for the silly idea that I don't get paid-- especially when I retain all my benefits and have a job when I get back the following January. You get paid for all year- including the two months off. There may be no guarantees for you this year- but the last few years have been the exception in a very long run. We'll see if the fight for OUR rights, the rights of the taxpayers, OUR seat at the negotiating table is sustained. Odds are pretty good you have a job for life. So, you can make it sound however you want, but you can't say on the one hand that you know teachers that have worked at the same job for 30 years (Who does that anymore?) and on the other there are no guarantees. We see you. And if we do things right- you're going to experience dramatic changes and a big shift away from the government run monopoly and towards market forces. You are only proving in this message, just how completely clueless you are in regard to teacher pay and benefits. You simply are misinformed. There is just no arguing with someone who has no real information or idea of the truth.
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Frappuccino
Junior Member
Joined: Jan 16, 2011 18:58:33 GMT -5
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Post by Frappuccino on Mar 16, 2011 0:40:33 GMT -5
It just seems that corporations get tax money too by way of tax breaks, bail outs, or government contracts. Tax money that we ALL pay. There are companies with government customers making money off of people who earned it from their government job. Every single year during the budget impasse the Sacramento Bee has nongovernment business owners crying every single year that they can't get paid from their state government customer until the budget is passed. They might as well call themselves state employees too. But, I'll bet they are out there cheering for the pensions to be eliminated.
To really eliminate the tax burden of pensions, why not fight to ELIMINATE welfare programs and ELIMINATE tax and fee programs? That way, less public union workers are necessary to carry out welfare programs that POLITICIANS implement. That way, less public union workers are necessary to administer tax and fee programs that POLITICIANS implement. Less workers = less pension and government employee salary burden.
Sure there are people who will do the job for a little bit less money now, but they aren't going to work for free, and eventually these people you find who will do the job for less will want a raise. Money makes the world go round and it all flows into and out of the same pot. I think politicians just laugh and laugh at these battles among the citizens.
Why do you want minimum wage earners teaching your future teachers and doctors and auto mechanics and....? You may be rich enough to afford good private schools, but your grandkids may not be so lucky.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 16, 2011 9:26:25 GMT -5
SV- you lost the argument. I posted facts, and you have no response to them except to say that they are somehow union busting propaganda. That may in fact be true, but it isn't true merely because you say so. You have to back up the claim. You want to use the anecdote of your own pay, but then you want to make broad arguments about the hours and pay of teachers generally. The same job for 30 years isn't an accomplishment. It's like your earlier post about showing up to work early and leaving late. In the private sector, we call that "doing minimums". This is no different-- there's a big difference between 30 years experience and 1 year of experience repeated 30 times. Most of the teachers I know personally (since we can sometimes use anecdotes in this discussion, and sometimes not) fall in the latter category. Stop- just stop- trying to say you don't get paid for the time off in the summer. Just quit it. You retain all of the benefits of your job during the summer, you're still employed during that time, and you have a job when you get back. We're smart enough to figure out that it's just math. If I make $100K in January, and no money February - December, I make $100K a year. I only work 1 month, and I only get paid for the month I work, but nobody is falling for the silly idea that I don't get paid-- especially when I retain all my benefits and have a job when I get back the following January. You get paid for all year- including the two months off. There may be no guarantees for you this year- but the last few years have been the exception in a very long run. We'll see if the fight for OUR rights, the rights of the taxpayers, OUR seat at the negotiating table is sustained. Odds are pretty good you have a job for life. So, you can make it sound however you want, but you can't say on the one hand that you know teachers that have worked at the same job for 30 years (Who does that anymore?) and on the other there are no guarantees. We see you. And if we do things right- you're going to experience dramatic changes and a big shift away from the government run monopoly and towards market forces. You are only proving in this message, just how completely clueless you are in regard to teacher pay and benefits. You simply are misinformed. There is just no arguing with someone who has no real information or idea of the truth. You're just blinded because you're too close to the situation. It's understandable that you want to protect your own interests, but the fact of the matter is that (for once) the people that pay your salary, and the salaries of public employee union members everywhere ARE actually quite well informed. I've documented everything I've said-- you have not taken one thing I've said and refuted it. Your whole argument is symantics. Your "contract" isn't YOUR contract. You're part of a group. You don't have to compete in an open market with other people every year for your job. You don't have to resubmit a resume and explain what you were doing for the last 60 days while you weren't working. You don't have to sit for an interview. Because the fact of the matter is that YOU ARE EMPLOYED OVER THE SUMMER. You can say, "Yeah, but" all you want, but it's just math and symantics. It's a rare, rare, rare occassion when a teacher doesn't come back, or a contract is not renewed-- griping about "temporary" contracts notwithstanding. We (I) understand the process quite well. You have attacked sources- but you've offered no alternative information- other than the aforementioned symantic points. You haven't made your case that my sources are not reliable. So, one can only assume that you just don't like my sources because they refute what you're saying. But you've offered no information to suggest they're not reliable, or documented a single instance where they have been incorrect. This is all to common in our political discourse-- and I realize it happens on the right, too. But I will read HuffPo, Salon, and watch MSNBC. I will listen to both sides. You will not. You just want to cite your own situation-- anecdotal. You want to "shout down" my information by saying, "Your sources are right wing" (and therefore wrong?), and you don't want to actually engage, make a coherent point, and offer documentation for what you're saying.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 16, 2011 9:37:21 GMT -5
BUZZZZZZZ!!!!!
Oh, I'm sorry, but that's incorrect. Thank you for playing.
If I show up with a gun and take your $1,000; but I throw you back $200 you did not "get" $200 from me.
I TOOK $800 from YOU.
Corporations do not "get" tax money. Corporations PAY tax money.
And there is no such thing as taxing corporations anyway. Because corporations do not actually exist. They are legal fictions. Not real persons. They are MADE UP OF real persons-- and it's PEOPLE that we tax.
A corporation that has a cost structure of $1 for every widget they sell to the consumers has their costs increased when taxes are increased. Taxes are just a line item expense. When costs go up-- prices go up.
You raise producer's costs, you raise prices.
Consumers ultimately pay ALL the taxes.
If they can't raise prices to account for costs and leave some profit on the table, then they go out of business. They stop making widgets, and now widget aren't expensive, they aren't available.
Taxes hurt everyone.
Tax breakes HELP everyone.
There's no such thing as "giving" a company a "tax break" there is only TAKING MORE, or TAKING LESS.
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floridayankee
Junior Associate
If You Don't Stand Behind Our Troops, Feel Free to Stand in Front of Them.
Joined: Dec 20, 2010 14:56:05 GMT -5
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Post by floridayankee on Mar 16, 2011 10:26:50 GMT -5
If I show up with a gun and take your $1,000; but I throw you back $200 you did not "get" $200 from me.
I TOOK $800 from YOU. I'd say if they're walking around with $1k cash, they must be an evil, rich person and would then deserve to have their money taken and redistributed. I say you toss that $200 to the homeless guy on the corner and recklessly spend the rest.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
Distinguished Associate
Joined: Dec 21, 2010 11:59:07 GMT -5
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Favorite Drink: Sweetwater 420
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Mar 16, 2011 10:31:30 GMT -5
If I show up with a gun and take your $1,000; but I throw you back $200 you did not "get" $200 from me.
I TOOK $800 from YOU. I'd say if they're walking around with $1k cash, they must be an evil, rich person and would then deserve to have their money taken and redistributed. I say you toss that $200 to the homeless guy on the corner and recklessly spend the rest. And borow another $1,000 on the account of the person I just took the $1,000 from...
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