azucena
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Post by azucena on Jun 29, 2019 9:47:36 GMT -5
You've all convinced me to try out a house cleaner, so we can close that discussion LOL. The mental health comment rang true. I'm completely free today with my family on a trip and i stayed behind because I'm on call for when my BFF goes into labor any day/minute. There are a million things to do inside the house and all I want to do is finish some landscaping that has been making my heart sing.
We just hit the $50k savings mark which I sort of arbitrarily set. Knowing that we have a $15k vehicle on the horizon and not wanting to fall back into car loans. I figure we can take $10k directly out of savings, leaving a healthy $40k (about 6 months expenses) and then cash flow $5k over 2 months before/after purchase.
Not knowing where to put the ongoing $2k is my main question of this post as well as general feedback. I've never been in a position with what feels like fully funded retirement, full emergency fund, and still extra money to spare.
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Knee Deep in Water Chloe
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Post by Knee Deep in Water Chloe on Jun 29, 2019 10:13:03 GMT -5
But don’t you answer your question right there? If you know you have a $15K cat purchase coming up, put $1K-$1.5K aside for the next few months just for the car.
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Knee Deep in Water Chloe
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Post by Knee Deep in Water Chloe on Jun 29, 2019 10:14:58 GMT -5
Also, I have someone come into mop our 1500sf of floors every two weeks. The rest of us still have chores to do. That $80-$120/month saves me at least four hours of time per month. Everyone still as lots of other work to do.
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Knee Deep in Water Chloe
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Post by Knee Deep in Water Chloe on Jun 29, 2019 10:15:38 GMT -5
And we make our bed ever day, but we don’t force the kids to make theirs.
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resolution
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Post by resolution on Jun 29, 2019 10:37:59 GMT -5
Not knowing where to put the ongoing $2k is my main question of this post as well as general feedback. I've never been in a position with what feels like fully funded retirement, full emergency fund, and still extra money to spare. I can't say what is right for you to invest the money in, but I hope you consider investing the excess once your car is paid. When I started building up funds outside of retirement, I opened a joint account with DH at Vanguard. It was all online to open the account. I transfer money into it electronically from my checking account when I have extra. I am primarily in VFIAX, which is Vanguard's version of the S&P500 fund. That is pretty risky and I have taken some big hits on it during market crashes, but in the longer term I have made a lot more than keeping it in savings or a money market. I also have some emergency money in their money market, which is paying 2.3%. I would recommend you think about how much risk you are comfortable taking and choose a fund accordingly. You should be able to find a quiz online to help you determine your risk level and what percentage of stocks versus bonds you will want. If you want high risk/high chance of gain, its hard to beat a total market index (VTSAX at Vanguard). If you want to moderate your risk by including bonds, there are some funds that you can pick that have a set percentage of each so it is easy to match up your risk tolerance with a fund. investor.vanguard.com/mutual-funds/lifestrategy/#/ I mention Vanguard because that is what I am comfortable with, but you will find the same type of thing at Fidelity, Charles Schwab, E-trade, or wherever. You can also make your own asset allocation by buying several funds, but I just want to let you know that there are some "one stop shop" funds that make it simpler if you want.
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phil5185
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Post by phil5185 on Jun 29, 2019 11:56:56 GMT -5
I'm a saver, risk averse, and numbers geek. It's so tempting to forecast throwing the bonus money on the mortgage to make it go away quickly. Splitting the money doesn't accomplish college savings or mortgage goal quickly. That's a drawback lol. You are doing great! You have the government sponsored accounts, both pre-tax and post-tax, well funded and on track. I didn't see any taxable investment accounts? That might be something to work on. Here's what we did - we continually placed our money at its 'highest and best use', eg, almost no savings accounts or CDs (they are designed to offset inflation, so, by design, there is no wealth building, only safe storage of money). Instead we used wealth-building investments - things that grow faster than inflation. Check this site - for almost any 30-year block you will see that the return is close to 11%/yr. If you invest $50,000 now you'll have about $1,150,000 in 30 years. One way is to refi a house, take out $50k. That adds about $250/m to the mortgage payment (about $90,000 total). The remaining $1,160,000 is a capital gain, you pay capital gains tax when/if you sell. Or, if you hold it forever, your heirs get that money tax-free. Consider this - 'risk averse' is something that is overcome by fully understanding the math & the process (the opposite of gritting your teeth and betting on red). And 'making the mortgage go away quickly is an emotion, most of us considered it - but like so many intuitive thoughts, the exact opposite is true, I would never prepay a 4%, 30 year fixed rate loan, I would retain the use of that money as long as possible. We got a new car 3 yrs ago, loan rate was 2.5% for 60 months. Financed it 100%, no down payment. And I'll retain that loan full term. Meanwhile, the $35k that is still in the SP500 will probably double over the 5 years (rule of 72). So the end point should be a paid-for car and $70k in the SP500 account - minus the $37k of monthly payments. As an engineer, I often questioned the intuitively obvious answer - ie, pay off a car quickly, prepay your mortgage, invest in 'solid' things, bonds, CDs. It turns out that 'common knowledge" answers are mostly wrong when you do your due-diligence.
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pooks
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Post by pooks on Jun 29, 2019 12:11:53 GMT -5
Ours is paid off. I meant kids future student loan debt. Like if tuition is $50k, and we could only cash flow $25k so they'd take $25k in loans and end up $100k in debt. Then we would pay 20k/yr for 4 yrs post college and they'd pay $5k/yr and it would be gone (ignoring interest to keep it simple). You are doing great, so this is only a small criticism on an otherwise really great strategy. I would set up an automatic investment of the current $2,000 with the idea that some of it could be used to fund the kid's college. The above plan depends too heavily on the current situation not changing. Which may happen or you could be in an even better position, but it could also be worse. And having extra money hanging around just in case doesn't ever hurt. The above quoted plan would seem to work fine if you had only 1 kid. But with 2, one would be entering college just as the other leaves, so you wouldn't have the extra to throw at the loans as soon as child #1 graduated. We are about 9 years older than you with similar income and 1 child who will start college in 2020. Dh is exhausted with work. Really he is just over it and he didn't imagine he would feel that way at 40. We started saving for DD late (11), mostly in a standard investment account and though we worry some about DD's college expense, we would be more stressed if we were thinking it needed to be cash flowed. Your plan requires you to work for 12-16 years after the first starts college, so until 60-64. That could feel like a lot of pressure when you may want to relax more. Just a thought and wish you all the best.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Jun 29, 2019 14:01:39 GMT -5
I think you are right on, and something I never bargained for. When I was in my 20s, I assumed I'd work my side job until I died or was incapacitated...meaning couldn't talk or couldn't move.
In my 30's I started calculating how many hours a week I'd have to work to pay for my health insurance premium. I determined that I could/would work 5-10 hours a week if that meant I really could be done at 58.
In my 40s, when I'm done working, I want to be done. done. No more teaching. No more dayjob. My patience is pretty much non-existant. It doesn't matter if it's coming from peers at work or cute kids.
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travelnut11
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Post by travelnut11 on Jun 29, 2019 21:42:30 GMT -5
OP, you're doing great. I'd probably look at adding to a taxable investment accouts if it were me once you max out your tax advantaged 401k/IRAs. I feel the taxable savings is something we are seriously lacking in though so that may color my opinion. I make my bed right before I get it in at night and have since high school. I can't stand getting in a messy bed and must have flat covers to sleep. But apparently the messy bed doesn't bother me throughout the day.
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tcu2003
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Post by tcu2003 on Jun 30, 2019 0:25:58 GMT -5
We have some similarities to you, except our two kiddos are a little younger. For us, we are maxing each of our 401k accounts in the Roth option. We each have a fairly sizable amount in the traditional 401k, so we wanted to contribute to the Roth 401k for tax savings later. Our company matches are to the traditional, of course, so it still gets around 5.25% added each year. (DH and I work for the same company and have similar salaries, so while we have separate accounts, we invest them similarly and get the same match percentages and similar profit sharing).
We finally opened a Roth IRA for 2018. We were over the limit so had to backdoor fund it. We’ll do the same for 2019.
We haven’t started a taxable account yet, but that’s on my list for this year or next year.
We do contribute to each kid’s 529 - I vary the monthly contribution somewhat, but usually contribute around $3k for each annually. It won’t cover college, but I’m going to take advantage of what we do contribute. We also get a state income tax break.
We also paid off our mortgage. It’s definitely a personal decision, but my DH wanted to, so we went with it.
Also, yay for a cleaning lady! I’m still trying to get my DH on board on that thought!
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jun 30, 2019 2:59:45 GMT -5
Great news on the cleaner! I'm sure you won't regret it. I think I would probably divide your annual bonus into 3 parts. - college savings - mortgage - fun/vacation This would allow you to retire earlier if you should decide to, because you'll have college savings and you'll have paid off your mortgage earlier.
If you know you have a $15K cat purchase coming up, put $1K-$1.5K aside for the next few months
I agree with Knee Deep in Water Chloe here (except that is one a very expensive cat lol). Maybe aim for 55K to include the extra 5K for the car?
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Jun 30, 2019 7:05:00 GMT -5
We do contribute to each kid’s 529 - I vary the monthly contribution somewhat, but usually contribute around $3k for each annually. It won’t cover college, but I’m going to take advantage of what we do contribute. We also get a state income tax break. Side note: It depending on how bad instate tuition is for you, and how well the market does, you may be pleasantly surprised. DS is 15, and he's got almost 100K in his 529, from 3K contributions every year since birth. It's enough to cover instate and room and board for four years. But, tuition in our state has been frozen for 8 years, and I'm not going to promote that my kids go to their dream school. DD1 could end up at a prestigious school, though, because she's a school kid and she needs to be in a million activities. However, as of now she wants to be a teacher, ultimately ending up at private school. So I'll push for a place that will have her be debt free from the get go.
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Knee Deep in Water Chloe
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Post by Knee Deep in Water Chloe on Jun 30, 2019 10:27:49 GMT -5
It's a very elite cat who has very specific needs.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2019 15:04:30 GMT -5
We do contribute to each kid’s 529 - I vary the monthly contribution somewhat, but usually contribute around $3k for each annually. It won’t cover college, but I’m going to take advantage of what we do contribute. We also get a state income tax break. 3K/year is going to still be a lot of money, and you're going to want to cash flow some of it anyhow for the tax breaks.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Jun 30, 2019 15:44:08 GMT -5
You've all convinced me to try out a house cleaner, so we can close that discussion LOL. The mental health comment rang true. I'm completely free today with my family on a trip and i stayed behind because I'm on call for when my BFF goes into labor any day/minute. There are a million things to do inside the house and all I want to do is finish some landscaping that has been making my heart sing. On the house cleaner, it can be tricky finding the right fit. In the last 10 years, I've had two that I really liked the way they cleaned my house and was comfortable with them being in my house. I do live in a much smaller area than you and it's hard to find anyone. Don't think it isn't working if the first one isn't working out. I have learned that paying more doesn't always mean better quality.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jul 1, 2019 14:34:15 GMT -5
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Jul 1, 2019 19:48:27 GMT -5
I'd still do a little college savings for now (you're doing $276 to charity, you could probably match without too much trouble), then more when they go to HS and you're no longer paying private school tuition. I recently returned to my previously cheap state school. It was far from cheap any longer. Even the CC isn't that cheap any more. States are all different in that regard. My state sucks. By the time they go to high school, you'll have a better idea what you are looking at.
You're high enough in income that tax planning becomes more important. I don't think your regular 401k is that high that you need to worry too much about RMDs yet, but you can definitely do some projections and crunch some numbers knowing your tax bracket. Don't prepay your mortgage, especially this far out from payoff.
What you can do is track all of your spending, and see if the things you are spending on are in alignment with your values. You seem fairly frugal for your income, but there's always things that sneak in. If you do loosen the purse strings for something, reevaluate after a few months to see if you feel it was worth it to you.
ETA: look for an RIA for investment advice. They are fiduciaries.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jul 1, 2019 21:16:02 GMT -5
What does RIA stand for?
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Jul 1, 2019 22:22:08 GMT -5
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lund
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Post by lund on Jul 18, 2019 16:13:03 GMT -5
I am a bit late here, but here are my $0.00.... Soapbox warnings for opinionated bubble preacher hereby issued - A house cleaning service every second/third week is perfectly OK IMO. (You can always pause the cleaning service during a few weeks when you have a less hectic period at work and/or there are less activities/school for the children in order for them to pitch in and learn, and "re-calibrate" to the normal.) But, make sure that they do their part picking up before the service comes, that they pitch in during cleaning between scheduled times, and that they know that the cleaning service is a luxury and "the family is cleaning together - we all live here" is the norm (no laziness or frequent "too busy", "don't want to", "not my job", or similar).
- Roth IRAs while you can, for both of you, to the max
- Use the 401(k)s available to you and your DH. No income tax on your DH's pre-tax contributions is already a substantial plus. Regular 401(k) contributions also get the AGI down, which may let you contribute to Roth IRAs for a longer time. Increase as you can. (Sooner or later most of us change jobs, and it should get possible to change allocations at that time if the choice is not too good.)
- Use designated educational savings accounts for the children. Use all tax breaks that you can get. Your income means that they will probably not get any financial aid and that the expected family contribution probably will be 100%... Having "fat" educational savings accounts also may help your college-time cash flow, provided you intend to contribute to your children's post-HS education.
- I hope that you will contribute generously to your children's educations. Your income probably excludes any financial aid for them, leaving them with side-job income and expensive private student loans only. Too much working side-jobs may also not be beneficial for good grades.
- However, there are ways to let the students have a skin in the game. Paying for as many credits year two (tuition, room, board, books, fees, necessary transportation to/from classes) as they passed year one is one way that is very straight forward. To limit the level of your contributions to what an in-state non-private would cost (with books, fees, necessary transportation) also keeps the amount under a limit.
- I like the Rule of the Four Es (for staying in the parental home): Enrolled (and actively studying in school, college,....), Enlisted (in the military), Employed (and paying rent), or Evicted. (Sickness is not included in the list, but I think that following doctor's orders and instructions, and actively working on regaining health qualifies for staying.)
- Let your children know that you expect education after HS. If it is college, technical school, vocational school,..... depends on them. Their job is to do the best they can in school (and choosing good HS subjects if applicable), and try to find out what kind of education/careers/jobs they want to have.
- I also suggest that when they are a bit older, let them know that if they, Lord prevent, become teenage parents, you still expect them to get an education, and that you may use part of the cash-flow meant for tuition to pay for a sitter during school time, leaving them with loans. Else, the rule of the Four Es still apply. (A "graduation baby" is not a free get out of getting an education/work card.)
- Remember to make a mock FAFSA (and play the numbers a bit) both three and four years before your oldest is graduating HS, in order to adjust any savings accounts and cash flow issues. (Also check the credit reports of both parents and child.)
- In the FAFSA, home equity in the family home, debts, and retirement accounts don't count. You are allowed some cash savings. So adding to retirement and educational accounts, keeping adequate savings, staying out of debt with a few exceptions (mortgage, perhaps a smaller car loan), and paying down debt/increasing the home equity can be good things.
- You are likely to get the 100% EFC if your financial situation continues to be as good as it is at present, making much of the common discussions about non-retirement assets pretty void. But, Lord prevent, if something hits a fan in a bad way concerning your family income, it would be really good to have all ducks in a row both concerning educational savings, retirement, debt, and other savings and investments, so that a lower-income FAFSA would mean at least some financial aid for your children.
- Saving up cash can be a good thing. But don't let that mean that you don't max a Roth, a 401(k) or a designated educational savings account. A reasonable car loan probably is preferable to missing maxing.
- Time car purchases with the FAFSA and college period. (You may want to avoid debt due to less available cash-flow. The savings may not be as important due to 100% EFC anyway.)
- IMO your DH needs long-term disability. LTD can be more expensive than a death (since that situation hopefully is covered by life insurance and SS). STD can often be managed by using up available resources (changing spending/cash-flow, using EF, using other available savings,....). A long-term situation with somebody who is unable to have an income while costing more than previously (co-pays, medications, increased transportation help, not able to do much at home, increased living costs due to more a/c, heating, TV, water,..... because of somebody being home 24/7) is very financially draining.
- If you are maxing all retirement accounts, maxing all college accounts, contribute some to a post-tax investment account, have a healthy "regular" savings account, and have no other debt, definitely pay down that mortgage. EDIT: Forgot maxing any health savings accounts/similar that "carries over" towards retirement.
- If your DH wants to pay off the house, which is important for many persons, I suggest that you let part of any "windfalls" and "left-over money" go to it after maxing retirement accounts and educational savings. My suggestion is that you keep part of windfalls for fun (something like 10% unless the amount is very large), if you have any ongoing projects that you are saving up for (car replacement, home repairs, post-tax investment account yearly target amount,.....) 45% (else 0), and mortgage 45% (else 90%).
- If you are risk-averse, you could have a money market account and a money market fund. The MMA should guarantee the original amount, but yields less than a MMF.
- Maxed retirement accounts, nice other savings and investments, no other debt (with the exception of a reasonable mortgage) makes you a lot less vulnerable for forced retirement (Lord prevent). As tskeeter wrote above, it gives you options. I would like to add that it gives a certain measure of stability and security as well.
- Personally, I think that a certain amount of travel can be very educational. If you need to spend less somewhere, I think that dining out, shopping and DH hobby could be cut a bit.
- I would not chose between college and mortgage. I would prefer to do a bit of each, but preferably max all tax advantaged educational savings accounts.
- And as to how much is or should be saved for retirement, the 10% probably was for a couple with pensions, widow's pension, good SS, a paid for home, and company subsidized medical, and a substantially lower expected length of life than today.... You also are somewhat late starters by no fault of your own (health reasons), and probably also want your retirement savings to correspond to your present income level (good work, BTW!). Work your budget and aim for more than 10%. (I think that including all retirement accounts, health savings accounts, contributions to long-term savings and investment accounts meant for retirement, and mortgage extra payments count.) (Also check that you are only counting the saved long-term savings, not the short-term or middle-term "savings to spend".)
- Consider consulting some professionals - you need good advice on finances/taxes/investments and perhaps also inheritance/wills. (I assume that you have at least the basic wills, POAs, and similar done already). The different retirement kinds of accounts work differently when inherited by a non-spouse, and you may want to check that aspect too.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jul 18, 2019 19:09:35 GMT -5
Wow thanks for so much great info lund. I'll have to re-read it a few more times to take it all in.
Because dh has monthly ostomy supplies that cost $300-$400, we are keeping our low deductible plan as long as my company offers it. The current deductible keeps going up, this yr it's 400 per person, 800 family. I do the math every yr to make sure it's still best for us. So we don't have access to an hsa.
I'm not sure dh would qualify for long term disability. Honestly he doesn't make much more than he would get from soc sec disability. But, I'll think more about it.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jul 18, 2019 19:13:05 GMT -5
We just did our wills - adulting win. We set everything up to go into a trust to avoid as many taxes as possible and now need to update all the beneficiary paperwork.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jul 18, 2019 19:19:28 GMT -5
Both girls are college track. I'm not beyond doing community college for a year or two which is free in mo if you have a 3.0 GPA.
I get that our efc will be 100%. I don't know that I will pay it all. At this point, I'm thinking I'll look at what in state tuition is and pay some large percent of that. If they want something fancier, that's on them. I'll be upfront about plans when they hit 12 to 14 and how good grades and scholarships will make a difference.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jul 19, 2019 6:43:25 GMT -5
Lund - I'm not sure what you meant by this statement
You are likely to get the 100% EFC if your financial situation continues to be as good as it is at present, making much of the common discussions about non-retirement assets pretty void.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2019 7:21:10 GMT -5
Lund - I'm not sure what you meant by this statement You are likely to get the 100% EFC if your financial situation continues to be as good as it is at present, making much of the common discussions about non-retirement assets pretty void. It means, don't even bother worrying about sheltering assets from financial aid.
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azucena
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Post by azucena on Jul 19, 2019 7:43:17 GMT -5
Lund - I'm not sure what you meant by this statement You are likely to get the 100% EFC if your financial situation continues to be as good as it is at present, making much of the common discussions about non-retirement assets pretty void. It means, don't even bother worrying about sheltering assets from financial aid. Because my income alone makes EFC = 100%? That makes sense. I'm so far removed from the current FASFA. My parents EFC was $1000, DH's was $0, so it's a whole new ballgame for our kids. I don't mind helping to pay for college, but not at the expense of my own retirement. And I also just wish college expenses weren't so outrageous. What are the chances the tuition bubble bursts before 2026? And gosh, that's not that far away.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2019 7:51:50 GMT -5
It means, don't even bother worrying about sheltering assets from financial aid. Because my income alone makes EFC = 100%? That makes sense. I'm so far removed from the current FASFA. My parents EFC was $1000, DH's was $0, so it's a whole new ballgame for our kids. I don't mind helping to pay for college, but not at the expense of my own retirement. And I also just wish college expenses weren't so outrageous. What are the chances the tuition bubble bursts before 2026? And gosh, that's not that far away. Income is by far the hardest hitter to EFC, and getting your AGI lower with pre-tax retirement accounts doesn't even help as they'll add it back in. It's usually around 22-40% of income and only 5.6% of assets.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on Jul 19, 2019 10:58:20 GMT -5
It means, don't even bother worrying about sheltering assets from financial aid. Because my income alone makes EFC = 100%? That makes sense. I'm so far removed from the current FASFA. My parents EFC was $1000, DH's was $0, so it's a whole new ballgame for our kids. I don't mind helping to pay for college, but not at the expense of my own retirement. And I also just wish college expenses weren't so outrageous. What are the chances the tuition bubble bursts before 2026? And gosh, that's not that far away. I am so with you on this. As a returning student I will say that it is not easy to get a reasonably priced bachelor degree considering most starting salaries.
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debthaven
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Post by debthaven on Jul 19, 2019 15:02:37 GMT -5
A house cleaning service every second/third week is perfectly OK IMO. lund since I know you're in Northern Europe, I was surprised by this. Here cleaners have always come every week, or not at all. So I was amazed when my cleaner told me that my friend E (who had referred her to me, then let her go two years ago) told me that E rehired her two years later, for every other week. This is literally the first time I have ever heard of a cleaner not working every week here (Paris suburbs). I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised, because whatever happens in the US eventually makes its way here LOL.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Jul 19, 2019 19:13:40 GMT -5
I should consider myself lucky that I found someone who will come every three weeks, I take it?
It has been difficult to find someone who will come every 3 weeks. They want, weekly, every other week or monthly. I can't afford every other week but monthly is too long.
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