souldoubt
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Post by souldoubt on Jun 3, 2019 17:52:04 GMT -5
Trump came along at the right time when enough people were tired of career politicians and wanted an outsider but unfortunately he was the one that came along. If he gets re-elected that's an an indictment on American politics as much as it is anything else. If either side can put forth a viable candidate who doesn't push a ridiculous platform, has America's best interests in mind, has goals that are feasible and can work with both sides then I'd like to think there's enough people who would vote for that person. Unfortunately I don't think I've seen that person yet but there's definitely still time.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 3, 2019 17:59:47 GMT -5
I want him to not be re-elected in 2020, and I want him to survive long enough he has to wade through all the legal issues that are coming up like whack-a-moles during his tenure. And he'll have the knowledge that he'll go down in the history books as one of the few presidents who got elected without a majority of the popular vote, and with the documented help from a hostile foreign country - so, he'll forever have an asterisk by his name. Maybe he'll also remain the least popular modern president, too. So far he's beating everyone since Truman. projects.fivethirtyeight.com/trump-approval-ratings/?ex_cid=rrpromo
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 3, 2019 18:01:18 GMT -5
Trump came along at the right time when enough people were tired of career politicians and wanted an outsider but unfortunately he was the one that came along. If he gets re-elected that's an an indictment on American politics as much as it is anything else. If either side can put forth a viable candidate who doesn't push a ridiculous platform, has America's best interests in mind, has goals that are feasible and can work with both sides then I'd like to think there's enough people who would vote for that person. Unfortunately I don't think I've seen that person yet but there's definitely still time. Unfortunately, elections always favor incumbents, so whoever gets the nod will have an up hill battle.
However, Trump does seem to have a knack both for enraging voters to vote for him and against him, so we'll see.
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Rukh O'Rorke
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on Jun 3, 2019 18:36:21 GMT -5
I am not going to get on board with impeachment. President Trump needs to be rejected by the voters in November 2020, or not. Why? He very clearly obstructed justice. Why should he not be held accountable for that? Let alone, whatever it was that he did that he was impeding the investigation into. The message for the future would be clear: Get into office any way you can, cover up your crimes, and you get to stay in office. that's a really bad message to send the future.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 3, 2019 18:50:44 GMT -5
I am not going to get on board with impeachment. President Trump needs to be rejected by the voters in November 2020, or not. Why? He very clearly obstructed justice. Why should he not be held accountable for that? Let alone, whatever it was that he did that he was impeding the investigation into. The message for the future would be clear: Get into office any way you can, cover up your crimes, and you get to stay in office. that's a really bad message to send the future.Hell yes he should be held accountable but the House impeaching him and the Senate allowing him to stay in office is sending a much more dangerous message for the future.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 3, 2019 20:47:32 GMT -5
Why? He very clearly obstructed justice. Why should he not be held accountable for that? Let alone, whatever it was that he did that he was impeding the investigation into. The message for the future would be clear: Get into office any way you can, cover up your crimes, and you get to stay in office. that's a really bad message to send the future.Hell yes he should be held accountable but the House impeaching him and the Senate allowing him to stay in office is sending a much more dangerous message for the future. do you believe it impossible that the impeachment would not reveal high crimes?
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 3, 2019 21:17:16 GMT -5
Hell yes he should be held accountable but the House impeaching him and the Senate allowing him to stay in office is sending a much more dangerous message for the future. do you believe it impossible that the impeachment would not reveal high crimes? I don't think that impeachment hearings would result in findings that would lead to the Senate removing him from office.
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steff
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Post by steff on Jun 3, 2019 21:34:40 GMT -5
do you believe it impossible that the impeachment would not reveal high crimes? I don't think that impeachment hearings would result in findings that would lead to the Senate removing him from office. so you are in favor of absolutely no holding him accountable or repercussions for all the illegal acts? And you think our elections are going to be fair? Hell, Kushner basically announced that he's open for business to pull it all off again in his Axios interview yesterday. we know, without a doubt, that our elections are NOT secure. My state alone proves that.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 3, 2019 21:41:41 GMT -5
do you believe it impossible that the impeachment would not reveal high crimes? I don't think that impeachment hearings would result in findings that would lead to the Senate removing him from office. that's not exactly what I am asking. I agree with you on that.
what I am asking is if you believe the House would find him guilty of crimes that under normal circumstances would result in his removal.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 3, 2019 21:43:23 GMT -5
I don't think that impeachment hearings would result in findings that would lead to the Senate removing him from office. so you are in favor of absolutely no holding him accountable or repercussions for all the illegal acts? And you think our elections are going to be fair? Hell, Kushner basically announced that he's open for business to pull it all off again in his Axios interview yesterday. we know, without a doubt, that our elections are NOT secure. My state alone proves that. what concerns me deeply is that he has so corrupted the electoral process that removing him via impeachment MIGHT be the only way we get rid of him, other than riding out an 8 year term.
NOTE: I am not saying that this will happen. I am saying I am worried. furthermore, I don't see anything that is PREVENTING him from doing it. any objection is brushed aside as fake news and voter fraud. it is kinda terrifying, really.
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oped
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Post by oped on Jun 3, 2019 21:55:03 GMT -5
Nixon’s impeachment hearings had a huge impact on independent voters. Massive shift.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 3, 2019 22:45:20 GMT -5
I don't think that impeachment hearings would result in findings that would lead to the Senate removing him from office. so you are in favor of absolutely no holding him accountable or repercussions for all the illegal acts? And you think our elections are going to be fair? Hell, Kushner basically announced that he's open for business to pull it all off again in his Axios interview yesterday. we know, without a doubt, that our elections are NOT secure. My state alone proves that. I do not think that House impeachment hearings or even passage of Articles of Impeachment would solve all that.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 3, 2019 23:09:09 GMT -5
I don't think that impeachment hearings would result in findings that would lead to the Senate removing him from office. that's not exactly what I am asking. I agree with you on that.
what I am asking is if you believe the House would find him guilty of crimes that under normal circumstances would result in his removal.
Not sure what circumstances you wish to define as normal.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 3, 2019 23:10:38 GMT -5
that's not exactly what I am asking. I agree with you on that.
what I am asking is if you believe the House would find him guilty of crimes that under normal circumstances would result in his removal.
Not sure what circumstances you wish to define as normal. maybe.....the US prior to 1995?
if you are too young to remember than that, take a pass.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Jun 3, 2019 23:42:17 GMT -5
Not sure what circumstances you wish to define as normal. maybe.....the US prior to 1995?
if you are too young to remember than that, take a pass.
lol, not too young. I don't think he would be removed.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jun 4, 2019 0:56:22 GMT -5
No impeachment as the Repo-Cons in the Senate are a bunch of ball-less lizards that wouldn’t do the right thing.
Furthermore the Demos should take the highest rode possible as we cruise towards 2020 and concentrate on moving the American people forward as best they can. This should be done to garner as much support from the electorate as possible for the eventual candidate.
However, Pelosi et al should remind the American people that Trump should be impeached, and if this was one year ago would be. But too much is on the line right now to waste time and energy on it. Better to wait until he can be indicted in late January of 2021for all the various crimes he has committed.
Then on the eventual debates have the Demo candidate remind everyone of how Trump has despoiled the Presidency. You name or...emoluments, tax payer enrichment of his golf courses, his childish twitter posts, his support of and acting like he is a king/dictator/autocrat. There is so much more, but go after him hard so he loses it numerous times on national television.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 4, 2019 7:06:55 GMT -5
So.. who here has actually read the redacted report? I downloaded it and read most of it. (some skimmed) There is enough there to provide guideposts for the House Investigations, and I can surely see why Nadler wants (and should get) the unredacted version. I also believe that well conducted House investigations will further show more Americans how their President tried to obstruct justice. They will also remind us that our election was interfered with, and give us caution going into 2020. There is speculation that that's what Nadler is trying to do next week, by lining up a panel to review the Mueller report - try to the facts in front of all Americans.
There's too many people who get distracted by Trump's constant noise - his tweets, his ranting speeches, his promotion of extreme agenda items, like the proposed Mexican tax increase. All of it designed to distract the media and his Trumpettes away from the Mueller report, and news reporting on his other illegal activities. I don't know that televised Congressional panels of experts reviewing the Mueller report will break through the clutter, but I think it's important to try anything, at this point, that would reveal Trump's corrupt and inept administration.
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oped
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Post by oped on Jun 4, 2019 14:05:05 GMT -5
Yesterday the streets were deserted in London for his arrival. Today there are thousands of protestors complete with baby blimp and statue of trump on a toilet saying fake news and making farting sounds...
His take is that thousands came to greet him and any protests, if there are any, are small...
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on Jun 4, 2019 14:17:34 GMT -5
There is lying like saying I like the dinner you made when I don't and then there is pathological lying which is what Trump does.
The fact people either don't know or don't care that there is a difference is alarming.
And don't "But Obama! But Hillary!" Me you lost any credibility when you did not get in a froth over Trump's lies. It's the epitome of hypocrisy to carry on about the former two and ignore the latter.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 4, 2019 19:11:37 GMT -5
All people have to do is listen. My favorite trumpism of the week this week- "I didn't know she was nasty." trump, discussing Meghan Markle with an interviewer. "I never said she was nasty!" trump, replying to a question as to what he said about Markle. "I didn't know she was nasty." trump, on tape, on the recording of the interview where he said Markle was nasty. I mean, the man is cuckoo for cocoa puffs. You can't make this stuff up, large and small. Dh works with a solid Trumpette, who told him today that Trump did NOT say that Meghan Markle was nasty.
She listened to the audio where he calls Markle nasty, but insists that's 'not what Trump meant.'
When DH asked her what Trump DID mean when he said 'I didn't know she was nasty,' his co-worker said she didn't know, but was certain Trump did NOT call Markle nasty.
There's some kind of perverse brainwashing going on here. Some of the Trumpettes are willing to suspend reason, logic, and even what their eyes see and their ears hear in order to continue to be loyal to Trump. It's like Charlie Manson, or Waco or something. Scary.
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phil5185
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Post by phil5185 on Jun 4, 2019 19:29:22 GMT -5
"" All people have to do is listen. My favorite trumpism of the week this week ""
Kinda funny tho, while the Libs are busily counting "lies", Trump is managing the business of the nation, almost unnoticed. Ie, the Libs are almost handing the 2020 election to him.
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dondub
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Post by dondub on Jun 5, 2019 0:19:59 GMT -5
Wrong again Phil.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Jun 5, 2019 0:57:10 GMT -5
"" All people have to do is listen. My favorite trumpism of the week this week ""
Kinda funny tho, while the Libs are busily counting "lies", Trump is managing the business of the nation, almost unnoticed. Ie, the Libs are almost handing the 2020 election to him. How's that healthcare reform coming along? Does he have anything besides "Go to Canada for your medications?"
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 5, 2019 7:09:17 GMT -5
"" All people have to do is listen. My favorite trumpism of the week this week ""
Kinda funny tho, while the Libs are busily counting "lies", Trump is managing the business of the nation, almost unnoticed. Ie, the Libs are almost handing the 2020 election to him. What's your opinion of Trump's effort to impose a tax on Mexican imports to force Mexico to keep people from coming through their country and over the border into ours? How do you think that will impact our economy?
Do you think the GOP members of Congress should move to block the tax, as they're threatening to do, or go ahead and let Trump apply the brakes to the economy by causing all the prices at your local Walmart and grocery to jump?
And is this an example of Trump 'effectively managing the business of the nation' or more of an example of Trump trying to pander to that segment of his base that is racist?
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Rukh O'Rorke
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on Jun 5, 2019 10:34:30 GMT -5
Why? He very clearly obstructed justice. Why should he not be held accountable for that? Let alone, whatever it was that he did that he was impeding the investigation into. The message for the future would be clear: Get into office any way you can, cover up your crimes, and you get to stay in office. that's a really bad message to send the future.Hell yes he should be held accountable but the House impeaching him and the Senate allowing him to stay in office is sending a much more dangerous message for the future.How? I don't see why the senate potentially not acting should prevent appropriate movement in the house. Knowing that the senate may not do their job, does not absolve the house from doing theirs. Each actor here is going to need to live with the legacy of their actions. In my job, if I know that there is something not right - I escalate that to the next level and do my own due diligence. I don't sit and philosophize on the utility of doing my job based on whether or not the next level is going to do theirs. I do my job. and I document that I have done my job. While the senate may not act, the house needs to do what is right here. If they don't, 10 years form now anyone in the senate can point to the house and say they were the ones who decided to ignore these high crimes, not them.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jun 5, 2019 11:54:23 GMT -5
"" All people have to do is listen. My favorite trumpism of the week this week ""
Kinda funny tho, while the Libs are busily counting "lies", Trump is managing the business of the nation, almost unnoticed. Ie, the Libs are almost handing the 2020 election to him. I asked before, I will ask again:
name me one populist promise he has kept.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Jun 5, 2019 15:35:13 GMT -5
"" All people have to do is listen. My favorite trumpism of the week this week ""
Kinda funny tho, while the Libs are busily counting "lies", Trump is managing the business of the nation, almost unnoticed. Ie, the Libs are almost handing the 2020 election to him. I asked before, I will ask again:
name me one populist promise he has kept.
Well, he did create a big tax break, so he gets some points for that, but the tax break ended up going mostly to the wealthy and large corporations, and didn't have any of the benefits he claimed it would have, so it had no benefit for the lower and middle classes - so, take points away from that, and you end up with a big fat zero.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jun 5, 2019 15:58:33 GMT -5
All people have to do is listen. My favorite trumpism of the week this week- "I didn't know she was nasty." trump, discussing Meghan Markle with an interviewer. "I never said she was nasty!" trump, replying to a question as to what he said about Markle. "I didn't know she was nasty." trump, on tape, on the recording of the interview where he said Markle was nasty. I mean, the man is cuckoo for cocoa puffs. You can't make this stuff up, large and small. Its his way of playing 'Look, squirrel'. He loves insulting people by coming up with words he thinks will stick to them. He does it by repeating the phrase over and over again. Maybe Democrats should be hiring celebs willing to do similar shit to Trump and see what happens.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jun 5, 2019 16:00:17 GMT -5
Why waste time on impeachment proceedings? The general election is a little over a year away and there is no way it will ever pass both houses in that period of time. Congress has more important things to think about. I wonder what Dems don't want to deal with to even think about impeachment. I will agree its too late for the 2020 election season. I disagree that there is much stuff more important than getting rid of the Trump regime.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Jun 5, 2019 16:03:15 GMT -5
... If he is in 4 more years, the US is gone as we know it. And I don't know after that if there will be more elections. So I think this is when the rubber meets the road. ... I do agree this is a very significant point in our history. But I see it as something the American people need to deal with and decide. President Trump is more a symptom than a cause. There will just be another demagogue elected if that is the direction the people are going to go. Sadly true. And parts of Europe are falling to stupid and fear as well.
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