Anne Frank Diary 'Pornographic,' Claims Mom...

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Apr 28, 2013 7:55:57 GMT -5 @craftysarah said:

I will concede the point that The Diary of Anne Frank is a bit racier today than back when most of us read it.  It wasn't until the past 20 years or so that they added back the parts her Dad had withheld from the original publication.


That said, it was written by a 13 year old, which would imply that it is appropriate content for other 13 year olds.  The power in her story is its ordinariness.  Faced with completely extraordinary circumstances, Anne still had completely ordinary hormones and feelings and petty jealousies and all the rest.  If she wasn't so relatable, people would have stopped reading her words.

In typical American fashion, we are fixated on sex and oblivious to violence.  The most disturbing part of my copy was the afterword describing Anne's life after their arrest.

I was getting ready to say something like this.  I'm a pretty conservative Christian, and I gotta tell ya- if this lady thinks Ann Frank's discovery of her genitalia is 'racy' in the classroom she would really like to hear what the kids that age talk about in between classes.  I still remember some of the stuff I saw, heard, talked about, and hoped to participate in as a 7th grader.  It was a lot racier than Ann Frank's diary.

Fortunately, my parents weren't totally naive, nor were they cowards.  They pretty much laid stuff out for me, told me where they stood, and didn't spend too much time worrying about this kind of crap.

These days- my biggest worry is what my 9 year old is doing online.  Not so much here or at school, but what is he doing at his friend's houses?  What is he going to be shown?  These days you're not worried about your kid running across a Playboy centerfold in some kid's older brother's stash.  And online isn't just more easily accessed, it's way, way, way too intense- it's just wrong.  But I'm not stupid- I know kids stumble across it- often whether they're looking or not.  I know not all parents are careful, or even pay attention.  So, yeah- Ann Frank's diary?  Way down on the priority list in terms of big worries in life.

Of course, she could just pull her kid(s) out of the government schools.  That would solve this problem, but I'm not fooled or comforted by the idea that Christian schools are a bubble of safety.  I went to public school, but the real hard core derelicts I know all went to Christian schools- one in particular, Timothy Christian was (in the mid to late 80's) a veritable sesspool- chock full of human debris.

[thyme4change]

The Catholic School Girl fantasy isn't because they are all so innocent and pure.

[Deleted]

Apr 28, 2013 16:38:48 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Apr 28, 2013 13:02:46 GMT -5 TonyTiger said:

'Appropriate' - for a child - should be left up to the parents of the child - not you, nor I, nor the local townie school-board - at least within reason..

not questioning that.  i asked a simple question OF PARENTS. 

I am ok with parents deciding what is appropriate for THEIR children. I DO have a problem with them trying to decide what is appropriate for MY child by demanding a book be banned.  They have no right deciding what is appropriate for my child.  If they do not want their child reading the book then they should meet with the teacher and ask for an alternative assignment. 

I gave several alternative assignments to children when what we were learning went against their religious beliefs (holidays and Jehoviah Witnesses come to mind). 

[Deleted]

I worked in 7th grade last year and believe me...Anne Frank's diary doesn't have anything that they don't already know or talk about.  Most of the conversations I heard in the 7th grade hallway made me blush!  IMHO this mother has way too much time on her hand and is doing her daughter a huge disservice.

[djAdvocate]

Apr 30, 2013 4:15:01 GMT -5 imanangel said:

I worked in 7th grade last year and believe me...Anne Frank's diary doesn't have anything that they don't already know or talk about.  Most of the conversations I heard in the 7th grade hallway made me blush!  IMHO this mother has way too much time on her hand and is doing her daughter a huge disservice.

..............and driving that discussion underground does no good whatsoever.

[Tennesseer]

[justme]

I was 10 when the uncensored version came out, and I probably didn't read it until I was a bit older. For the life of me I can't remember those parts of the books and it's making me wonder whether my school still had us read the censored version or if it was such a non-issue to remember.

[thyme4change]

Apr 30, 2013 4:10:10 GMT -5 imanangel said:

Apr 28, 2013 16:38:48 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

not questioning that.  i asked a simple question OF PARENTS. 

I am ok with parents deciding what is appropriate for THEIR children. I DO have a problem with them trying to decide what is appropriate for MY child by demanding a book be banned.  They have no right deciding what is appropriate for my child.  If they do not want their child reading the book then they should meet with the teacher and ask for an alternative assignment. 

I gave several alternative assignments to children when what we were learning went against their religious beliefs (holidays and Jehoviah Witnesses come to mind). 

I'm totally not in agreement with the mother who is complaining, however, in the spirit of accuracy, she did not ask the book be banned or removed.  She asked that a permission slip be sent home informing parents so they could make a decision on what their own children be exposed to.

I am having this vision of a 45 page document coming home with my 7th grader, in which I have to initial each paragraph, that details out every book they may read and what is contained, as well as all the other stuff we would have to approve.  

[billisonboard]

Apr 30, 2013 10:16:16 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

... in the spirit of accuracy, she did not ask the book be banned or removed. ...

... Demands School Drop Book From Curriculum
...

Mom, Gail Horalek, has filed a formal complaint ...
...

Horalek has now demanded that the book be removed from the curriculum: ...

...

m.christianpost.com/news/anne-frank-diary-pornographic-claims-mom-demands-school-drop-book-from-curriculum-video--94843/

[thyme4change]

Oh crap - sorry!  I must have skimmed the OP, because I only saw the permission slip deal.

Yeah - this lady be trippin.

[billisonboard]

Apr 30, 2013 10:26:05 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

Oh crap - sorry!  I must have skimmed the OP, because I only saw the permission slip deal.

Yeah - this lady be trippin.

I thought it was weird that they talked about the permission slips and then, bang, ban the book. I posted earlier that I thought permission slips would have been good particularly since there was already the precedent for the school using them.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I wonder how many 7th graders are suddenly doing their reading assignments looking for the pornography

Do you watch South Park?  They do an episode about Catcher in the Rye.  Mr. Garrison talks about how some people find the book offensive so all the kids get excited and want to read it.  Then they're pissed because they don't see what's so offensive about it. 

DH didn't think the episode was that funny but I found it hysterical. 

I agree with whoever said that the afterword in the diary describing what happened after the Nazi raid is far more disturbing/troubling material.  If all you take away from the diary is that Anne talked about her vagina you have issues.

[Deleted]

How do people not realize that the moment you say "ban the book," you increase sales of that book by like a bajillion percent?  Best way to get people to read something, really.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

I think the point is you can bury your head in the sand and pretend your daughter will now never be exposed to the word "vagina".

I can't ignore it if she comes home talking about that damn diary.  I can ignore it if she's reading it behind the cover of another book on the school bus.

That's what my grandmother did when she read Gone with the Wind.  The book was a huge scandal at the time.

[swamp]

Why should a 13 year old girl be sheltered from the word vagina? She has one.

[thyme4change]

I have actually started going out of my way to increase my children's exposure to certain things.  They are so naive, and don't ask any questions about anything, but other kids their age are starting to grasp certain things.  I just don't want them to be so sheltered that people gang up on them.  

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

Why should a 13 year old girl be sheltered from the word vagina? She has one

She does not, she has a "flower"!

Ugh, I've already had an argument with my husband over the correct terms for genitalia.  So there are people out there who believe/feel that teaching people about their body parts and using the proper terms is a bad thing.

 I don't think my DH would go on a book burning rampage over the subject, but this woman's attitude is sadly not surprising to me.

[djAdvocate]

Apr 30, 2013 10:40:46 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

I wonder how many 7th graders are suddenly doing their reading assignments looking for the pornography

Do you watch South Park?  They do an episode about Catcher in the Rye.  Mr. Garrison talks about how some people find the book offensive so all the kids get excited and want to read it.  Then they're pissed because they don't see what's so offensive about it. 

DH didn't think the episode was that funny but I found it hysterical. 

I agree with whoever said that the afterword in the diary describing what happened after the Nazi raid is far more disturbing/troubling material.  If all you take away from the diary is that Anne talked about her vagina you have issues.

kaboom!

[justme]

Apr 30, 2013 10:53:17 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

Why should a 13 year old girl be sheltered from the word vagina? She has one

She does not, she has a "flower"!

Ugh, I've already had an argument with my husband over the correct terms for genitalia.  So there are people out there who believe/feel that teaching people about their body parts and using the proper terms is a bad thing.

 I don't think my DH would go on a book burning rampage over the subject, but this woman's attitude is sadly not surprising to me.

Have your husband watch that Friends show where they wonder what if... Rachel married Barry, Chandler became a writer, Ross was still married to his lesbian wife. Monica was like 30 and a virgin and still referring to it as her flower. Maybe it'll scare him straight.

[mmhmm]

This is just sad.  That foolish woman is raising a little anachronism not prepared to get along in today's world.  They'll both regret it, but the child will be more negatively affected by it, sadly.

[thyme4change]

I remember hearing that some mother taught her younger child to call her vagina "kitty."  And she was molested and the court appointed person was trying to get the story out of the girl, and she said the man was touching her kitty, and rubbing her kitty.  And the man's lawyer came back and said the girl had a cat.  And it was really messed up.  I always wondered if they actually used the word "kitty" or if that was a cleaned up version and the girl was really using a much more vulgar nickname for her private parts.

[swamp]

Thyme, I handled a similar type case. The girl called it "my bug". They just had her mom testify the girl referred to her private parts as "my bug". Frankly if be embarrassed as a defense attorney to argue the girl meant he petted her cat.

[Deleted]

My mom taught me it was my kitty or monkey. 

I try to use the words penis and vagina daily.   It drives my 12 year old daughter nuts....oh and the word titty.  She hates that one too.

[NomoreDramaQ1015]

We don't give other body parts stupid cutesy code word names.  Why do we do it for that part of the body?

I told DH suck it up, he took anatomy and I'm pretty sure they called those parts by their proper names in class.

My MIL got on me that I might make other parents uncomfortable when Gwen announces she has a vagina.  I said that's not my problem.  Get over yourself.

[djAdvocate]

Apr 30, 2013 11:48:20 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

We don't give other body parts stupid cutesy code word names.  Why do we do it for that part of the body?

I told DH suck it up, he took anatomy and I'm pretty sure they called those parts by their proper names in class.

My MIL got on me that I might make other parents uncomfortable when Gwen announces she has a vagina.  I said that's not my problem.  Get over yourself.

i am totally on board with this.  if we can't call things what they ARE, then we are really in a mess.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Apr 30, 2013 12:17:47 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Apr 30, 2013 11:48:20 GMT -5 NomoreDramaQ1015 said:

We don't give other body parts stupid cutesy code word names.  Why do we do it for that part of the body?

I told DH suck it up, he took anatomy and I'm pretty sure they called those parts by their proper names in class.

My MIL got on me that I might make other parents uncomfortable when Gwen announces she has a vagina.  I said that's not my problem.  Get over yourself.

i am totally on board with this.  if we can't call things what they ARE, then we are really in a mess.

Maybe it's because my mom is a registered nurse, but that's the way it was in my house- and it still never ceases to amaze me how much more trouble the word penis causes as opposed to wiener or peepee.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Apr 30, 2013 11:36:29 GMT -5 mmhmm said:

This is just sad.  That foolish woman is raising a little anachronism not prepared to get along in today's world.  They'll both regret it, but the child will be more negatively affected by it, sadly.

I doubt this- the negative impact.  She won't be the first kid that grew up in a household where genitalia weren't discussed, she won't be the last.  Life will go on for her.

[thyme4change]

At school all the boys call it their "privates" - so as a joke, we started calling it "The Sargent."  I know I shouldn't do that, but it makes me laugh every time.  Maybe when my son goes through puberty, we will promote it to Colonel.  

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

Apr 30, 2013 12:59:23 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

At school all the boys call it their "privates" - so as a joke, we started calling it "The Sargent."  I know I shouldn't do that, but it makes me laugh every time.  Maybe when my son goes through puberty, we will promote it to Colonel.  

[weltschmerz]

Have a kid learn about her labia, and next thing you know, she'll be wanting to know all there is to know about her liver and lungs. Where does it end?