wvugurl26
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Post by wvugurl26 on Mar 29, 2021 21:30:46 GMT -5
I think we should definitely be worried about manufacturing drugs more than clothes. I heard a frightening statistic last year. Something like 98-99% raw active ingredients in ALL generic drugs comes from China no matter where the drug is actually manufactured. That's something I think we should be concerned about trying to balance.
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jelloshots4all
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Post by jelloshots4all on Mar 30, 2021 5:02:05 GMT -5
Sorry, but I'm not looking at the label as to where it is made. And I'd rather buy 4 pair of $20 pants from Marshall's (no idea where they are made), than 1 pair of $80 pants. I like variety. I know they won't last more than a couple years/go out of style. I'm happy when they help me create a cute outfit. My shopping there is paying the employees wages and those of others "working in the USA". They US is not going to bring all clothing mfg back to the USA. It is what it is. Flame me if you'd like. No flaming here. International trade is good as long as it is balanced. I would rather strive for a high tech, high value manufacturing workforce. When you think of good jobs, you don’t think of sitting at a sewing machine assembling clothes. I know someone had to do it. Maybe robots? I think we should be more concerned about manufacturing computer chips, iPhones and drugs in the US. Agreed, but as someone who lives and works in the land of the "holy" Foxconn debacle, that tech manufacturing is tough to get going in the US too. I'm no smarter than the average bear, but I gave the Foxconn experiment about a 10% chance of success. My former company was caught up in it as a supplier to Foxconn and invested big dollars in capital and infrastructure to support Foxconn. There is little movement (that I am aware of) in trying to get this hi tech mfg ramped up right now.
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lurkyloo
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Post by lurkyloo on Mar 30, 2021 7:55:14 GMT -5
Chinese, etc. made clothes are convenient and have their place. I wouldn’t bother with American made for my little hellion who outgrows clothes only slightly faster than he destroys them.
I am not hugely worried about China/India being the source for APIs either. Pharma companies are going to go with the cheapest reliable source, and China has fewer climate and human protections in place. It’s always cheaper to buy material from the place that can freely their chemical waste in the river and pay even their skilled workers less bc of an artificially low COL. I would worry about it if I thought we absolutely couldn’t pivot to making the material in the US. We could, it’d just be more expensive. However, this is a real worry for places like Canada who have made it so expensive to do business that basically all the pharma companies and manufacturing have left. Largely because they have no home grown pharma manufacturing they are at a competitive disadvantage in sourcing enough vaccines for their population. Tech development is also a real worry...there needs to be at least 1-2 US based places of manufacturing for some IT items and DH has run into issues bc it’s hard for the private sector to compete and turn a profit.
DH has a lot of family members who were hurt by the auto wars in the 80s and has a healthy respect for US manufacturing. I also would prefer to support US manufacturing, so I research and buy American where it makes sense. (I could also make our clothes if I absolutely had to, but it’s far more efficient to work and earn money buy them.)
I do think awareness is important. I have no problem with Chinese people individually but I trust their leadership about as far as I can throw them.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Mar 30, 2021 9:08:49 GMT -5
I'd like to buy less things from China, but this thread makes me feel very, very poor. I'm more focused on buying a little better quality these days, but I don't need or want my clothes to last forever. I already hang onto stuff for way too long.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Mar 30, 2021 9:58:11 GMT -5
I buy most of my clothes 2nd hand so I don't pay any attention to where theyre made. Reducing total waste is my focus at this point.
The kids have sized out of the consignment store we've relied on for them. I need to look at platos closet next. I'm hoping that will be our next go-to.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Mar 30, 2021 10:56:56 GMT -5
There are slim pickings for 2nd hand clothes for my boys. If I went shopping more often, I'd try them more, but I've mostly given up. I usually shop for really specific things. Most of the time, by the time clothes go through my two boys, they're ready for the trash. The oldest is hard on the knees. My youngest can destroy shoes in 2 weeks. It's amazing.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Mar 30, 2021 12:09:49 GMT -5
There are slim pickings for 2nd hand clothes for my boys. If I went shopping more often, I'd try them more, but I've mostly given up. I usually shop for really specific things. Most of the time, by the time clothes go through my two boys, they're ready for the trash. The oldest is hard on the knees. My youngest can destroy shoes in 2 weeks. It's amazing. We stopped even trying to sell stuff back to the consignment store unless it was new and just too late to return it. Neither of my kids have had a big growth spurt, 4-5 inches consistently every year so they wear out their clothes. I don't find much for them at goodwill or arc either, but I'm hoping the teen consignment store will be an option. I did order from H&M for both kids recently, but it hasn't come in yet.
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tractor
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Post by tractor on Mar 30, 2021 14:02:42 GMT -5
My work clothes are obviously clerics. The local church supply store has made arrangements in Ghana to have shirts made there, all salaries are living wage, health insurance included. The local store could have just has easily contracted with a larger company but considered this as a social justice project. At least you know what you’re wearing most days. 🙂. It’s always strange to see a priest wearing shorts, a colorful shirt and baseball cap..I know it’s you father, no sense trying to hide...
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Mar 30, 2021 14:18:07 GMT -5
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pulmonarymd
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Post by pulmonarymd on Mar 30, 2021 14:24:28 GMT -5
Chinese, etc. made clothes are convenient and have their place. I wouldn’t bother with American made for my little hellion who outgrows clothes only slightly faster than he destroys them. I am not hugely worried about China/India being the source for APIs either. Pharma companies are going to go with the cheapest reliable source, and China has fewer climate and human protections in place. It’s always cheaper to buy material from the place that can freely their chemical waste in the river and pay even their skilled workers less bc of an artificially low COL. I would worry about it if I thought we absolutely couldn’t pivot to making the material in the US. We could, it’d just be more expensive. However, this is a real worry for places like Canada who have made it so expensive to do business that basically all the pharma companies and manufacturing have left. Largely because they have no home grown pharma manufacturing they are at a competitive disadvantage in sourcing enough vaccines for their population. Tech development is also a real worry...there needs to be at least 1-2 US based places of manufacturing for some IT items and DH has run into issues bc it’s hard for the private sector to compete and turn a profit. DH has a lot of family members who were hurt by the auto wars in the 80s and has a healthy respect for US manufacturing. I also would prefer to support US manufacturing, so I research and buy American where it makes sense. (I could also make our clothes if I absolutely had to, but it’s far more efficient to work and earn money buy them.) I do think awareness is important. I have no problem with Chinese people individually but I trust their leadership about as far as I can throw them. Based on my experience over the last few years, I am more worried than you are. We have a standing item on our monthly meeting agenda to talk about drug shortages. Mainstay generic drugs have been in short supply, and we have had to make adjustments in how we decide to allocate those drugs at times. It hasn't impacted patient care all that negatively to this point, but I believe that has been plain luck. After Hurricane Maria hit Puerto Rico, a whole host of things were in short supply, including Tylenol, Valium, and IV bags. We had to make do with different options. I have serious concerns about the supply chain in medicine, both for medications as well as supplies. Just in time has turned out to be dangerous for patient care. That is a major lesson of this pandemic
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Mar 30, 2021 18:25:34 GMT -5
When I had gall bladder surgery 5 years ago, there were certain meds they didn't have. Seemed like there was a shortage of IV bags. They found substitutes for me and I healed. Some of the meds were not the first choice.
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irishpad
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Post by irishpad on Mar 30, 2021 21:55:32 GMT -5
My work clothes are obviously clerics. The local church supply store has made arrangements in Ghana to have shirts made there, all salaries are living wage, health insurance included. The local store could have just has easily contracted with a larger company but considered this as a social justice project. At least you know what you’re wearing most days. 🙂. It’s always strange to see a priest wearing shorts, a colorful shirt and baseball cap..I know it’s you father, no sense trying to hide... fortunately for me the rest of may wardrobe is pretty limited. Mostly free T-Shirts from events. lol I'm an athletic guy so need some of those shorts, running shoes, caps. Plus I look good in them. hehe
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ktunes
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Post by ktunes on Mar 30, 2021 23:25:31 GMT -5
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Spellbound454
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"In the end, we remember not the words of our enemies but the silence of our friends"
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Post by Spellbound454 on Mar 31, 2021 4:32:42 GMT -5
Foreign clothing imports fit a need; Many consumers want clothing that is in fashion, they don't want to wear it for more than a season..... or they have growing kids who need kitting out frequently. Cheaper clothes are always going to be popular....... and since many Countries have lower manufacturing costs...... this makes it more feasible.
Its also good for people on a budget. The reality is that people have kids to feed and need to make their money stretch.
Many of the medium range clothing retailers have gone out of business over here. Consumers won't pay excess money when they can get something just as good down the road.
Its nice to think that we would all buy British..... but its up to the businesses to make a good offering. Nationalism isn't going to cut it in these difficult times.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2021 10:48:26 GMT -5
Foreign clothing imports fit a need; Many consumers want clothing that is in fashion, they don't want to wear it for more than a season..... or they have growing kids who need kitting out frequently. Fast fashion. Look it up. More junk in the landfills and synthetic fabrics (polyester, nylon, Spandex, etc.) are NOT biodegradable. If you actually go out and buy this season's "must-have" colors and styles you're part of the problem. DS and DDIL are raising 3 kids on one salary. DDIL buys a the kids' clothes (and even shoes) at a resale shop. They look adorable and their clothes are actually better quality than the cheap stuff, which doesn't last long enough to end up in a resale shop. OK, that's about the only valid reason I can see for buying clothing made by slave labor in countries that don't care about the environment, and which will be in the landfill in a year. Its still not a "given". Ever hear of hand-me-downs? They're not fatal. I came from a comfortable middle-class family and I remember my mother buying me a winter coat that was more expensive than usual. We got it a size too big so it was too big the first year, just about right the second and getting a bit tight the third. I must have learned something from that. I've bragged here before about my dress winter coat- camel hair, bought it 1983 for $450, still looks beautiful. That kind of long-lasting value for money IS "a good offering".
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Spellbound454
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"In the end, we remember not the words of our enemies but the silence of our friends"
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Post by Spellbound454 on Mar 31, 2021 11:57:47 GMT -5
Foreign clothing imports fit a need; Many consumers want clothing that is in fashion, they don't want to wear it for more than a season..... or they have growing kids who need kitting out frequently. Fast fashion. Look it up. More junk in the landfills and synthetic fabrics (polyester, nylon, Spandex, etc.) are NOT biodegradable. If you actually go out and buy this season's "must-have" colors and styles you're part of the problem. DS and DDIL are raising 3 kids on one salary. DDIL buys a the kids' clothes (and even shoes) at a resale shop. They look adorable and their clothes are actually better quality than the cheap stuff, which doesn't last long enough to end up in a resale shop. OK, that's about the only valid reason I can see for buying clothing made by slave labor in countries that don't care about the environment, and which will be in the landfill in a year. Its still not a "given". Ever hear of hand-me-downs? They're not fatal. I came from a comfortable middle-class family and I remember my mother buying me a winter coat that was more expensive than usual. We got it a size too big so it was too big the first year, just about right the second and getting a bit tight the third. I must have learned something from that. I've bragged here before about my dress winter coat- camel hair, bought it 1983 for $450, still looks beautiful. That kind of long-lasting value for money IS "a good offering". Yes I'm aware of what is.. and isn't, biodegradable .... but.... young people especially like to be fashionable, so that's why they buy it...... Its also cheaper and more affordable for them. If a cultural change is whats needed, and I'd probably agree in cutting down the wastage....it will take time. Recycling and resale is one idea ..... but do enough people do that, or do they just kit their kids out in new things for the new School term? Not sure about the term "slave labour" If the big retailers were buying from sweatshops..... (which do exist) there would be a storm of people wanting to know what is going on. There has to be product tracing and accountability and fair prices and working conditions. Also, the wages may be less than we would have........ but for some families in far flung places, this is the money which feeds their kids. Similarly, there is a big industry in Ghana of selling recycled clothes which come from the West "Dead white mens clothes" .... but its an industry... and its work... and food for people that are there. We cant just stop sending them. Its good to have ideas on what we need to do in order to protect the environment etc but thats not what happens when poorer people want to clothe themselves and their kids. Imports give them a choice which wasn't there before....... and why shouldn't they have a good standard of living etc?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2021 18:12:42 GMT -5
Yes I'm aware of what is.. and isn't, biodegradable .... but.... young people especially like to be fashionable, so that's why they buy it...... Its also cheaper and more affordable for them. If a cultural change is what's needed, and I'd probably agree in cutting down the wastage....it will take time. And it can start now. I see people whose kids, especially little girls, have WAY too many clothes and are too preoccupied with them. One had 3 changes of clothes during her 4th birthday party and when they went to Disney she had different Disney gear on in every picture. Too much emphasis on the superficial. No- in most circles sending your kid to school in last season's clothes would be child abuse. Meh. I wore uniforms in 7th and 8th grade and all through HS. I hated them but got a great education. In college I went the other way and dressed in T-shirts and shorts or jeans. Got another great education. Didn't lack for male company, either. The BBC has been documenting this for years, most recently in Xinjiang in China where there are giant labor camps where the Uighur minorities are forced to work. The major brands always respond with, "We have no evidence that our Chinese-made clothing is produced in this region..." Weasel words. How would they know? When over 1,000 workers died in the Rana Plaza fire/building collapse, the brands found in the rubble included Disney and Benetton. I agreed that I understand why poor people are forced to shop for their kids' clothes at Wal-Mart. The rest of us should be unwilling to pay the price in terms of human rights violation and environmental damage.
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jerseygirl
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Post by jerseygirl on Mar 31, 2021 18:18:12 GMT -5
Walmart or Macy’s - most clothes in both from China etc
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Spellbound454
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"In the end, we remember not the words of our enemies but the silence of our friends"
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Post by Spellbound454 on Apr 1, 2021 2:02:36 GMT -5
I agree... some children have too much.
In the UK, all children go to School in uniform. You would get new shirts and trousers, (boys wear them out) jumpers, socks and sweatshirts each year. Good for the parents. One uniform set in the wash, the other on the child and they are always neat and presentable. Things get handed down or given back to the School to recycle........ and you don't need so many other clothes.
All the main retailers, however, will have generic uniforms for the start of the year in September....ie...white shirts, school trousers (pants), black shoes, coats.... to keep their market share and much of it is sourced from abroad. Parents will shop around for whatever quality and price they want to pay.
Companies do know where they are sourcing their product lines from.......and as consumers we need to know too. The only way to stop sweatshops is not to buy from them. As their market we have leverage to say, we will buy.. but only if you give your workers proper breaks/wages/ventilation and they don't use underage children. Western consumers have no tolerance for exploitation.
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mamasita99
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Post by mamasita99 on Apr 4, 2021 19:49:06 GMT -5
The main way I try to make better choices for the environment and support humane labor practices is first of all, to buy less and use less. After that I look to buy second hand so that I can extend the working life of products already in circulation. Finally, I will do a bit of background check on products I want to purchase. I can’t afford all American, all-organic everything, but I’m also not a monster
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2021 17:15:26 GMT -5
Well, I tried. The tailor I used back when I was working was having a promotion ending April 10, including 10% off jackets. My one item I wear the most that I got through him is a blazer that looks good with jeans and boots and I thought- well, maybe I can get another one. He'd told me at one point that everything was made in Chicago0 that he'd tried using "the Orient" but couldn't get the quality he wanted.
I e-mailed in response to the promotional ad- it had gone out from his daughter, who is now a partner. I asked if the clothes were still made in the USA. HE responded saying that the promotion ended April 10. I repeated my question: were the clothes made in the USA? Well, it depends... his main source is the USA but some are made elsewhere. I asked where the jackets were made. He responded by saying that you could get quality in any country of manufacture and suggested times for me to come in. I know his standards and don't doubt the quality. That wasn't the issue.
Unfortunate- I sure don't NEED another item of clothing but it would have been nice and would have supported a local business and US manufacture- except I guess it wouldn't. More for charity and the 529 accounts.
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