End Prohibition?

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

One of the biggest wastes of money over the last 80+ years has been the Prohibition of Cannabis. There have been BILLIONS of dollars wasted AND an ENTIRE black market has been created by trying to stop something that was once EMBRACED by this country(NA). So we are CREATING the thing we are tying to stop...

There was recently an attempt to take the money right out of the hands of the criminals by creating a cannabis bank in Colorado, however, it was decided that it is a federal decision... There is an idea for the O man, he likes tax, how about regulation and taxation of pot. Increase revenues and decrees spending fro a tax, that HAS to be something he would like.

We are talking about a HUGE fix for cash strapped states, and an entire new industry in some cases, that were actually already industries that existed. Which fits into the whole... What's old, is new!

Legalize marijuana, former B.C. attorneys-general say
Colin Gabelmann, Ujjal Dosanjh, Graeme Bowbrick and Geoff Plant say the 89-year-old marijuana prohibition has failed
www.vancouversun.com/news/Legalize+marijuana+former+attorneys+general/6152280/story.html

"It's just time - 77 per cent of Canadians are telling us it's time to change the law.".......

....."The case demonstrating the failure and harms of marijuana prohibition is airtight," write the attorneys general in their letter.

"Massive profits for organized crime, widespread gang violence, easy access to illegal cannabis for our youth, reduced community safety and significant-and escalating-costs to taxpayers."

More than 50,000 or so Canadians are busted every year for possession; throw in 20,000 traffickers and producers, and the so-called war on drugs is costing us as much as $400 million annually in law enforcement, court and corrections.(THAT'S CANADA!!!!)


They argue a regulation and taxation strategy will better protect our communities while eroding the profits of organized crime.

"It's time for our political leaders to accept and act on the overwhelming evidence linking marijuana prohibition to organized crime

and gang violence," said Geoff Plant, who served as Liberal attorney general from 2001 to 2005 in the first administration of Premier Gordon Campbell.

Pot activist to challenge Canada's drug laws
Compassion club owner charged with trafficking
www.kamloopsnews.ca/article/20120215/KAMLOOPS0101/120219872/-1/kamloops01/pot-activist-to-challenge-canadas-drug-laws

A Kamloops medical marijuana activist says he will challenge Canada’s drug laws as unconstitutional after being charged with trafficking.

Legal history of cannabis in the United States
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_history_of_cannabis_in_the_United_States

In 1619 Jamestown colony law declared that all settlers were required to grow hemp.[2] George Washington grew hemp at Mount Vernon as one of his three primary crops. The use of hemp for rope and fabric was ubiquitous throughout the 18th and 19th centuries in the United States.

Hemp
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemp#History

Biofuels, such as biodiesel and alcohol fuel, can be made from the oils in hemp seeds and stalks, and the fermentation of the plant as a whole, respectively. Biodiesel produced from hemp is sometimes known as "hempoline".[52]

Filtered hemp oil can be used directly to power diesel engines. In 1892, Rudolf Diesel invented the diesel engine, which he intended to fuel "by a variety of fuels, especially vegetable and seed oils, which earlier were used for oil lamps, i.e. the Argand lamp."[53][54][55]

Production of vehicle fuel from hemp is very small. Commercial biodiesel and biogas is typically produced from cereals, coconuts, palmseeds,... and a small amount of cheaper raw materials are used too, like garbage, wastewater, dead plant and animal material, animal feces and kitchen waste...........

..............Hemp was used extensively by the United States during World War II. Uniforms, canvas, and rope were among the main textiles created from the hemp plant at this time.[72] Much of the hemp used was cultivated in Kentucky and the Midwest.(YOU COULD ADD CA, OR, WA AND OTHERS NOW)

Patients say marijuana an effective treatment
www.dailytribune.com/articles/2011/10/04/news/doc4e8bb30a3f83d396669958.txt

Banking for pot shops rejected in Colorado
www.pekintimes.com/newsnow/x1341779735/Banking-for-pot-shops-rejected-in-Colorado

Marijuana-based drug Sativex may get FDA approval ?
articles.nydailynews.com/2012-01-22/news/30653996_1_fda-approval-sativex-drug-companies

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

That's is exactly is wxyz, then on top of that....

If prohibition was ended there would be TONS of investments. Pharmaceutics companies are already on the bandwagon. We would see more tax revue which would go toward the over all economy, which the stock market loves. Big commercial grow ops like the one in Oakland would go public, and the people that supply all this stuff would also have more revenue. There would be companies like PM that would pop up, and they would be great LONG TERM investments because they would supply more than just a tobacco like product and since cannabis hasn't been shown to give anyone caner yet, if you didn't invest in Tobacco for moral reason it would give you an opportunity to invest in something similar in good conscious.

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

It's just a matter of time now, this is a clear indication that Socialism is on the way out. A Conservative party admitting that they are just waisting our money currently and that a new approach is necessary, aka TAX...

Softening tone, Harper concedes drug war ‘is not working’
www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/softening-tone-harper-concedes-drug-war-is-not-working/article2403500/?utm_source=Shared

[Driftr]

At the moment I support legalization. The one thing I haven't fully considered in my opinion though is whether it is a gateway drug or not. Anyone have studies on that?

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

I'm on my phone right now Driftr, I could see what I could find. Personally I look at it like all they are doing is wasting cash and putting money in the hands of criminals. It's fairly obvious that people aren't listening to the "laws" that they are trying to enforce and the fact is it's our tax dollars that are being wasted. Pot is a revenue stream for the criminals that push harder stuff, which is mostly in the clubs where alchol gernerally leads people to it. So if we take that stream from the criminals and focus and the hard stuff we are actually doubling our efforts on cleaning up our streets of the poision.

[Driftr]

No need for you to research. If we ever get close to legalization I expect there will be studies published up the wazoo.

[Trongersoll]

Alcohol and Tobacco are gateway drugs.

[Deleted]

Unless a benefit can be shown to compel people to want to legalize it, i don't see it happening. I think it is probably no worse than alcohol, but that isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of why we should have a mind altering substance be legal and it would have the air of legitimacy and also become more available. I really don't want my teens to have any more access to it than they probably already do. And, i do believe that legalizing it would in their minds be saying that it is safe and fine to use.

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

It's most likely less harmful and damaging long term than alcohol, and it can be used to treat caner patients. Teens "don't" have access to alcohol and tobacco and right now if your teens are getting a hold of weed, there is the possibility that it isn't clean. If it's regulated, then their is 0 chance that it has been tampered with. Grow houses, gone, big producers (Wal-martish) would knock those mom and pops off the market, which is why cartels actually SUPPORT the criminalization of weed, it keeps it in their hands.

Which is the next point, in this very first article in this thread the cost of fighting just pot, was quoted at $400 Mil in Canada; so it would probably like 4 Billion in the USA. Yet it's becoming decriminalized for medicinal purposes across the country???

Then there is the other thing the marijuana does that alcohol doesn't. Make rope, paper, clothing, biofuels, ect.. Which is exactly why from the founding of the country until, and during WW2 fields of it were all over the USA.

I could go on and I feel bad for ranting, however, the best point is the one that Trong made. Booze and Tobacco are the biggest gateway drugs and the fact is that cigs are targeted toward teens and pre teens. By the time people are adults they have usually decided to be a smoker or not.

[Deleted]

I really don't have a problem with legalizing. But, it is hard to get past the hump of why it is somehow of benefit to society to legalize yet another mood altering substance.

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

That's an easy one. Everyday I see ads on TV for pills that these "mental health" professionals are giving people that have side effects up to and including death. Pills for aliments that have side effects longer than the positives. None of these issues are prevalent in pot. However, the biggest thing, for six years I have been saying that this is coming and the reality is that it's because Socialism is dying. Our bureaucratic govt doesn't produce anything, it is literally the biggest middle man in the history of the world and there is no way that they can keep wasting money on things that over 50% of the population sees as just that.

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

So this gets interesting. The theme of this trend is of course that this was always just an VERY expensive prohibition anyway. Think about the change in Tax revenue, ect, ect.

Obama's October Surprise Could Be Legalizing Pot
news.yahoo.com/obamas-october-surprise-could-legalizing-pot-191100768.html

Poll suggests two thirds of Canadians want possession of small pot amounts decriminalized
ca.news.yahoo.com/blogs/dailybrew/poll-suggests-two-thirds-canadians-want-possession-small-211305728.html

[Bluerobin]

Legalizing Marijauna only, would be like legalizing Scotch but not Bourbon. Legalize everything. If some idiot is going to blow his brains out with drugs, it doesn't matter whether they are legal or not. Legalize it, tax it, and stop wasting money on the DEA and prisons. Sell it at CVS to adults only. That won't totally stop kids from getting drugs, but it will drastically cut down on use by kids.

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

That's what they do in Spain.. bring them in off the streets and educate them, ect, ect. Those stats are interesting. I agree it's about choices and junkies are a cost to the system either way, at least one way is trying to lead them towards a less violent life. Consider this, they just legalized prostitution across Canada, and yet they won't legalize weed? Or will they..? ;D

[Driftr]

The Dutch are getting more restrictive. God I hate the Dutch.

The Netherlands has begun rolling-out restrictions on the sale of cannabis to foreigners, as part of attempts to deter drug tourism.

www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/europe/benelux/120501/dutch-cannabis-coffee-shops-begin-closing-doors-tourists

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

LOL... What you don't like wooden shoes...

I have heard that all the shop owners are lobbying against this. Seems like a money grab. A govt trying to grab money through taxes??

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

More pressure on PM Harper..

B.C. mayors vote to decriminalize pot: That was the easy part
www.vancouversun.com/news/story.html?id=7303027

[Cookies Galore]

Apr 17, 2012 14:25:23 GMT -5 Driftr said:

At the moment I support legalization. The one thing I haven't fully considered in my opinion though is whether it is a gateway drug or not. Anyone have studies on that?

I've been conducting a study since I was about 17 years old. It's cool, man.

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

Same! I grew up in a dying town of 300 that seem to almost glorify alcoholism, when my friends stared drinking at 13-14, I look up some facts.

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

Socialism is finished.

Mulgrew: U.S. vote could signal beginning of the end for War on Drugs
With three states contemplating legalizing marijuana and a growing chorus of support, prohibition’s days seem numbered
www.calgaryherald.com/news/Mulgrew+election+could+signal+beginning+Drugs/7496954/story.html

The Washington State measure, though, looks like it is going to pass according to the latest polls.

Colorado’s could as well, though Oregon’s looks headed for defeat.

B.C. Watches Marijuana Vote Closely
www.ctvvancouverisland.ca/2012/11/b-c-watches-marijuana-vote-closely/

B.C. MLA Kash Heed calls for legalization of marijuana
www.vancouversun.com/news/Kash+Heed+calls+legalization+marijuana/7409759/story.html

Amsterdam's cannabis cafes will remain open to tourists, city's mayor says
www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/amsterdams-cannabis-cafes-will-remain-open-to-tourists-citys-mayor-says-8276780.html

[Deleted]

Honestly, with world govts and markets collapsing and an outdated energy grid and govt run by Lords and Ladies who vote for things and then exempt themselves from their own laws, i really don't have much energy left to rally around illegal cannabis as some kind of issue i want to hang my hat on. We don't need even more legal substances for people to impair themselves.

[ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ]

Consider this, they just legalized prostitution across Canada, and yet they won't legalize weed?

You must live in a different Canada than I do.

www.slsedmonton.com/criminal/prostitution/

[weltschmerz]

Nov 6, 2012 13:50:27 GMT -5 ՏՇԾԵԵʅՏɧ_LԹՏՏʅҼ said:

Consider this, they just legalized prostitution across Canada, and yet they won't legalize weed?

You must live in a different Canada than I do.

www.slsedmonton.com/criminal/prostitution/

SL, they recently legalized brothels in Ontario. I think it's a great idea. Much safer for the women.

Ontario cities could be getting brothels as early as next year, thanks to a ruling from the province’s top court this week. The decision allows prostitutes to hire bodyguards, starting next month, but upheld a ban on street solicitation. This means municipalities could start issuing licences so that prostitutes could operate brothels as any other small business.
www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/what-will-ontarios-legalized-brothels-be-like-your-questions-answered/article4096161/
Harassing people on the street (solicitation) will still be illegal.

[Virgil Showlion]

Much safer for the women.

Not the ones who wouldn't have considered it as a trade had it remained illegal.

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

It's not just Ont Weltz, Sask and BC are also going that way as well. I don't know what to think of it....

Putting the brakes on the legalization of prostitution
Target the demand, not the supply, Malarek says
ckom.com/story/putting-brakes-legalization-prostitution/82285

Sex workers free to challenge Canada’s prostitution laws, court rules
Supreme Court of Canada sides with group wanting to challenge prostitution laws.
www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/americas/canada/120921/sex-workers-challenge-canada-prostitution-laws


Shooby, world markets are definitely not collapsing. These are turbulent times no doubt and will be for a while I’m pretty sure. What is collapsing is big govt spending and the programs that go along with the idea of socially engineer a perfect society with govt subsidies. The reason I think this is because of the massive debt. The only way they are going to pay for that is through GDP growth and regulation of natural substances like cannabis. So, I guess what I’m saying is there is nothing to rally around it’s just the economics of the situation.

As far as impairment, I would say that pharmaceutically produced mind and mood altering drugs and sleep aids are far worse than cannabis in that department. I have heard of many stories of people going off their physic pills and doing some bad things. Those same things don’t seem to happen with cannabis users.

Cannabis has been used for at least 4500 yrs as medicine. Whereas the stuff that I see all the time advertised for curing the same ailments from pharmaceutical CO. have been around for 30 yrs tops. Most new products on the market seem to have the side effect that it may cause blindness or death.

Not only will it make money in the tax department, it will also cut down on costs and make police services more efficient. To me it’s nothing political; it comes down money and the future. I would also like to invest in a cannabis company like people can with tobacco and pharmaceutical companies and make big dividends in a long term market. Cannabis is legal for medicinal purposes right now and cigarettes give you cancer

[Virgil Showlion]

Shooby, world markets are definitely not collapsing. These are turbulent times no doubt and will be for a while I’m pretty sure. What is collapsing is big govt spending and the programs that go along with the idea of socially engineer a perfect society with govt subsidies.

Alas, nothing Mr. Ahamburger just said is true.

You'll have to forgive him, shooby. Think of it as "climate change denial" where the climate change is in the world economy.

His views on medicinal marijuana aren't bad, though.

[Bluerobin]

Legalize pot and tax it. No fiscal cliff worries!

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

Probably, cigarettes put people in the hospital and pot has been used as medicine for over 7000 yrs. It was also instrumental in the early success of the USA, hemp was used for everything(clothing, ships sails, oil, ect). Cigarettes and tobacco will never be outlawed, they are legal for the same reason that pot is going to be legalized, money.

California pot decriminalization correlated to lowest youth crime rate in recorded history
boingboing.net/2012/11/30/california-pot-decriminalizati.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+boingboing%2FiBag+%28Boing+Boing%29

How to invest in legalized marijuana
articles.marketwatch.com/2012-11-13/finance/35076220_1_medical-marijuana-dispensaries-medical-marijuana-medbox

Legal drugs, deadly outcomes: LA Times investigation on prescription drug deaths
boingboing.net/2012/11/11/legal-drugs-deadly-outcomes.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+boingboing%2FiBag+%28Boing+Boing%29

An excellent long read on the growing phenomenon of prescription drug overdoses in Southern California, which a Los Angeles Times investigative team reports "now claim more lives than heroin and cocaine combined, fueling a doubling of drug-related deaths in the United States over the last decade."

Israel pushing ahead in medical marijuana industry
news.yahoo.com/israel-pushing-ahead-medical-marijuana-industry-180817891.html

[Jake 48]

[Aman A.K.A. Ahamburger]

Just a quick note here for today, 52 percent of Americans in favor of legalizing marijuana.