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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2011 17:09:36 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2011 17:14:55 GMT -5
Islamic state "Meanwhile Libya’s deputy foreign minister told E.U. ambassadors in Tripoli al-Qaeda has set up an Islamic emirate in Derna, in eastern Libya, headed by a former U.S. prisoner at Guantanamo Bay, However, residents in the city have told reporters there is no substance to these rumors, which they claim the Libyan government is sowing to "scare Europe." "Al-Qaeda has established an emirate in Derna led by Abdelkarim al-Hasadi, a former Guantanamo detainee," Khaled Khaim said. "They have an FM radio station and have begun to impose the burqa" (head-to-toe covering for women) and have "executed people who refuse to cooperate with them." Khaim said Hasadi has a lieutenant, "also a member of al-Qaeda and named Kheirallah Baraassi" in al-Baida. Derna is the capital of a province by the same name in the region of Cyrenaica, some 1,250 kilometers (775 miles) east of Libya's capital Tripoli. Al-Baida lies about 100 kilometers west of Derna. Earlier, Italian Foreign Minister Francesco Franco Frattini said embattled Libyan leader Gaddafi had lost control of Cyrenaica and shared reports that an Islamic emirate had been declared there. Speaking at a meeting in Rome organized by the Community of Sant'Egidio, a Christian organisation, Frattini said here had been recent proclamations in Cyrenaica that it was now an Islamic emirate and calls to break with the West. "It is a worrying development if radical Islam is only a few hundred kilometers away from the European Union's front door, but nothing can justify the violent death of hundreds of innocent civilians," he added. www.alarabiya.net/articles/2011/02/23/138957.html
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2011 19:09:58 GMT -5
Is Obama going to bomb Libya? I'm remembering all the people that insisted Iraq was all about oil, when it was supposed to be about WMD, while it seemed to me to be about human rights. What did that last Obama speech a while ago mean? How far are they willing to go to stop this guy from killing his people? There's a lot of oil there....... Just wondering.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2011 19:41:55 GMT -5
www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/24/us-libya-usa-idUSTRE71K6D520110224Obama breaks silence, condemns Libya crackdown After days of cautious statements on the turmoil in Libya, U.S. officials steadily ratcheted up their rhetoric on Wednesday. Crowley said sanctions and freezing Libyan assets, including those belonging to Gaddafi, were among the options being considered by the United States. Sanctions alone would not have much impact -- U.S. exports to Libya were only $665 million in 2010, while U.S. aid amounted to less than $1 million. Analysts say getting international agreement on such measures will likely be difficult and take time. Obama said he had ordered his national security team to prepare the full range of options for dealing with the crisis. "It is imperative that the nations and peoples of the world speak with one voice," he said.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Feb 23, 2011 21:37:51 GMT -5
Frankly, I very much doubt that anything we might do will have any effect, whatsoever, on the goings on in Libya. Gadhafi doesn't care, and he's not going to start caring. He'll happily murder every living creature in his country to save his ego, and he's not going to stop. That's the long and the short of this guy.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Feb 23, 2011 21:53:30 GMT -5
He said he will die a martyr. Looks like he is fine with taking his country down with him. I've seen some pretty scary stuff on TV in the last few days about what is going to happen to the price of gas now because of this middle east stuff. I also heard that Venezuela is now choosing to sell the oil we need from them to China over the US. I feel like the US is being squeezed on all sides by the dangerous people we have been doing business with. Too bad all those deep water rigs in the gulf were shut down and have started moving to other countries. They might have been able to ramp up a take a little bit of the sting out of the coming leap in oil and gas prices. Your correct , that was Bushes fault , right?
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Feb 23, 2011 23:54:35 GMT -5
This report from "Debka" indicates Gadadi is abl to start regining control and is readying forces to retake cities taken by those who have been rising against his reign..military for the most part seems to be supporting him, and he has the weapons, Airforce and also hired merceneries to fight on his side. His threats to hang the ones caught in the uprising seem to have lessoned the crowds on the street. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- www.debka.com/article/20698/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Feb 24, 2011 0:15:01 GMT -5
American views of world politics and events are quite strange. Two years ago, he is considered a dangerous man with great influence around the world, and too dangerous to interfere with. Today, he is considered the Emporer wearing no clothes........ Somewhere in the middle lies the truth, but we in America, have for years considered Dictators in small countries to hold much more political influence than what these tyrants really do, outside of their borders, imho.
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floridayankee
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Post by floridayankee on Feb 24, 2011 9:24:04 GMT -5
Your correct , that was Bushes fault , right? Might as well be, you blame everything else on him. He's got broad shoulders...I'm sure he can handle it.
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Post by privateinvestor on Feb 24, 2011 9:43:14 GMT -5
Frankly, I very much doubt that anything we might do will have any effect, whatsoever, on the goings on in Libya. Gaddafi's doesn't care, and he's not going to start caring. He'll happily murder every living creature in his country to save his ego, and he's not going to stop. That's the long and the short of this guy. Not to worry Obama just announced he has instructed the State Dept to weight all options for the Libya crisis.....whatever that means? Take your best guess while the world watches to see what Obama will do with his bud Qaddafi who once said Obama is the best president of the USA in his lifetime.. Think I will have to disagree with Qaddafi's opinion on that one..
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wyouser
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Post by wyouser on Feb 24, 2011 12:02:34 GMT -5
Oh and guess what...refinery jobs and jobs in the coal fields pay a heck of a lot higher wages than working at MC Donalds Once the unions are broken they won't. Did you know that in the ship channel area, cheap welders were imported to work down there? I mean so cheap they lived in company provided quarters and were paid next to nothing, while welders here try to get work. Our people can't afford to work for $5 an hour unless the costs of everything is going to come down, what do you think the chances of that is?
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wyouser
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Post by wyouser on Feb 24, 2011 12:03:53 GMT -5
Wyoming is a right to work state. none of our coal mines or oil operations are unionized. wages in the mines are among the highest in the state.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2011 12:16:25 GMT -5
If Obama bombs him....that would be Obama's war, right, or would it still be Bush's?
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wyouser
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Post by wyouser on Feb 24, 2011 12:23:25 GMT -5
I dont know...Regan did it first...they will probably call it Regans war??
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wyouser
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Post by wyouser on Feb 24, 2011 12:26:58 GMT -5
Perhaps ....blame could be placed on Field Marshall Montgomery..he drove out the Italians and the Germans from Libya in 1943....
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Feb 24, 2011 12:53:56 GMT -5
Wyoming is a right to work state. none of our coal mines or oil operations are unionized. wages in the mines are among the highest in the state. Wow..that is all of $8.75 per hour.....
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2011 13:07:57 GMT -5
Wow, Dez- I just saw some video out of Libya. Nighttime, people running, shots, machine guns, fire, a car with people in it being run over by a tank. I've never been in a war, but it looked like what a war would look like to me. Terrible.
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wyouser
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Post by wyouser on Feb 24, 2011 13:27:05 GMT -5
miners wages are well in excess of $8.75 per hour. Since they were established in the 1970's wages have been high enough along with benefit packages that these guys have expressed little interest in even forming unions. I believe the coal produced in Wyoming already provides something close to 60% of the electricity in the whole country.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Feb 24, 2011 13:33:24 GMT -5
miners wages are well in excess of $8.75 per hour. Since they were established in the 1970's wages have been high enough along with benefit packages that these guys have expressed little interest in even forming unions. I believe the coal produced in Wyoming already provides something close to 60% of the electricity in the whole country. I know it's higher then $8.75 per...bet it's over $10.00 per...
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Feb 24, 2011 13:38:55 GMT -5
Here's the latest on Libya...it's getting bloody..if they pull out out ..the citizens...they will have earned their freedom with the blood of their people, very brave. The mobilized militiamen are really hired killers and they have no compulsion to hold their fire on basically unarmed civilians. Yet it seems the citizens are fighting back with personal arms, the few they have , hunting rifles and such against military arms. Some of the comments coming back from the family and Gaddafi's himself are so out of reality..in a way showing desperation. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110224/ap_on_re_af/af_libya--------------------------------------------------------------- Associated Press Paul Schemm And Maggie Michael, Associated Press – 1 hr 1 min ago BENGHAZI, Libya – Army units and militiamen loyal to Moammar Gadhafi struck back Thursday against rebellious Libyans who have risen up in cities close to the capital, attacking a mosque where many were holding an anti-government sit-in and battling others who seized control of an airport. Medical officials said 15 people were killed in the clashes. In a rambling phone call to state TV, Gadhafi accused al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden of being behind the uprising. The Libyan leader said the revolt that began Feb. 15 has been carried out by young men hopped up on hallucinogenic pills given to them "in their coffee with milk, like Nescafe." -------------------------------------------------------- Can you imagine a comment like this from some one in their right mind? "In a rambling phone call to state TV, Gadhafi accused al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden of being behind the uprising. The Libyan leader said the revolt that began Feb. 15 has been carried out by young men hopped up on hallucinogenic pills given to them "in their coffee with milk, like Nescafe." If this is TRUE...that is good news. "Gadhafi's control now has been reduced to the northwest corner around Tripoli, the southwest deserts and parts of the center. The uprisings in Misrata, Zawiya and several small towns between the capital and Tunisian border have further whittled away at that bastion." -------------------------------------------------------------------- International players are now getting involved , not just the USA...Europe gets a lot of oil from Libya..has a lot of connections with the regime so to expect a quick consensus of actions is possible not going to happen, though the following has been suggested , and if it was only the US with it's carriers who could practically carry it out, if ok's by the European nations, unlike our invasion of Iraq, so little support by major European nations, that would possible be the finish of Gaddafi if his Air Force was effectivly neutralized. Not beiing able to be used against the Libyan civilians who are in revolt. "Another proposal gaining some traction was for the United Nations to declare a no-fly zone over Libya to prevent it using warplanes to hit protesters. U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights Navi Pillay said that if reports of such strikes are confirmed, "there's an immediate need for that level of protection." ---------------------------------------------------------- {click on link to read article}
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Feb 24, 2011 14:57:31 GMT -5
Heres one from a link from the past, the Huff..."Lakhota, Lakhota..where have you gone to" actually been doing dine me thinks with out the old Huff though i never objected.. "LIBYA IN CHAOS: QADDAFI REFUSES TO STEP ASIDE - Helicopters and pickup trucks filled with African mercenaries are slaughtering people with machine guns in the streets of Tripoli, where it is the middle of the night now. HuffPost Hill spoke with a man whose dozens of Libyan family members have been updating him roughly every few hours. He said that Muammar Qaddafi has lost almost all of his support but the gangs of hired guns continue to mow down any group that appears to be gathering in size. The Libyan people are poorly armed but are still determined to storm Qaddafi's palace. "The action happens at night. The Libyan people have decided it's time to finish this and they're trying to do it tonight. The only way to end this is to storm the fortress," he said through tears. "The only way they're going to end this is if they commit suicide. The only hope we have right now is if somebody close to him shoots him. They need to kill him now." In a rambling, barely coherent speech, Qaddafi declared that he would not step down under any circumstances. Qaddafi's own interior minister has defected to the opposition and demanded that the government respect their "legitimate demands." Our Libyan source isn't happy that the U.S. is standing on the sidelines. "We have no problem sending 130,000 people to Iraq but we can't spare a few fucking planes? I thought America was better than this. America is just going to let it happen. This is a lunatic with soldiers from Sierra Leone." Kinda emotional one from Huff..I don't like emotional from commentators actually, just the facts..I get all the emotional I can take just right here were it is acceptable, average folks just emotionally posting their ideas and thoughts..but from the talking heads...naaaaa Anyone else feel the same or is it just me?
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wyouser
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Post by wyouser on Feb 24, 2011 16:15:30 GMT -5
as they used to say in the 60's Dez...right on!
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Feb 24, 2011 16:21:46 GMT -5
"blast from the past"..right on.. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Got another one on Gaddafi and friends and familus..comments from a analist from al Jazeer ... Opinion The King of Kings' speech Al Jazeera's senior policy analyst says Gaddafi's threats were no different from those of any foreign occupier. Marwan Bishara Last Modified: 22 Feb 2011 22:19 GMT Gaddafi has ruled Libya for the past 42 years with an iron fist, but insists he has no official role [EPA] Muammar Gaddafi is dangerously in denial. Alas, he's been that way for a long time. Gaddafi has ruled Libya for the past 42 years with iron fist, but insists he has no official role and therefore couldn't resign. Otherwise, he would have done that long ago! He thinks of himself as Zaim - a guru leader - or the king of kings of Africa as referred to himself repeatedly the last couple of years. How do you resign from greatness, he wondered! After recounting his heroism, sacrifice and courage over the last few decades. In reality, he wasted his country's fortunes, misused its sources and violated its people. He misspent hundreds of billions of dollars in revenues from oil. He commands the state budget along with his family, and yet he insists he has no money, no fortune and no belonging to give away. Why would he need any of that when he de facto had claim on the whole country. One is speechless listening to him telling Libyans: Go ahead take back your oil. Like father like son Gaddafi senior, like Gaddafi junior before him on Monday, went on rambling endlessly in Tuesday's televised address, with little coherence, many threats and more political blackmail. Speaking to both domestic audience and Western decision makers, he raised the spectre of civil war, bloodbath and the threat of al-Qaeda takeover in various parts of the country. He warned he would use all or any means to prevent the breakdown of Libya. Over the last few days, his regime has killed hundreds and reportedly using his air force to bomb Libyan cities, but insists he hasn't ordered the use of force yet. But he did threaten to kill all those participating in the ongoing upheaval, in accordance with the Libyan law, as he put it. Worse, he threatened to burn the land, behaving as if his rule was a foreign occupation. For many years, Qaddafi, his family and tribe have maintained their rule through the maintenance and deformation of the very tribal order he's been warning against. He's used political blackmail and financial bribes and unveiled threats of force to stay at the helm of the regime. In the process, much of the country's wealth was wasted. And so was any chance of development as his dictatorship suppressed pluralism, creativity and freedom of expression. Meanwhile, unemployment in this "rentier economy" has shot from one-fourth to one-third unemployment year after year. Gaddafi has turned a country rich in oil to a poor country in more than one way. Dangerous call to arms While Gaddafi admitted that the police has refused to confront or shoot at the demonstrations, he called on his loyal and violent "popular committees" to defend his "revolution", either individually or by joining forces with members of their tribes. Certainly, the most deadly and dangerous force in the coming days will be those popular committees and their association with the private militias of Gaddafi's regime, his sons, cousins and tribe. It seems that these well-armed and well-financed militias have been carrying out the worst violence against the peaceful demonstrators. Possibly aided by mercenaries from various neighbouring countries. Unless the Libyan army puts an end to the violations and violence of the militias, the ongoing confrontation might continue to escalate. Alas, there is little information as to today's relationship between the army and the militias, but one suspects it shouldn't be a good one as the militias have been used primarily to keep the army in check. That's why Arab and international decision makers must try and deter the escalation of violence by making it clear that those committing the crimes against the Libyan people will have no future in their country, but would eventually be punished for their crimes. And that the army has a responsibility to protect the people and the unity of the country
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2011 16:29:36 GMT -5
Check this out, Dez.. www.cnbc.com/id/41747049Oil Settles Near $97 on Rumors Gaddafi Shot Oil dropped sharply following Saudi Arabia's assures it could fill any Libyan supply shortfalls and unconfirmed rumors Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi had been shot.
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wyouser
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Post by wyouser on Feb 24, 2011 16:39:21 GMT -5
I wish I could find the copy of Life Magazine. It ran an issue with Gaddafi on the cover..if not 1969 it was the very eary 70's. In it he made references comparing himself to Napoleon. not much has changed in the way he views himself (king of kings). How does that go? power corrupts..but total power corrupts totally
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2011 16:52:57 GMT -5
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wyouser
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Post by wyouser on Feb 24, 2011 17:02:06 GMT -5
Fox had a few comments on the rumor around noon here. they also said the state dept would or could not confirm any truth to this
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2011 17:06:32 GMT -5
I wonder if we sent in special ops to off him? There is no way it would be announced without the entire world co-ordinating, etc.
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deziloooooo
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Post by deziloooooo on Feb 24, 2011 17:08:56 GMT -5
I wonder if we sent in special ops to off him? There is no way it would be announced without the entire world co-ordinating, etc. Hadn't heard that....but it would solve the thing unless the sons...still don't think they have the clout of...
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2011 17:10:15 GMT -5
...better than a war... no word if it is true or not...
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