Bay Area elementary school holds toy-gun exchange

[billisonboard]

Jun 15, 2013 18:45:01 GMT -5 Politically_Incorrect12 said:

Jun 12, 2013 14:39:43 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

We played with the hard playground rubber balls.  Those could do some damage if throw hard enough.

In elementary school the PE teacher ran a tight shift so dodgeball wasn't too bad.  Middle school/high school it was a free for all and the name of the game was to pummel the girls/nerds/anyone the popular kids didn't like.

DH pretty much confirmed for me that's how he and his friend's played and yes he would have been out to get me.  Good thing we met as adults.  He sounds like he was an ass in high school .
 
I don't think it leads to kids being more violent later in life if they play dodge ball so banning it for that reason is silly. 

But I never understood how getting the crap beat out of me was supposed to teach me to appreciate the value of exercise.  Dodgeball is hell for an uncoordinated kid.

So I don't mind that game going the way of the dodo.

The same thing could be said of pretty much any sport...ever been hit by a baseball....ever been tackled in football....ever had a ball spiked on you in volleyball....ever been fouled in basketball....and I'm sure the list can go on.

Baseball and tackle football are not co-ed PE sports. Few youngsters can effectively spike a volley and hitting another person is incidental to the goal. A hard intentional foul is cause for injection from a basketball game. The intent of dodge ball is to hit another person with the ball.

[Politically_Incorrect12]

Jun 15, 2013 23:38:31 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Jun 15, 2013 18:45:01 GMT -5 Politically_Incorrect12 said:

The same thing could be said of pretty much any sport...ever been hit by a baseball....ever been tackled in football....ever had a ball spiked on you in volleyball....ever been fouled in basketball....and I'm sure the list can go on.

Baseball and tackle football are not co-ed PE sports. Few youngsters can effectively spike a volley and hitting another person is incidental to the goal. A hard intentional foul is cause for injection from a basketball game. The intent of dodge ball is to hit another person with the ball.

The idea of being co-ed was never mentioned....if that is the issue, then go back to the days of boys and girls playing in separate groups for anything such as the above mentioned activities.  I really hope this is just the pendulum swinging too far one way and that it will eventually swing back to the middle.  I seriously don't know what happened in the 70's, 80's, and 90's that people who are in charge today see things like dodge ball as promoting the idea of a "human target," tag being inappropriate, or toy guns as a menace to society. What's next, arguing all sports should be banned because it hurts the self esteem of those who are not able to make the team or that it promotes the idea of "winners" and "losers"?  I honestly wouldn't be surprised if that idea hasn't been pushed by some people.   

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I seriously don't know what happened in the 70's, 80's, and 90's that people who are in charge today see things like dodge ball as promoting the idea of a "human target,"

Personally from the perspective of the human target I don't care if dodgeball is played as long as it is reasonably safe.  The dogeball I played in school HURT and I'm sorry if you disagree with me but I don't understand the point of a game where the sole purpose was to do as much damage to people as possible.

If we had played with Angel's nerf type balls that would have been different.   We played with balls that could seriously hurt people.

Baseball, basketball, football, volleyball etc all have rules.  Sure you can be hit by a ball or tackled but you're not intentionally hurting people in those games and can be penalized for it.  Baseball in the face is going to hurt like a mofo but the pitcher is not being actively encouraged to hit me as part of the game.   Tackling is going to suck but it's not intended to plow me into the ground as deliberately hard as possible, there are rules of engagement.

I have no problems with "winners/losers", FWIW.  I just don't understand what dodgeball really has to do with any of that.  There are hunderds of other games that can be played that don't involve deliberately trying to injure people.

You'd probably agree with my husband who is outraged dodgeball is no longer played.  He thinks it teaches strategy, coordination if you are one of the ones who are good at it.  In the case of the people like me who he was aiming it teachs us to suck it up and either get better or grow a thicker skin.

[billisonboard]

I do want to share this dodge ball story to show a little of the other side:

I was running a junior high special education department in a small school.  One day I went to the PE class to observe one of my students, a high functioning autistic student.  They were playing dodge ball that day.  I watched Chris pace back and forth between two lines painted on the floor.  His front foot would hit the blue line, he would execute a perfect 180 pivot and pace back to the other line.  His pace and movement never changed.  He was like one of those ducks at a shooting gallery.  I remember thinking to my self that this wasn't good.  But the only balls that I ever saw touch him were ones that bounced off of other people.

[billisonboard]

Jun 16, 2013 9:24:47 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

...

You'd probably agree with my husband who is outraged dodgeball is no longer played.  He thinks it teaches strategy, ...

[AGB]

Jun 16, 2013 7:36:25 GMT -5 Politically_Incorrect12 said:

Jun 15, 2013 23:38:31 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Baseball and tackle football are not co-ed PE sports. Few youngsters can effectively spike a volley and hitting another person is incidental to the goal. A hard intentional foul is cause for injection from a basketball game. The intent of dodge ball is to hit another person with the ball.

The idea of being co-ed was never mentioned....if that is the issue, then go back to the days of boys and girls playing in separate groups for anything such as the above mentioned activities.  I really hope this is just the pendulum swinging too far one way and that it will eventually swing back to the middle.  I seriously don't know what happened in the 70's, 80's, and 90's that people who are in charge today see things like dodge ball as promoting the idea of a "human target," tag being inappropriate, or toy guns as a menace to society. What's next, arguing all sports should be banned because it hurts the self esteem of those who are not able to make the team or that it promotes the idea of "winners" and "losers"?  I honestly wouldn't be surprised if that idea hasn't been pushed by some people.   

Here is one more rule that's trying to address the hurt self esteem issue...
"Some people are outraged after a high school track team is disqualified from competing in state finals because one runner made a religious gesture. In just a few seconds the boys Columbus High School 4 X 100 relay team went from winning the regional meet, heading to state championships to having it all stripped away. How did the "W" so quickly become "DQ"? Well. when the anchor of the relay team crossed the finish line, he won the race, raised his finger to the sky and that gesture caused the winning regional's relay team to be disqualified.
...
"It's a harsh consequence for what some people may deem a small gesture. The rule states no celebratory gestures including raising your arms," explains Columbus I.S.D. Superintendent Robert O'Connor. According to the UIL the relay team was disqualified for "unsporting conduct". The UIL also points out, it does not have a rule prohibiting religious expression. "You can do whatever you want to in terms of prayer, kneeling or whatever you want to once you get out of the competition area. You just can't do it in the competition area. It goes back to the taunting rule. I can't taunt my opponent," O'Connor explains." link

There is more to this story, and some variances depending on the source... but the details don't change the fact that celebrating your win by pointing, or raising your arms is now taunting in HS competitions, at least in TX.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I thought for sure someone would say if you can dodge a wrench you can dodge a ball.

What's next, arguing all sports should be banned because it hurts the self esteem of those who are not able to make the team or that it promotes the idea of "winners" and "losers"?

I think learning to win and learing to lose are both imporant and I understand getting hurt is part of playing sports.

What I don't get and have never agreed with is a game that is solely designed to hurt people.  If we had played with nerf balls maybe I'd feel differently, but I never understood why the school let us play with the balls we did.  They could have easily broken a nose or resulted in a concussion, especially in HS when for a lot of boys the idea was to see how hard you to pelt someone.

That game was a giant liabilty.  You can argue pretty easily I got smashed in the face by accident with a baseball or basketball or hurt something during a tackle.  A lot harder to argue it's an accident when you're playing a game that encourages hitting someone with a fairly hard object.

[swamp]

I'm a big fan of team sports, and I loved dodge ball, but I don't think it's appropriate for gym class as the whole point of the game is to whack someone as hard as you can. It's kind of like having boxing featured as the activity of the day. 

Our local gym classes have moved on to featuring lifetime fitness instead of sports. The kids have units including golf, cross country skiing, tennis, step aerobics, Zumba, interval training, skating, and jogging.   They still have so e exposure to sports, though. That's how the coaches scout new players. 

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Our local gym classes have moved on to featuring lifetime fitness instead of sports. The kids have units including golf, cross country skiing, tennis, step aerobics, Zumba, interval training, skating, and jogging. They still have so e exposure to sports, though. That's how the coaches scout new players.

Clearly your gym classes are raising feel good tree hugging liberals.

[swamp]

Jun 17, 2013 8:03:27 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

Our local gym classes have moved on to featuring lifetime fitness instead of sports. The kids have units including golf, cross country skiing, tennis, step aerobics, Zumba, interval training, skating, and jogging. They still have so e exposure to sports, though. That's how the coaches scout new players.

Clearly your gym classes are raising feel good tree hugging liberals.

It's NY state, what do you expect?

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I would have liked PE if that is what it had been like.  Instead they threw a 85 lb 5 foot tall girl in with the football players and ordered her to play flag football.  Yeah. . .

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

I wonder if Barrack and his daughters are on their way down to an elementary school toy gun buy back? 

dailycaller.com/2013/06/16/happy-fathers-day-president-obama-and-his-daughter-play-with-toy-guns/

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Jun 17, 2013 8:03:27 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

Our local gym classes have moved on to featuring lifetime fitness instead of sports. The kids have units including golf, cross country skiing, tennis, step aerobics, Zumba, interval training, skating, and jogging. They still have so e exposure to sports, though. That's how the coaches scout new players.

Clearly your gym classes are raising feel good tree hugging liberals.

I'll give you all a little hint from someone raising two kids who has NO INTENTION of paying for college:  anywhere from dozens to thousands (depending on the school) of "obscure" sports scholarships go unclaimed every year.  Leading the pack:  golf.  I would not have guessed that with the advent of Tiger Woods, and the recent decade's popularization of golf- but alas, there you go.  Others include archery, surfing, bowling, rifle, and equestrian teams.  People that care about these sports tend to be wealthy, and passionate about their sport.  Every year they donate money for scholarships- and most of it goes unclaimed.  Are you going to get a full ride for bowling?  No, this isn't basketball or football- but that's the point.  One of the best ways to make it in life is to AVOID competition, not jump into it.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Piano is another one that goes unclaimed a lot apparently.  I saw a ton of them when applying.  I wish I had learned.  A $3k renewable scholarship is nothing to sneeze at.

I need to make DD into a golf playing pianist.

[Politically_Incorrect12]

Jun 17, 2013 10:24:18 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

I wonder if Barrack and his daughters are on their way down to an elementary school toy gun buy back? 

dailycaller.com/2013/06/16/happy-fathers-day-president-obama-and-his-daughter-play-with-toy-guns/

That looks like an assault style toy weapon, maybe they get extra for trading those in...

[Deleted]

Jun 17, 2013 10:31:22 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

Jun 17, 2013 8:03:27 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

Our local gym classes have moved on to featuring lifetime fitness instead of sports. The kids have units including golf, cross country skiing, tennis, step aerobics, Zumba, interval training, skating, and jogging. They still have so e exposure to sports, though. That's how the coaches scout new players.

Clearly your gym classes are raising feel good tree hugging liberals.

I'll give you all a little hint from someone raising two kids who has NO INTENTION of paying for college:  anywhere from dozens to thousands (depending on the school) of "obscure" sports scholarships go unclaimed every year.  Leading the pack:  golf.  I would not have guessed that with the advent of Tiger Woods, and the recent decade's popularization of golf- but alas, there you go.  Others include archery, surfing, bowling, rifle, and equestrian teams.  People that care about these sports tend to be wealthy, and passionate about their sport.  Every year they donate money for scholarships- and most of it goes unclaimed.  Are you going to get a full ride for bowling?  No, this isn't basketball or football- but that's the point.  One of the best ways to make it in life is to AVOID competition, not jump into it.

 It's shameful how so many Americans expect and demand a "Free Ride" for their progeny. Especially the financially well-off who neglect to make any more than the minimum investment in their offspring.

 Most people I grew up with went to college on Student Loan money, their parents hadn't saved for their imminent tuition costs (mostly because their working-stiff income just didn't stretch far enough to amass the necessary thousands of $) Many of the former students were still making student loan payments 20+ years after graduating.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Jun 25, 2013 19:36:41 GMT -5 @patiencetried said:

Jun 17, 2013 10:31:22 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

I'll give you all a little hint from someone raising two kids who has NO INTENTION of paying for college:  anywhere from dozens to thousands (depending on the school) of "obscure" sports scholarships go unclaimed every year.  Leading the pack:  golf.  I would not have guessed that with the advent of Tiger Woods, and the recent decade's popularization of golf- but alas, there you go.  Others include archery, surfing, bowling, rifle, and equestrian teams.  People that care about these sports tend to be wealthy, and passionate about their sport.  Every year they donate money for scholarships- and most of it goes unclaimed.  Are you going to get a full ride for bowling?  No, this isn't basketball or football- but that's the point.  One of the best ways to make it in life is to AVOID competition, not jump into it.

 It's shameful how so many Americans expect and demand a "Free Ride" for their progeny. Especially the financially well-off who neglect to make any more than the minimum investment in their offspring.

 Most people I grew up with went to college on Student Loan money, their parents hadn't saved for their imminent tuition costs (mostly because their working-stiff income just didn't stretch far enough to amass the necessary thousands of $) Many of the former students were still making student loan payments 20+ years after graduating.

A scholarship isn't a "free ride", it's earned.  And FWIW, I've grown quite the thick skin when it comes to critiques of wise planning as some kind of selfish elitism.  Could it be that I'm "well off" for a reason; and likewise the working-stiffs are in their current station in life by choice?  Oh, no...couldn't be.

[EVT1]

The really well-off make sure their kids end up on top no matter what it costs.  Everything from private tutors and the best possible schools starting in kindergarten.  Imagine spending 20K a year or more for that.

It is the merely rich that are out to scam the system I think.  Was like an article I read a while back- the douchebag rich hire a handicapped person to let them skip lines at Disney.  It is amazing how entitled these people think they are.  But they will jump up and down all day if some some poor black kid gets a free sandwich. 

[EVT1]

Scholarships should in theory be earned- but I have a hard time equating the true efforts of students when as said above- the wealthy give their kids all of the benefits to learning that other kids do not get.  That's some bullshit IMO. 

And what do we base it on?  Academic ability- as measured by.......?  Some 100K a year private academy with a 10-1 teacher ratio that dares not fail any of their customers?  At a minimum it should be based on an objective test- and of course the wealthy are going to have their kids take all of the week long prep courses that teach to the test- another advantage the rest do not get.

Screw that- there needs to be a financial cutoff for scholarships.  At least academic- football ability, while still subject to similar strategies- cannot overcome natural talent.

[djAdvocate]

as to the picture of Obama, i believe he is a gun rights advocate- so there is nothing to be made of him using one, right?

[Deleted]

Every year, there are millions of students who just do not get Athletic Scholarships ( as "planned" by their parents).
 They have to make alternate plans.
 

[Deleted]

 Any idea what logo that is on PrezzO's cap?
 It's not a "Raiders" cap, or is it?

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Jun 25, 2013 20:05:17 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

The really well-off make sure their kids end up on top no matter what it costs.  Everything from private tutors and the best possible schools starting in kindergarten.  Imagine spending 20K a year or more for that.

It is the merely rich that are out to scam the system I think.  Was like an article I read a while back- the douchebag rich hire a handicapped person to let them skip lines at Disney.  It is amazing how entitled these people think they are.  But they will jump up and down all day if some some poor black kid gets a free sandwich. 

This is probably one of the most ignorant posts I've ever read.  You're smarter than the average bear-  you should know better.  There's no such thing as a free sandwich.  Someone paid for it.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Jun 25, 2013 20:12:51 GMT -5 EVT1 said:

Scholarships should in theory be earned- but I have a hard time equating the true efforts of students when as said above- the wealthy give their kids all of the benefits to learning that other kids do not get.  That's some bullshit IMO. 

And what do we base it on?  Academic ability- as measured by.......?  Some 100K a year private academy with a 10-1 teacher ratio that dares not fail any of their customers?  At a minimum it should be based on an objective test- and of course the wealthy are going to have their kids take all of the week long prep courses that teach to the test- another advantage the rest do not get.

Screw that- there needs to be a financial cutoff for scholarships.  At least academic- football ability, while still subject to similar strategies- cannot overcome natural talent.

You're absolutely correct.  And I just gave everyone here a big hint at a work-around.  I specifically advise you DO NOT have your kid compete for a basketball, or football scholarship.  And if you're really wealthy- what do you care?  My post is aimed more at the affluent or "well off" like many of us here.  Go for the oddball scholarship.