stats45
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Post by stats45 on Feb 9, 2011 9:35:36 GMT -5
I understand the ideas about not trying to work at a level that can't be sustained over a long period of time, but I just don't think that other parts of that make sense. I do think that it makes sense to not accept jobs or work that is not consistent with your position if it is lower in status and might change how people perceive your competency or ability to do the work you were hired to do.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Feb 9, 2011 11:36:14 GMT -5
Never mix business with friendship, no matter how much you really and truly think it will work out.
This is always good advice. However, I broke this rule and we have been married nearly 20 years now.
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sil
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Post by sil on Feb 9, 2011 15:08:05 GMT -5
Agree with a lot of previous posts. Adding a few:
1. Never complete 100% of a large job solo, or you'll end up with a lot of re-work.
First re-state the job (in writing) back to the requestor and accept all input/changes. Then check in again when the job is no more than 25% complete, and periodically thereafter. When the requestor asks for more changes (and they always do) re-state those changes in writing and explain the impact on your deadline or resource needs.
2. Verify good news before passing it up, but deliver bad news as fast as possible.
3. Simply put, my job is to make my boss look good. But since bosses are easily replaced, I always take a second job of making my boss' boss look good.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Feb 9, 2011 16:37:15 GMT -5
To me it would say that you are such an idiot you can't answer a phone, or such a jerk you can't say "Hi" to someone who walks in the door.
Our receptionist's back-up is a man.
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daylight
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Post by daylight on Feb 9, 2011 17:47:16 GMT -5
Since you asked, I'll elaborate a bit about 1. The disadvantages of doing your job 100%: My immediate boss figured out in 3 months that I'm smarter than him. Lucky me, his immediate boss also figured this out so I have not been fired but not for his lack of trying. I'm not doing administrative work, but since I tried to be nice and pleasant and answer every question I was asked, I ended up being responsible for a) answering the phone if the receptionist goes to the loo. Now there are 3 other people below me in ranks, but I still have to answer it, since I'm doing a superb job and the people below me are seen incapable of answering the phone properly. (There is more than one receptionist but there are a couple of hours when we have only one.) b) I was held responsible for the fact that the receptionists failed to buy the office flowers/cake for a birthday, since I'm known to know everyone's birthday by heart. c) I am always to blame if the receptionist fails to properly mail a letter that is being sent to the same person in one month for the tenth time. I'm not even involved in mailing (at all). But I should have known better. Or better yet, I should have personally mailed it. d) I'm proofreading every single email that is being sent out by the receptionists, since they know that their spelling is awful. What's worse, I usually have to re-write even one-sentence emails, because they cannot properly form one. The last time I was on vacation, a colleague, who is apparently seen second best, was calling me in despair and asked how I do my daily job with all these requests. Need I go on? Also, since they saw that when they said that something needed to be done in 5 minutes I always did it under 5 minutes...I ended up doing every single thing that had to be taken care of immediately. Have I ever been praised after the first couple of months? No, but I had my head yelled off on the few occasions when I needed 6 minutes...since I can do better. Colleagues at the same level are not even asked for this type of work since everyone knows they would not be able to do it.
In general, they see that you actually care about the quality of the job you are doing, may even be passionate about it and they use you. A lot depends on room of advancement. I imagine it would be seen as an asset if your boss's boss notices your excellence if you can get promoted. Otherwise you end up being the firm's conscience and superstar, who will soon realize that he/she is seriously underpaid and will leave anyway. You're more of a liability than an asset. You also make feel everyone else bad at work without realizing it. Finally, I ended up at the original YM board because friends suggested that I'd get less under 5-minute, 1-hour you name it work if I pretended that I needed more time. I still get them all, but am very thankful for YM anyway.
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Post by restless on Feb 9, 2011 22:07:16 GMT -5
I don't get this "not working 100%".
I work in a large Corporation and in my area (Finance) the leadership is very big on developing and promoting talent. Because I do a good job and give 100% most of the time I have never had to seek out new opportunities on my own, I just got a great promotion and is because my new boss got my name from someone (remember to network) then she called my boss and other people and they recommended me, and that has been the case in my professional career except for my first job out of school.
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Elizabeth
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Post by Elizabeth on Feb 9, 2011 23:01:10 GMT -5
that is soo true Elizabeth = 6 before end of today ;D use your vacation and sick days every year! not taking the time is like giving the money back to the company if you are Project Leader still take the time after project is over if project is open ended no dead line take the time. EVERYBODY can be replaced, or fired, the company will not fall apart if you are gone. Thanks Hampton- I was wondering where it all came from ;D
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Post by ummboutthat on Feb 9, 2011 23:51:21 GMT -5
looking to move from assistant to manager position. on your resume list the job functions of your manager! it's you that gets your manager through the day doing the actual work! you're just missing having to sit in on the conference calls, meetings, company car, and high salary.
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Post by ummboutthat on Feb 9, 2011 23:55:22 GMT -5
To me it would say that you are such an idiot you can't answer a phone, or such a jerk you can't say "Hi" to someone who walks in the door. Our receptionist's back-up is a man. Thanks Thyme4change I was thinking the same
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Post by ummboutthat on Feb 10, 2011 0:00:52 GMT -5
Here's another bit of advice. If the boss asks you to do something you don't want to do or might make your career look bad - like being the receptionist back-up when that isn't want you signed up for - all you have to do is screw it up. You don't want them to ask you again to relieve the receptionist. Notice the boss always asks the women to be the back up receptionsit and never the men. If you are in a career oriented position you don't want to take these little steps back in an effort to appear like you are a team player. So you look like a team player agreeing to relieve the receptionist, but then you do a bad job and you laugh it off and throw your hands up and say "I wasn't cut out for this" and unsaid you are saying "I was meant for bigger more important big picture things." actually I also disagree on this again because covering makes me more aware of other job functions. the more I know how to work other jobs make me more valuable employee. so when someone is out....normally no one can answer questions about that job. But covering and working different jobs is the time to shine - Team Player.
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Post by ummboutthat on Feb 10, 2011 0:18:31 GMT -5
I don't get this "not working 100%". I work in a large Corporation and in my area (Finance) the leadership is very big on developing and promoting talent. Because I do a good job and give 100% most of the time I have never had to seek out new opportunities on my own, I just got a great promotion and is because my new boss got my name from someone (remember to network) then she called my boss and other people and they recommended me, and that has been the case in my professional career except for my first job out of school. Greetings restless my current situation 70% (no real math behind the 70% magic number) is volunteering to do other shit around the office. my actual job responsibilities are dull, boring, a toddler can do it in an hour, and really doesn't change much. So I jump in and do and cover a whole hell of a lot of other stuff. Stuff that I actually have no business doing but this fills up my days, people now turn to me (like I know what I'm doing) to get certain tasks done including my boss AND HIS BOSS! OH -sorry my point - I think people don't want to do there job at 100% is so they can sandbag their job. well that's what we call it at work now. People will under perform so they know they can always meet what they are supposed to do in the first place, will not have to constantly run at top performance and be more laid back, and working at top performance or under performing to reach the same goal doesn't really matter.
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happyscooter
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Post by happyscooter on Feb 10, 2011 7:46:35 GMT -5
#whatever we are up to--On a job interview, be nice to everyone you come in contact with. Janitor, receptionist, whoever. I don't care if you are interviewing for VP of a big corp. The HR or Pres. or CEO will ask the receptionist how you treated her and she will tell them. If you treat her like a lowlife peon, she will let them know and chances are, you won't get a second interview. Or the receptionist herself might be on break and the person relieving her might be one of the above. It happens.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2011 8:54:08 GMT -5
1. People skills are as important as technical skills but they don't replace technical skills. People will forget that you got their job done quickly and efficiently but remember how good they feel seeing you because of the big smile and enthusiasm you show to see them. They will forget if you get the job done quickly and efficiently but remember if it got screwed up.
2. Scottie knew what he was doing. Always overestimate how long something will take you.
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jeffreymo
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Post by jeffreymo on Feb 10, 2011 9:28:27 GMT -5
Here's another bit of advice. If the boss asks you to do something you don't want to do or might make your career look bad - like being the receptionist back-up when that isn't want you signed up for - all you have to do is screw it up. You don't want them to ask you again to relieve the receptionist. Notice the boss always asks the women to be the back up receptionsit and never the men. If you are in a career oriented position you don't want to take these little steps back in an effort to appear like you are a team player. So you look like a team player agreeing to relieve the receptionist, but then you do a bad job and you laugh it off and throw your hands up and say "I wasn't cut out for this" and unsaid you are saying "I was meant for bigger more important big picture things." I'd say that this advice only applies to someone who's been in their career field for a while. In my early 20's, I did everthing I could to prove I was ambitious and able to adapt to any scenario. This involved some mailroom duties and even backing up the receptionist (and I'm male).
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jeffreymo
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Post by jeffreymo on Feb 10, 2011 9:29:59 GMT -5
#whatever we are up to--On a job interview, be nice to everyone you come in contact with. Janitor, receptionist, whoever. I don't care if you are interviewing for VP of a big corp. The HR or Pres. or CEO will ask the receptionist how you treated her and she will tell them. If you treat her like a lowlife peon, she will let them know and chances are, you won't get a second interview. Or the receptionist herself might be on break and the person relieving her might be one of the above. It happens. Absolutely. I've seen it many times firsthand. People won't get hired, and vendors will lose business if they treat the gatekeepers poorly.
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Post by mawmawandlovingit on Feb 10, 2011 11:36:58 GMT -5
I wish I would have know that working with 11 men is TEN TIMES worse than working with 11 women (sorry guys)!! Being the only female in the office surely has it's challenges.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Feb 10, 2011 15:05:13 GMT -5
If you are in a career oriented position you don't want to take these little steps back in an effort to appear like you are a team player. So you look like a team player agreeing to relieve the receptionist, but then you do a bad job and you laugh it off and throw your hands up and say "I wasn't cut out for this" and unsaid you are saying "I was meant for bigger more important big picture things."
I disagree as well. In my field I work on grant based pay and there is only so much money to go around. When you have to get rid of a lab technician it isn't going to be the one who does everything, it's going to be the one who only does one task.
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daylight
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Post by daylight on Feb 10, 2011 18:41:26 GMT -5
There are fields (medicine, law), which are very specialized and in which people higher up are not necessarily interested in your improvement. They're interested in keeping their own job and own opportunities. Not to mention how there is a certain ladder that you have to climb no matter what (mandatory internship periods etc.). I cannot even begin to tell you how much fun it is to have your work supervised by someone who half the time does not know what you are talking about and see them selling your work as "theirs" because you are supervised by them and the end result of your work will necessarily be seen as a product honed by their "talents". One of the happiest workdays of my life included a public confession of my immediate boss on how he knows nothing about a certain field and has to rely on me and my work. ;D The problem is not raises, I did get them, but the longer the people higher up see you excel (and overshadow them) the longer you are exposed to their efforts to make your life hell. It's catch-22 as they would consider firing you if you decide to underperform just to avoid their wrath (since they can't sell your work as their own anymore and have to work harder). And even your boss's boss will not be able to pull you out of an internship period mandated by law.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Feb 10, 2011 19:06:23 GMT -5
So true that it's just scary.
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cronewitch
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Post by cronewitch on Feb 11, 2011 16:23:05 GMT -5
I only do my job most of the time and my desk is always full of something, filing is never caught up, because I am too busy. But I have time to sit at the reception desk 1.5 hours every day playing on the internet because they want me to. The company is open from 6:30 to 4:30 the receptionist goes home at 3 along with most people who aren't management all the office staff goes then. I am the only women left. Everyone else left makes twice what I make and I make twice what the receptionist makes. The phone seldom rings after the workers leave and people seldom come in. If I am really swamped I can stay at my desk and listen for people who come in and transfer the phones to my boss. I never complain but seldom do a lick of work at her desk.
If I was to catch up all my filing and do every lick of my work they would know how not busy I am and expect me to do other people's jobs. Now I am using my spare time to do someone elses job and write up instructions. I am working late every night doing two jobs but the bosses know how hard I am working the my boss and his boss have both thanked me almost every day. I will not make this look easy my desk is stacked high with files and the tops of my file cabinets. Each file will take about 10 minutes to finish so I could do the biggest ones 9 in a hour and a half at the reception desk but I don't want to. When they hire the replacement person I will still be swamped in files while training them and as they get up to speed I will be too busy catching up to take on any of their duties all the time. I normally work about 3-4 hours out of 6.5 I am at my desk and always stay late at least 5-10 minutes. At closing I lock all the doors and turn off my computer. I could do it all 5 minutes before closing but staying late 5 minutes make me look like a non clock watcher not like the receptionist who stands at her desk with her coat on 10 minutes before quitting time and if you don't relieve her within seconds come to tell you she is going home and yell at you because she isn't getting paid to be here. I never relieve her even a few seconds early either or she would be wearing her coat even sooner.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Feb 11, 2011 16:37:40 GMT -5
I'll tell you that the personality is EVERYTHING. DF's DD got a job she is totally unqualified for because they liked her in the interview. They will train her so obviously the job isn't rocket science and anyone can do it. Makes it seem kind of silly to actually get a degree in a hard major because you can smile and be friendly and you'll get hired anyway.
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Post by ummboutthat on Feb 12, 2011 5:05:47 GMT -5
I'll tell you that the personality is EVERYTHING. DF's DD got a job she is totally unqualified for because they liked her in the interview. They will train her so obviously the job isn't rocket science and anyone can do it. Makes it seem kind of silly to actually get a degree in a hard major because you can smile and be friendly and you'll get hired anyway. see that just upsets me!!
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Feb 12, 2011 7:53:09 GMT -5
I don't blame you but we are grateful. She didn't get hired initially because of her academic background so I got her a job and then they offered her this entry level position so off she went. Hooray!!!! She's out of town in a big city and she is happy. They are working her butt off, though!!! Good because she didn't work that hard in college.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Feb 12, 2011 8:00:27 GMT -5
So true but I'm still glad for her and she isn't dumb but what made me laugh was the fact that other people hired had these hard majors so they studied their behinds off at college and she didn't and she ended up hired as well and for the same pay. I wonder how they must feel?
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Feb 12, 2011 9:15:03 GMT -5
Well, to be fair, she is genuinely a nice person and well-liked. It isn't like she pretends to be nice to get what she wants (only with Dad!!!) No, she doesn't pretend with him, just kidding. But he is a soft touch where she's concerned and that's okay, I was Daddy's girl, too.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Feb 12, 2011 9:16:16 GMT -5
I do hope she glosses over her major though when she is with other newbies as they are accounting, finance, business, kind of majors and she is a step up from basket weaving.
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Post by restless on Feb 13, 2011 1:28:07 GMT -5
There are fields (medicine, law), which are very specialized and in which people higher up are not necessarily interested in your improvement. They're interested in keeping their own job and own opportunities. Not to mention how there is a certain ladder that you have to climb no matter what (mandatory internship periods etc.). I cannot even begin to tell you how much fun it is to have your work supervised by someone who half the time does not know what you are talking about and see them selling your work as "theirs" because you are supervised by them and the end result of your work will necessarily be seen as a product honed by their "talents". One of the happiest workdays of my life included a public confession of my immediate boss on how he knows nothing about a certain field and has to rely on me and my work. ;D The problem is not raises, I did get them, but the longer the people higher up see you excel (and overshadow them) the longer you are exposed to their efforts to make your life hell. It's catch-22 as they would consider firing you if you decide to underperform just to avoid their wrath (since they can't sell your work as their own anymore and have to work harder). And even your boss's boss will not be able to pull you out of an internship period mandated by law. I agree that we are all worried about our own careers but in some places if you are a good perfomer it's going to be hard to get rid of you because of that one time you made a mistake or failed. All I know is that we are all (companies) short of talent, believe it or not, so in light of that many times you don't have to do much and look like a superstar
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Post by restless on Feb 13, 2011 1:29:28 GMT -5
I tell this to interns and new hires, you own your career, people will coach you and mentor you but they will not seek out opportunities for you unless you get it started.
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daylight
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Post by daylight on Feb 13, 2011 16:08:01 GMT -5
Zib, I'd say - good for her. Most jobs do need certifications, but some are just various means to ensure that your future co-worker knows how to a) count, b) read, c) think or d) speak coherently.
We have jobs ads for people with an LLM (in law) for entry level positions. You study at least an extra 1,5 years for that after law school. And what was a friend told at her job interview about the purpose of this degree? We wanted to make sure that you actually speak English (or German/any other foreign language that's marketable for them). Like a 3 minute conversation in English would not suffice (or a couple of pages of translation for the written part).
I've interviewed people on their language skills. A person, who claimed to have an advanced understanding of English couldn't tell me what kind of pet she had at home (this was supposed to be an easy question after she failed when simulating a phone call). Then again, it turned out that she did not even know where she interviewed and who we were, so what was I expecting, really?
All in all, good for her for having what it actually takes to do that job without grinding her b*tt off for skills that could possibly be tested in other ways.
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onestepcloser
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Post by onestepcloser on Jun 4, 2011 17:38:05 GMT -5
I work in retail. I wish I would of know that I would be thone checking the fitting rooms and that persons will do almost anything in them. A few days ago I checked the rooms and found two gay men going at it, they saw me and still did not stop until we got security and the police involved!
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