Tennesseer
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Garage
Apr 23, 2019 9:06:33 GMT -5
Post by Tennesseer on Apr 23, 2019 9:06:33 GMT -5
Last year I made the mistake of mentioning out loud the thought of building a garage. (Haha) Pretty quickly it was a thing. So I got a soft quote from an associate who is a quality builder, and was going to go with it at about 50K, BUT he got a lot of work and got too busy. Subsequently I got very busy as well, and it set on the back shelf, but my DW never forgot, so here we are again. Anyone here add a garage to a house? I am just curious about any issues, flags, tips, etc. We are adding an enclosed breezeway and 28x28 two car garage to our existing, and the sloped grading means there will be quite a bit of fill. Our base grade is gravel, no ledge or rock. This is the primary reason I am not self-contracting it- I know little about foundation and excavation work. I could put it on a slab, but with the fill I am thinking it may need foundation walls, footings, etc., and am not even sure which way would be cheaper given the amount of fill that would be needed for a slab (if even practicable) I've gotten one quote back so far, from an established builder, for 83K+ OUCH! I am not sure we will even undertake it for that. We had figured a budget of 50-55. Thanks! Just curious, deminmaine-have you been parking your vehicles outdoors all this time especially with Maine's winter weather?
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Value Buy
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Post by Value Buy on Apr 23, 2019 9:09:38 GMT -5
I have to assume since you live up north, a slab is not enough. You need a concrete foundation to below the frostline at a minimum. People spend upwards of $10,000 for a good prefab shed where you are responsible for the foundation in my neck of the woods right now. I could visualize a well planned out garage pushing $60,000 but $80,000? My first house was $52,000 with extras back in 1978. Good luck.
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busymom
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Garage
Apr 23, 2019 9:11:26 GMT -5
Post by busymom on Apr 23, 2019 9:11:26 GMT -5
Ouch! I'd definitely get more bids. Are you attaching the garage directly to the house, or, will the breezeway be between the house & garage?
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Artemis Windsong
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Garage
Apr 23, 2019 9:22:33 GMT -5
Post by Artemis Windsong on Apr 23, 2019 9:22:33 GMT -5
For storage, my DIL bought an 8' x 40' container for $2,000. It won't blow away. Where they live, she has few codes. DS said he couldn't build anything for that price.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 23, 2019 9:24:33 GMT -5
The only "tip", which if you're going with a builder they will understand (and you probably also understand this) is that you want the garage floor to be below your floor level of your home.
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hoops902
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Apr 23, 2019 9:27:48 GMT -5
Post by hoops902 on Apr 23, 2019 9:27:48 GMT -5
How set are you on having the garage attached to the house? How set are you on having a concrete pad to drive up onto?
Not that I would do this myself, because I want the concrete as a work area for shop-activities...but around here a LOT of people either build a detached garage, build a garage with gravel floor, or buy a pre-fab building that can work as a garage or storage building that comes with a floor included.
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oped
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Post by oped on Apr 23, 2019 9:46:41 GMT -5
I have to assume since you live up north, a slab is not enough. You need a concrete foundation to below the frostline at a minimum. People spend upwards of $10,000 for a good prefab shed where you are responsible for the foundation in my neck of the woods right now. I could visualize a well planned out garage pushing $60,000 but $80,000? My first house was $52,000 with extras back in 1978. Good luck. Yes, that was what I always understood too VB, and at first I budgeted it with this in mind. But I have since seen garage packages with a slab and integral footing. This would not go below the frost line (42"+) so the earth would have to be very well compacted and drained away from the garage. The latter would not be an issue, but I am worried about heaving. My cost thoughts are the same- 60K yeah, but not 80. I hear you, our house was 100 K in 1998, and I did the kitchen and the stairs. I am not anxious to spend most of that for a garage! My great grandmother was born in 1901. She and grandpa paid $500. for the farm. In small increments when they had it. It pissed her off to no end that decades later it cost more than that to add a bathroom to the house. She spoke of it frequently But yeah. Way too much.
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oped
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Garage
Apr 23, 2019 9:48:02 GMT -5
Post by oped on Apr 23, 2019 9:48:02 GMT -5
We park our vehicles outside too.
Would it return value at 80K?
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alabamagal
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Post by alabamagal on Apr 23, 2019 10:11:20 GMT -5
If you spend money to add a garage, it would almost likely not add that amount onto the value of the house. However, it you are planning to stay in the house for the long term, and it is something that is really important to you in your house, and you have the money to do it, then it could be "worth it".
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nittanycheme
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Post by nittanycheme on Apr 23, 2019 10:16:31 GMT -5
The attachment between your house and the garage may actually be driving the cost up. They need to make sure that the house won't be damaged by any changing due to settling, heaving, general moving, etc. Similar to if you install an attached deck. I know that there are a bunch of rules you need to follow to install an attached deck later; I would expect that this would be more complicated. Its basically just an addition to house then - even if you designate that addition as a "garage" and care less about it than if it was a real room with living space.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 23, 2019 10:30:52 GMT -5
The attachment between your house and the garage may actually be driving the cost up. They need to make sure that the house won't be damaged by any changing due to settling, heaving, general moving, etc. Similar to if you install an attached deck. I know that there are a bunch of rules you need to follow to install an attached deck later; I would expect that this would be more complicated. Its basically just an addition to house then - even if you designate that addition as a "garage" and care less about it than if it was a real room with living space. It's definitely driving the cost up to have an attached garage (either via a breezeway or via directly attaching it). A lot of people without an attached garage don't put AS much concern into having a super solid garage. Heck, you could post-frame the garage, you could fill the floor and not bother with any kind of real foundation and just let it move a little with some saw-cuts into the concrete. You could buy a prefab building that you could drive your car into and just have it dropped onto your property. You could probably still post-frame the garage even having it attached (structurally you could, just not sure what the code is) similar to how you'd build a deck. On the flip side, if you're set on really building a super solid garage, then attaching it via a breezeway probably isn't adding a lot of cost to the project (other than the cost of the actual breezeway). The cost is in building a super solid garage, which is just more necessary when it is attached. If you're building a super solid detached though, it's not going to reduce price all that much because the cost is in making it super solid to begin with.
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Deleted
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Garage
Apr 23, 2019 11:07:41 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2019 11:07:41 GMT -5
No advice on the building (although that sounds insanely expensive), but I love having an attached garage. That and a master bathroom are two things I don't think I could go without anymore.
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phil5185
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Post by phil5185 on Apr 23, 2019 11:14:47 GMT -5
I don't know how rural or 'rustic' your site is - but we have used pole buildings on our family farm for many years. The newest building is 40 x 60, has about a 16 ft clearance. The door is about 24 ft wide by 15 ft high, we store a John Deere Combine in there, plus several tractors, trucks, farm implements. The poles are square, either 8x8 or 10x10. We built it in about 1980, it's been thru high winds, heavy snow, hail, yada - the usual Upper Midwest weather. Our floor is dirt, one corner has a concrete pad for a heated shop area - but with a pole building you can put in any kind of flooring - when you build or add later, the structure is not tied to the floor. Dirt, gravel, asphalt, concrete. Course gravel is nice, it won't stick to shoes. As for a breezeway - a concrete sidewalk, covered roof, open sides, appeals to me.
As for adding value - I'm a landlord, bought sold a few - I wouldn't count on 'added value' for the garage, I would confine it to "value for your purposes".
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busymom
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Post by busymom on Apr 23, 2019 11:17:41 GMT -5
Ouch! I'd definitely get more bids. Are you attaching the garage directly to the house, or, will the breezeway be between the house & garage? Yes, getting more bids! The breezeway would be between the house and garage- attaching the two. It would be an enclosed room- more like a mudroom, although probably not heated. It is one more complication in the foundation work. Glad to hear the added on garage will NOT be attached directly to the house. There can be issues with attaching rooflines. Since you're not doing that, I won't trouble you with possible problems.
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billisonboard
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Garage
Apr 23, 2019 11:23:34 GMT -5
Post by billisonboard on Apr 23, 2019 11:23:34 GMT -5
Smaller size?
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Apr 23, 2019 11:50:46 GMT -5
Construction prices are insane around here right now. Wait until there is a recession. Things may get cheaper.
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Tennesseer
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Garage
Apr 23, 2019 12:07:01 GMT -5
Post by Tennesseer on Apr 23, 2019 12:07:01 GMT -5
At least you won't do what my dumb neighbor down the street did; turned his two-car garage into an insulated living space. Now the family vehicles sit in the driveway.
He tried to sell the house but there were no buyers. I wonder why?
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Apr 23, 2019 12:27:18 GMT -5
We park our vehicles outside too. Would it return value at 80K? Maybe by 2101..... Sarcasm aside, I don't think as high a percentage, no. Garages give back a lot of the value invested, but not all (according to "experts I have read") Somewhere between 70-80% is what sticks in my head. So I think it would follow that other things being equal, like size and quality, the more you spend the less you recapture. I'm sure in your location the return would be on the high end of the scale - garages are very nice in cold and snowy areas. Down here, keeping your car outside would mostly mean you might get wet or trip on something in the dark - car ports or even just awnings are common options, rather than garages, so around here I don't think the return would be as well as you would get there.
I get where you're coming from, though - we're thinking of remodeling our kitchen and master bath and don't want to spend half what the house is worth on doing that - it won't increase the living space, after all. You have to consider what you could end up selling your house for, and I don't think I'd get the money back on that level of kitchen remodel.
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hoops902
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Apr 23, 2019 12:37:07 GMT -5
Post by hoops902 on Apr 23, 2019 12:37:07 GMT -5
Does anyone have any experience in hiring out for excavation and foundation work? I don't think that is often done. What kind of experience? When we added onto my house I hired out the excavation and foundation work, then I did everything else myself after that (other than roofing which I also hired out because I wanted to reroof everything and wanted it done faster than I could have done it).
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 23, 2019 12:38:42 GMT -5
Maybe by 2101..... Sarcasm aside, I don't think as high a percentage, no. Garages give back a lot of the value invested, but not all (according to "experts I have read") Somewhere between 70-80% is what sticks in my head. So I think it would follow that other things being equal, like size and quality, the more you spend the less you recapture. I'm sure in your location the return would be on the high end of the scale - garages are very nice in cold and snowy areas. Down here, keeping your car outside would mostly mean you might get wet or trip on something in the dark - car ports or even just awnings are common options, rather than garages, so around here I don't think the return would be as well as you would get there.
I get where you're coming from, though - we're thinking of remodeling our kitchen and master bath and don't want to spend half what the house is worth on doing that - it won't increase the living space, after all. You have to consider what you could end up selling your house for, and I don't think I'd get the money back on that level of kitchen remodel.
Even if the return isn't high, it'll most likely help the house sell a lot FASTER. People around here won't pay top dollar in terms of return on a garage, but if you don't have one you might have a real tough time selling it at all.
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hoops902
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Apr 23, 2019 12:56:45 GMT -5
Post by hoops902 on Apr 23, 2019 12:56:45 GMT -5
What kind of experience? When we added onto my house I hired out the excavation and foundation work, then I did everything else myself after that (other than roofing which I also hired out because I wanted to reroof everything and wanted it done faster than I could have done it). Exactly your experience. Did you have engineered plans to give them? I don't. I would just be explaining exactly what needed to be happening at grade and at building height, which I am quite confident I can lay out well - including actual architectural plans. But for their work I would be relying heavily on their expertise. I'm nervous about that, because I don't have expertise in that area to be sure it is all good. No engineered plans, I gave them a layout of where I wanted the windows in the basement which is about it so that they wouldn't put block there. I told them how big of a foundation I needed, where I needed it, I told them how many rows of block I wanted, I gave them a reference point of where the blocks needed to end at their finished height (same as the current house, so relatively simple there). I wasn't doing anything that involved rocket science, doesn't sound like you are either. Any decent company will have done this plenty of times. I gave them an overhead view of the current structure plus the structure I needed with dimensions that I just created simply in Excel. And I told them I had gotten a permit and had their payments linked to inspection passings. If I were doing a garage, I'd lay out where I wanted the garage with some flags and give them a drawing. I'd put some specifications on that drawing telling them what I wanted at grade, what I expected the foundation to look like, how thick I expected the concrete floor to be, etc. I had literally no expertise in that area to be sure it is all good. I essentially relied on the inspections, on their reputation, and on having a little common sense since I was seeing the job site daily (i.e. I looked to see if it appeared they were lining up with the current wall on the house, did they put my basement windows in the right place, where was their inspection sheet once they got past a part that needed inspection and I hadn't seen it yet, etc). At the end of the day, I think if they did botch it, you're not likely to find that with any other contractor you hire either. Other contractors aren't going to stand around and watch their subs do excavation or foundation work.
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Anne_in_VA
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Post by Anne_in_VA on Apr 23, 2019 14:35:07 GMT -5
Another resource may be your city or town inspectors. In our city, you can make an appointment to meet with an inspector to discuss what you want to do and they will tell you what the code is and explain what you need to do as well as what permits are required.
Good luck!
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Chocolate Lover
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Post by Chocolate Lover on Apr 23, 2019 14:36:10 GMT -5
Just curious, deminmaine-have you been parking your vehicles outdoors all this time especially with Maine's winter weather? Ayuh. Not unusual up here to do that either. But a garage would alleviate a lot of hassle in the winter, to be sure! Plus, it would retain a lot of the value. I only ever see this word in Stephen King books, my brain went right to the old guy in Pet Semetary. Also, check with your local permit office about what kind of plans they will want from you to get the permit, you might yet get stuck needing engineered ones.
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schildi
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Apr 23, 2019 15:07:23 GMT -5
Post by schildi on Apr 23, 2019 15:07:23 GMT -5
Another resource may be your city or town inspectors. In our city, you can make an appointment to meet with an inspector to discuss what you want to do and they will tell you what the code is and explain what you need to do as well as what permits are required. Good luck! You must be living in a really good city / county where everything is the way it should be, LOL. Here, you go to the permit office, tell them what you want to do or submit plans, and they say "No" pretty much right away. From here on, it's an uphill battle and you need to justify and explain why you are within the code. It will eventually work most of the time, but man, it's nerve wrecking at times ....
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CCL
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Post by CCL on Apr 23, 2019 18:52:09 GMT -5
I'd go bigger, at least a 3-car.
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Rukh O'Rorke
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Apr 23, 2019 19:45:19 GMT -5
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on Apr 23, 2019 19:45:19 GMT -5
Last year I made the mistake of mentioning out loud the thought of building a garage. (Haha) Pretty quickly it was a thing. So I got a soft quote from an associate who is a quality builder, and was going to go with it at about 50K, BUT he got a lot of work and got too busy. Subsequently I got very busy as well, and it set on the back shelf, but my DW never forgot, so here we are again. Anyone here add a garage to a house? I am just curious about any issues, flags, tips, etc. We are adding an enclosed breezeway and 28x28 two car garage to our existing, and the sloped grading means there will be quite a bit of fill. Our base grade is gravel, no ledge or rock. This is the primary reason I am not self-contracting it- I know little about foundation and excavation work. I could put it on a slab, but with the fill I am thinking it may need foundation walls, footings, etc., and am not even sure which way would be cheaper given the amount of fill that would be needed for a slab (if even practicable) I've gotten one quote back so far, from an established builder, for 83K+ OUCH! I am not sure we will even undertake it for that. We had figured a budget of 50-55. Thanks! Rent to a quiet couple or sell the house. Just say #no to Betty White.
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Urban Chicago
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Post by Urban Chicago on Apr 24, 2019 13:59:28 GMT -5
I'm going against what most here are saying and argue that a detached garage is better. I really hate attached garages because: - Despite super-insulation and such, every attached garage I've ever been in is both loud and adds significantly to heating/cooling costs.
- Again despite building codes and such, attached garages often contain chemicals and materials that are highly flammable adding to the risk of fire.
- As others mentioned, it costs a lot more
- They are just plain ugly and nearly always dominate the visual appeal of your house.
- No matter what precautions you take, vehicle exhaust will make it into the main house. Over time this toxic buildup can cause serious health problems.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 24, 2019 14:26:00 GMT -5
I'm going against what most here are saying and argue that a detached garage is better. I really hate attached garages because: - Despite super-insulation and such, every attached garage I've ever been in is both loud and adds significantly to heating/cooling costs.
- Again despite building codes and such, attached garages often contain chemicals and materials that are highly flammable adding to the risk of fire.
- As others mentioned, it costs a lot more
- They are just plain ugly and nearly always dominate the visual appeal of your house.
- No matter what precautions you take, vehicle exhaust will make it into the main house. Over time this toxic buildup can cause serious health problems.
So just a couple of points - Not all attached garages are heated/cooled, so a garage attached to the house, particularly after-the-fact isn't likely to increase costs if not heated or cooled. - Detached garages are also often ugly and make a house look significantly worse (though I do agree with you that the way attached garages are going these days, they dominate the front visual of the house for the worse) - Taking even average precautions against vehicle exhaust makes the risk practically non-existent (i.e. You pull in front-first, you don't let your car run while in the garage, you have the proper step-up from garage into house).
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Apr 24, 2019 15:02:56 GMT -5
I never want a detached garage again. My car isn't left running in the garage. I don't warm up the car in the garage.
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tskeeter
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Post by tskeeter on Apr 24, 2019 21:59:29 GMT -5
I'm going against what most here are saying and argue that a detached garage is better. I really hate attached garages because: - Despite super-insulation and such, every attached garage I've ever been in is both loud and adds significantly to heating/cooling costs.
- Again despite building codes and such, attached garages often contain chemicals and materials that are highly flammable adding to the risk of fire.
- As others mentioned, it costs a lot more
- They are just plain ugly and nearly always dominate the visual appeal of your house.
- No matter what precautions you take, vehicle exhaust will make it into the main house. Over time this toxic buildup can cause serious health problems.
So just a couple of points - Not all attached garages are heated/cooled, so a garage attached to the house, particularly after-the-fact isn't likely to increase costs if not heated or cooled. - Detached garages are also often ugly and make a house look significantly worse (though I do agree with you that the way attached garages are going these days, they dominate the front visual of the house for the worse) - Taking even average precautions against vehicle exhaust makes the risk practically non-existent (i.e. You pull in front-first, you don't let your car run while in the garage, you have the proper step-up from garage into house). 2 cents worth An unheated attached garage will actually improve the energy efficiency of the house it is attached to. How? The air space provided by the garage is a contained, stagnant airspace. This creates a thermal break between the walls of the house and the outside. Much the same as how the stagnant air trapped in the insulation between the drywall and the exterior siding reduces heat transfer between the interior of the house and the outside.
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