Had to reduce retirement savings

[Deleted]

I felt like such a YM failure today, but I had to cut back on my 457. I earn $5000 a month, but I only manage to take home $2100 of it. I was saving $100 here (529), $541 there (Roth), $50 here (dog's savings), $125 there (extra principal), $100 here (Christmas Club), $500 there (regular savings), $175 here (FSA), $400 (457) there . . . well, you get the idea.  And then I needed to increase my income tax withholdings!

I literally have $200 to buy groceries with this month.  That's all I can buy except gas unless I hit my savings, and it isn't even Feb. 1.  That is all I have to buy with it (money is already subtracted out in my budget for everything else including gas and utilities), but that majorly sux.

I am all for making yourself artificially poor to help save $$$, but I took it to an extreme that I can't handle.  It's fine and easily correctible.  It isn't like really being poor.  And keeping the grocery budget in check will be good for me.

But has anyone else saved themselves into "poverty"?

[Blonde Granny]

Poverty was what we had when first married in 1964. DH cleared $29 every 2 weeks from the Air Force and I had a fulltime job paying $200/mo. Some days he had to hitch hike to the base and I rode the bus for $.05 each way because we didn't have enough money for gas, after all it was about $ .25/gal.

I fear starting Febr. 1 this YNAB is going to send us into the poverty line. We've committed to living within the projected spending plan, but I don't know how long DH is going to be willing to go along with it.  I think our cash account will be raided to help cover some of the required (lol) spending.

You'll make it through Susana, it just feels scary at this point. Take a deep breath, have some wine and things will look brighter tomorrow.

[Plain Old Petunia]

You're not a failure, SS.         You're saving what you reasonably can.   What more can anyone ask?

[Bonny]

I'd cut back the principal payment vs your retirement savings. Otherwise I think you're doing a fantastic job saving; you're saving something like 40% of your gross salary.

[Deleted]

When I first started to max my 401k many years ago I really struggled with what was left over and had to finally cut back when the ex's car shot craps. It took 3 years to get back.

[dancinmama]

We used to "budget" by self-imposed scarcity.  We decided how much we wanted to save and had to make the rest stretch throughout the month.   Knowing that we had the money in the bank IF we needed it for anything, made it easier.

[Knee Deep in Water Chloe]

I was going to say the same thing about the principal payment that Bonny did. 
I'm sorry you're frustrated. How much longer do you plan to teach?

[resolution]

I don't have things as regimented and highly organized as you do, but I move $1500 into Vanguard every month and send an extra $500 to the mortgage. I also have some pre-tax deductions from my pay check. If it turns out that we have extra money in savings I move it out into Vanguard. Unfortunately I develop a spending problem if my bank balance gets too high, so I have to keep it low enough to feel broke and keep my spending in check.

You mentioned sending $500 a month into regular savings... That wouldn't be safe for me because I would see it in the bank and feel like I had extra money. I would recommend that you cut back on the principle payments and the regular savings until your grocery budget is healthier.

You should also have some fun money. I have had too many coworkers die before retirement to believe in saving all the fun for later.

[Deleted]

I increased the 457 in Sept. by $150 so that's why I selected it.   The principal reduction is to pay the house off when I am 72, rather than 77.  Think of it as a form of diversification in my retirement plan.   

Oh, I forgot to mention that there are a couple of built-in cheats.  The most important one is that DH pays when we go out to eat whereas I buy groceries.  So I still get a little fun.     

You guys made me feel better.  I just hate going backwards!  It isn't entirely my fault.  The state unexpectedly cut back on online classes in Sept.  I also gave up Sat. School because it had become so hit or miss.  I always banked these extra $$$. 

[teen persuasion]

DH switched jobs, and unfortunately he now pays more for health insurance than before.  We've also switched to maxing the HSA.  It is killing me to stop maxing his 401k, but if we did, his take home would be under $200.  Just not realistic.  At least the shift to HSA partially makes up for it, since it saves FICA and is still savings, and he has a tiny match on his 401k now, but he has to wait a few years for it to vest.

[Deleted]

Jan 31, 2015 18:20:25 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

DH switched jobs, and unfortunately he now pays more for health insurance than before.  We've also switched to maxing the HSA.  It is killing me to stop maxing his 401k, but if we did, his take home would be under $200.  Just not realistic.  At least the shift to HSA partially makes up for it, since it saves FICA and is still savings, and he has a tiny match on his 401k now, but he has to wait a few years for it to vest.

Ok, that would be horrific. 

You just made my taking home "only" $2100 of my $5000 paycheck . . . and still having to pay the house payment, the utilities, the Roth, the 429, the dog's account, etc. . . . seem like I'm rolling in $$$.

  My condolences to your DH.  It is difficult to work for peanuts even if it really means that all the deductions are coming out of one paycheck. 

[teen persuasion]

Jan 31, 2015 19:12:44 GMT -5 @southernsusana said:

Jan 31, 2015 18:20:25 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

DH switched jobs, and unfortunately he now pays more for health insurance than before.  We've also switched to maxing the HSA.  It is killing me to stop maxing his 401k, but if we did, his take home would be under $200.  Just not realistic.  At least the shift to HSA partially makes up for it, since it saves FICA and is still savings, and he has a tiny match on his 401k now, but he has to wait a few years for it to vest.

Ok, that would be horrific. 

You just made my taking home "only" $2100 of my $5000 paycheck . . . and still having to pay the house payment, the utilities, the Roth, the 429, the dog's account, etc. . . . seem like I'm rolling in $$$.

  My condolences to your DH.  It is difficult to work for peanuts even if it really means that all the deductions are coming out of one paycheck. 

Well, there is still my paycheck, too, but I'm only part time.  I'd love to fund a 401k for me, but have no option to do that.

[Deleted]

Jan 31, 2015 19:17:56 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

Jan 31, 2015 19:12:44 GMT -5 @southernsusana said:

Ok, that would be horrific. 

You just made my taking home "only" $2100 of my $5000 paycheck . . . and still having to pay the house payment, the utilities, the Roth, the 429, the dog's account, etc. . . . seem like I'm rolling in $$$.

  My condolences to your DH.  It is difficult to work for peanuts even if it really means that all the deductions are coming out of one paycheck. 

Well, there is still my paycheck, too, but I'm only part time.  I'd love to fund a 401k for me, but have no option to do that.

Is there no way to start a small retirement account for YOU?

Hindsight being perfect and all, all the retirement $$$ being in his account wasn't the best idea. We were married almost 25 years.  

Fortunately, i had (have) time to do my own 25 years.  But no way everything would ever be in one person's name again.  I had to retitle my car in my name, and I entered the marriage with a paid-for car!

[teen persuasion]

Jan 31, 2015 20:49:57 GMT -5 @southernsusana said:

Jan 31, 2015 19:17:56 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

Well, there is still my paycheck, too, but I'm only part time.  I'd love to fund a 401k for me, but have no option to do that.

Is there no way to start a small retirement account for YOU?

Hindsight being perfect and all, all the retirement $$$ being in his account wasn't the best idea. We were married almost 25 years.  

Fortunately, i had (have) time to do my own 25 years.  But no way everything would ever be in one person's name again.  I ad to retitle my car in my name, and I entered the marriage with a paid-for car!

I'm funding a Roth IRA for me (and we fund one for him, too, we're playing catchup and trying to diversify), so I have something, but I would prefer things more even.  I've tried convincing my employer to start something, 401k or 403b, but the board shot it down.  I'm guessing they think it is too expensive (our budget is quite low, and they are leery to put an increased budget up to a public vote just yet).  The board is also preoccupied with selecting a new director - we shall see if lack of benefits influences things once they begin interviewing candidates.

[DVM gone riding]

Jan 30, 2015 20:59:28 GMT -5 Bonny said:

I'd cut back the principal payment vs your retirement savings. Otherwise I think you're doing a fantastic job saving; you're saving something like 40% of your gross salary.

and i would cut the Christmas club and or the 529. I know you have a bunch of grandkids but its their parents responsibility not yours to provide for them .

[Deleted]

Feb 1, 2015 16:15:22 GMT -5 DVM gone riding said:

Jan 30, 2015 20:59:28 GMT -5 Bonny said:

I'd cut back the principal payment vs your retirement savings. Otherwise I think you're doing a fantastic job saving; you're saving something like 40% of your gross salary.

and i would cut the Christmas club and or the 529. I know you have a bunch of grandkids but its their parents responsibility not yours to provide for them .

The Christmas Club is the last thing I want to cut . . . next to my Roth and the flex account. I have eight grandchildren.   Coincidentally, the car insurances and tag registration both come due in January as well. It was also when I got notified of an escrow shortage.

I can't imagine going into December without the CC. In fact, I increased it $20 a month to cover some of the items mentioned above as well.  The toy sales were so good this past year that we actually managed to pick up their birthday presents as well.

The 529 is actually a lot less than I used to put in.   I hope that each ends up with about $2500 as a nice graduation gift.  I have no delusions of funding eight college educations at that rate.  

As I said, I only recently bumped the 457, not knowing that I would not be doing online teaching or eventually even Saturday School.  It is a minor part of my retirement planning.  I also contribute to a defined benefit plan (pension) and the Roth.  So I was wrong.  I also recently bumped the personal savings by the same amount ($150).  Something had to give.  And at this age, the tax deferred part isn't as big a deal.

I won't be eating cat food. 

[Blonde Granny]

Susana, April each year is our big month: Car, home, umbrella insurance. Then comes along IRS and Arkansas quarterly tax payments. Real estate taxes and we can't forget personal property taxes.

Even though we escrow for all that, it still causes my hands to shake when I write out all those checks.

[DagnyT]

Feb 1, 2015 14:21:02 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

Jan 31, 2015 20:49:57 GMT -5 @southernsusana said:

Is there no way to start a small retirement account for YOU?

Hindsight being perfect and all, all the retirement $$$ being in his account wasn't the best idea. We were married almost 25 years.  

Fortunately, i had (have) time to do my own 25 years.  But no way everything would ever be in one person's name again.  I ad to retitle my car in my name, and I entered the marriage with a paid-for car!

I'm funding a Roth IRA for me (and we fund one for him, too, we're playing catchup and trying to diversify), so I have something, but I would prefer things more even.  I've tried convincing my employer to start something, 401k or 403b, but the board shot it down.  I'm guessing they think it is too expensive (our budget is quite low, and they are leery to put an increased budget up to a public vote just yet).  The board is also preoccupied with selecting a new director - we shall see if lack of benefits influences things once they begin interviewing candidates.

Teen persuasion,

Are you applying for the director's position?

[teen persuasion]

Feb 1, 2015 20:02:37 GMT -5 DagnyT said:

Feb 1, 2015 14:21:02 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

I'm funding a Roth IRA for me (and we fund one for him, too, we're playing catchup and trying to diversify), so I have something, but I would prefer things more even.  I've tried convincing my employer to start something, 401k or 403b, but the board shot it down.  I'm guessing they think it is too expensive (our budget is quite low, and they are leery to put an increased budget up to a public vote just yet).  The board is also preoccupied with selecting a new director - we shall see if lack of benefits influences things once they begin interviewing candidates.

Teen persuasion,

Are you applying for the director's position?

No, the board is considering only candidates with an MLIS and state certification.

I am watching the selection process, and asking lots of questions.  I am wondering just how high the board will have to go with salary.  They did not specify that on the job description, and had several out of state applicants.  We all doubt anyone would move for the $35k they want to offer, especially with no benefits.

I am planning on reshaping/redefining my role at the library when the new director is in place.  Since was hired, I have taken on new duties that previously didn't exist here, like handling all social media for the library, and all computer tech issues.

[HoneyBBQ]

Groceries >>> 529 plans and extra towards your mortgage.

You need to eat, woman!

[HoneyBBQ]

Feb 1, 2015 14:25:07 GMT -5 alwaysbeoptimizing said:

It's easy to go crazy. I make 15k per month but net 3,500

Details needed.

[gooddecisions]

Feb 2, 2015 10:54:39 GMT -5 HoneyBBQ said:

Feb 1, 2015 14:25:07 GMT -5 alwaysbeoptimizing said:

It's easy to go crazy. I make 15k per month but net 3,500

Details needed.

Agreed. I'm wondering if his allowances are also at 0 and he's getting big refunds. I max my 401K, dependent care FSA and HSA. I have insurance deductions and prepaid legal services and still manage to bring home $3200/month. I don't make half that salary. Are you making huge contributions to United Way, PAC, ASC, union fees, additional time off? Do you have garnishments? What gives?

[Lizard Queen]

Feb 2, 2015 10:52:58 GMT -5 HoneyBBQ said:

Groceries >>> 529 plans and extra towards your mortgage.

You need to eat, woman!

True, but sometimes it's good to cut down and go through your pantry/freezer too.

[Deleted]

Feb 2, 2015 11:19:26 GMT -5 gooddecisions said:

Feb 2, 2015 10:54:39 GMT -5 HoneyBBQ said:

Details needed.

Agreed. I'm wondering if his allowances are also at 0 and he's getting big refunds. I max my 401K, dependent care FSA and HSA. I have insurance deductions and prepaid legal services and still manage to bring home $3200/month. I don't make half that salary. Are you making huge contributions to United Way, PAC, ASC, union fees, additional time off? Do you have garnishments? What gives?

I think he just means he's saving a crap ton.  We can have 529 and two savings accounts in addition to our regular payroll deductions directly taken out of our checks.

[DagnyT]

Feb 1, 2015 20:02:37 GMT -5 DagnyT said:

Feb 1, 2015 14:21:02 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

I'm funding a Roth IRA for me (and we fund one for him, too, we're playing catchup and trying to diversify), so I have something, but I would prefer things more even.  I've tried convincing my employer to start something, 401k or 403b, but the board shot it down.  I'm guessing they think it is too expensive (our budget is quite low, and they are leery to put an increased budget up to a public vote just yet).  The board is also preoccupied with selecting a new director - we shall see if lack of benefits influences things once they begin interviewing candidates.

Teen persuasion,

Are you applying for the director's position?

Sorry to hear that. I think you would make a good director. Best of luck with the new boss. I hope he/she is a supportive supervisor and is willing to do all that is necessary to provide excellent library services to your community.

[DagnyT]

Feb 2, 2015 10:33:32 GMT -5 teen persuasion said:

Feb 1, 2015 20:02:37 GMT -5 DagnyT said:

Teen persuasion,

Are you applying for the director's position?

No, the board is considering only candidates with an MLIS and state certification.

I am watching the selection process, and asking lots of questions.  I am wondering just how high the board will have to go with salary.  They did not specify that on the job description, and had several out of state applicants.  We all doubt anyone would move for the $35k they want to offer, especially with no benefits.

I am planning on reshaping/redefining my role at the library when the new director is in place.  Since was hired, I have taken on new duties that previously didn't exist here, like handling all social media for the library, and all computer tech issues.

Sorry to hear that. I think you would make a good director. Best of luck with the new boss. I hope he/she is a supportive supervisor and is willing to do all that is necessary to provide excellent library services to your community.

ETA: Oops, I quoted the wrong post. Hopes this clarifies the conversation.

[teen persuasion]

Thanks, DagnyT !

[swasat]

Ok, I have to be blunt and ask.

Why would you reduce your retirement savings , but not cut out the 529 contribution for your grandchildren??

[HoneyBBQ]

Feb 2, 2015 11:29:41 GMT -5 minnesotapaintlady said:

Feb 2, 2015 11:19:26 GMT -5 gooddecisions said:

Agreed. I'm wondering if his allowances are also at 0 and he's getting big refunds. I max my 401K, dependent care FSA and HSA. I have insurance deductions and prepaid legal services and still manage to bring home $3200/month. I don't make half that salary. Are you making huge contributions to United Way, PAC, ASC, union fees, additional time off? Do you have garnishments? What gives?

I think he just means he's saving a crap ton.  We can have 529 and two savings accounts in addition to our regular payroll deductions directly taken out of our checks.

I wouldn't personally refer to after-tax savings as something I don't "bring home."  I would just say I divert it instantly. That's why I was curious.  But perhaps you are right. 

[HoneyBBQ]

Feb 2, 2015 15:53:22 GMT -5 alwaysbeoptimizing said:

I should probably do up a budget on here, but worried i'm be torn into by the snipers who want to tear anyone down that makes more than they do. (I've seen it happen.)minnesotapaintlady HoneyBBQ  

I posted a vague-ish budget (because that's what I have) once and while people were  , in general, they were not rude about it and said expenses seemed reasonable considering HCOL/high income, etc. At least, I don't remember getting torn down. If I did, I recovered nicely.

I mean, honestly, you and I are not even close to top 20% earners compared to over on bogleheads... part of it is where we live, and salaries are higher because there isn't a house in 20 square miles from downtown seattle that costs less than 500,000. Things are skewed. 

And in general I think we both post enough here that people "know" us and know we're down to earth and not posting to make anyone feel bad, etc.