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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 8:58:27 GMT -5
Judge has harsh words for Mom before sentencing her for spanking her kid Rosalina Gonzales had pleaded guilty to a felony charge of injury to a child for what prosecutors had described as a "pretty simple, straightforward spanking case." They noted she didn't use a belt or leave any bruises, just some red marks. www.volunteertv.com/national/headlines/Mom_pleads_guilty_to_spanking_own_child_124072014.html~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ...I'll admit that I find this enfuriating and a gross-overstepping of government services, both with the court and CPS... flame me if you disagree... ...but I'm still wondering how to back-track to just when our common sense train derailed? ...was it recently? like NCLB? or was it a generation ago? like the 60s' love-all-love-ins?
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:03:17 GMT -5
...another quick search found me this: corbettlawfirm.info/2010/12/spanking-legal-texas/ The Bible says, “He who spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him is careful to discipline him.” The interpretation that many Texans, especially black Texans, give this scripture is that God condones spanking. As a parent, I agree with this interpretation and have occasionally spanked my children. However, as an attorney, I caution parents to be very careful spanking their children. I have represented parents who were charged with serious felonies for spanking their children. These parents were facing up to 10 years in jail. In addition, CPS removed and took custody of their children. Fortunately, after many months and lots of hard work, I got the charges dismissed in each case. Nevertheless, these experiences compel me to warn parents about the serious legal jeopardy they face under Texas law when they spank their children.
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:06:49 GMT -5
...and this: www.wnd.com/?pageId=79008A Wisconsin pastor has been charged with felony physical abuse of a child after he spanked his 12-year-old son for lying and a teacher notified social services. Barry W. Barnett Jr., 43, of Poynette, Wis., is free on a $10,000 bond, but he could face up to three years in prison and fines for disciplining his son, the local Portage Daily Register reported. At the pastor's hearing, Barnett's son said his father was right to spank him . Read more: Pastor charged with felony for spanking son www.wnd.com/?pageId=79008#ixzz1PdWTEK7N
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 18, 2011 9:19:03 GMT -5
Is this in Texas only, or the whole US?
If this is how bad it's gotten down there, I can see why revolutionary sentiment is gaining ground.
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:26:15 GMT -5
...turns out there's a lot more states involved... some "good" outcomes, some not... Naples Man Cleared of Child Abuse for Spanking Teen Daughter NAPLES, Fla. (AP) - A 43-year-old man has been acquitted of child abuse for spanking his teenage daughter with a belt. A jury took less than an hour Wednesday to find William O'Brien, of Naples, innocent of felony child abuse. "I'm happy with the outcome," O'Brien said after hugging his wife and 14-year-old daughter. O'Brien said he swatted his daughter, who was 13 at the time, once with a belt in May 2002 after she cursed at her mother. O'Brien said he ordered his daughter to her room and warned her not to come out or he would spank her. After she stormed out of her room and slammed the door, he said he hit her once with a belt. www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/959956/posts
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:27:46 GMT -5
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:28:58 GMT -5
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:30:23 GMT -5
Is this in Texas only, or the whole US? If this is how bad it's gotten down there, I can see why revolutionary sentiment is gaining ground. ...agreed...
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:31:34 GMT -5
...turns out, it's been an issue in Canada, too... www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2004/01/30/spanking040130.htmlCanada's top court has upheld a law allowing parents to spank their children, but also set guidelines outlining "reasonable limits" to the act. In a 6-3 decision, the Supreme Court of Canada refused to repeal Section 43 of the Criminal Code that allows parents and school teachers to physically discipline children in their care by using "reasonable" force. In its decision Friday, the court ruled that reasonable corrective force can be used against children between the ages of two and 12 years old.
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Post by jarhead1976 on Jun 18, 2011 9:31:47 GMT -5
At 11 years old my daughter came to me telling me she was meeting her "Girl Friends" at the movies and would I take her.. Having picked up the phone the same time she did I overheard her the conversation. It was with a group of boys all laughing in the background and trying to get her and some of her other girl friends to go. New at being a parent I was not sure How to handle the fact she had lied to me. So I decided to tell her I heard the conversation and that she was not going. I was a little loud and smacked her Lightly on the butt, one time and said I need to know who you are with and that lying will get you some more of the same . She was on the phone with my ex when I came into the room. 2 hours later the drive way was full of the sheriffs department. We were out washing the cars and having a water fight laughing and hosing each other off. We had made up in the mean time. Well I told her that she had better tell the truth about what had happened or I would probably go to jail. I let the police interview her and they left. My ex just wanted to see me get into trouble and had once before asked me to come to her house because she couldn't handle her. Without even calling me and asking what is going on she just called the law on my ass. Now if I had let her go knowing she was meeting a group of boys and not knowing their ages. I would have been accountable for anything that would have gone wrong. I am constantly being set up to fail . Does she realize that it is her daughter that suffers the most and is being pulled in two. That was the last time I have ever spanked her. She is a wonderful kid and loved very much. Now me I had my ass beat on a regular basis and usually had to cut my own switches. I think we are raising bunch of wimps. They have no fear of God or respect for parents.Hell anything goes.
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:33:58 GMT -5
...and Europe... Need a lesson in parenting? If you live in California, you may have to take one from the government whether you like it or not. Next week, Assemblywoman Sally Lieber will introduce a bill banning the practice of spanking children younger than four. If passed, the state will become the first to make the corporal punishment of infants and toddlers a misdemeanor — punishable by up to a year in jail and a $1,000 fine — along with more than a dozen countries, mostly in Europe, that have laws against the practice. Read more: www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1581853,00.html#ixzz1PddIvDyt
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handyman2
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Post by handyman2 on Jun 18, 2011 9:35:43 GMT -5
There is a defining difference between a spanking on the bottom and a beating but the court does not recognoze the difference. I was spanked and so were my friends.It did not cause any socialogical harm or turn me into a criminal as some socioligest claim. Not spanking was an idea put forth by the famous Dr. Spock in his book on proper child raising. He later admitted he was wrong. My grand daughter was having a conversation with some people in her teen years about spanking. They were all claiming that spanking was a bad thing. My granddaughter said well I can tell you this,(Had my mother not spanked me on occasion I can assure you that you would not have wanted to have me around or as a friend). wise words from a teen.
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:37:22 GMT -5
At 11 years old my daughter came to me telling me she was meeting her "Girl Friends" at the movies and would I take her.. Having picked up the phone the same time she did I overheard her the conversation. It was with a group of boys all laughing in the background and trying to get her and some of her other girl friends to go. New at being a parent I was not sure How to handle the fact she had lied to me. So I decided to tell her I heard the conversation and that she was not going. I was a little loud and smacked her Lightly on the butt, one time and said I need to know who you are with and that lying will get you some more of the same . She was on the phone with my ex when I came into the room. 2 hours later the drive way was full of the sheriffs department. We were out washing the cars and having a water fight laughing and hosing each other off. We had made up in the mean time. Well I told her that she had better tell the truth about what had happened or I would probably go to jail. I let the police interview her and they left. My ex just wanted to see me get into trouble and had once before asked me to come to her house because she couldn't handle her. Without even calling me and asking what is going on she just called the law on my ass. Now if I had let her go knowing she was meeting a group of boys and not knowing their ages. I would have been accountable for anything that would have gone wrong. I am constantly being set up to fail . Does she realize that it is her daughter that suffers the most and is being pulled in two. That was the last time I have ever spanked her. She is a wonderful kid and loved very much. Now me I had my ass beat on a regular basis and usually had to cut my own switches. I think we are raising bunch of wimps. They have no fear of God or respect for parents.Hell anything goes. ...I hear you... but that "being set up to fail" feeling is seemingly pervasive nowadays... from so many directions... so no wonder we're finding more resistance to the "new and improved status quo" about stuff...
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:38:29 GMT -5
There is a defining difference between a spanking on the bottom and a beating but the court does not recognoze the difference. I was spanked and so were my friends.It did not cause any socialogical harm or turn me into a criminal as some socioligest claim. Not spanking was an idea put forth by the famous Dr. Spock in his book on proper child raising. He later admitted he was wrong. My grand daughter was having a conversation with some people in her teen years about spanking. They were all claiming that spanking was a bad thing. My granddaughter said well I can tell you this,(Had my mother not spanked me on occasion I can assure you that you would not have wanted to have me around or as a friend). wise words from a teen. ...agreed...
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 18, 2011 9:44:02 GMT -5
I was spanked when I was a kid. Rarely. It was an effective deterrent.
Unfortunately I could see how anti-spanking laws could creep into the books as a defense against parents claiming "we just spank him a lot" to cover up genuine abuse. Still, the story in the OP is classic nanny state run amok. Thanks for the listing, BTDT.
ETA: The good news is that of the many comments I read following the article, not one called the judge anything better than "idiot".
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 9:49:54 GMT -5
I was spanked when I was a kid. Rarely. It was an effective deterrent. Unfortunately I could see how anti-spanking laws could creep into the books as a defense against parents claiming "we just spank him a lot" to cover up genuine abuse. Still, the story in the OP is classic nanny state run amok. Thanks for the listing, BTDT. ...agreed... nanny state run amok... ...I'll confess I've been lax in my reading about parenting laws... it's not like surfing the web for spanking stories was high on the list, you know? ...but intruding governance is getting downright enfuriating... a little creep here and a little creep there, makes for a very creepy situation... and boy do we need a few more Tank Man stands in the face of the onslaught... imo...
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 9:52:53 GMT -5
This is why I am here, to spank conservatives regularly so that they become better human beings.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 18, 2011 9:58:33 GMT -5
And here I thought you were the plucky comic relief.
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Jun 18, 2011 10:06:24 GMT -5
...ba da, bup...
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txbo
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Post by txbo on Jun 18, 2011 10:20:19 GMT -5
The Bible also says, "Then He said, "Take now your son, your only son Isaac, whom you love, and go to the land of Moriah, and offer him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains of which I shall tell you." Yah right, I should read and believe the bible.
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handyman2
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Post by handyman2 on Jun 18, 2011 10:26:36 GMT -5
TXBO: You should read the whole chapter. The problem is that many take a verse in the bible without reading the whole background that goes with it and draw neferious conclusions.
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Jun 18, 2011 10:28:16 GMT -5
You might want to read the part about Abraham having walked with God for 90 years, trusting Him implicitly in all matters, and sparing Isaac at His command when his faith was proven.
This thread is about spanking. There are at least a dozen other threads where you can make known your presentiments about the bible while staying on topic.
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Post by privateinvestor on Jun 18, 2011 10:29:48 GMT -5
The Bible also says "So teach us to number our days, that we may gain a heart of wisdom"...(Psalm 90:12)
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 10:46:20 GMT -5
TXBO: You should read the whole chapter. The problem is that many take a verse in the bible without reading the whole background that goes with it and draw neferious conclusions. Like the spare the rod nonsense?
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 10:48:01 GMT -5
And here I thought you were the plucky comic relief. I try.
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AGB
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Post by AGB on Jun 18, 2011 11:30:10 GMT -5
Especially considering this... TEMPLE, TEX. -- In an era when students talk back to teachers, skip class and wear ever-more-risque clothing to school, one central Texas city has hit upon a deceptively simple solution: Bring back the paddle. Most school districts across the country banned paddling of students long ago. Texas sat that trend out. Nearly a quarter of the estimated 225,000 students who received corporal punishment nationwide in 2006, the latest figures available, were from the Lone Star State. www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/04/15/AR2010041505964.html
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 12:02:02 GMT -5
We got spankings when I was a kid. We behaved. We also got paddled at school-- TX-- and the whole school knew about it when you got paddled. We behaved. When I was a kid kids didn't kill people, carry weapons, blow things up, none of that. When I see the things kids do these days I am not at all surprised. Even SCREAMING at your kids is considered child abuse. I used to get grounded a lot. Wonder if that is now child imprisonment or some such stupid crap. One of my kids started ditching school, which I was unaware of because they would not call me until the END of the school day. I got a letter threatening ME with legal action. They did NOTHING to my daughter. I yanked her out of school, put her in a charter school, and had to stop work twice a day to take her and pick her up after. Kids are totally off the hook these days. Even when they get in trouble with the law they get put in diversion, and have to take classes, and go to meetings.. all paid for by the parent, and all falls on the parent if the kid does not do it. Costs a lot of money, too. The old days of spanking, grounding, forced hard labor.. were so much more effective. Want proof-- look around... Heck, my Mom once nailed my windows shut because I decided I liked to run around in the middle of the night. It worked. She basically held me hostage until I cleaned my act up. It worked. I HATED he for it, but she probably saved my life. A couple of those kids I was TRYING to run with ended up dead.. one overdose, one shot robbing a drugstore. All before they even grew up, because their parents could care less what they did. I'm all for spanking, imprisoning, hard labor-- whatever it takes to get them grown in one piece. It's the old hippies that never matured making these laws, you know.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2011 12:04:35 GMT -5
Yup, even in Texas. That's one of the reasons that I wouldn't live in a large Texas city, they are to liberal. If that had been my I would be in jail now because I would have told the judge & the whole system to get F*****!
Just as many people have said all along, the government has no right to be involved in this stuff (in cases of abuse, of course they do but a spanking isn't abuse). Something like this opens the door for the future. Didn't feed your child a "balanced" mean....That's child abuse. Put your kid in Catholic school where they hit his hand with a ruler....that's child abuse. A storm in the area & you didn't take your child to a "protected" area...That's child endangerment. Etc...
The point here is that this can & will progress to the point that everybody who has children is guilty of something because it all depends on what government is official is looking & what they consider bad. Just sad as to what our society has turned into.
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NoMoreLunacy
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Post by NoMoreLunacy on Jun 18, 2011 12:06:24 GMT -5
Especially considering this... TEMPLE, TEX. -- In an era when students talk back to teachers, skip class and wear ever-more-risque clothing to school, one central Texas city has hit upon a deceptively simple solution: Bring back the paddle. Most school districts across the country banned paddling of students long ago. Texas sat that trend out. Nearly a quarter of the estimated 225,000 students who received corporal punishment nationwide in 2006, the latest figures available, were from the Lone Star State. www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/04/15/AR2010041505964.htmlTexas is the national leader in creating minimum wage jobs. No wonder.
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cereb
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Post by cereb on Jun 18, 2011 12:10:03 GMT -5
Never would I spank a child. I have tapped a toddler on the butt and I mean a tap for reaching at something dangerous. I never spanked my kids. There are other methods that work just fine without resorting to hitting your kids.
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