Our "200 Patriotic Millionaires"

[Value Buy]

We have 200 "patriotic millionaires" who say they are under taxed and want to pay more Federal income taxes.............well, why don't they start by informing their accountants and tax attorneys to stop looking for loopholes and deductions?
Problem solved.

Why must there be more Legislation to solve their angst?

Do they speak for the rest of the "99 millionaires" group, or are they the evil "1%" in sheeps's clothing?

[Deleted]

Nov 17, 2011 11:46:26 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Why must there be more Legislation to solve their angst?

Misery loves company?

[Value Buy]

Can a mod move this to the Politics board? I am in the wrong forum......

[rovo]

Yup. I'll move it over to P&M for you.

[Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ]

Some numb-nutz was on the PBS Newshour last evening, I forget the hamsters name. But he was rambling and pontificating like some blowhard liberal professor at Columbia about how just paying more is not acceptable.

[Bluerobin]

Actually, the IRS does accept donations........

[Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ]

Nov 17, 2011 12:26:22 GMT -5 Bluerobin said:

Actually, the IRS does accept donations........

And interestingly enough, they only enforce a minimum collectible tax level.

[Mkitty is pro kitty]

We have 200 "patriotic millionaires" who say they are under taxed and want to pay more Federal income taxes

"Millionaires Support Warren Buffett’s Tax on the Rich"
blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2011/10/27/most-millionaires-support-warren-buffetts-tax-on-the-rich/?mod=e2tw

"A new survey from Spectrem Group found that 68% of millionaires (those with investments of $1 million or more) support raising taxes on those with $1 million or more in income. Fully 61% of those with net worths of $5 million or more support the tax on million-plus earners."

Sorry, painting them as a kooky 1% minority doesn't work. You can pick up your fail on the way out.

well, why don't they start by informing their accountants and tax attorneys to stop looking for loopholes and deductions?

I hate to inform you, but that horse is long dead and there's probably nothing left to it.

Why must there be more Legislation to solve their angst?

Because legislation would make it so everyone does. That's how legislation works. Tomorrow's topic: is water wet?

[Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ]

"A new survey from Spectrem Group found that 68% of millionaires (those with investments of $1 million or more) support raising taxes on those with $1 million or more in income. Fully 61% of those with net worths of $5 million or more support the tax on million-plus earners."

Sorry, painting them as a kooky 1% minority doesn't work. You can pick up your fail on the way out.

Sorry, millionaires with $1 million in assets would include nearly most of the current crop of retirees, and most of not all the middle class boomers with paid off homes, fat 401Ks and IRAs.

[AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP]

"Anyone may arrange his affairs so that his taxes shall be as low as possible; he is not bound to choose that pattern which best pays the treasury. There is not even a patriotic duty to increase one's taxes. Over and over again the Courts have said that there is nothing sinister in so arranging affairs as to keep taxes as low as possible. Everyone does it, rich and poor alike and all do right, for nobody owes any public duty to pay more than the law demands." - Justice Learned Hand

Justice Learned Hand He

rose to fame outside the legal profession in 1944 after giving a short address in Central Park that struck a popular chord in its appeal for tolerance. During a period when a hysterical fear of subversion divided the nation, Hand was viewed as a liberal defender of civil liberties. A collection of Hand's papers and addresses, published in 1952 as The Spirit of Liberty, sold well and won him new admirers. Even after he criticized the civil-rights activism of the 1950s Warren Court, Hand retained his popularity.
Hand is also remembered as a pioneer of modern approaches to statutory interpretation. His decisions in specialist fields, such as patents, torts, admiralty law, and antitrust law, set lasting standards for craftsmanship and clarity. On constitutional matters, he was both a political progressive and an advocate of judicial restraint. He believed in the protection of free speech and in bold legislation to address social and economic problems. He argued, however, that the United States Constitution does not empower courts to overrule the legislation of elected bodies, except in extreme circumstances. Instead, he advocated the "combination of toleration and imagination that to me is the epitome of all good government".[3]

[usaone]

Nov 17, 2011 13:42:42 GMT -5 Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ said:

"A new survey from Spectrem Group found that 68% of millionaires (those with investments of $1 million or more) support raising taxes on those with $1 million or more in income. Fully 61% of those with net worths of $5 million or more support the tax on million-plus earners."

Sorry, painting them as a kooky 1% minority doesn't work. You can pick up your fail on the way out.

Sorry, millionaires with $1 million in assets would include nearly most of the current crop of retirees, and most of not all the middle class boomers with paid off homes, fat 401Ks and IRAs.

1 Million or more in income NOT assets.

I never understand middle class people that are so upset about the richest of the rich paying slightly more taxes. They are historically low at the moment.

[floridayankee]

Nov 17, 2011 13:42:42 GMT -5 Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ said:

"A new survey from Spectrem Group found that 68% of millionaires (those with investments of $1 million or more) support raising taxes on those with $1 million or more in income. Fully 61% of those with net worths of $5 million or more support the tax on million-plus earners."

Sorry, painting them as a kooky 1% minority doesn't work. You can pick up your fail on the way out.

Sorry, millionaires with $1 million in assets would include nearly most of the current crop of retirees, and most of not all the middle class boomers with paid off homes, fat 401Ks and IRAs.

That's why they can support it. Being a millionaire is not dependent on a million dollar income. The tax increase likely won't effect them one bit.

[Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ]

Nov 17, 2011 14:17:22 GMT -5 floridayankee said:

Nov 17, 2011 13:42:42 GMT -5 Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ said:

"A new survey from Spectrem Group found that 68% of millionaires (those with investments of $1 million or more) support raising taxes on those with $1 million or more in income. Fully 61% of those with net worths of $5 million or more support the tax on million-plus earners."

Sorry, painting them as a kooky 1% minority doesn't work. You can pick up your fail on the way out.


Sorry, millionaires with $1 million in assets would include nearly most of the current crop of retirees, and most of not all the middle class boomers with paid off homes, fat 401Ks and IRAs.

That's why they can support it. Being a millionaire is not dependent on a million dollar income. The tax increase likely won't effect them one bit.

They've been lead to believe it will not affect them.

How's the AMT working out for the typical middle class family?

[djAdvocate]

Nov 17, 2011 11:46:26 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

We have 200 "patriotic millionaires" who say they are under taxed and want to pay more Federal income taxes.............well, why don't they start by informing their accountants and tax attorneys to stop looking for loopholes and deductions?
Problem solved.

you are mistaking the problem. the problem is not that they feel they are undertaxed. the problem is the deficit. and taxing ONLY them certainly will not fix it.

[floridayankee]

Nov 17, 2011 14:40:13 GMT -5 Savoir Faire-Demogague in NJ said:

Nov 17, 2011 14:17:22 GMT -5 floridayankee said:

That's why they can support it. Being a millionaire is not dependent on a million dollar income. The tax increase likely won't effect them one bit.

They've been lead to believe it will not affect them.

Trust me. Our government wouldn't do that to them......

How's the AMT working out for the typical middle class family?

....again.

[Angel!]

Nov 17, 2011 14:54:14 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Nov 17, 2011 11:46:26 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

We have 200 "patriotic millionaires" who say they are under taxed and want to pay more Federal income taxes.............well, why don't they start by informing their accountants and tax attorneys to stop looking for loopholes and deductions?
Problem solved.

you are mistaking the problem. the problem is not that they feel they are undertaxed. the problem is the deficit. and taxing ONLY them certainly will not fix it.

How dare these millionaires share their opinions on how to improve the deficit of this country, especially when those solutions means they personally will pay more taxes.

Are millionaires not allowed to have opinions on fixing the deficit or what they feel are appropiate rates?

[floridayankee]

Nov 17, 2011 15:17:58 GMT -5 Angel! said:

How dare these millionaires share their opinions on how to improve the deficit of this country, especially when those solutions means they personally will pay more taxes.

Seeing as how you're overreacting and injecting drama here, I'd say it's more like how dare us peasants share our opinion about raising taxes on the rich even though it will have no effect on us what-so-ever. And, being a millionaire does not mean they will pay more. The proposed tax increase on those earning more than $1 million per year. It has nothing to do with simply being a millionaire.

Are millionaires not allowed to have opinions on fixing the deficit or what they feel are appropiate rates?

Sure they are....has anyone suggested otherwise? Are we allowed to share our opinion or will we get the above overreaction every time we do?

[cme1201]

Nov 17, 2011 15:28:44 GMT -5 floridayankee said:

Are we allowed to share our opinion or will we get the above overreaction every time we do?

You must be new here, allow me to welcome you. ;D

[floridayankee]

Nov 17, 2011 15:54:58 GMT -5 cme1201 said:

Nov 17, 2011 15:28:44 GMT -5 floridayankee said:

Are we allowed to share our opinion or will we get the above overreaction every time we do?

You must be new here, allow me to welcome you. ;D

[Deleted]

How dare these millionaires share their opinions on how to improve the deficit of this country, especially when those solutions means they personally will pay more taxes.

You can literally send a check to the IRS and specifically mark the funds to go to the deficit. I'd be more willing to listen if these folks were sending in their checks while waiting for the legislation to occur to raise rates on millionaires. Saying "no one is forcing me to do what I believe is the right thing, therefore I'm not going to do it" is just cheesy and ethically pathetic.

I believe in food banks and birth control, therefore I send money to those causes. I'm not waiting for the gov't to make me do it.

[Value Buy]

Nov 17, 2011 13:37:30 GMT -5 Mkitty is pro kitty said:

We have 200 "patriotic millionaires" who say they are under taxed and want to pay more Federal income taxes

"Millionaires Support Warren Buffett’s Tax on the Rich"
blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2011/10/27/most-millionaires-support-warren-buffetts-tax-on-the-rich/?mod=e2tw

"A new survey from Spectrem Group found that 68% of millionaires (those with investments of $1 million or more) support raising taxes on those with $1 million or more in income. Fully 61% of those with net worths of $5 million or more support the tax on million-plus earners."

Sorry, painting them as a kooky 1% minority doesn't work. You can pick up your fail on the way out.



I hate to inform you, but that horse is long dead and there's probably nothing left to it.

Why must there be more Legislation to solve their angst?

Because legislation would make it so everyone does. That's how legislation works. Tomorrow's topic: is water wet?

Why is that horse dead?
Not all millionaires want to pay more taxes. Let the ones that do want to, do it.
Add a BOX to the Federal tax return, stating, "Yes, I am under taxed. Please charge me an extra 10% (or whatever you feel is fair) more to my original gross income Before loopholes and deductions.
Wonder how many altruistic people will check that off.
To be fair, add a box for the poor who receive more money than they had withheld, with a box stating,
Yes, I believe I should not be compensated for ignoring all parental requests to not get pregnant in high school (if I even stayed in school) not do drugs, or any other nasty habit that makes me not want to earn an income, and please do not send me my earned income tax credit to the treasury.
How many takers will we see with that one....

As far as Legislation, less is more. Too many Legislative regulations now. That is why millionaires are millionaires, and most here, are not.

[Angel!]

Nov 17, 2011 15:28:44 GMT -5 floridayankee said:

Are millionaires not allowed to have opinions on fixing the deficit or what they feel are appropiate rates?

Sure they are....has anyone suggested otherwise? Are we allowed to share our opinion or will we get the above overreaction every time we do?

How is my reaction any more dramatic than just saying millionaires who think taxes should be raised should just pay extra on taxes through donations without changing the tax code? Maybe I don't follow the same logic as some of you, but that is a dumbass idea if I have ever heard one.

And for the record, I think everyone should pay more in taxes, so I would be impacted by my opinions on taxes. And if any of you suggest I just send more than I owe, well like I said - dumbass idea if I ever heard one.

[Deleted]

Nov 17, 2011 11:46:26 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

We have 200 "patriotic millionaires" who say they are under taxed and want to pay more Federal income taxes.............well, why don't they start by informing their accountants and tax attorneys to stop looking for loopholes and deductions?
Problem solved.

Why must there be more Legislation to solve their angst?

Do they speak for the rest of the "99 millionaires" group, or are they the evil "1%" in sheep's clothing?

Oh I just love this. People who earn more than a million annually (that would be the very bottom of the the deep end of the barrel) actually saying, "look, let the Bush tax cuts on us die, we can afford it."

We all should pay our share, obviously.

But then most of the serfs and peasants on this board ;D (I say that in a jesting sort of way), are all up in arms about how their poor masters are being mistreated and abused.

Ya just can't cure stupid, can you.

[Value Buy]

Nov 17, 2011 17:29:35 GMT -5 Robert not Bobby said:

Nov 17, 2011 11:46:26 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

We have 200 "patriotic millionaires" who say they are under taxed and want to pay more Federal income taxes.............well, why don't they start by informing their accountants and tax attorneys to stop looking for loopholes and deductions?
Problem solved.

Why must there be more Legislation to solve their angst?

Do they speak for the rest of the "99 millionaires" group, or are they the evil "1%" in sheep's clothing?

Oh I just love this. People who earn more than a million annually (that would be the very bottom of the the deep end of the barrel) actually saying, "look, let the Bush tax cuts on us die, we can afford it."

We all should pay our share, obviously.

But then most of the serfs and peasants on this board ;D (I say that in a jesting sort of way), are all up in arms about how their poor masters are being mistreated and abused.

Ya just can't cure stupid, can you.

Are you jesting when you call me "stupid"?

[Deleted]

No not you.

Well, I haven't read enough of your posts to know for sure. I am talking about the general tenor of this place. It is always about the government destroying the country and people being taxed to death.

Give me some time to judge you, we've only just crossed board paths.

I like the idea that greed is not always paramount and limitless. I like the idea that people who feel they can contribute to the greater good are willing to do so. If we are just this atomized country, with everyone looking out for their own interests and nothing above that, then it is a sad state of affairs.

[Deleted]

And if any of you suggest I just send more than I owe, well like I said - dumbass idea if I ever heard one.

I think it's hypocritical and morally suspect to say that the right thing to do is pay more taxes and yet not do it. There are avenues available to these folks to pay more in taxes. I just find it really strange to say that I'm not going to do the right thing until I'm forced to do it - so make me do it. What's that about? To they have such little moral fiber or spine?

I actually agree that taxes on people earning that kind of money should be raised.

[Mkitty is pro kitty]

Not all millionaires want to pay more taxes. Let the ones that do want to, do it.

In other words, "let the babies have their own way."

Add a BOX to the Federal tax return

Or how about a BOX that says "I'm whiny and unpatriotic and I'll be moving to Somalia the first chance I get." Speaking of which...

"Patriotic Millionaires To Grover Norquist: ‘Move To Somalia’"
horseedmedia.net/2011/11/18/patriotic-millionaires-to-grover-norquist-move-to-somalia/
Just remember, you heard it here first

I think it's hypocritical and morally suspect to say that the right thing to do is pay more taxes and yet not do it.

Who knows what they do with their taxes. If they voluntarily not use a tax break, how would we know?

To they have such little moral fiber or spine?

Right, they're so much more amoral than the ones that spend millions lobbying to get mega-millions.

[formerexpat]

"A new survey from Spectrem Group found that 68% of millionaires (those with investments of $1 million or more) support raising taxes on those with $1 million or more in income.

This just in, 68% of apples believe potatoes should be peeled.

Assets and Income are not the same.

[formerexpat]

And for the record, I think everyone should pay more in taxes, so I would be impacted by my opinions on taxes. And if any of you suggest I just send more than I owe, well like I said - dumbass idea if I ever heard one.

If you think you should pay more, do it. Money - meet mouth.

www.pay.gov/paygov/forms/formInstance.html?agencyFormId=23779454

I want my government to fix their fucking spending problem before they come to me for any more money.

[Angel!]

Nov 17, 2011 20:19:13 GMT -5 @anne81 said:

And if any of you suggest I just send more than I owe, well like I said - dumbass idea if I ever heard one.

I think it's hypocritical and morally suspect to say that the right thing to do is pay more taxes and yet not do it.

Well, I never said paying more taxes is the right thing to do nor am I trying to make it a moral issue, so I don't see the hypocrisy. I'm saying that if this country wants to take steps to fix this problem, one of those steps needs to be to raise taxes on everyone, including me.

Me personally sending in extra would be like a drop in the freaking ocean & useless. I could donate my entire income & it would be meaningless. I am interested in making changes that would actually help this country, not making some moral stand or trying to make myself feel superior by sending in extra taxes.

I want my government to fix their fucking spending problem before they come to me for any more money.

The govt has both a spending problem & lack of revenue problem. To fix this country they need to focus on both sides of the equation. They can't cut spending enough to make ends meet at this point, so that means they have to raise revenue also.

There is a massive difference between me sending in an extra $1200 & raising the tax rates on everyone in the country. One costs me money & won't make a damn bit of difference & the other (while still costing me money) will be taking a step towards solving our problems. Why some people are unable to see the difference is beyond me. That is why asking people who believe taxes should be raised to just donate is a dumbass idea. It has nothing to do with being hypocritical & has to do with changing our country's path & trying to fix our problems.