thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Jan 31, 2020 10:07:39 GMT -5
If I had actually seen "You", recognized you. I would have introduced my self, we could have had a pleasant chat. Now, the next time you go to Costco, You are going to wonder if the old guy wearing long pants, is oldcoyote. Aren't you east valley?
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jan 31, 2020 15:31:47 GMT -5
Not at all, we hate interference with elections of any kind. (bolded) Even domestic, partisan, make believe interference. Interesting. So how do you feel about the Mueller report and Russian interference in out election? How do you feel about Trump illegally using the power of his office to get dirt on his potential political opponent's son? How do you feel about the idea that The President should be allowed to interfere in the 2020 general election on his behalf?
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jan 31, 2020 15:36:38 GMT -5
I don't understand this lingering fixation to out the original whistleblower. We've had so many 'on the record' witnesses since that whistleblower, we could discount what he said and still have ten times over the number of credible witnesses needed to convict a normal criminal. The whistle blower still need to be accountable, for their actions, they are protected, if we can keep secret any whistle blower, what keeps the whistle blower honest,,
I can say anything I want true or not? NO Words have consequences. Reality is, the whistleblower is corraborated by others. He/she is not actually needed in person anymore than allegedly Trump is needed to testify on his own behalf to prove his innocence or guilt.
No, just no. The whistleblower is ALREADY accountable for their actions. Trump, however, isn't even close. To recap, the impeachment trial IS ABOUT TRUMP AND HIS ILLEGAL ACTIONS. This televised senate trial is either a real impeachment trial or more bread and circuses at the direction of the GOP & Trump.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jan 31, 2020 16:12:51 GMT -5
Interesting. So how do you feel about the Mueller report and Russian interference in out election? How do you feel about Trump illegally using the power of his office to get dirt on his potential political opponent's son? How do you feel about the idea that The President should be allowed to interfere in the 2020 general election on his behalf? The corruption in Ukraine goes back way farther than Trump as president. I really can't speculate, as I will never be privy to the details a president can access. Whether there was dirt or not can only be verified by investigation. I am probably an outlier here, but I actually don't care about Ukraine's corruption.
I do, however, care about the corruption of the US government, since they purportedly represent ME. I am better than that, and I expect them to be, as well.
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Bob Ross
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Post by Bob Ross on Jan 31, 2020 16:17:35 GMT -5
Not at all, we hate interference with elections of any kind. (bolded) Even domestic, partisan, make believe interference.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jan 31, 2020 16:22:17 GMT -5
Not at all, we hate interference with elections of any kind. (bolded) Even domestic, partisan, make believe interference. Interesting. So how do you feel about the Mueller report and Russian interference in out election? How do you feel about Trump illegally using the power of his office to get dirt on his potential political opponent's son?How do you feel about the idea that The President should be allowed to interfere in the 2020 general election on his behalf? I'm ok with using his powers to find out if the former VP of the US used his influence to get his son out of trouble in the Ukraine. I find it hysterical that everyone wants to overlook what Biden potentially did. I have no idea if it is true or not, but I would have done the same thing if I were Trump. Using the power of the office to find out if someone else did something illegal is ok in my book. Using the power of the office to get yourself, family or friends out of trouble is not ok. There are lots of people that agree with me and lots of people that disagree with me. I do believe bias is at work. But the fact of the matter is that Biden was in office when this occurred so I have no idea why the left doesn't want THAT investigated.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jan 31, 2020 16:37:52 GMT -5
Nothing in that debunked conspiracy smokescreen indicated Hunter Biden was in any trouble at all, unless I missed something.
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Tennesseer
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Post by Tennesseer on Jan 31, 2020 17:12:41 GMT -5
The Post's View Opinion If Senate Republicans give Trump the coverup he wants, his acquittal will be worthlessSENATORS FACE a historic decision Friday: whether to shut down the trial of President Trump without hearing what they know would be essential evidence. Mr. Trump has denied for months that he withheld military aid and a White House meeting from Ukraine’s president in an effort to force politicized investigations, including of former vice president Joe Biden. The president’s lawyers have insisted that there is no firsthand testimony to the contrary. Yet, now, senators know that former national security adviser John Bolton can supply that testimony and that he is prepared to appear if called. Polls show that Americans overwhelmingly want the senators to hear witnesses. There is no precedent for an impeachment trial without testimony. If the Senate refuses, it will ratify a coverup, making any acquittal of Mr. Trump meaningless. Mr. Bolton is not the only witness who could enlighten the Senate, and the country, about the Ukraine affair. Acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney also has direct knowledge of Mr. Trump’s intention in withholding the Ukraine aid. Vice President Pence knows why Mr. Trump suddenly ordered him not to attend the inauguration of Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky last May. Rudolph W. Giuliani, the president’s personal lawyer, and his former sidekicks Lev Parnas and Igor Fruman know in detail how Mr. Zelensky and his top aides were pressured. Republicans argue that an attempt to subpoena Mr. Bolton or other witnesses would lead to court battles with the White House — even as they fault the House for not undertaking the same fight. One of the president’s lawyers has advanced the extraordinary defense that Mr. Trump was entitled to trade official acts for help with his reelection — a position, that, if ratified, would grant Mr. Trump and future presidents vast powers to rig elections. Complete article here: If Senate Republicans give Trump the coverup he wants, his acquittal will be worthless
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jan 31, 2020 17:20:42 GMT -5
They will also be worthless as sworn in representatives of the Constitution and all Americans. But, then again, they are Repo-Cons afterall.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Jan 31, 2020 17:37:19 GMT -5
Interesting. So how do you feel about the Mueller report and Russian interference in out election? How do you feel about Trump illegally using the power of his office to get dirt on his potential political opponent's son?How do you feel about the idea that The President should be allowed to interfere in the 2020 general election on his behalf? I'm ok with using his powers to find out if the former VP of the US used his influence to get his son out of trouble in the Ukraine. I find it hysterical that everyone wants to overlook what Biden potentially did. I have no idea if it is true or not, but I would have done the same thing if I were Trump. Using the power of the office to find out if someone else did something illegal is ok in my book. Using the power of the office to get yourself, family or friends out of trouble is not ok. There are lots of people that agree with me and lots of people that disagree with me. I do believe bias is at work. But the fact of the matter is that Biden was in office when this occurred so I have no idea why the left doesn't want THAT investigated. Riddle me this - was accepting a job on the board of Burisma in any way illegal? Did VP Joe Biden Have the ability to stop his son from accepting the job?
and part two of the question - How is Hunter Biden accepting a board position with Burisma different that anything Trump's children are currently doing?
What's good for the goose is also good for the gander?
If Republicans really wanted to stop potential influence peddling using the Children of office holders - they could change our laws right? Go to it - I have no objection.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jan 31, 2020 17:57:16 GMT -5
Nothing in that debunked conspiracy smokescreen indicated Hunter Biden was in any trouble at all, unless I missed something. That lying, scheming hypocrite in chief, Trump claimed he was withholding aid to the Ukraine so he could "investigate corruption". Oddly enough, he didn't seem the least bit concerned about Israeli corruption, and they get a crap-ton of aid. Israel's Attorney General Avichai Mandelblit has decided to indict Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on charges of bribery, fraud and breach of trust. The cases involved are known as 1,000, 2,000 and 4,000. www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-47409739Since 1985, the United States has provided nearly US$3 billion in grants annually to Israel, with Israel being the largest annual recipient of American aid from 1976 to 2004 and the largest cumulative recipient of aid ($142.3 billion, not inflation-adjusted) since World War II. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2%80%93United_States_relations
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jan 31, 2020 18:37:32 GMT -5
Interesting. So how do you feel about the Mueller report and Russian interference in out election? How do you feel about Trump illegally using the power of his office to get dirt on his potential political opponent's son? How do you feel about the idea that The President should be allowed to interfere in the 2020 general election on his behalf? The corruption in Ukraine goes back way farther than Trump as president. I really can't speculate, as I will never be privy to the details a president can access. Whether there was dirt or not can only be verified by investigation. There was no resolution on the alleged dirt. If the son looks in a bad light, taking that position for that pay, looking that way was always a possibility. Yes, the Ukraine has historically been very corrupt. However, whether or not Biden's son was engaging in corruption was unimportant to the impeachment. Tump used American taxpayer money to strong arm another government to open an investigation into Biden's son and then go on CNN and announce the investigation. It didn't matter to Trump whether there was any corruption or not, he just wanted to be able to agitate his rallies by announcing there was an ongoing investigation. If he was really interested in corruption he would be looking a little closer to home. Like his family members and, today, his own lawyer Sekulow. Somehow, none of that grifting bothers him.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jan 31, 2020 18:51:47 GMT -5
Interesting. So how do you feel about the Mueller report and Russian interference in out election? How do you feel about Trump illegally using the power of his office to get dirt on his potential political opponent's son?How do you feel about the idea that The President should be allowed to interfere in the 2020 general election on his behalf? I'm ok with using his powers to find out if the former VP of the US used his influence to get his son out of trouble in the Ukraine. I find it hysterical that everyone wants to overlook what Biden potentially did. I have no idea if it is true or not, but I would have done the same thing if I were Trump. Using the power of the office to find out if someone else did something illegal is ok in my book. Using the power of the office to get yourself, family or friends out of trouble is not ok. There are lots of people that agree with me and lots of people that disagree with me. I do believe bias is at work. But the fact of the matter is that Biden was in office when this occurred so I have no idea why the left doesn't want THAT investigated. No one is overlooking any corruption. Biden Jr and his work for Bursima was investigated and cleared. That's the part the GOP wants to overlook. They also insist on overlooking the fact that Biden was tasked by Obama, in coordination with multiple international allies (including the central bank) to push the Ukraine to fire the Ukrainiane DA (a DIFFERENT DA than the one who, later on, investigated Bursima) because that DA was notoriously corrupt. That's pretty damn hysterical, too. But, continually repeating bullshit apparently works, because you're on here repeating it like it was a fact. In case you doubt me (and i'm sure you will) here is a timeline by Reuters. Biden threatened the DA PRIOR to there being an investigation of Bursima. And subsequent investigations by the Ukraine did nothing illegal. www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-whistleblower-timeline/timeline-key-dates-in-the-us-political-controversy-over-ukraine-idUSKBN1W82HK
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dondub
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The meek shall indeed inherit the earth but only after the Visigoths are done with it.
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Post by dondub on Jan 31, 2020 19:00:58 GMT -5
As the Repo-Cons learned well in their attacks on Hillary over the years....just mentioning something is good enough. You neither need facts/evidence, or a real investigation to get to the desired end result.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jan 31, 2020 19:05:11 GMT -5
Interesting. So how do you feel about the Mueller report and Russian interference in out election? How do you feel about Trump illegally using the power of his office to get dirt on his potential political opponent's son?How do you feel about the idea that The President should be allowed to interfere in the 2020 general election on his behalf? I'm ok with using his powers to find out if the former VP of the US used his influence to get his son out of trouble in the Ukraine. I find it hysterical that everyone wants to overlook what Biden potentially did. I have no idea if it is true or not, but I would have done the same thing if I were Trump. Using the power of the office to find out if someone else did something illegal is ok in my book. Using the power of the office to get yourself, family or friends out of trouble is not ok. There are lots of people that agree with me and lots of people that disagree with me. I do believe bias is at work. But the fact of the matter is that Biden was in office when this occurred so I have no idea why the left doesn't want THAT investigated. What trouble would that be?
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jan 31, 2020 19:05:34 GMT -5
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dondub
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The meek shall indeed inherit the earth but only after the Visigoths are done with it.
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Post by dondub on Jan 31, 2020 19:14:24 GMT -5
Oh geez what a sleaze.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jan 31, 2020 19:37:56 GMT -5
I'm ok with using his powers to find out if the former VP of the US used his influence to get his son out of trouble in the Ukraine. I find it hysterical that everyone wants to overlook what Biden potentially did. I have no idea if it is true or not, but I would have done the same thing if I were Trump. Using the power of the office to find out if someone else did something illegal is ok in my book. Using the power of the office to get yourself, family or friends out of trouble is not ok. There are lots of people that agree with me and lots of people that disagree with me. I do believe bias is at work. But the fact of the matter is that Biden was in office when this occurred so I have no idea why the left doesn't want THAT investigated. No one is overlooking any corruption. Biden Jr and his work for Bursima was investigated and cleared. That's the part the GOP wants to overlook. They also insist on overlooking the fact that Biden was tasked by Obama, in coordination with multiple international allies (including the central bank) to push the Ukraine to fire the Ukrainiane DA (a DIFFERENT DA than the one who, later on, investigated Bursima) because that DA was notoriously corrupt. That's pretty damn hysterical, too. But, continually repeating bullshit apparently works, because you're on here repeating it like it was a fact. In case you doubt me (and i'm sure you will) here is a timeline by Reuters. Biden threatened the DA PRIOR to there being an investigation of Bursima. And subsequent investigations by the Ukraine did nothing illegal. www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-whistleblower-timeline/timeline-key-dates-in-the-us-political-controversy-over-ukraine-idUSKBN1W82HKAnd if Biden did nothing wrong, then trumps inquiry would have yielded the same results. But the fact that nothing was found under an investigation (headed by?) doesn’t mean there was nothing there. I mean, the senate is very likely to acquit Trump. Does that mean in your eyes there was nothing there? Or, will it get brushed under the carpet by the Republicans?
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jan 31, 2020 20:25:05 GMT -5
No one is overlooking any corruption. Biden Jr and his work for Bursima was investigated and cleared. That's the part the GOP wants to overlook. They also insist on overlooking the fact that Biden was tasked by Obama, in coordination with multiple international allies (including the central bank) to push the Ukraine to fire the Ukrainiane DA (a DIFFERENT DA than the one who, later on, investigated Bursima) because that DA was notoriously corrupt. That's pretty damn hysterical, too. But, continually repeating bullshit apparently works, because you're on here repeating it like it was a fact. In case you doubt me (and i'm sure you will) here is a timeline by Reuters. Biden threatened the DA PRIOR to there being an investigation of Bursima. And subsequent investigations by the Ukraine did nothing illegal. www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-whistleblower-timeline/timeline-key-dates-in-the-us-political-controversy-over-ukraine-idUSKBN1W82HKAnd if Biden did nothing wrong, then trumps inquiry would have yielded the same results. But the fact that nothing was found under an investigation (headed by?) doesn’t mean there was nothing there. I mean, the senate is very likely to acquit Trump. Does that mean in your eyes there was nothing there? Or, will it get brushed under the carpet by the Republicans? As previously mentioned... there only has to be implication to make it a usable political talking point. Neither truth nor an investigation is required. And even though the conspiracy has been fully debunked it still and will continue to have life. That’s how it works now.
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OldCoyote
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Post by OldCoyote on Jan 31, 2020 21:03:28 GMT -5
If I had actually seen "You", recognized you. I would have introduced my self, we could have had a pleasant chat. Now, the next time you go to Costco, You are going to wonder if the old guy wearing long pants, is oldcoyote. Aren't you east valley? No.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jan 31, 2020 22:38:57 GMT -5
No one is overlooking any corruption. Biden Jr and his work for Bursima was investigated and cleared. That's the part the GOP wants to overlook. They also insist on overlooking the fact that Biden was tasked by Obama, in coordination with multiple international allies (including the central bank) to push the Ukraine to fire the Ukrainiane DA (a DIFFERENT DA than the one who, later on, investigated Bursima) because that DA was notoriously corrupt. That's pretty damn hysterical, too. But, continually repeating bullshit apparently works, because you're on here repeating it like it was a fact. In case you doubt me (and i'm sure you will) here is a timeline by Reuters. Biden threatened the DA PRIOR to there being an investigation of Bursima. And subsequent investigations by the Ukraine did nothing illegal. www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-whistleblower-timeline/timeline-key-dates-in-the-us-political-controversy-over-ukraine-idUSKBN1W82HKAnd if Biden did nothing wrong, then trumps inquiry would have yielded the same results. But the fact that nothing was found under an investigation (headed by?) doesn’t mean there was nothing there. I mean, the senate is very likely to acquit Trump. Does that mean in your eyes there was nothing there? Or, will it get brushed under the carpet by the Republicans? You're not getting it. Trump didn't care if there was an actual investigation, or if either Biden did anything criminal at all. He just wanted the Ukrainians to go on CNN and announce they were doing an investigation so he could use that as his 2020 'lock her up' chant at his 2020 rallies. Everything is a marketing campaign to Trump. The constitution doesn't matter. The law doesn't matter. Ethics don't matter. Everything is a TV show in search of good ratings.
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dondub
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The meek shall indeed inherit the earth but only after the Visigoths are done with it.
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Post by dondub on Jan 31, 2020 23:16:56 GMT -5
Bondi the slaver doesn’t matter.
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sesfw
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Post by sesfw on Feb 1, 2020 10:14:55 GMT -5
I am .......... NE valley My Costco of choice is on Hayden ....... and I wear long pants all year ........
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 1, 2020 12:01:11 GMT -5
Yes, the Ukraine has historically been very corrupt. However, whether or not Biden's son was engaging in corruption was unimportant to the impeachment. Tump used American taxpayer money to strong arm another government to open an investigation into Biden's son and then go on CNN and announce the investigation. It didn't matter to Trump whether there was any corruption or not, he just wanted to be able to agitate his rallies by announcing there was an ongoing investigation. If he was really interested in corruption he would be looking a little closer to home. Like his family members and, today, his own lawyer Sekulow. Somehow, none of that grifting bothers him. You actually can't say what matters to Trump. Only he knows that. From what I watched in regards to testimony from those involved, Ukraine officials weren't even aware of the pause till the politico article came out. The money was also a five year slow feed and didn't affect anything they were doing at the time. There is always the mutual law enforcement agreement from the 1990's to consider also. I now say 1990's instead of the Clinton administration, so I don't have to keep proving over and over again that Clinton was involved with it.
I'm not following your last statement here. do you mind clarifying?
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Feb 1, 2020 15:49:06 GMT -5
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gambler
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"the education of a man is never completed until he dies" Robert E. Lee
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Post by gambler on Feb 1, 2020 16:10:26 GMT -5
So now that he is going to be found not guilty of the bull shit charge's and now being sure of a second term. it is now time to start working on amending the Constitution so he can have a third maybe forth term, to make sure the liberal agenda is dead
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Feb 1, 2020 16:14:19 GMT -5
So now that he is going to be found not guilty of the bull shit charge's and now being sure of a second term. it is now time to start working on amending the Constitution so he can have a third maybe forth term, to make sure the liberal agenda is dead There is no other eligible American who can run to make that happen? It has to be Donald J. Trump?
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dondub
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The meek shall indeed inherit the earth but only after the Visigoths are done with it.
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Post by dondub on Feb 1, 2020 16:19:10 GMT -5
So now that he is going to be found not guilty of the bull shit charge's and now being sure of a second term. it is now time to start working on amending the Constitution so he can have a third maybe forth term, to make sure the liberal agenda is dead . I’m thinking just declare the Trump’s as our royal authoritarian family and go through Donny, then Ivanka and finally Barron after the Was Impeached One is done with his 5th term. We can get no welfare, food stamps, minimum wage, SS, SSDI, Medicare, Medicaid, child labor limits, just off the books completely. Maybe go full Theocracy while they are at it. A fascist utopia!
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Feb 1, 2020 16:34:14 GMT -5
So now that he is going to be found not guilty of the bull shit charge's and now being sure of a second term. it is now time to start working on amending the Constitution so he can have a third maybe forth term, to make sure the liberal agenda is dead So now that he won't be found guilty because the "trial" was a sham, let's just crown him king, eh?
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Feb 1, 2020 16:36:08 GMT -5
And if Biden did nothing wrong, then trumps inquiry would have yielded the same results. But the fact that nothing was found under an investigation (headed by?) doesn’t mean there was nothing there. I mean, the senate is very likely to acquit Trump. Does that mean in your eyes there was nothing there? Or, will it get brushed under the carpet by the Republicans? You're not getting it. Trump didn't care if there was an actual investigation, or if either Biden did anything criminal at all. He just wanted the Ukrainians to go on CNN and announce they were doing an investigation so he could use that as his 2020 'lock her up' chant at his 2020 rallies. Everything is a marketing campaign to Trump. The constitution doesn't matter. The law doesn't matter. Ethics don't matter. Everything is a TV show in search of good ratings. Ding, ding, ding. We have a winner.
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