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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 14:48:09 GMT -5
Let's say you're a buyer looking for a house. You use an agent, look at a bunch of houses, and make an offer on one. Is your agent representing you?
I've heard multiple explanations. I've heard that as long as the agent isn't the listing agent, then you're fine. But I've also heard that unless you sign a specific buyers agent contract, then the agent is kinda working for the listing agent as a "sub-agent" and thus bound to the seller as a fiduciary.
The reason I ask is that my agent has not been a very helpful negotiator. I get the feeling at times that she is siding more with the buyer, than me. And honestly, I'm not really all that unreasonable with things.
But as an example, the inspection report came back with a list of items that needed to be fixed. I left off the normal stuff, but asked for anything that was not working, to be fixed. She kinda was letting me know to pick/choose the items I asked for. The radon test came back a little high so I asked for a remediation system to be installed. The seller balked and I stood my ground. Then my agent tells me that sometimes those tests are a little funky and that I might want to think about re-testing. I said no, I want the system installed.
Part of me kinda thinks this is how agents operate. They don't like to give TOO much advice so they don't get blamed if the deal falls through. She also has said in the past that I should definitely ask for them to pay for that because I'll have to disclose it to future buyers. So possibly she is just giving me subtle messages that the sellers agent is giving her i.e. they aren't paying. She also is kind of a softy with certain things (too nice) so maybe she doesn't want to be the SOB that I think she probably needs to be.
I am leaning towards the thought that she probably is trying to give me subtle messages on the sentiment of the seller. The seller promptly lost $55K in a few years on the sale price alone, not counting the $55-$75K they dumped into the house. So maybe they really DON'T want to drop the price much more. These people are loaded, so they can afford to walk away.
Anyways, what do you think?
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Taxman10
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Post by Taxman10 on Jun 21, 2011 14:52:50 GMT -5
if you don't feel like she's working for you, then her. I've always had a good working relationship with my realtor, he's given me good advice, and I've never felt like he was working for anyone other than me.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jun 21, 2011 14:59:17 GMT -5
Everyone works for themselves. You just have to find someone that understands meeting your needs will help them achieve their goals.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Jun 21, 2011 15:01:42 GMT -5
Davebo, I was in a similar pickle with our realtor when we bought our place - and I really, really wish we'd dumped him. He was also a "softy", and around the same age as the sellers (60s-70s), and I think felt bad insisting on the things we wanted. For example, the closing date kept getting moved back, because the sellers were having difficulty finding a new place to live. The realtor kept telling me, "Oh, don't worry about it, it's just an extra couple of days." THAT'S NOT THE POINT! We had to make moving arrangements too! And what the eff did they think was going to happen when they signed a contract that said we'd close within 30 days, and they had to be out within a week of closing? We went well past 30 days, the mortgage rate changed, and they had to re-underwrite everything, all because he didn't have the balls to tell the sellers they needed to GTFO. It was a nightmare. (Our broker ripped him a new one, it was kind of fun to watch. I didn't have the stomach to yell at an old man myself.) So, the moral of the story is, you may want to find a different realtor... Get an SOB if need be
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Jun 21, 2011 15:03:13 GMT -5
I don't approve of dual agency. I have a BUYER'S agent (who is also my listing agent) but I'd never touch one of his listings.
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on Jun 21, 2011 15:08:39 GMT -5
The buyer's agent works for themselves. The seller's agent works for themselves.
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tskeeter
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Post by tskeeter on Jun 21, 2011 15:10:20 GMT -5
Unless you have a buyer agency agreement, "your agent" is actually working on behalf of the seller. Remember, too, that your agent's share of the commission is larger if you pay more for the house and if the deal falls through, your agent gets nothing on this deal and has to start all over again. Your agent wants the deal done so they can collect their commission and start work with another client.
As you noted, you can enter into a buyer agency agreement with your agent. In that case, your agent has a fiduciary responsibility to you, not the seller.
As you are finding, some agents talk big about what the seller should do/pay for when you are looking, but when it comes down to closing the deal, they adopt a different perspective. You need to be aware that you may get the house even though you really ticked off the seller. In that case, there are lots of ways to even the score a bit. Things like take every single light bulb, put nearly dead batteries in smoke detectors in hopes they fail in the middle of the night, trip the hard to locate GFI, fertilize the lawn so heavily that it must be mowed every couple of days, run a hose for several hours right against the foundation of the house in hopes of causing leakage into the basement after the seller has moved out, tampering with the irrigation system in order to cause leaks and excessive water consumption, and a whole host of things that a truly unhappy seller could dream up. Why push so hard that you risk that kind of reaction?
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alabamagal
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Post by alabamagal on Jun 21, 2011 15:39:36 GMT -5
The agent represents the seller. She is only paid if you close the deal. Her goal is to close the deal. If you hire a buyer's agent, you pay them and they work for you.
I hate the whole inspection process. What home does not have things that need to be fixed. I have heard of some wild items being put on the list. In my mind, only the absolute necessities should be fixed. I would be concerned about major sstructural issues. I don't know much about the whole radon thing, but if you want the house just buy it. Anything can be added later.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 15:45:25 GMT -5
Unless you have a buyer agency agreement, "your agent" is actually working on behalf of the seller. Remember, too, that your agent's share of the commission is larger if you pay more for the house and if the deal falls through, your agent gets nothing on this deal and has to start all over again. Your agent wants the deal done so they can collect their commission and start work with another client. As you noted, you can enter into a buyer agency agreement with your agent. In that case, your agent has a fiduciary responsibility to you, not the seller. As you are finding, some agents talk big about what the seller should do/pay for when you are looking, but when it comes down to closing the deal, they adopt a different perspective. You need to be aware that you may get the house even though you really ticked off the seller. In that case, there are lots of ways to even the score a bit. Things like take every single light bulb, put nearly dead batteries in smoke detectors in hopes they fail in the middle of the night, trip the hard to locate GFI, fertilize the lawn so heavily that it must be mowed every couple of days, run a hose for several hours right against the foundation of the house in hopes of causing leakage into the basement after the seller has moved out, tampering with the irrigation system in order to cause leaks and excessive water consumption, and a whole host of things that a truly unhappy seller could dream up. Why push so hard that you risk that kind of reaction? Ha. I wouldn't want to buy a house from you. I'm not really asking for that much. Nor did I really act like a total SOB during the negotiation. I think the seller is just pissed about the entire situation. They said in one of the emails with my attorney that they thought they made it clear that they didn't want to spend money getting the house ready for closing. I thought that was an idiotic response. You might want a lot of things, but that's not my problem.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 15:50:06 GMT -5
I hate the whole inspection process. What home does not have things that need to be fixed. I have heard of some wild items being put on the list. In my mind, only the absolute necessities should be fixed. I would be concerned about major sstructural issues. I don't know much about the whole radon thing, but if you want the house just buy it. Anything can be added later. Eh, I don't know about that. The inspection process offers a clue to the buyer. Some people might not expect to have to put $15K into a house within the first 2 years so that's enough to walk away. But the seller has a chance to save the deal by fixing those problems. Seems straight-forward to me. Here's an example from the inspection for us. Our inspector said that it needed a new water tank, but this one was still working. So we didn't ask for that. The garbage disposal, however, was listed on the listing sheet but was NOT working. That should be fixed. Everything should be in working order. Radon exposure is linked to cancer and it's something you're required to disclose. So you either get the seller to pay for it, or you're going to pay for it later...not just by having to live with higher radon levels..but when you sell the house.
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kgb18
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Post by kgb18 on Jun 21, 2011 15:58:24 GMT -5
When we bought our house, we had an agent who was working with us. She was not the selling agent for the home we bought. We didn't sign a specific contract with her, but I felt like she worked on our behalf.
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happyscooter
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Post by happyscooter on Jun 21, 2011 21:15:38 GMT -5
davebo, just because someone is loaded doesn't mean they should walk away and give you their house. Unfortunately that's what everyone thinks nowadays. The house appraises for a certain amount and the buyers say 'they don't need to make that much'.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 21:16:47 GMT -5
Yeah, it is a buyers market out there.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2011 21:32:32 GMT -5
Davebo, It varies from state to state. I am most familar with California and AZ. Both states require an agent have you sign a contract disclosing which party the agent represents. Generally speaking the listing agent represents the seller and the agent who brings in the buyer represents the buyer but there are a couple of exceptions. One is if you make an offer directly with the seller's agent. S/he will typically represent the seller (and you're on your own) or they will attempt "dual agency" which means they represent both. Generally not a good situation but sometimes with very unique properties it can work and of course there are those situations where the other agent is such a jerk/idiot/dufuss that you're better off not having their "help". The other exception is when you buy a property listed by the same agency (but not your agent's listing). See "Dual Agency" comment above. I think TSkeeter's response was how a seller might react if s/he is pushed too far. It's a fair warning. For many people selling their house is VERY emotional; remember it's their home. I've seen people blow reasonable deals because the parties emotional reactions blew things out of proportion.
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sil
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Post by sil on Jun 21, 2011 23:17:21 GMT -5
Just saw "Freakonomics" and the first segment was about this very question. The example they used was for a seller who wanted a given price, a prospective buyer who wanted to pay $10,000 less than the asking price, and the seller's agent who is in the situation of having to advise the client if they should take the offer or hold out for more money.
The additional commission on the lost $10,000 would amount to a net of just a couple hundred dollars to the seller's agent, but holding onto the listing for another couple of weeks would result in much more work. The time they spend trying to get commission on the extra $10k of sales price would be much better spent trying to get a commission on a $300,000 home that was just listed.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Jun 22, 2011 6:12:17 GMT -5
The listing agent represents the seller and not you. EVER.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 9:26:30 GMT -5
davebo, just because someone is loaded doesn't mean they should walk away and give you their house. Unfortunately that's what everyone thinks nowadays. The house appraises for a certain amount and the buyers say 'they don't need to make that much'. Who said that? I said they could walk away and wait for a better offer if they feel they are getting lowballed. Everyone is out for the best deal and buying the home of someone rich could be a good or a bad thing. Good if they just want out, bad if they don't need to sell. Odds are higher that you're going to get a better deal from someone that can dig into their pocket. A middle class family can only reach in their pocket so much.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 9:34:26 GMT -5
Our buyers agent made a percentage of the sellers commission. I think she did pretty good for us, only one thing I would have done differently. I wanted to counter $5k less than I did, she told us not to bother because we'd be able to find that 5K worth of fixes in the inspection... because it was an older house that had been empty for a little while we agreed that something would pop up in the inspection. Nope, a few minor things but money wise wouldn't amount to much. Oh well, she did some pre-offer negotiations for us and got $20k knocked off the list price. I'd say that was her earning her pay. Yeah, our lady did ok I guess. I really think she was just a softy. She had a partner that she worked with and when my agent would make a comment about something that favored the seller like "They're losing so much money", the partner would say "Well that's not his problem". I think she tended to soften my harshness BIG TIME during negotiations because she was really nice. So for example, we had heard there was going to be another offer coming in. And when we sent ours to them, they sat on it for a couple days. My agent said "They might be waiting to see the other offer". I told her that if we didn't hear back by the end of the day, we're pulling the offer. Realistically, I knew that I wouldn't pull the offer. But I knew that she wouldn't tell them that I'd pull the offer, she'd probably say something a little less harsh like "Well, they are going to continue their search if they don't hear back". Maybe that's good, not totally sure. I'm used to watching the agents on million dollar listing and their tactics.
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tskeeter
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Post by tskeeter on Jun 22, 2011 12:35:20 GMT -5
Maybe not, Dave. However, I have bought and sold houses 11 times, so I probably have more experience negotiating residential real estate transactions than many people. That really means that I've had more opportunity to learn from my mistakes and the mistakes of others.
The biggest thing I have learned is that the purchase or sale of a home is not really a business transaction. As Bonnap pointed out, there is too much emotion tied up in the transaction for it to be simply business. I think that the most successful negotiators understand the emotional factor and how to integrate emotional considerations into the negotiations.
I think the most productive negotiations require give and take by both the seller and buyer. It's not a question of the buyer demanding and the seller accommodating, as many of the home buying shows seem to depict. Even in a buyer's market, such as the one we have now, squeezing everything you can get out of a seller creates hard feelings. Those hard feelings come back to the buyer when something goes wrong, as it inevitably does. Then sellers have an opportunity to make life more difficult for the buyer, and sellers sometimes do that.
So how was I able to recite a list of ways to give a buyer a hard time, even after close of the sale? I had one buyer that really annoyed the living daylights out of me. First, the buyer's attitude was one of arrogance, finding fault and criticizing feature after feature of the house (see, an emotional issue). The buyer's offer was lower than I thought it should be and they were reluctant to raise their offer (I finally figured out that was all they could afford). Then the buyer's home inspector made several mistakes, requiring re-inspection by more knowledgeable inspectors and requiring more time away from work for me to disprove the incorrect information. The inspection was followed by a demand that any and all corrective work be done by licensed contractors, another major inconvenience and unnecessary expense when you are talking about simple things like putting longer extensions on downspouts. Then closing was delayed. Twice. On short notice. After we had adjusted our schedules to accommodate the closing. It got to the point where I didn't want to deal with those people any more, even if it delayed the sale of the house and we ended up taking a lower offer. Finally, at closing the buyer began to propose that we fund a large escrow to pay for anything they might be unhappy with after they moved into the house. Seeing this as the buyer's way to get the house decorated the way they wanted at our expense, I negotiated this point by swearing loudly and insisting that I didn't give a rat's rear end if the sale closed, that I'd be just as happy to notify the real estate agent that the deal had fallen through and that we'd have to start over again. At this point the buyers began to understand that negotiations were complete and they could take the deal or leave it.
Pushing the other party in transaction to the point that they are as angry as I was can not lead to the level of cooperation that is needed to complete many transactions, whether those transactions are real estate, or another type of contract. If you want the deal, you've got to be prepared to give, not just take.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 12:49:44 GMT -5
Maybe not, Dave. However, I have bought and sold houses 11 times, so I probably have more experience negotiating residential real estate transactions than many people. That really means that I've had more opportunity to learn from my mistakes and the mistakes of others. The biggest thing I have learned is that the purchase or sale of a home is not really a business transaction. As Bonnap pointed out, there is too much emotion tied up in the transaction for it to be simply business. I think that the most successful negotiators understand the emotional factor and how to integrate emotional considerations into the negotiations. I think the most productive negotiations require give and take by both the seller and buyer. It's not a question of the buyer demanding and the seller accommodating, as many of the home buying shows seem to depict. Even in a buyer's market, such as the one we have now, squeezing everything you can get out of a seller creates hard feelings. Those hard feelings come back to the buyer when something goes wrong, as it inevitably does. Then sellers have an opportunity to make life more difficult for the buyer, and sellers sometimes do that. So how was I able to recite a list of ways to give a buyer a hard time, even after close of the sale? I had one buyer that really annoyed the living daylights out of me. First, the buyer's attitude was one of arrogance, finding fault and criticizing feature after feature of the house (see, an emotional issue). The buyer's offer was lower than I thought it should be and they were reluctant to raise their offer (I finally figured out that was all they could afford). Then the buyer's home inspector made several mistakes, requiring re-inspection by more knowledgeable inspectors and requiring more time away from work for me to disprove the incorrect information. The inspection was followed by a demand that any and all corrective work be done by licensed contractors, another major inconvenience and unnecessary expense when you are talking about simple things like putting longer extensions on downspouts. Then closing was delayed. Twice. On short notice. After we had adjusted our schedules to accommodate the closing. It got to the point where I didn't want to deal with those people any more, even if it delayed the sale of the house and we ended up taking a lower offer. Finally, at closing the buyer began to propose that we fund a large escrow to pay for anything they might be unhappy with after they moved into the house. Seeing this as the buyer's way to get the house decorated the way they wanted at our expense, I negotiated this point by swearing loudly and insisting that I didn't give a rat's rear end if the sale closed, that I'd be just as happy to notify the real estate agent that the deal had fallen through and that we'd have to start over again. At this point the buyers began to understand that negotiations were complete and they could take the deal or leave it. Pushing the other party in transaction to the point that they are as angry as I was can not lead to the level of cooperation that is needed to complete many transactions, whether those transactions are real estate, or another type of contract. If you want the deal, you've got to be prepared to give, not just take. I hear you. Honestly, we're not unreasonable at all. We really wanted the house, made a low-ball offer to test them out, and then negotiated from there. Realistically, they should've been thrilled where they ended up based off their list price..I would've been. The issues raised during the inspection were minor in terms of cost and big in terms of safety. The two things that aggrevated me about the seller was this. 1) They appeared to be waiting for another offer coming in before responding. 2) They said something along the lines of "We're not interested in putting any more money into the house in preparation for closing". The first point was annoying me because I kinda felt like they knew we were very interested and were willing to string us along. That's when I had to threaten to pull the offer and walk away in order to get them moving. Hey, gotta let em know you mean business. Second, the radon test came back well above normal acceptable levels. They have a finished basement and I have 3 small kids. It costs $1K to install a remediation and they were balking. Despite really not having to repair anything else major. This is something they would now have to disclose to future buyers and, most likely, get fixed. So to argue with it is completely absurd. I have been pretty reasonable, but I expect the seller to be reasonable as well. Fixing radon problems should be expected so don't give me this "We don't want to put money into the house" excuse. Who does want to put money into the house?!?!?!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 12:50:12 GMT -5
Tskeeter,
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 13:00:07 GMT -5
Davebo,
Both of your objections are actually quite normal. Put yourself in their shoes. If you had a low-ball offer and heard that another offer was coming in wouldn't you wait?
And if you lost over $50k on the purchase of a house wouldn't you be reluctant to put more money in?
Your point about the radon is well taken; it would become a disclosure issue so their agent probably talked them into taking your request vs paying another month's worth of interest, taxes and insurance over a $1,000 repair.
Unfortunately you set the tone with the low-ball offer. It sounds like you've come up quite a bit and now feel like your "losing". This is what I mean about the emotional element. You're both banging your heads when it sounds like it's probably (financially anyway) a good transaction for both of you.
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8 Bit WWBG
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Post by 8 Bit WWBG on Jun 22, 2011 13:42:35 GMT -5
...:::"I think TSkeeter's response was how a seller might react if s/he is pushed too far. It's a fair warning. For many people selling their house is VERY emotional; remember it's their home.":::...
That or they KNOW they are taking a big hit because its a buyers market and they are already going to have to bring cash to the table and probably pay the buyers closing costs just to sell -- not to mention they may have had to upgrade to granite counter tops because HGTV has convinced buyers to accept nothing less.
So yeah... push someone too far, and there are lots of things they can do to make trouble for you. Even if you "might" be able to get recourse in the long term, you'll spend a lot of time and effort that would be better spent elsewhere.
...:::"I think she tended to soften my harshness BIG TIME during negotiations because she was really nice.":::...
This is very valuable. We bought from a couple with a newborn (who eventually wanted 4 kids) and sometimes we got excuses like "they want to meet earlier, because the baby needs to go to bed". My agent was very valuable in "translating" my not so flattering opinion of how much influence the baby should have on this transaction.
I also knew that my sellers were going to make a profit because they bought lower. I could see very different attitudes among people who stand to "make $10k less" vs "lose $10k more", even if the difference in each case is the same.
...:::"nd were willing to string us along. That's when I had to threaten to pull the offer and walk away in order to get them moving. Hey, gotta let em know you mean business.":::...
I was in this situation too, and I recognize that it is "just business". A potential seller used every stall tactic she could, because she thought something else was coming in. I pulled the offer. 6 months later, the house sold at about $3k less than I had offered. Oh well.
I hope I never have to sell in a buyers market...
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tskeeter
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Post by tskeeter on Jun 22, 2011 13:52:00 GMT -5
Dave, I see your point. You are the aggravated buyer rather than the aggravated seller that I was.
Sometimes, the response to continued negotiation is how an issue is presented. What do you think would have happened if the radon issue was presented as - I hate to do this, especially since I'm sure you're accepting less for the house than you would like. But the radon thing is a big issue when you've got kids and it affects the future value of the house because I would have to disclose the high radon level to future home buyers. Unfortunately, we're really at our limit and investing $1K in radon remediation is more than we can take on. We'd very much like to buy your home and raise our family in it (and other nice words to make the seller feel warm and fuzzy). But we need your help with the radon in order to make the deal work. I'm hoping that you will agree that helping us with the radon remediation is a better financial decision than absorbing the cost of carrying the house for several additional months.
I think this approach sells better than "The radon level is high. You need to fix it."
Diplomacy: The art of telling someone to go to hell in a way that makes them look forward to the trip.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 13:58:08 GMT -5
"Diplomacy: The art of telling someone to go to hell in a way that makes them look forward to the trip."
LOL! You've made my day!
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8 Bit WWBG
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Post by 8 Bit WWBG on Jun 22, 2011 14:45:41 GMT -5
...:::"Diplomacy: The art of telling someone to go to hell in a way that makes them look forward to the trip.":::...
I don't disagree, but many people still hear the original words. I'd certainly hear the above as "fix or I walk". Of course I am a reasonable person too, and can't really argue with a fix like radon.
But you never really know WHAT is going to happen. I watched a friend's father sell, only to have the buyer come back 2 months later and demand money for a fix, claiming that the seller "hid" it by stacking panels or something over a water-damaged spot.
In this particularly sad situation, the seller had USAA insurance, so got free legal services. My friend's father had to choose between spending $5k to fight (and possibly lose) or spending $2k to get the seller off his back.
If I ever have to sell my house, I am putting "as is" in the listing at the top of every page.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 14:51:16 GMT -5
Well, I was actually in their shoes. I was EXACTLY in their shoes. And I realized that in a down-market, low-ball offers are commonplace. So when I got one, I just played ball. Just because it starts really low, doesn't mean it has to end that way. You know the price you want, so start the process and let's go.
Besides, it's kind of stupid to wait for the other offer...all they knew is someone else was expressing interest. You deal with what you have and if something comes in, great. Maybe take 24 hours to respond each time thinking that'll string out over a few days.
And I lost money too. And of course, I didn't WANT to put money in...but who does? I had to install the same radon system they were griping about. But it needed to be done...I knew it..and they know it too.
I don't feel like I'm losing at all. I feel like the price we settled on was fair..I think I expected a little lower, but it's fair to both sides I would guess. Let's face it, when you list a house for $525K and sell it for $505K with no credits...that's about as good as you could expect right? Granted, they priced it to sell but you're not going to get someone coming in with a full-price offer. You have to expect you're going to have to come down. That's why I can't understand why they would think they really got taken. When you price at $525K, you must mentally expect you aren't going below $500K.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 14:58:48 GMT -5
Well, I wasn't the one doing the communicating. That was all done through the attorney's. I'm not actually sure how he worded it. When they denied it the first time, I told my attorney they needed to fix because I have 3 small kids. Maybe that helped, but not sure. I don't even know if he relayed that or not.
But maybe I'm just too practical, nice, or have watched too much "Holmes on Homes", but you gotta do what's right. No matter how it is worded. If the request is reasonable, then what's the difference how we asked for it. If I said "Looks like the A/C unit will go out in 5 years, hot water tank in 2, and furnace in 3, I'd like a full credit or I walk". Then I could see your point. But radon levels tested high, toilet is leaking, garbage disposal is broken...those are all things that should be fixed.
My seller asked for 4 things. New fixture in closet (cracked), replace gutter downspout, new mailbox cause it didn't close properly, and a radon remediation. I could've said somethng like "HEY, you can still put mail in the box right?!?!?!". But they're buying a house, the mailbox is a bit funky, it'll cost me a few bucks to fix...whatever. I didn't get into a pissing match because I didn't want to spend money.
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tskeeter
Junior Associate
Joined: Mar 20, 2011 19:37:45 GMT -5
Posts: 6,831
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Post by tskeeter on Jun 22, 2011 16:10:13 GMT -5
I assumed that an intermediary was presenting the message. Maybe that contributed to some of the issues you have encountered. Ever seen some attorneys work? I've seen some situations where it appeared to be a game of who has bigger cojones and who can bulldoze the other party into what they want.
Even so, I think the way we communicate information sets the tone for how our representatives may communicate to others.
I can't agree with you on your statement that "you gotta do what's right". The terms of a home purchase are negotiable. During the sale of homes, I have repeatedly said I will do a, b, and c, but not x, y, and z, when presented with a laundry list of the inspector's findings. What is right becomes what the parties to the contract agree on. What is reasonable depends on the perspective of each of the parties. For example, re-gluing the seams in some wallpaper may seem like a minor issue to you and a very reasonable request. To me, who has an extended business trip starting tomorrow, who is working 12 - 16 hours a day just to keep up, and who has to be half way across the country on a new job in three weeks, and who has never hired a paper hanger, a simple two hour repair job is an insurmountable hassle that I am unwilling to deal with. If you think it's so simple and such a minor request to accommodate, you can handle it yourself, so it is done the way you want it done.
My pet peeve with the home buying shows and some home repair shows is that they seem to set the expectation that a home seller is somehow obligated to ensure that a home is in perfect condition and up to current building codes for the buyer. It just ain't so. The condition of the house when the sale is closed is the subject of negotiations. I have sold homes with things like peeling paint, that both the buyer and I knew would need to be painted very soon. The condition of the paint was a consideration in determining the listing/selling price for the home.
One of the things to keep in mind about H on H is that the host is usually responding to situations where the homeowner contracted for work that was not done in an appropriate fashion. What is not right is that the homeowner did not get what they paid for. This isn't the same as negotiating who is going to pay for repair of a condition that all parties to a contract are aware of.
Another purpose of the H on H program is to educate homeowners that building to the building code may not yield the results they are expecting. I can't count the number of times I've watched Mike Holmes talk about how the building code is the absolute minimum level of performance and that compliance with the building code does not assure high quality construction or that the work will perform as the homeowner expects.
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Deleted
Joined: Oct 5, 2024 13:28:01 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 16:49:15 GMT -5
My comment "do what's right" was more a Mike Holmes quip. Obviously I can say no to all that stuff. But all the stuff they named, didn't seem like a huge deal to me to have fixed. My point is, why ruffle the feathers of an extremely qualified buyer just to save $100. The radon thing is understandable and while I know it IS negotiable, I think it's something the seller should handle. The other stuff was more maintenance, but whatever. I saw 15 houses just like mine for sale on my block and we had a good buyer. I didn't want to give them a reason to have a way out.
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