qofcc
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Post by qofcc on Jul 28, 2012 8:32:16 GMT -5
One of my co-workers was recently forced by HR to change her name at work after her divorce. She's kind of a ditz and I don't know all of the details, but it got me thinking.
On the New York State Judgment of Divorce form. Section 34 says: ORDERED AND ADJUDGED THAT Plaintiff is authorized to resume the use of the prior surname XXXXX
Does that mean that she HAS to change her name back to that prior surname?
Section 33 says: ORDERED AND ADJUDGED THAT both parties are authorized to resume the use of any prior surname
so if someone didn't want to change their name after divorce should they just strike section 34?
She completed the forms herself and filed them with the clerk.
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Colleenz
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Post by Colleenz on Jul 28, 2012 8:39:43 GMT -5
I did not have to change mine back. I wanted as little confusion as possible for DS. He does not need to have a Mommy with a new name in addition to all of the other changes divorce brings. Does she have kids?
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qofcc
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Post by qofcc on Jul 28, 2012 8:41:12 GMT -5
Does she have kids?
no. But she's used the other name professionally for most of her career and she didn't want to change it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2012 8:50:29 GMT -5
I don't understand how HR can "force" you to change your name. I can see why they would want your legal name (however that's defined) to be consistent with whatever they report to the IRS, but that should be their only concern.
I'm not a lawyer- maybe the sections you quote are standard divorce decree boilerplate, giving the parties the option of changing back to a previous name. It doesn't say "plaintiff WILL change..." or "plaintiff is REQUIRED TO change.."
I never changed mine, so it wasn't an issue- till I applied for a passport for DS when he was 12. I carefully brought the divorce papers with me so they could see that I had sole physical custody of DS and to resolve any concerns because I kept my last name and DS had my Ex's last name. The brilliant civil servant asked where in the decree it said I could go back to my own name. Umm, I never used any other name so it wasn't necessary.
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qofcc
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Post by qofcc on Jul 28, 2012 9:03:38 GMT -5
I don't understand how HR can "force" you to change your name.
They said she had to start using her legal name at work or they'd fire her. Again, I wasn't there. We work for a huge company and when someone changes their name, their old name disappears out of the e-mail system and phone lists and if you don't know the person's new last name or already know their phone number, you have to find someone who does in order to contact them.
I changed my name at work when I got married and a few months later I was on a client call with my boss with a company I had only dealt with over the phone and e-mail before and they didn't know I was the same person. They asked him what happened to X we liked her and I explained that was me.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jul 28, 2012 9:33:19 GMT -5
I wanted DFs EX to change her last name but she refused because her old name was associated with criminals. Rats. Her kids, who are the criminals children, changed theirs to DFs as soon as they were eighteen. I understand it even though I don't like it.
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Apple
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Post by Apple on Jul 28, 2012 9:36:52 GMT -5
She is authorized to use either name she chooses (but I do believe one has to be legal, her choice). When I got my divorce, I could choose to go by married or maiden name, but it was in the orders that my son SHALL only be known by his father's surname, I couldn't sign him up for school, etc with my last name. It says she's authorized to change it if she wants. If she wants the married name to be her legal name then it is, HR cannot change it for her.
When we were in HS, we were friends with a guy named Juan. We saw him when he was working and his name tag had "Jose" or something similar. We asked him what the deal was and he said at McDonalds, you had to go by your legal name, and Jose was his legal name, Juan was his middle name. Her case is different though.
To get an "official" legal name change it costs a few hundred dollars, but if she really wants to keep the married name, it's not hard to do, but should have already been taken care of in the divorce. It might depend on which name she signed the paperwork with. If she signed it with her maiden name, that may show she "picked" that as her legal name.
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simser
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Post by simser on Jul 28, 2012 9:58:32 GMT -5
In Texas, if you wanted to go back to your maiden name, you had to change it with the divorce. The default option felt like to keep the married name. I was asked questions like "are you changing your name to avoid criminal prosecution?" in my hearing. Oook. No.
Anyway it is probably state dependent.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jul 28, 2012 10:02:48 GMT -5
HR needs a swift kick in teh ass. You are free to keep your married name or go back to any other name you were known by prior to marriage. HR is waaaaaay out of line here.
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qofcc
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Post by qofcc on Jul 28, 2012 10:16:49 GMT -5
swamp. so, just to confirm. So even though Section 34 says:
ORDERED AND ADJUDGED THAT Plaintiff is authorized to resume the use of the prior surname XXXXX
That just means you're authorized to if you want to it doesn't mean you have to, right?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2012 10:55:31 GMT -5
qofcc - just to clarify - are you saying she changed her legal name back, but at work she was still using her married name?
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qofcc
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Post by qofcc on Jul 28, 2012 10:58:30 GMT -5
HR is waaaaaay out of line here.
Like I said, she's kind of a ditz. I think she intended to keep her former married name professionally and she possibly went back to her maiden name socially. I expect she probably changed her name on her DL or SS card or some other legal document and HR found out.
I know someone else getting divorced and going the do-it-yourself route and she wants to make sure that by using the default form that says she's authorized to go back to her maiden name that she's not obligated to go back to it.
She wants to keep her married name and HR requires a copy of the divorce decree to remove the former spouse as beneficiary of the benefits plans, so she wants to make sure they can't tell her that she has to change her name.
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alabamagal
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Post by alabamagal on Jul 28, 2012 11:29:44 GMT -5
Legally you can change your name anytime you want to anything you want (with a few exceptions, like Jesus Christ, etc.). When you get married, you are allowed to change your name without going through separate court proceedings and probably the same for divorce.
If you are not getting married or divorce, you just have to file court documents and get it approved by the judge. This is how Chad Johnson changed his name to Ochocinco, and I guess is not going back. You can choose your name with the proper paperwork.
I don't think anyone can force you to change your name (ex-husband, HR)
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2012 11:46:36 GMT -5
Like I said, she's kind of a ditz. I think she intended to keep her former married name professionally and she possibly went back to her maiden name socially. I expect she probably changed her name on her DL or SS card or some other legal document and HR found out. Yeah, the inconsistency can be a problem. I have a SIL who seems to have successfully used different last names socially and in business, but I have no idea what name was on her passport, drivers license, etc. and how she resolved any questions when they didn't match.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Jul 28, 2012 13:50:42 GMT -5
swamp. so, just to confirm. So even though Section 34 says: ORDERED AND ADJUDGED THAT Plaintiff is authorized to resume the use of the prior surname XXXXX That just means you're authorized to if you want to it doesn't mean you have to, right? Exactly. It's not an Order to change her name, it's permission to do it of she wants.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2012 13:57:36 GMT -5
They said she had to start using her legal name at work or they'd fire her. This makes it sound like she already legally changed her name in the divorce and now her employer wants her to use that. That sounds like a reasonable request to me, especially if she has to sign things or if they are going to have any need for her name and identification to match. I can imagine a secretary booking plane tickets for "Sarah Johnson" but then when the employee gets to the gate all her ID says "Sarah Smith."
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qofcc
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Post by qofcc on Jul 28, 2012 19:07:38 GMT -5
This makes it sound like she already legally changed her name in the divorce and now her employer wants her to use that. That sounds like a reasonable request to me, especially if she has to sign things or if they are going to have any need for her name and identification to match.
That's entirely possible. Thing is, we've worked together for 10 years and she was divorced when I met her and she's always used her former married name at work. I don't know why it's all of a sudden an issue, but some of the HR folks are pretty petty when it comes to rules. They wouldn't let my soon-to-be-step kids be considered my kids for the purposes of discount tickets to the company picnic at an amusement park 2 weeks before the wedding. I was so offended we didn't go to the picnic.
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northdakotanice
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Post by northdakotanice on Jul 28, 2012 19:07:53 GMT -5
A friend who is a teacher got a divorce in the middle of the school year...for the sake of not having to explain her crumbling personal life to a bunch of high school students she kept her married name. Later on, she decided to go back to her maiden name and found out she had to pay several hundred dollars and go back to court, the same process as when anyone legally changes their name (other than when you get married). Had she done it as a part of the divorce proceedings it would have been free of charge. I'm thinking that is what it means when it says you are "authorized" to go back to your prior name.
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Jul 28, 2012 19:24:02 GMT -5
I'm thinking that is what it means when it says you are "authorized" to go back to your prior name. my sis is going through this now, as a newlywed. she's a teacher, but her private school has a summer session. she changed her name immediately (the wedding was the weekend before summer session started) professionally, even though she's kind of taking her time converting the financial records to the new name. her thought was that some of the new summer kids would be full-time students in the fall. better that they learn the new name rather than the old one, for less confusion. as far as what the OP describes, unless that order says "must use the prior surname" I'd tell HR to pound sand.
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northdakotanice
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Post by northdakotanice on Jul 28, 2012 20:22:49 GMT -5
As a name change relates to HR, when I got married I completed my paperwork to change my name right away. At my part time job I tried three times to make the change. Each time was told I needed a different piece of documentation. After bringing in all three pieces of paper they still didn't make the change so I thought to hell with them. I went by my maiden name there for five years out of spite. Every year at tax time I would get a letter from them encouraging me to properly change my name with them (even though if they were to look in my file they would find all of the required paperwork I had submitted five years earlier). Finally last spring I bit the bullet and did it over. My boss told me she wouldn't give me my raise if I didn't.
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jul 28, 2012 22:13:19 GMT -5
...interesting thread... especially about the legal name vs. social name question... because I thought it was acceptable, and legal, for wives to use their husband's surname both legally and socially, despite retaining their maiden name... because they are, in fact, Mrs. Handsome Stranger... and they can be referred to as "Mrs. Stranger" even if their docs still say "Charming Jones"...
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Jul 28, 2012 22:29:42 GMT -5
You want it even more confusing? Under the law of my home country I am free to change my mind whenever I want. After my divorce DS1 thought I should change my name back and DS2 had a hard time with it, so I waited until he was ready. I then went to the embassy to get my paperwork done and was informed that I really didn't need to do anything (I also had to renew my passport so I had to be there anyway). When I questioned the "legally you can change it back whenever you want to" they dragged the relevant legislation up. So now - at least in my home country - I can be Mrs X-Y or Mrs X or Ms Y whenever the mood strikes me and it is all legal. The mood hasn't struck yet though and I doubt it ever will I did change to my maiden name for US purposes.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Jul 28, 2012 22:59:18 GMT -5
...interesting thread... especially about the legal name vs. social name question... because I thought it was acceptable, and legal, for wives to use their husband's surname both legally and socially, despite retaining their maiden name... because they are, in fact, Mrs. Handsome Stranger... and they can be referred to as "Mrs. Stranger" even if their docs still say "Charming Jones"... I don't believe in your example that you are LEGALLY Mrs. Handsome Stranger ever. That is not your legal name. That's a social construction. You might legally be Charming Jones, or legally Charming Stranger, but I don't believe you're ever "Mrs. Handsome Stranger".
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jul 28, 2012 23:16:34 GMT -5
...interesting thread... especially about the legal name vs. social name question... because I thought it was acceptable, and legal, for wives to use their husband's surname both legally and socially, despite retaining their maiden name... because they are, in fact, Mrs. Handsome Stranger... and they can be referred to as "Mrs. Stranger" even if their docs still say "Charming Jones"... I don't believe in your example that you are LEGALLY Mrs. Handsome Stranger ever. That is not your legal name. That's a social construction. You might legally be Charming Jones, or legally Charming Stranger, but I don't believe you're ever "Mrs. Handsome Stranger". ...and I've seen wives single signature, "Mrs. Handsome Stranger", despite their names being "Charming Jones" or "Charming Jones Stranger"... which is why I found this thread interesting...
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NoNamePerson
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Post by NoNamePerson on Jul 29, 2012 6:34:09 GMT -5
I couldn't tell from the post if she actually changed her name or not but here is excerpt from SS page. Anyone who does payroll should know this.
Update Your Payroll Records - Ask employees to verify their name and SSN before you close out your books and prepare the Forms W-2. If a name has changed, continue to use the old name and tell the employee to contact Social Security to obtain an updated card. Using a new name before the employee updates Social Security's records may prevent the posting of earnings to the employee's earnings history. Change your payroll records only after the employee obtains an updated Social Security card with the new name.
Maybe the co-worker hasn't given you a complete picture of the facts or HR person is confused about guide lines on name changes.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2012 7:58:18 GMT -5
...interesting thread... especially about the legal name vs. social name question... because I thought it was acceptable, and legal, for wives to use their husband's surname both legally and socially, despite retaining their maiden name... because they are, in fact, Mrs. Handsome Stranger... and they can be referred to as "Mrs. Stranger" even if their docs still say "Charming Jones"... I don't believe in your example that you are LEGALLY Mrs. Handsome Stranger ever. That is not your legal name. That's a social construction. You might legally be Charming Jones, or legally Charming Stranger, but I don't believe you're ever "Mrs. Handsome Stranger". I agree. I never changed my name, so calling me Mrs. HisLastName is incorrect. If someone does, I may let it pass if it's not worth the hassle of explaining. I once had a stupid bank assign my first husband's last name to me on a mortgage even though everything, including my payroll records and tax returns, were in my own name. A few years later they sent me a nasty letter telling me I'd given them an incorrect SS number because SS said it didn't match the name on the mortgage.
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beags
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Post by beags on Jul 29, 2012 20:45:30 GMT -5
One of my co-workers was recently forced by HR to change her name at work after her divorce. She's kind of a ditz and I don't know all of the details, but it got me thinking. On the New York State Judgment of Divorce form. Section 34 says: ORDERED AND ADJUDGED THAT Plaintiff is authorized to resume the use of the prior surname XXXXX Does that mean that she HAS to change her name back to that prior surname? Section 33 says: ORDERED AND ADJUDGED THAT both parties are authorized to resume the use of any prior surname so if someone didn't want to change their name after divorce should they just strike section 34? She completed the forms herself and filed them with the clerk. Well when a friend of ours was divorced from his wife because she cheated on him. . . . he told the judge that "I don't want that bitch carrying my last name." The judge ordered that she go back to her maiden name. (as that was the only other name she had) Of course this was in a different state than New York. I took the OP to mean that the judge has ordered her to go back to her previous name.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2012 21:21:42 GMT -5
If she changed her name with Social Security, then she declared her legal name as whatever she registered with them. I doubt that it is actually the divorce decree that HR is fussing about.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jul 30, 2012 6:49:08 GMT -5
"I know someone else getting divorced and going the do-it-yourself route and she wants to make sure that by using the default form that says she's authorized to go back to her maiden name that she's not obligated to go back to it.
She wants to keep her married name and HR requires a copy of the divorce decree to remove the former spouse as beneficiary of the benefits plans, so she wants to make sure they can't tell her that she has to change her name."
a do-it-yourself divorce?? I'm pretty cheap but I think that is one area where I would pay to make sure it got done right.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jul 30, 2012 7:23:56 GMT -5
I don't think in our state anyone can make you change it.
I had a co-worker who was only married 18 months but she decided to keep her exDH's last name because she liked it better than her maiden name. And I've had other friends who married divorced men who were annoyed that his ex-wife still had his name, too, making 2 Mrs ABC's - although I don't know why that bothered them.
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