fairlycrazy23
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Post by fairlycrazy23 on Jan 24, 2011 21:25:37 GMT -5
Maybe to discourage abortions, we should tax them, first is freebie (tax wise), for the next and beyond it gets progressively more expensive.
But we should make the morning after pill more available, it is not an abortion pill but prevents fertilization.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2011 21:28:52 GMT -5
A tax that women WITH money will have no problem affording, and which poor people will NOT be able to afford... Again, most people who have multiple abortions report having no access to primary care...
When abortion was illegal... rich women generally still didn't have a problem gaining access one... and they usually could find a safer one, although not as safe as modern methods...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2011 21:30:06 GMT -5
If you want to discourage abortions, in addition to making the morning after pill (and all birth control) more available, as you said, we need education, poverty elimination, and better access to primary care.
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Post by marjar on Jan 24, 2011 21:30:16 GMT -5
A tax that women WITH money will have no problem affording, and which poor people will NOT be able to afford... Again, most people who have multiple abortions report having no access to primary care... When abortion was illegal... rich women generally still didn't have a problem gaining access one... and they usually could find a safer one, although not as safe as modern methods... D&C's were popular for young girls with irregular cycles.
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vonnie6200
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Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 24, 2011 21:30:48 GMT -5
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vonnie6200
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Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 24, 2011 21:33:29 GMT -5
Or maybe even develop a birth control pill for men - to use until they are married and want to become a father - just a thought for modern medicine
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2011 21:34:19 GMT -5
I 100% agree with the idea of the morning after pill being widely available, and without a prescription. I know it is a heavy dose of hormones, and is not healthy for a woman to use as contraception. We need to teach our children this. Whatever-- it is better than killing an innocent human being. It all comes down to when you believe life starts. If you think life starts at conception-- how can you abort? If you think it starts at birth, but have a sick feeling you may be wrong-- well, then, I hope for you there is no God, because you are killing and you know it. If you could care less when life starts and just want that "parasite" out of your body................. geez-- I cannot even comprehend that.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2011 21:36:23 GMT -5
Vonnie-- I like it. Let the men kill themselves with hormones like women have been doing for a long time now.
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steff
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Post by steff on Jan 24, 2011 21:36:37 GMT -5
Your religious beliefs and your God have no right to tell women what they can or cannot do. And if there are consequences to be had in front of some "God" later, then it's not your problem is it?
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fairlycrazy23
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Post by fairlycrazy23 on Jan 24, 2011 21:37:06 GMT -5
A tax that women WITH money will have no problem affording, and which poor people will NOT be able to afford... Again, most people who have multiple abortions report having no access to primary care... When abortion was illegal... rich women generally still didn't have a problem gaining access one... and they usually could find a safer one, although not as safe as modern methods... Well obviously poor people wouldn't pay the tax, but it might put a dent in the rich ones and then the tax collected could go to pay for the abortions of the poor.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jan 24, 2011 21:37:16 GMT -5
I 100% agree with the idea of the morning after pill being widely available, and without a prescription. I know it is a heavy dose of hormones, and is not healthy for a woman to use as contraception. We need to teach our children this. Whatever-- it is better than killing an innocent human being. It all comes down to when you believe life starts. If you think life starts at conception-- how can you abort? If you think it starts at birth, but have a sick feeling you may be wrong-- well, then, I hope for you there is no God, because you are killing and you know it. If you could care less when life starts and just want that "parasite" out of your body................. geez-- I cannot even comprehend that. And if you believe it starts at birth and don't have a sick feeling you may be wrong?
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Jan 24, 2011 21:40:43 GMT -5
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Jan 24, 2011 21:41:23 GMT -5
He's equally responsible, but all the pro-abortion folks on here who are saying it is 100% "a woman's choice" seem to disagree with us on that... said "responsible" gentleman generally absconds his responsibility, hence the quote-unquote. your comments have generally seemed to be enlightened enough to catch this, but clearly you either choose to ignore it or are actually obtuse enough to think that men jump to do their duty every time the condom breaks. either way, your outrage at women is incredibly misplaced without equal outrage at the men involved in the same equations.
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Post by ed1066 on Jan 24, 2011 21:41:51 GMT -5
This is what I was talking about. Pro-abortion folks don't believe the man bears any responsibility. It's a bad road to go down, holding the woman 100% responsible for something that takes two people to do. Very unfair to the women...I'm teaching my own daughters better than this...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2011 21:42:11 GMT -5
But women living below the poverty line have 3X the number of abortions as women living at twice the poverty line income...
And most rich people have access to primary care, so multiple abortions would not be as common in that population.
Are there any medical procedures that are taxed? Just wondering? I don't know.
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Post by marjar on Jan 24, 2011 21:44:45 GMT -5
There are those who oppose this. The MAP works one of three ways, including preventing a fertilized egg from implanting in the wall of the uterus. Some people believe that life begins when fertilization occurs, regardless of whether implantation has happened. Again, the question of when does life begin?
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steff
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Post by steff on Jan 24, 2011 21:44:47 GMT -5
Ok ed, then your religious beliefs and your god have no right to tell any women or their partners/husbands/boyfriends that they cannot make the decision to abort or not. It's not your place or any other anti choicers right to dictate to everyone else what you feel is right or wrong. Abortion is LEGAL.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2011 21:46:27 GMT -5
I don't know anyone who is 'pro-abortion'. I'm pro-choice... (and frankly, I think 'pro-life' people should support live in ALL aspects and not just pre-birth, if they want to lay claim to that title...)
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vonnie6200
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Post by vonnie6200 on Jan 24, 2011 21:48:59 GMT -5
Your religious beliefs and your God have no right to tell women what they can or cannot do. And if there are consequences to be had in front of some "God" later, then it's not your problem is it? This has nothing to do with God - but either you are killing an innocent life or your are not - most of what I keep reading in the abortion debate is only about the convenience for the mother (and given the fact that the father has taken a hike - either physically or emotionally) Bottom line - abortion at some stage of a pregnancy is killing a viable life - for the convenience of its parents. And yes flame me all you want - but I have actually been there
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Post by ed1066 on Jan 24, 2011 21:51:21 GMT -5
Not that you would understand the difference, but it isn't a religious issue for me, it's a moral one...unless you believe there is no morality without religion...
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chiver78
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Post by chiver78 on Jan 24, 2011 21:52:20 GMT -5
This is what I was talking about. Pro-abortion folks don't believe the man bears any responsibility. It's a bad road to go down, holding the woman 100% responsible for something that takes two people to do. Very unfair to the women...I'm teaching my own daughters better than this... and yet the years prior to Roe v. Wade proved that society would scald the woman for her sinful actions while letting the man quietly walk away if he so chose. those of us that feel that the woman has the absolute right to choose only have history to rely on for our ideals. it's so nice to have the option of choice, sir, isn't it?
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steff
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Post by steff on Jan 24, 2011 21:52:29 GMT -5
but I have actually been there
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are you assuming others haven't? are you assuming that anyone else who has "been there" did it stricting for convience?
and is it still an "innocent" life if it's a result of rape? incest? if the mother's health is in jeopardy? at what point is it acceptable and the fetus is no longer this so called 'innocent life'?
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Post by marjar on Jan 24, 2011 21:53:01 GMT -5
Not that you would understand the difference, but it isn't a religious issue for me, it's a moral one...unless you believe there is no morality without religion... I do believe there is morality without religion. No doubt in my mind.
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fairlycrazy23
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Post by fairlycrazy23 on Jan 24, 2011 21:53:43 GMT -5
Bottom line - abortion at some stage of a pregnancy is killing a viable life - for the convenience of its parents. This seems like the root of the question when does a fetus become a human being and thus getting equal protection to the mother. I know it is absurd, but most people would say killing a baby outside the womb would be murder? So how about the minute before the fetus comes out? What is the cut off point?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2011 21:54:30 GMT -5
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Jan 24, 2011 21:56:18 GMT -5
[/size]
Cumulatively, the cost is insignificant compared to the cost of end of life care. If cost is a concern then shouldn't we focus there first instead of on a life that could actually contribute to the world for the next 80 years instead of one that's on its way out?
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Post by ed1066 on Jan 24, 2011 21:56:49 GMT -5
The pro-abortion folks can't answer this question honestly and without a lot of hemming and hawing and qualifications. That's why their arguments are weak and they tend to avoid direct discussion of this exact question...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2011 21:57:13 GMT -5
The cut off is generally accepted to be when a fetus if viable, capable of living outside the womb on his own... which is why third trimester has different rules... and why most abortions take place in the first trimester... way before viability...
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steff
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Post by steff on Jan 24, 2011 21:57:38 GMT -5
That's why their arguments are weak and they tend to avoid direct discussion of this exact question...
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abortion is LEGAL
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Post by ed1066 on Jan 24, 2011 21:58:41 GMT -5
Thank you for proving my point...
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