"Rape Culture" Claims Obscure True Dangers To Young Women

[steff]

If there's no actual NO- it's not rape.

(Reuters) - California Governor Jerry Brown on Sunday signed a law requiring all state colleges to adopt a policy of unambiguous, affirmative consent by students engaged in sexual activity, part of a nationwide effort to curb sexual assault on U.S. campuses.

California's so-called "yes means yes" law will be the first in the nation to make affirmative consent language a central tenet of school sexual assault policies, proponents said.

The legislation, passed by the California State Senate last month, defines consent as "an affirmative, conscious and voluntary agreement to engage in sexual activity."

It also states that silence and a lack of resistance do not signify consent and that drugs or alcohol do not excuse unwanted sexual activity.

www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/29/us-usa-california-sexcrimes-idUSKCN0HO07D20140929

[EVT1]

Sept 29, 2014 21:36:11 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

Sept 29, 2014 21:18:47 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

     "Despite hysterical propaganda about our “rape culture,” the majority of campus incidents being carelessly described as sexual assault are not felonious rape (involving force or drugs) but oafish hookup melodramas, arising from mixed signals and imprudence on both sides."

Ahhhh- imprudence on both sides   Mixed signals   She said no but her eyes said yes   Oafish hookups  

So how many males are claiming sexual assault or rape?

And how many women are crying rape instead of admitting buyer's remorse?  Men don't claim rape, because for the most part- they want sex.  With rare exceptions, men have a much stronger drive to "hook up" than women.  For men, sex is celebrated- high fives, fist bumps, etc.  Hey- not the way I personally view it, but I'm not an idiot.  I know the world around me and how it works.  Women like sex, too-- but for women, it's a much more valuable commodity.  And there's still a stigma associated with women having a one night stand.  It's the old stud vs. slut double standard we've always had.  Even if a man is branded a slut, they wear it like a badge of honor.  Men actually train to sell women on having sex with them.  There are pickup artists whose stock and trade is teaching men how to practically hypnotize women into bed with them.  I've never met a man who regretted having sex the night before.  Not one.  In fact, for the most part men brag about having sex the night before whether or not they even did.  I don't think real rape is that complicated.  I get that "no means no".  But a makeout session that perhaps unexpectedly goes too far, and is later regretted is not rape.  Not even a little bit.  If there's no actual NO- it's not rape.  If there's a no, followed by a yes of any kind, including implied by actions, that's not rape.  What you gotta worry about is our increasingly barbaric culture that is no longer surprised by the knockout game, or workplace beheadings, and school shootings.  That's the real threat.  Increasingly brazenly evil people out to do you real serious harm. To kidnap you, violently rape you- perhaps more than once over a long period of time, and then kill you.  Not some drunk ass at the sports bar trying to get some that you were too hammered to say no to.

Got it- and just what I thought.  A threatened republican dealing with a woman that has her own opinion and sexuality.  Brrrrrr!  Hope every minute you can't find your wife you fear you are being cuckolded by Obama   And I am sure the women appreciate you speaking for them

[Green Eyed Lady]

Paul?  What are your qualifications...your experience, if you will, to demonstrate that you actually DO know shit from shinola on this particular subject?

[djAdvocate]

Sept 29, 2014 22:04:25 GMT -5 steff said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:02:52 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

Paul?  What are your qualifications...your experience, if you will, to demonstrate that you actually DO know shit from shinola on this particular subject?

He has a dick, therefore he knows more than any woman who has ever dared to breathe male dominated air & not fall to her knees out of gratefulness.

<guffaw>

reason #73 to leave the GOP: in discussions like this, the loudest voices from my party have all the hair missing from their knuckles dragging so much.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Sept 29, 2014 21:56:25 GMT -5 steff said:

If there's no actual NO- it's not rape.

(Reuters) - California Governor Jerry Brown on Sunday signed a law requiring all state colleges to adopt a policy of unambiguous, affirmative consent by students engaged in sexual activity, part of a nationwide effort to curb sexual assault on U.S. campuses.

California's so-called "yes means yes" law will be the first in the nation to make affirmative consent language a central tenet of school sexual assault policies, proponents said.

The legislation, passed by the California State Senate last month, defines consent as "an affirmative, conscious and voluntary agreement to engage in sexual activity."

It also states that silence and a lack of resistance do not signify consent and that drugs or alcohol do not excuse unwanted sexual activity.

www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/29/us-usa-california-sexcrimes-idUSKCN0HO07D20140929

I agree that drugs and alcohol do not equate to permission, but if you're gettin' busy and you're not saying no, or resisting in any way- how exactly are you not saying yes?  I think it's absurd that we've gotten to the point where we have dumbed down rape to the point where we're talking "yes means yes" proposals.  But then, this is liberalism in full bloom.  We're going to have to stop the action and whip out a contract- not just this time, but every time, and that will include married couples.

[Deleted]

Sept 29, 2014 21:52:31 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Sept 29, 2014 21:36:11 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

And how many women are crying rape instead of admitting buyer's remorse? 

i'm thinking a number approaching zero.  what are you thinking? 

That's somewhat meaningless... no matter what the discussion topic.

If one started counting at 5,000,000,000... any number BELOW that is "a number approaching zero"... because it's headed in the direction OF zero (ergo "approaching"), as opposed to getting larger.

[mmhmm]

Sept 29, 2014 22:09:19 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

Sept 29, 2014 21:56:25 GMT -5 steff said:

(Reuters) - California Governor Jerry Brown on Sunday signed a law requiring all state colleges to adopt a policy of unambiguous, affirmative consent by students engaged in sexual activity, part of a nationwide effort to curb sexual assault on U.S. campuses.

California's so-called "yes means yes" law will be the first in the nation to make affirmative consent language a central tenet of school sexual assault policies, proponents said.

The legislation, passed by the California State Senate last month, defines consent as "an affirmative, conscious and voluntary agreement to engage in sexual activity."

It also states that silence and a lack of resistance do not signify consent and that drugs or alcohol do not excuse unwanted sexual activity.

www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/29/us-usa-california-sexcrimes-idUSKCN0HO07D20140929

I agree that drugs and alcohol do not equate to permission, but if you're gettin' busy and you're not saying no, or resisting in any way- how exactly are you not saying yes?  I think it's absurd that we've gotten to the point where we have dumbed down rape to the point where we're talking "yes means yes" proposals.  But then, this is liberalism in full bloom.  We're going to have to stop the action and whip out a contract- not just this time, but every time, and that will include married couples.

Has it ever occurred to you that a woman being raped may well not resist, and may well not say anything at all?  Has it maybe dawned on you she might be afraid to move?

[djAdvocate]

Sept 29, 2014 22:14:55 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

Sept 29, 2014 21:52:31 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

i'm thinking a number approaching zero.  what are you thinking? 

That's somewhat meaningless... no matter what the discussion topic.

If one started counting at 5,000,000,000... any number BELOW that is "a number approaching zero"... because it's headed in the direction OF zero (ergo "approaching"), as opposed to getting larger.

sorry, i was using terminology from limit theory:

lim x>0 (limit as x approaches zero)

do you know it?  if not, i will explain it. 

edit: i can assure you, it is not meaningless.  it is actually deeply meaningful, and quite specific.

[justme]

God, this shit almost makes me fucking embarrassed to say I'm a conservative. Granted I'm more libertarian than republican, but still OMFG! Seriously?!?! If I had a roommate they would think I'm having a seizure over the number of times I've rolled my eyes. 

Men don't claim rape,

False. Thanks for trying to play though. In that way they give every kid a participation trophy now. 

With rare exceptions, men have a much stronger drive to "hook up" than women.

Well that either speaks to your inexperience with enough women or a willingly admittance to stick your fingers in your ear while you sing. 

Women like sex, too-- but for women, it's a much more valuable commodity.

And who makes it more valuable for them? 

And there's still a stigma associated with women having a one night stand.

See above.

Men actually train to sell women on having sex with them.

Some train how to force it on them, but tomato tomatah.

In fact, for the most part men brag about having sex the night before whether or not they even did.

Class acts if I ever heard of one!

But a makeout session that perhaps unexpectedly goes too far, and is later regretted is not rape.

I mean, if she pushes you off her in the course of it that's her just playing hard to get. Or the fact that she says no but didn't directly kick you in thenuts means she really didn't mean it. Or the fact that she kept moving her head (because that's the only thing she could move) and say stop means nothing. Or the fact that eventually she stops fighting because fighting just makes it a) worse and b) hurt more (because trying to kick/move a guy off you when he weighs more than you and is pressing all his weight down on you WILL hurt)

If there's a no, followed by a yes of any kind, including implied by actions, that's not rape.

By actions? Does her giving up count as an "action" that gives permission? How about if the guys legs are keeping her from moving her legs and he's holding her arms so she can't move, is her lack of moving an "implied action". God, I hope you fucking don't have a daughter.

Not some drunk ass at the sports bar trying to get some that you were too hammered to say no to.

Cuz he's not a fucking asshole and deserves jail time? Really? So a guy purposefully gets a girl to a point where she CAN'T consent and it's her fault for letting him get her to that point? Because, why? There's no good reason why. Because you know why? There would be next to no rapes if our culture fucking stood behind the fact that women aren't men's play things and respected them as people and didn't bestow upon them the right to keep their virtue. If society took even half as much time to beat men over the head of not sleeping with someone they barely know, has had any drinks, or to acknowledge the "actions" that are telling you to leave her the fuck alone I think the rape rates would plummet. 

*I'll edit the cursing if needed, but dammit I felt it was needed.

[Deleted]

Sept 29, 2014 22:17:18 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:14:55 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

That's somewhat meaningless... no matter what the discussion topic.

If one started counting at 5,000,000,000... any number BELOW that is "a number approaching zero"... because it's headed in the direction OF zero (ergo "approaching"), as opposed to getting larger.

sorry, i was using a phrase from limit theory:

lim x>0

do you know it?  if not, i will explain it. 

edit: i can assure you, it is not meaningless.  it is actually deeply meaningful, and quite specific.

I'm a programmer (as a hobby) so I understand the concept... I just don't like it due to it's imprecision.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Sept 29, 2014 22:16:55 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:09:19 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

I agree that drugs and alcohol do not equate to permission, but if you're gettin' busy and you're not saying no, or resisting in any way- how exactly are you not saying yes?  I think it's absurd that we've gotten to the point where we have dumbed down rape to the point where we're talking "yes means yes" proposals.  But then, this is liberalism in full bloom.  We're going to have to stop the action and whip out a contract- not just this time, but every time, and that will include married couples.

Has it ever occurred to you that a woman being raped may well not resist, and may well not say anything at all?  Has it maybe dawned on you she might be afraid to move?

Yeah, if it's a woman being raped.  If it's a woman making out with a guy she voluntarily started making out with, and things progress, and she does not offer a no, or any resistance- that's a yes.

[Green Eyed Lady]

Sept 29, 2014 22:16:55 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:09:19 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

I agree that drugs and alcohol do not equate to permission, but if you're gettin' busy and you're not saying no, or resisting in any way- how exactly are you not saying yes?  I think it's absurd that we've gotten to the point where we have dumbed down rape to the point where we're talking "yes means yes" proposals.  But then, this is liberalism in full bloom.  We're going to have to stop the action and whip out a contract- not just this time, but every time, and that will include married couples.

Has it ever occurred to you that a woman being raped may well not resist, and may well not say anything at all?  Has it maybe dawned on you she might be afraid to move?

Keep that in mind if you are ever being robbed at gunpoint.  If you don't scream your head off and don't try to kick him in the balls, you secretly want to get robbed and are, therefore, giving consent to be robbed.  If you do as you are told, hoping to not get shot, you are just asking for it, lady!

Why do I let this stuff raise my BP?  Now I have a headache. 

[djAdvocate]

Sept 29, 2014 22:19:35 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:17:18 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

sorry, i was using a phrase from limit theory:

lim x>0

do you know it?  if not, i will explain it. 

edit: i can assure you, it is not meaningless.  it is actually deeply meaningful, and quite specific.

I'm a programmer (as a hobby) so I understand the concept... I just don't like it due to it's imprecision.

it is not imprecise.  what i was saying is that i think it is a very low number- something NEAR TO ZERO.  i apologize if that was unclear.

edit: i meant it in the same sense as this: my mom is approaching the end of her life.  you would not say that of a teenager, even though, logically, it is just as much true for them.

PS- limit theory generally gives exact results. 

[mmhmm]

Sept 29, 2014 22:21:50 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:16:55 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

Has it ever occurred to you that a woman being raped may well not resist, and may well not say anything at all?  Has it maybe dawned on you she might be afraid to move?

Keep that in mind if you are ever being robbed at gunpoint.  If you don't scream your head off and don't try to kick him in the balls, you secretly want to get robbed and are, therefore, giving consent to be robbed.  If you do as you are told, hoping to not get shot, you are just asking for it, lady!

Why do I let this stuff raise my BP?  Now I have a headache. 

It's one of my hot buttons, as well, GEL. My daughter was instructed not to fight back. She was told, distinctly, to go limp. I knew we could deal with a loss of virginity a lot more easily than we could deal with severe injury or death!

[Deleted]

Sept 29, 2014 22:21:50 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:16:55 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

Has it ever occurred to you that a woman being raped may well not resist, and may well not say anything at all?  Has it maybe dawned on you she might be afraid to move?

Keep that in mind if you are ever being robbed at gunpoint.  If you don't scream your head off and don't try to kick him in the balls, you secretly want to get robbed and are, therefore, giving consent to be robbed.  If you do as you are told, hoping to not get shot, you are just asking for it, lady!

Why do I let this stuff raise my BP?  Now I have a headache. 

That's a stupid comparison. I can't think of anyone (man OR woman) that WANTS to be robbed... I can think of many women that want to have sex.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

God, this shit almost makes me fucking embarrassed to say I'm a conservative. Granted I'm more libertarian than republican, but still OMFG! Seriously?!?! If I had a roommate they would think I'm having a seizure over the number of times I've rolled my eyes.

Funny you should bring up libertarian. The WOMAN I got this article from is a LIBERTARIAN / ANARCHIST. She posted it on her facebook page, and she seems to have had no problem grasping the point of the article.

"Misled by the naive optimism and “You go, girl!” boosterism of their upbringing, young women do not see the animal eyes glowing at them in the dark. They assume that bared flesh and sexy clothes are just a fashion statement containing no messages that might be misread and twisted by a psychotic. They do not understand the fragility of civilization and the constant nearness of savage nature."

Do you know what I posted in response to her? "I can already hear the shrill cries of "DON'T BLAME THE VICTIM!!!" - for the record she "liked" my comment.

[Deleted]

OMG.

[mmhmm]

Sept 29, 2014 22:20:35 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:16:55 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

Has it ever occurred to you that a woman being raped may well not resist, and may well not say anything at all?  Has it maybe dawned on you she might be afraid to move?

Yeah, if it's a woman being raped.  If it's a woman making out with a guy she voluntarily started making out with, and things progress, and she does not offer a no, or any resistance- that's a yes.

No, it's not. A "yes" is a yes. If the woman in question has not agreed to have sex, there has been no "yes".

[mmhmm]

Sept 29, 2014 22:24:20 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:21:50 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

Keep that in mind if you are ever being robbed at gunpoint.  If you don't scream your head off and don't try to kick him in the balls, you secretly want to get robbed and are, therefore, giving consent to be robbed.  If you do as you are told, hoping to not get shot, you are just asking for it, lady!

Why do I let this stuff raise my BP?  Now I have a headache. 

That's a stupid comparison. I can't think of anyone (man OR woman) that WANTS to be robbed... I can think of many women that want to have sex.

If she wants to have sex, she'll do so voluntarily and with pleasure, I'm sure. She will not do so by lying there like a shot frog, Richard.

[mmhmm]

Sept 29, 2014 22:24:30 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

God, this shit almost makes me fucking embarrassed to say I'm a conservative. Granted I'm more libertarian than republican, but still OMFG! Seriously?!?! If I had a roommate they would think I'm having a seizure over the number of times I've rolled my eyes.

Funny you should bring up libertarian. The WOMAN I got this article from is a LIBERTARIAN / ANARCHIST. She posted it on her facebook page, and she seems to have had no problem grasping the point of the article.

"Misled by the naive optimism and “You go, girl!” boosterism of their upbringing, young women do not see the animal eyes glowing at them in the dark. They assume that bared flesh and sexy clothes are just a fashion statement containing no messages that might be misread and twisted by a psychotic. They do not understand the fragility of civilization and the constant nearness of savage nature."

Do you know what I posted in response to her? "I can already hear the shrill cries of "DON'T BLAME THE VICTIM!!!" - for the record she "liked" my comment.

Why the hell would anybody care, paul, what this "woman" had to say, or what her reaction to your comment might have been? I know it doesn't make a particle of difference to me.

[Green Eyed Lady]

Sept 29, 2014 22:24:20 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:21:50 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

Keep that in mind if you are ever being robbed at gunpoint.  If you don't scream your head off and don't try to kick him in the balls, you secretly want to get robbed and are, therefore, giving consent to be robbed.  If you do as you are told, hoping to not get shot, you are just asking for it, lady!

Why do I let this stuff raise my BP?  Now I have a headache. 

That's a stupid comparison. I can't think of anyone (man OR woman) that WANTS to be robbed... I can think of many women that want to have sex.

I don't think we were talking about women who want to have sex.  We were talking about rape.  Let me be the first to say they are very definitely two different things. 

[Green Eyed Lady]

A shot frog?  LOL!

[steff]

Sept 29, 2014 22:18:27 GMT -5 justme said:

God, this shit almost makes me fucking embarrassed to say I'm a conservative. Granted I'm more libertarian than republican, but still OMFG! Seriously?!?! If I had a roommate they would think I'm having a seizure over the number of times I've rolled my eyes. 

Men don't claim rape,

False. Thanks for trying to play though. In that way they give every kid a participation trophy now. 

With rare exceptions, men have a much stronger drive to "hook up" than women.

Well that either speaks to your inexperience with enough women or a willingly admittance to stick your fingers in your ear while you sing. 

Women like sex, too-- but for women, it's a much more valuable commodity.

And who makes it more valuable for them? 

And there's still a stigma associated with women having a one night stand.

See above.

Men actually train to sell women on having sex with them.

Some train how to force it on them, but tomato tomatah.

In fact, for the most part men brag about having sex the night before whether or not they even did.

Class acts if I ever heard of one!

But a makeout session that perhaps unexpectedly goes too far, and is later regretted is not rape.

I mean, if she pushes you off her in the course of it that's her just playing hard to get. Or the fact that she says no but didn't directly kick you in thenuts means she really didn't mean it. Or the fact that she kept moving her head (because that's the only thing she could move) and say stop means nothing. Or the fact that eventually she stops fighting because fighting just makes it a) worse and b) hurt more (because trying to kick/move a guy off you when he weighs more than you and is pressing all his weight down on you WILL hurt)

If there's a no, followed by a yes of any kind, including implied by actions, that's not rape.

By actions? Does her giving up count as an "action" that gives permission? How about if the guys legs are keeping her from moving her legs and he's holding her arms so she can't move, is her lack of moving an "implied action". God, I hope you fucking don't have a daughter.

Not some drunk ass at the sports bar trying to get some that you were too hammered to say no to.

Cuz he's not a fucking asshole and deserves jail time? Really? So a guy purposefully gets a girl to a point where she CAN'T consent and it's her fault for letting him get her to that point? Because, why? There's no good reason why. Because you know why? There would be next to no rapes if our culture fucking stood behind the fact that women aren't men's play things and respected them as people and didn't bestow upon them the right to keep their virtue. If society took even half as much time to beat men over the head of not sleeping with someone they barely know, has had any drinks, or to acknowledge the "actions" that are telling you to leave her the fuck alone I think the rape rates would plummet. 

*I'll edit the cursing if needed, but dammit I felt it was needed.

I wish I could give you a standing ovation. 




But I'm a Liberal and if I do that, Paul will say I'm not really a Liberal because I agreed with what you said, even though what you said was 100% against the bullshit Paul calls his conservative values.  




But I still think you rock!

[steff]

Sept 29, 2014 22:24:20 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:21:50 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

Keep that in mind if you are ever being robbed at gunpoint.  If you don't scream your head off and don't try to kick him in the balls, you secretly want to get robbed and are, therefore, giving consent to be robbed.  If you do as you are told, hoping to not get shot, you are just asking for it, lady!

Why do I let this stuff raise my BP?  Now I have a headache. 

That's a stupid comparison. I can't think of anyone (man OR woman) that WANTS to be robbed... I can think of many women that want to have sex.

are you equating "having sex" with rape?   Because after Paul's bullshit, if this is what you are saying, I'm totally going nutso batshit crazy & will need a time out.

[Deleted]

Sept 29, 2014 22:27:25 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:24:20 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

That's a stupid comparison. I can't think of anyone (man OR woman) that WANTS to be robbed... I can think of many women that want to have sex.

If she wants to have sex, she'll do so voluntarily and with pleasure, I'm sure. She will not do so by lying there like a shot frog, Richard.

Missed the point.

"Silent and going along with what they tell you to do at gunpoint during a robbery" is considered trying to saving your life. Because no one wants to be robbed.

"Silent and going along with what's happening sexually" can be considered consent, absent any force or threat. Because humans (generally) want to have sex. Maybe "just laying there like a shot frog" is what they think they are supposed to do... because their parents taught them "it's bad, you should only do it this way". Maybe they aren't excited because "Bobby with the hot body" turns out to be "Mister Micro-Peen"... there are several reasons I can think of (and probably MANY, many more that escape me) for "less than active participation" that have nothing to do with unwillingness to participate.

[mmhmm]

Sept 29, 2014 22:32:30 GMT -5 Green Eyed Lady said:

A shot frog?  LOL!

That little bit was a gift from my crazy, red-haired aunt, God rest her soul. She was one funny woman! 

[Deleted]

Sept 29, 2014 22:36:56 GMT -5 steff said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:24:20 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

That's a stupid comparison. I can't think of anyone (man OR woman) that WANTS to be robbed... I can think of many women that want to have sex.

are you equating "having sex" with rape?   Because after Paul's bullshit, if this is what you are saying, I'm totally going nutso batshit crazy & will need a time out.

No. GEL was.

[djAdvocate]

the definition of rape is quite simple: sex without consent.  if you don't get it, spend more time thinking about it before you start talking as if you were an expert.  there is a whole range of activity that doesn't conform to consent.  it is ALL rape.

we can all spend hours on end here describing these cases, but it really is fairly simple and uncontroversial.

[steff]

Sept 29, 2014 22:24:30 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

God, this shit almost makes me fucking embarrassed to say I'm a conservative. Granted I'm more libertarian than republican, but still OMFG! Seriously?!?! If I had a roommate they would think I'm having a seizure over the number of times I've rolled my eyes.

Funny you should bring up libertarian. The WOMAN I got this article from is a LIBERTARIAN / ANARCHIST. She posted it on her facebook page, and she seems to have had no problem grasping the point of the article.

"Misled by the naive optimism and “You go, girl!” boosterism of their upbringing, young women do not see the animal eyes glowing at them in the dark. They assume that bared flesh and sexy clothes are just a fashion statement containing no messages that might be misread and twisted by a psychotic. They do not understand the fragility of civilization and the constant nearness of savage nature."

Do you know what I posted in response to her? "I can already hear the shrill cries of "DON'T BLAME THE VICTIM!!!" - for the record she "liked" my comment.

this can't be real....not in this day and age....there just can't be people who still think like this.  

[mmhmm]

Sept 29, 2014 22:37:12 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

Sept 29, 2014 22:27:25 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

If she wants to have sex, she'll do so voluntarily and with pleasure, I'm sure. She will not do so by lying there like a shot frog, Richard.

Missed the point.

"Silent and going along with what they tell you to do at gunpoint during a robbery" is considered trying to saving your life. Because no one wants to be robbed.

"Silent and going along with what's happening sexually" can be considered consent, absent any force or threat. Because humans (generally) want to have sex. Maybe "just laying there like a shot frog" is what they think they are supposed to do... because their parents taught them "it's bad, you should only do it this way". Maybe they aren't excited because "Bobby with the hot body" turns out to be "Mister Micro-Peen"... there are several reasons I can think of (and probably MANY, many more that escape me) for "less than active participation" that have nothing to do with unwillingness to participate.

WRONG! As I said, my daughter was instructed to simply go limp. "Do not fight. Do not struggle. We'll deal with it but you need to be alive for us to do so and I don't want you severely injured." Do you understand that, Richard? Silence is NOT consent.