zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Aug 10, 2011 13:05:19 GMT -5
I think it is very generous of her parents. It is a step up from the streets but not so great that she will live there permanently.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Aug 10, 2011 13:05:49 GMT -5
I'm personally kind of curious about the "shed". Yes it is small, but it sounds like it is climate controlled and it has running water (although no bathroom ... probably more of an issue for a pregnant woman in the last trimester than a baby).
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Aug 10, 2011 13:19:56 GMT -5
Does the friend know if her husband has created other babies with other women? If he has, and the other woman files for child support first, your friend could be SOL, depending on the state. Given this guys history, I'd be surprised if he didn't father another child.
In your shoes, I would actually suggest your friend finding another lawyer. Now, many people are counseled to stay in the house. It tends to not be a good idea to leave the marital home, and could come to bit her in the rear if her husband gets a nasty lawyer.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Aug 10, 2011 13:55:36 GMT -5
I thought it was an apartment. If it was his before marriage, she is SOL.
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Clever Username
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Post by Clever Username on Aug 10, 2011 13:57:31 GMT -5
Comparing the description of this "shed" to those Phil has posted about his childhood home.... which would you choose? Reading between the lines: why are they making her live in the shed? Because it's a decent place to live. Will DCFS like it? Maybe not. Will their custody judge like it? Maybe not. Will the guy she picks up at the club like it? Better than inside with her parents.
Personally, I think a low safety net is a good way to encourage her own personal responsibility. Similarly, if she hits you up for lunch again, practice a similar response. Allow her to order one or two items off of the dollar item.
Oft repeated maxim when I was growing up: Beggers can't be choosers.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 10, 2011 14:15:42 GMT -5
So, here is a thought...
We've heard about him having an affair - but is it possible she wants to stay married until after the baby is born so he would have to legally fight being on the birth certificate? I mean, if he thinks she has been out and about, maybe the baby isn't his, or at least he thinks it isn't. Maybe the lawyer says that staying married gives a presumed parenthood, and he would have to fight to get away from that kid. As opposed to being legally divorced, she could list him, but he could dispute easier (maybe.)
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Aug 10, 2011 14:16:59 GMT -5
The plot thickens......
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 10, 2011 14:34:31 GMT -5
I'm doing my best to work this up to the MOST f'd up situation I can fictionalize.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Aug 10, 2011 14:46:46 GMT -5
I'm doing my best to work this up to the MOST f'd up situation I can fictionalize.
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flopsy
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Post by flopsy on Aug 10, 2011 15:23:19 GMT -5
in college i had a friend who popped out baby three right after graduation. she wasn't married, made minimum wage at most, had money/debt issues, and did take advantage of social programs (WIC, etc). i gave her emotional support when she needed it though i didn't agree with many of the choices she made. i would every so often ofter to watch her child(ren) if i was free while she had class. i gave her some pointers on class work when she wanted help. i gave her $40 once, she didn't pay me back but also never asked for money again. i wouldn't have given her more money if she had asked. that's what i did and it was all i could do.
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on Aug 10, 2011 15:41:02 GMT -5
The "shed" is exactly what I said it is - a former wooden storage shed that has been converted into a bedroom. It does have electricity, it does not have running water. It has a window unit AC and there are plans to put in a baseboard heater this winter (I don't know how hot those get, but I hope that would be baby-safe)
As to the poster who said she had a "promising career in nursing", no, she doesn't. She is an LPN, not an RN. LPNs are the red-headed stepchildren of nursing. The jobs are low-paying, a quickly being eliminated.
Her husband has had a total of four of his one-night stands turn up pregnant, but he claims none are his (and my friend believes him for some reason).
To the poster who said I don't seem to think much of her, I do. I have a lot of fun when we get together, I am just kind of in shock as to how much she is denying reality. I mean last night we were doing some baby shower prep work, and her husband called. She referred to him as "baby", and was very nice to him. She said she wants to be his friend. He yelled at her for 15 minutes because when she moved she took something that he wanted, even though she had bought it. I don't know about you, but if my husband did that crap to me, he'd be lucky to still have his "member". There would be no friendship, no pet names. I would not be talking to him.
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on Aug 10, 2011 15:42:24 GMT -5
I don't know why the parents don't make room for her, except that they have a very crowded house as it is, and I'm not sure where they'd put her. I don't think they are very happy about this situation, and they didn't want her to marry this loser in the first place.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Aug 10, 2011 15:45:58 GMT -5
You cannot control her choices. You can only control your reaction to those choices.
One of my best friends is about 2 weeks away from popping out a baby with her husband, who (very publicly) cheated on her for more than a year. He is a real a-hole, and none of the rest of us can stand to be in a room with him. I'm not sure why my friend is still with him. But it is her choice to make, not mine. I may not agree with it or understand it, but there's nothing I can do to stop it.
Likewise with your friend. All you can do is decide the level of financial/emotional support you are willing and/or able to provide, and leave it at that. You can't make her "see reality" or do what you would do in a situation. You can only control your own actions.
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gooddecisions
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Post by gooddecisions on Aug 10, 2011 16:46:50 GMT -5
"You can only control your own actions."
Exactly, the less we try to control others the better off everyone is. It would be one thing if she reached out to you in a dire situation where the shed is 120 degrees and she's not allowed in the house. But that just doesn't sound like the case here. She has shelter, a supportive family and a full time job. Just because LPN is the bottom of the ladder, doesn't mean she doesn't still have a promising future in healthcare. Shoot, I made less than that at her age and didn't have a free place to live. I also think you're making too much of the halloween costume. She's probably still in a bit of denial about her new circumstances, but reality will sink in when the baby is here. For what it's worth, I'm also due in October with my first and have probably made some comments over my pregnancy about when I expect to return to my sports activities that my friends think I'm crazy. Yeah, I may be in for a rude awakening as well but at least nobody is trying to call social services on me!
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Aug 10, 2011 17:18:54 GMT -5
Divorce is difficult and there is a lot of yelling. If you have a child together, the best thing to do is try and forge through the hard times and create a new relationship that is pleasant. It will make everyone's life a lot easier.
Although I agree that I wouldn't call him any pet names, I wouldn't dismember the father of my children because he let his anger out during a f-d up situation. Although she is clearly a hot mess, her attitude will create a better life for her kids - far, far better than what you think is a proper course of action.
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Frugal Nurse
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Post by Frugal Nurse on Aug 10, 2011 17:25:09 GMT -5
Divorce is difficult and there is a lot of yelling. If you have a child together, the best thing to do is try and forge through the hard times and create a new relationship that is pleasant. It will make everyone's life a lot easier. Although I agree that I wouldn't call him any pet names, I wouldn't dismember the father of my children because he let his anger out during a f-d up situation. Although she is clearly a hot mess, her attitude will create a better life for her kids - far, far better than what you think is a proper course of action. No, he'd lose his member for being a serial cheater and possibly knocking up four other women, and for having all that unprotected sex. He left her open to all kinds of dangerous disease because he couldn't keep it in his pants. That's what I meant by that.
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constanz22
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Post by constanz22 on Aug 10, 2011 17:29:47 GMT -5
Dude should buy a f'ing lottery ticket if he has impregnated FOUR "one night stands". It doesn't take a genious to figure out that he's been having more substantial "relationships" outside his marriage than "one night stands". Does she really believe that BS?!
I had posted early in the thread about what is and is not considered abuse or neglect. Prime example, I had to call in a suspected case today and was told specifically that a child does not need to have their own room OR bed. It is not considered abuse or neglect. Part of this report was that mom, dad and 2 little ones were all sleeping on a dirty futon. If this were the only "issue", the report would have been declined...Just because someone doesn't live in a standard that you would, or would want them to, doesn't mean it rises to the level of abuse or neglect. The law states that a parent has to provide "minimum standards" of food, shelter and safety. This is a pretty broad definition. I can't even begin to tell you some of the homes I've worked in and situations that I've seen that have NOT been considered abuse or neglect because they are meeting minimum standards of care.
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mizbear
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Post by mizbear on Aug 10, 2011 21:27:38 GMT -5
2 questions- Has her "spouse" (strange, rhymes with louse...) heard of a condom??? Not 100% effective, but if you're gonna cheat and the 1st one gets preggo- uh, DUH! My mother was on BC with all 3 pregnancies so I won't go there.
2nd- My DM and DGP (who actually did most of my bringing up) didn't care for either of my husbands- particularly when they cheated, didn't work, or were drunks- but they didn't make me sleep in the garage!
I did get the I told you so thing- and still do.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Aug 11, 2011 8:42:48 GMT -5
She's living for free and whatever her salary is, she can start "banking it" for her and the baby. Stay out of it financially and emotionally and stop with the advice, she doesn't want it.
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mizbear
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Post by mizbear on Aug 11, 2011 9:45:12 GMT -5
I'm still with with snerd on the "why the shed" thing.
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Clever Username
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Post by Clever Username on Aug 11, 2011 10:53:00 GMT -5
I don't know why the parents don't make room for her, except that they have a very crowded house OK. I am just asking. Doesn't it seem strange to anyone else as well? Yes, it seems strange. So strange that it probably hints that something about your perception of this situation is wrong. The maxim we all try to live up to in life: do the best with what you've got. That's the lense I try to see this through. I also look at this from the angle of the daughter having a minimum she's willing to accept. If she was asked to stay in the crawlspace, she'd got find a cheapo motel, sleep in her SUV or reconsile with the douchebag. knock, knock, knock.... tear stained daughter. Hmmm, where do we put her. Bedrooms are all full. What's left? Closet. Attic. Kitchen. Living room couch. Crawlspace. Or the stand alone apartment with electric, a/c and soon to have heat. You pick. You seem overly concerned with the fact that this structure is not literally connected with the home. She's got access to more utilities than the average home 100 years ago. Decreases in infant mortality since then have been great, but are attributed more to improvements in antibiotics and medicine in general.
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kgb18
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Post by kgb18 on Aug 11, 2011 10:58:03 GMT -5
I think it seems strange. I was thinking the same thing, that even if my house were crowded, I would find room for my child who is going to give birth to my grandchild. I worry more about the baby-to-be in this situation than the mom.
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Clever Username
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Post by Clever Username on Aug 11, 2011 11:13:37 GMT -5
I think it seems strange. I was thinking the same thing, that even if my house were crowded, I would find room for my child who is going to give birth to my grandchild. I worry more about the baby-to-be in this situation than the mom. But they did find room! Why the preoccupation with the strip of grass between her bedroom and the house proper?
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kgb18
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Post by kgb18 on Aug 11, 2011 11:20:43 GMT -5
Because a bedroom is not a shed. And a shed with a space heater and no running water is no place for baby.
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muttleynfelix
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Post by muttleynfelix on Aug 11, 2011 11:25:44 GMT -5
Because a bedroom is not a shed. And a shed with a space heater and no running water is no place for baby. Why? Frugal hasn't said if it is insulated or not. But assuming insulation, it has an AC unit, it has some form of heat, it is apparently carpetted. They have access to running water. A bottle of water to prepare formula. Maybe I've been living in the Ozarks too long, but seriously it doesn't like a major safety risk. They have access to everything they need. Properly insulated, ventilated, and climate controlled and access to running water. What more do you really need? I mean really?
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mizbear
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Post by mizbear on Aug 11, 2011 11:39:33 GMT -5
I believe OP did mention it has been insulated. My objection to the shed is I know what our garage looked like when we tore it down...
Now, the new shed- yeah, I would stay in that- but it doesn't leak, have holes, it's on a foundation...
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kgb18
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Post by kgb18 on Aug 11, 2011 11:58:31 GMT -5
IDK, I just can't imagine having my baby live in a shed, even if it's insulated. Our dog lives in a better situation than that.
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yogiii
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Post by yogiii on Aug 11, 2011 12:56:22 GMT -5
I can see both points for the "shed". If we're just talking safety etc, sure it is probably "safe" for mom and baby. I think kgb's point is that this woman is a nurse, she has a job, in some ways she's like all of us on this forum. Would I live in a shed like that with my baby? Not while I had a job. I'd rather get an apartment. Maybe this whole "shed" thing is just to prove a point or something to be used later during divorce proceedings, clearly we don't know the whole story and maybe the OP doesn't either.
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yogiii
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Post by yogiii on Aug 11, 2011 12:57:27 GMT -5
Another thought about the 'shed'. I am assuming that she will have access to the house all of the time. Would most likely spend more time in the house than out. Really if it's just to sleep in, it doesn't sound that bad. How many times do you get up in the middle of the night to cook a full meal, do laundry, take a shower, go to the bathroom, whatever. Even if she did wake up with a hankering for all of those things, she could certainly walk across the lawn and do them. Honestly this shed sounds about the same as my dorm room in college. At least her 'roomate' can't throw parties, and use your dishes without asking. If she is living there right after birth, she'll have to go to the bathroom quite a bit in the MOTN. She probably won't be sleeping much either.
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kgb18
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Post by kgb18 on Aug 11, 2011 13:57:58 GMT -5
That, and maybe I'm off in my perception of things, but don't most parents (at least stable, caring parents) want what's best for their child. Is being relegated to sleeping in a shed at night really the best? Yes, it's better than the streets, but it's not exactly a normal living situation. Hopefully this is a very temporary situation, but I'm trying to put myself in the mindset of a little child and what he/she would think when it's bedtime and they've got to leave the house where their grandparents and others are sleeping to go sleep in a shed.
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