The President shows defiance to the

[Value Buy]

Supreme Court.
His arrogance is showing.

www.foxnews.com/us/2012/06/26/business-as-usual-for-homeland-security-after-supreme-court-ruling-in-arizona/

Time for the President to realize he is not a King, but a President.

From the article:
"Rather than work cooperatively with the states, as federalism requires, the administration unwisely decided to unilaterally and abruptly terminate multiple agreements under a program that fostered federal-state cooperation in tackling a very difficult public safety threat to Americans, reads the letter, from GOP Reps. Paul Gosar, Dave Schweikert and Trent Franks.

The agent who talked to FoxNews.com said his colleagues are as outraged as he is and that federal policy makes it impossible to catch illegal immigrants who are criminals, unless they are caught in the act.

“The biggest problem with their catch-and-release method is that ICE does not have an effective process for identifying detainees," he said. Most detainees do not carry identification on them and they voluntarily provide their name.

“This leads to a larger problem. ... We already know that there are difficulties with confirming identities of detainees, so how can ICE be sure that they are not putting a criminal back on the street?”



Read more: www.foxnews.com/us/2012/06/26/business-as-usual-for-homeland-security-after-supreme-court-ruling-in-arizona/#ixzz1yzmXQ5jp

[Value Buy]

I am beginning to think my thread title should actually be

"The man who would be King", but that title has already been used...............

[zibazinski]

Hopefully, this issue will be resolved in november.

[Value Buy]

Only 132 short shopping day to go!

[Deleted]

articles.businessinsider.com/2012-01-30/news/31004595_1_deportation-kumar-kibble-rob-paral

Probably because it costs an estimated $12,500 - $23,480 per deportation.
That's a lot of money to deport your average, otherwise law-abiding undocumented immigrant.

[Value Buy]

Darn! I must be at my two thread limit.....
Anyone want to post the Tea Party victory in Oklahoma over the Republican incumbant for me?

In the article, it states the incumbant pissed off the Optometrists in the state.
I never knew they were such a huge votong block
I will even give you the source.
www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/27/tea-party-favorite-bridenstine-defeats-incumbent-sullivan-in-oklahoma-house/

[jkapp]

Jun 27, 2012 7:33:07 GMT -5 @craftysarah said:

articles.businessinsider.com/2012-01-30/news/31004595_1_deportation-kumar-kibble-rob-paral

Probably because it costs an estimated $12,500 - $23,480 per deportation.

A one-time expense...which ends up MUCH cheaper than paying for their children to adulthood with various welfare/assitance programs. The education costs alone are more than double that.

That's a lot of money to deport your average, otherwise law-abiding undocumented immigrant.

Yes, illegally crossing a border, fraudulent legal transactions, identity theft...they are just totally law-abiding individuals, as long as you you ignore their actual crimes.

[zibazinski]

I'm not seeing where it costs that. You escort them to the border of their country and say GOODBYE. If you have to put them on a plane, does the ticket cost that? Even if you have to have a guard traveling with them? Or charter a plane for a bunch of them with a guard.

[zibazinski]

We don't need to do any of this stuff. Don't feed them, educate them, employ them, or rent to them and it resolves itself.

[Mkitty is pro kitty]

Republican treatment of judge program

010 If President = Democrat then print "He's arrogant and has no respect for the SUPREME court!!!"
020 If President = Republican then print "Those liberal activist judges!!!!!!!"
030 Goto 010

Yes, illegally crossing a border, ...

Hence the "otherwise." Set phasers to "kneejerk!"

[Deleted]

Jun 27, 2012 9:04:33 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

I'm not seeing where it costs that. You escort them to the border of their country and say GOODBYE. If you have to put them on a plane, does the ticket cost that? Even if you have to have a guard traveling with them? Or charter a plane for a bunch of them with a guard.

Welcome to America. We have this thing we like to call "due process" here. You may not be familiar with it, but I am quite fond of it.

[Deleted]

Jun 27, 2012 8:45:12 GMT -5 jkapp said:

A one-time expense...which ends up MUCH cheaper than paying for their children to adulthood with various welfare/assitance programs. The education costs alone are more than double that.

Which children are you speaking of? The same costs are associated with deporting children born outside of the U.S. as adults born outside of the U.S.

Or do you mean children born in the U.S.? It doesn't cost any more to educate those CITIZENS than it does to educate your kids or my kids or your neighbor's kids...

[TonyTiger]

Message deleted by TonyTiger.

[zibazinski]

Good grief. It's attitudes like this that will be the ruin of this country.

[Deleted]

Jun 27, 2012 9:22:18 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Good grief. It's attitudes like this that will be the ruin of this country.

Funny, I was just thinking the same thing...

[zibazinski]

Yes, it does cost more to educate non-citizens btw. But that shouldn't be an issue because we shouldn't be doing it period.

[zibazinski]

Put your money where your mouth is. YOU sponsor and pay for an illegal citizen.

[zibazinski]

Illegal citizen, not even a word that should be used. Just illegal period. You sponsor a criminal and pay all their costs.

[TonyTiger]

Jun 27, 2012 9:19:50 GMT -5 @craftysarah said:

"...The same costs are associated with deporting children born outside of the U.S. as adults born outside of the U.S..."

Children born outside the US and here illegally need to be in schools in their countries of origin - not my country - and not on my nickel.

"...to educate those CITIZENS..."

Oh, hurry the day when a more conservative Supreme Court re-interprets the 14th Amendment in order to eliminate Citizenship (going forward) for the children born in this country of Illegal Aliens; thereby eliminating the problem of so-called Anchor Babies.

[TonyTiger]

Don't deport 'em. Simply make it illegal to give them jobs or to sell or rent housing to them or to provide medical services or to provide schooling to them, and they'll beat a hasty retreat to the Exit Door... self-deportation. Problem solved.

[jkapp]

Jun 27, 2012 9:19:50 GMT -5 @craftysarah said:

Jun 27, 2012 8:45:12 GMT -5 jkapp said:

A one-time expense...which ends up MUCH cheaper than paying for their children to adulthood with various welfare/assitance programs. The education costs alone are more than double that.

Which children are you speaking of? The same costs are associated with deporting children born outside of the U.S. as adults born outside of the U.S.

Or do you mean children born in the U.S.? It doesn't cost any more to educate those CITIZENS than it does to educate your kids or my kids or your neighbor's kids...

the children of illegals...you know, the ones NOT supposed to be here, yet continue to suck up our limited resources. Oh, that's right, to the far-left mind, resources are unlimited. At least, "other" people's resources are.

[Deleted]

(a) I commented on the costs of deporting a non-citizen and educating a citizen. I didn't say anything about the costs of educating a non-citizen. Now that you have brought it up, do you have any evidence to support your claim about differential educational costs?
(b) If I were to sponsor an immigrant, they would not be here illegally. That is how the immigration process works.

(c) My charitable giving is my business. My tax dollars, however, go to support schools in my community. I don't have kids. I don't even like kids. And yet, I pay to educate other people's kids every damn day. I don't complain about it. It surprises me that you - as a parent - would complain about the costs of an educational system that your kids benefitted from.

[Deleted]

Jun 27, 2012 9:25:54 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Illegal citizen, not even a word that should be used.

You are correct - this is an oxymoron.

I assumed you meant illegal resident, as by definition citizens are here legally.

[Deleted]

Jun 27, 2012 9:32:25 GMT -5 jkapp said:

Jun 27, 2012 9:19:50 GMT -5 @craftysarah said:

Which children are you speaking of? The same costs are associated with deporting children born outside of the U.S. as adults born outside of the U.S.

Or do you mean children born in the U.S.? It doesn't cost any more to educate those CITIZENS than it does to educate your kids or my kids or your neighbor's kids...

the children of illegals...you know, the ones NOT supposed to be here, yet continue to suck up our limited resources. Oh, that's right, to the far-left mind, resources are unlimited. At least, "other" people's resources are.

Nope. I'm fully aware that resources are limited. That was the reason I believed the immigration authorities were opting not to deport people who weren't engaged in criminal activity.

If a kid was born abroad and his parents brought him here illegally, it would cost money to deport the kid and money to deport his parents. More than $60k for a family of three. I suspect the agencies budget wouldn't accomodate that many deportations, so they prioritize. Let's spend our money to get rid of the criminals and hope that we have scared this family enough through their brief detention that they choose self-deportation.

Or, let's crack down on the employers who are making it financially viable for undocumented workers to live here. Because we know that as long as our economy supports undocumented workers, this family of three that we deported will just be replaced by three more people coming into the country.


But, you caught me - I am a silly little liberal. I do believe in the right to a K-12 public education for all citizens of this country. And I don't think we can refuse to educate kids just because they are poor or because their parents broke the law.

[Deleted]

Jun 27, 2012 9:42:13 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

It doesn't cost any more to educate those CITIZENS than it does to educate your kids or my kids or your neighbor's kids...

Let me get this straight...You're saying it doesn't cost anymore to educate the child of an illegal?
I was under the impression that our schools were being funded by our tax dollars, tax dollars that the illegal parents aren't paying.
So, who then is paying for this education?

(a) we've talked at length about the fact that most undocumented workers do pay taxes. They probably don't pay in enough to cover their share - but neither do most poor people. We still educate poor kids.

(b) who pays? I pay. The costs of the educational system in this country aren't fully covered by parents of school-aged kids. We all subsidize the costs of educating kids that aren't our own.

Why do we single out these kids? How is the U.S. citizen child of an undocumented worker less worthy than the child of a bank robber? The kids aren't responsible for the parents' criminal acts.

How is the U.S. citizen child of a foreign-born laborer less worthy than the child of a U.S.-born laborer? Both kids are poor. Both probably get free lunches at school. The kids aren't responsible for their parents' earning potential.

They are kids. They go to school. That's the deal.

[jkapp]

>>(a) I commented on the costs of deporting a non-citizen and educating a citizen. I didn't say anything about the costs of educating a non-citizen. Now that you have brought it up, do you have any evidence to support your claim about differential educational costs? <<

Differential education costs? Children of illegals get educated on our dime - they are not supposed to even be there. More kids means more supplies, teachers, equipment, ESL aids/teachers, etc - all paid by LEGAL residents for the benefit of ILLEGAL ones. The cost per pupil can range anywhere form $7k to $20k+ per year, depending on the location. That's a base rate of $84k for 12 years...far outpacing even the highest deportation cost of $24k.

Then you must factor in the children of illegals flashing La Raza Nation gang signs, and causing death and destruction within our neighborhoods, and ending up in prison, costing us all more in police and prison costs - which far outweigh a one-time cost of $12,500-$24k+. When we're having to pay tens of thousands of dollars each year to house a criminal illegal in our prison system, it kind of makes that one time deportation cost seem pretty reasonable...

[Deleted]

Jun 27, 2012 9:53:15 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

More than $60k for a family of three.

Where are you coming up with this figure?

$23,480 x 3 people = $70,440.
I rounded down.

[jkapp]

Jun 27, 2012 10:00:38 GMT -5 @craftysarah said:

Jun 27, 2012 9:53:15 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

Where are you coming up with this figure?

$23,480 x 3 people = $70,440.
I rounded down.

it could also be $12,500 x 3 = $37,500 which means you padded the bill

[jkapp]

Jun 27, 2012 9:58:42 GMT -5 @craftysarah said:

Jun 27, 2012 9:42:13 GMT -5 @lonewolf said:

Let me get this straight...You're saying it doesn't cost anymore to educate the child of an illegal?
I was under the impression that our schools were being funded by our tax dollars, tax dollars that the illegal parents aren't paying.
So, who then is paying for this education?

(a) we've talked at length about the fact that most undocumented workers do pay taxes. They probably don't pay in enough to cover their share - but neither do most poor people. We still educate poor kids.

(b) who pays? I pay. The costs of the educational system in this country aren't fully covered by parents of school-aged kids. We all subsidize the costs of educating kids that aren't our own.

Why do we single out these kids? How is the U.S. citizen child of an undocumented worker less worthy than the child of a bank robber? The kids aren't responsible for the parents' criminal acts.

How is the U.S. citizen child of a foreign-born laborer less worthy than the child of a U.S.-born laborer? Both kids are poor. Both probably get free lunches at school. The kids aren't responsible for their parents' earning potential.

They are kids. They go to school. That's the deal.

Kids get punished by their parents actions every day...why should this be any different?

Do you really believe the Babyboomers are leaving their kids a better country? They sure aren't leaving much of an economy for them...and allowing 11 million illegals to suck up even more resources isn't helping either.

[Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ]

I am curious as to why the fed govt requires legal and natural born US residents to have to produce numerous pieces of govt issued documentation in order to get/renew your drivers license, as well as in order to get a job?