Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Apr 11, 2019 14:16:23 GMT -5
Here's some Friday Eve fodder from the MSN homepage: (and it's kind of money related - the parents PAID for everything for their children (mom dedicated her life to them!) - even the trip so the son could propose to his girlfriend all that money spent and the relationship still went sour.) www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/voices/i-dedicated-my-whole-life-to-my-kids-%E2%80%94-then-my-son-abandoned-me/ar-BBRgCyk?li=BBnb7KzI think I'm a horrible awful person. I found myself cringing and silently screaming to her son "Run Away!!! Run Away!!!" almost from the moment I read the title. Many of the mom's narrations of her behavior (and her son's flight responses) made me really cringe. I'm sure much of the story is missing (as I'm not quite sure what happened that caused the Groom's mom and dad not to go to the Wedding (surely, the Bride's family declining the rehearsal dinner without a "polite" reason wasn't the reason?). I did feel some relief for the son by the end of the article, though. He escaped. And, yeah, I kind of felt relief for the mom too. She's come to terms with the new arrangement and I get that it will always be painful. I'm sure she will always wait for her son to apologize for his betrayal. I suspect she and her son will be forever 'estranged' - well, maybe on her deathbed something will change. I don't think grandkids will fix this. And I'm not sure if it's fixable with the rest of the family after she's dead. I also feel really bad for her hubby and other kids, too. Caught in the middle and having to choose sides. And it's will NEVER go away. ::sigh:: I don't think my take away from this article was the intended take away. I'm not sure what I'm suppose to take away from this article. It's like Pride and Prejudice - I need someone to explain it to me... What exactly is going on in this article? What am I suppose to take away from it? Cause I think I fell into the trap of "it's a two way road and gee, Mom, some of this is on you".
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justme
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Post by justme on Apr 11, 2019 14:25:17 GMT -5
Oooh...I've already been down this rabbit hole on this article. For 1 - it was posted on Yahoo a year and a half ago www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/dedicated-whole-life-kids-then-170004609.html so she's obviously dragging out this tripe again, must be low on money Reddit has some threads about it https://www.reddit.com/r/childfree/comments/7c3mpu/i_dedicated_my_whole_life_to_my_kids_then_my_son/from the yahoo running, as well as on other subreddits (but I don't have reddit skills to find them) I don't know if there's a new one on it. The reddit also has someone that found a comment on the yahoo article that was supposedly written by a friend of the son https://www.reddit.com/r/childfree/comments/7c3mpu/i_dedicated_my_whole_life_to_my_kids_then_my_son/dpnwql2 And someone posted a good article in the reddit www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.htmlYou're supposed to take away that her son is an awful and cruel boy and that there's no way she's a manipulative delusional narcissist.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 11, 2019 14:27:39 GMT -5
I remember reading the article when it first came out. My takeaway was pretty much "If you're so unaware of yourself and how people perceive you that you think "are you certain about the marriage" is a totally normal question...then you probably WERE offensive at the bridal shower without understanding how offensive you were". Heck, even if you weren't offensive at the bridal shower, once you ask that question, the perception of other comments changes. You don't ask "are you sure you want to do this" when you like your child's partner in general.
I also notice that when accused of being offensive, there's zero mention of an apology.
I also took "Dan knew me better than that" to sound a lot like "I say offensive things, but he knows I don't mean anything by it". It was reminiscent of when I hear people saying racist or sexist stuff, and then saying "Oh, so and so knows me, they'll tell you I don't have a racist or sexist bone in my body". It's never "I don't say terrible stuff", it's "I may say terrible stuff, but this person knows I'm just too stupid to realize how terrible it was".
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 11, 2019 14:31:06 GMT -5
There's also something to be said for the idea that when your own recounting of events leaves people thinking you're wrong...the TRUE version of events probably isn't better for you than the version you told.
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shanendoah
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Post by shanendoah on Apr 11, 2019 14:39:24 GMT -5
There is so much information missing. We go from "her family won't be at the rehearsal dinner" to "calling to confirm you won't be at the wedding" and then learning that the rehearsal dinner didn't happen - the rest of his family gathered to eat Greek food without them. There are a billion conversations that took place in between that first "her family won't be at the rehearsal dinner" call and the outcome of the rehearsal dinner being cancelled and his whole family not being at the wedding. These things absolutely did not happen as discrete events with no transition. And since it's the mom that's telling the story and leaving those parts out, my best guess is that those parts don't make her look good/support her picture of herself.
I have a cousin who has had to cut her mother out from her life. And it was (and still is) the right decision. My aunt will tell you she has no idea why her daughter has cut her out, even though I know K told her specifically. And I also know that some of her mother's siblings (my mother being one of them) really struggled with maintaining a relationship with K. I think the main reason they did was that, even though they didn't want to admit it/believe it was bad enough for an estrangement, they knew her mother's behavior was a problem. But for one of our Uncle's he really only talked to K to tell her how she had hurt her mom. At least with my Mom, I was also there advocating for K and her decision.
So yeah, this woman is writing the story. And she's writing the story of how she was a good mom, and is now just a victim. And she's talking about her emotional reaction to some of these events without ever talking about her actual reaction to her son. She has a picture she has created of how this happened, and how none of it is her fault. And she appears to have family members who support her version.
And given the way things were written, I kind of wondered, was the son who left her biological son while all the other adult children were her husband's biological children? I mention this because the son who is estranged was always referred to as "my son", while the other kids were referred to as "our children", and she never referred to her husband as the one son's dad, and talked about telling his siblings they could talk to them (but doesn't refer to those other kids as her kids).
And that kind of tells me something about the family structure, and might be a very good clue as to why the one son felt the need to separate himself from that family.
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justme
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Post by justme on Apr 11, 2019 14:46:07 GMT -5
I remember reading the article when it first came out. My takeaway was pretty much "If you're so unaware of yourself and how people perceive you that you think "are you certain about the marriage" is a totally normal question...then you probably WERE offensive at the bridal shower without understanding how offensive you were". Heck, even if you weren't offensive at the bridal shower, once you ask that question, the perception of other comments changes. You don't ask "are you sure you want to do this" when you like your child's partner in general. I also notice that when accused of being offensive, there's zero mention of an apology. I also took "Dan knew me better than that" to sound a lot like "I say offensive things, but he knows I don't mean anything by it". It was reminiscent of when I hear people saying racist or sexist stuff, and then saying "Oh, so and so knows me, they'll tell you I don't have a racist or sexist bone in my body". It's never "I don't say terrible stuff", it's "I may say terrible stuff, but this person knows I'm just too stupid to realize how terrible it was". I think if you truly do have a good relationship with your kids you can ask that questions - assuming it's not surrounded by bad context too. With my bro's first wife I was there when my mom asked in conversation if he was sure he wanted to get married to her given examples of things we grew up doing that she decidedly does not like (and completely skirting things like the fact that she likes to scream at you when you do something wrong and is kind of a bitch). Didn't damage their relationship, and obviously my bro went on to marry her anyways. The only negative was after they divorced he was like why didn't you guys tell me this about here, and my mom's like uhh do you remember the conversation we had? And his response was you didn't make it clear enough. Which my mom scoffed and told him it wasn't like she was going to tell him she thought his fiance was stuck up and kind of a bitch. The problem is this mom obviously did not in reality have the relationship she had with her son in her mind.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Apr 11, 2019 15:04:04 GMT -5
There's a whole lot more this letter writer left out.
She sounds like a narcissist. My Mom was one, and she was totally clueless about how other people would perceive some of the comments she made. For instance, she went to her sister's funeral, and, surrounding by my aunt's family and friends, kept telling stories about all the mean things her sister had done to her, and how selfish she'd always been. At her sister's funeral. She made my sister (who had gone to the funeral with her) wish she could crawl under a heavy piece of furniture. Yet when my sister tried to take my mom to the side and whisper to her that she should only be saying kind things about her sister to her sister's family, Mom was completely amazed that what she'd been saying might be considered rude or insensitive.
And "I'm going to cry everyday for the rest of my life?" She gets A++ for manipulation and guilt.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Apr 11, 2019 15:06:37 GMT -5
Here's some Friday Eve fodder from the MSN homepage:
Wait....it's FRIDAY? Did I just sleep for a day and and a half?
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Apr 11, 2019 15:21:04 GMT -5
Here's some Friday Eve fodder from the MSN homepage:Wait....it's FRIDAY? Did I just sleep for a day and and a half? Oh. LOL! It's "Friday Eve" as in the night before Friday. I have online friends who use this phrasing. It took me a bit to realize they were using it like how Christmas Eve is the night before Christmas.
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Tiny
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Post by Tiny on Apr 11, 2019 15:22:59 GMT -5
Oooh...I've already been down this rabbit hole on this article. For 1 - it was posted on Yahoo a year and a half ago www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/dedicated-whole-life-kids-then-170004609.html so she's obviously dragging out this tripe again, must be low on money Reddit has some threads about it https://www.reddit.com/r/childfree/comments/7c3mpu/i_dedicated_my_whole_life_to_my_kids_then_my_son/from the yahoo running, as well as on other subreddits (but I don't have reddit skills to find them) I don't know if there's a new one on it. The reddit also has someone that found a comment on the yahoo article that was supposedly written by a friend of the son https://www.reddit.com/r/childfree/comments/7c3mpu/i_dedicated_my_whole_life_to_my_kids_then_my_son/dpnwql2 And someone posted a good article in the reddit www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.htmlYou're supposed to take away that her son is an awful and cruel boy and that there's no way she's a manipulative delusional narcissist. Thank you! I was concerned by the emotional cringing this woman caused me as I was reading it (for the first time). Knowing it's an old article (or a retread of it) I'm still VERY relieved her son escaped and I still feel bad for her hubby and other children.
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grumpyhermit
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Post by grumpyhermit on Apr 11, 2019 15:31:46 GMT -5
I remember reading the article when it first came out. My takeaway was pretty much "If you're so unaware of yourself and how people perceive you that you think "are you certain about the marriage" is a totally normal question...then you probably WERE offensive at the bridal shower without understanding how offensive you were". Heck, even if you weren't offensive at the bridal shower, once you ask that question, the perception of other comments changes. You don't ask "are you sure you want to do this" when you like your child's partner in general. I also notice that when accused of being offensive, there's zero mention of an apology. I also took "Dan knew me better than that" to sound a lot like "I say offensive things, but he knows I don't mean anything by it". It was reminiscent of when I hear people saying racist or sexist stuff, and then saying "Oh, so and so knows me, they'll tell you I don't have a racist or sexist bone in my body". It's never "I don't say terrible stuff", it's "I may say terrible stuff, but this person knows I'm just too stupid to realize how terrible it was". I think if you truly do have a good relationship with your kids you can ask that questions - assuming it's not surrounded by bad context too. With my bro's first wife I was there when my mom asked in conversation if he was sure he wanted to get married to her given examples of things we grew up doing that she decidedly does not like (and completely skirting things like the fact that she likes to scream at you when you do something wrong and is kind of a bitch). Didn't damage their relationship, and obviously my bro went on to marry her anyways. The only negative was after they divorced he was like why didn't you guys tell me this about here, and my mom's like uhh do you remember the conversation we had? And his response was you didn't make it clear enough. Which my mom scoffed and told him it wasn't like she was going to tell him she thought his fiance was stuck up and kind of a bitch. The problem is this mom obviously did not in reality have the relationship she had with her son in her mind. And if you do want to have it, as a genuine concern about the age, and possible rushing, you don't wait until RIGHT before the wedding. You bring it up when he announces his intent to propose. And you outline your concerns in a way that make it clear it is not a reflection on the girlfriend.
This woman's whole article gave me the creeps. She does not come across in a flattering light at all.
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Knee Deep in Water Chloe
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Post by Knee Deep in Water Chloe on Apr 11, 2019 16:04:09 GMT -5
I'm so confused about the wedding part.
Besides that, I've been on both sides of this equation. My mother is a difficult person, and I have cut her out of my life for long portions of time. She would deny knowing why, but she's wrong about that. I've told her, my dad told her, and my sister has told her. After my sister told her (which was about a year after my dad's death), my mother did at least stop bringing up my non-negotiable. We've spent a few holidays together since then, and she did come to the hospital when I had the blood clot issue.
My DIL wanted to cut us out of her life and our sons life. She got frustrated because our relationship with our son is better than her relationship with her mother. She didn't know how to have a good relationship with us. We also didn't understand why she was so upset with us, and neither did our son. One of the reasons she made up in her head, our son told her she was wrong. At no point did our son ever try to cut us out. We did have to do what was mentioned in the article regarding "pretend nothing happened". I've had to chalk it up to DIL simply having a difficult time accepting that not all parent-child relationships are dysfunctional and accepting that we are not here to simply hurt her (as her mother did and continues to do). We're good now.
Our younger son did cut off contact with his dad for 18 months and with me for four years. (I'm his step-mom.) He was frustrated with the two of us because we stopped paying his living expenses when he was 22. He was annoyed with me specifically for having a significantly larger income (on my own) than his biological mother. I give "my" children more financially-based opportunities than his mother ever allowed because she literally believes being a good Christian means living in poverty. Part of the dis-connect was due to our son needing to learn to accept himself as an adult and accept that his dad and I own our choices and accepting that his mother will never like him for who he is and that I do like him for who he is. We're all good now.
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Apr 11, 2019 16:08:49 GMT -5
Here's some Friday Eve fodder from the MSN homepage: (and it's kind of money related - the parents PAID for everything for their children (mom dedicated her life to them!) - even the trip so the son could propose to his girlfriend all that money spent and the relationship still went sour.) www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/voices/i-dedicated-my-whole-life-to-my-kids-%E2%80%94-then-my-son-abandoned-me/ar-BBRgCyk?li=BBnb7KzI think I'm a horrible awful person. I found myself cringing and silently screaming to her son "Run Away!!! Run Away!!!" almost from the moment I read the title. Many of the mom's narrations of her behavior (and her son's flight responses) made me really cringe. I'm sure much of the story is missing (as I'm not quite sure what happened that caused the Groom's mom and dad not to go to the Wedding (surely, the Bride's family declining the rehearsal dinner without a "polite" reason wasn't the reason?). I did feel some relief for the son by the end of the article, though. He escaped. And, yeah, I kind of felt relief for the mom too. She's come to terms with the new arrangement and I get that it will always be painful. I'm sure she will always wait for her son to apologize for his betrayal. I suspect she and her son will be forever 'estranged' - well, maybe on her deathbed something will change. I don't think grandkids will fix this. And I'm not sure if it's fixable with the rest of the family after she's dead. I also feel really bad for her hubby and other kids, too. Caught in the middle and having to choose sides. And it's will NEVER go away. ::sigh:: I don't think my take away from this article was the intended take away. I'm not sure what I'm suppose to take away from this article. It's like Pride and Prejudice - I need someone to explain it to me... What exactly is going on in this article? What am I suppose to take away from it? Cause I think I fell into the trap of "it's a two way road and gee, Mom, some of this is on you". Yeah. There is only one side presented there. None of that happened in a vacuum. The mom may not want to acknowledge what led to the estrangement, but there was definitely a reason, probably lots of them over a long period of time. Lots and lots of info left out.
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andi9899
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Post by andi9899 on Apr 11, 2019 17:25:23 GMT -5
Here's some Friday Eve fodder from the MSN homepage:Wait....it's FRIDAY? Did I just sleep for a day and and a half? Oh. LOL! It's "Friday Eve" as in the night before Friday. I have online friends who use this phrasing. It took me a bit to realize they were using it like how Christmas Eve is the night before Christmas. Don't even bother. She just has nothing better to do with her time then wait for people to make a grammatical error and then pounce. The amusing thing is that you didn't make a grammatical error and she just couldn't wait to pounce that she didn't see the word eve and then pounced anyway.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Apr 11, 2019 17:51:29 GMT -5
I remember reading the article when it first came out. My takeaway was pretty much "If you're so unaware of yourself and how people perceive you that you think "are you certain about the marriage" is a totally normal question...then you probably WERE offensive at the bridal shower without understanding how offensive you were". Heck, even if you weren't offensive at the bridal shower, once you ask that question, the perception of other comments changes. You don't ask "are you sure you want to do this" when you like your child's partner in general. I also notice that when accused of being offensive, there's zero mention of an apology. I also took "Dan knew me better than that" to sound a lot like "I say offensive things, but he knows I don't mean anything by it". It was reminiscent of when I hear people saying racist or sexist stuff, and then saying "Oh, so and so knows me, they'll tell you I don't have a racist or sexist bone in my body". It's never "I don't say terrible stuff", it's "I may say terrible stuff, but this person knows I'm just too stupid to realize how terrible it was". My Mom asked me, both my sisters, my husband and one of my sisters husband if we were sure we wanted to get married. A good friend of mine was going through a divorce around the time I got engaged and she said "I dont think I wanted to marry him. I had no one to talk to. If someone had asked me out loud if I was sure, everything may have been different." A few weeks later my Mom asked. I thought it was nice and my husband said he really appreciated it too.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Apr 11, 2019 17:57:43 GMT -5
Oh. LOL! It's "Friday Eve" as in the night before Friday. I have online friends who use this phrasing. It took me a bit to realize they were using it like how Christmas Eve is the night before Christmas. Don't even bother. She just has nothing better to do with her time then wait for people to make a grammatical error and then pounce. The amusing thing is that you didn't make a grammatical error and she just couldn't wait to pounce that she didn't see the word eve and then pounced anyway. Pounce? You're crazy. Get a grip. I thought it was funny.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Apr 11, 2019 18:28:09 GMT -5
DIL and I are ok, up and down some. But we just told her while son is gone if she needed help with anything she can call, we will. Heck hubs would run up there by himself if needed.
Son and I are getting along better then we have in years. Somehow I think since I've been sick, he is realizing that maybe mom won't be around forever. Also he knows we are going to worry about him.
Just little stuff, like he has such long arms he just sent me a picture of a bunch of shirts he bought that actually fit. I'm thinking, that's a bit much, but ok.
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TheHaitian
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Post by TheHaitian on Apr 11, 2019 20:01:40 GMT -5
I don’t know how I will handle it when my daughter finds someone but I hope it will be better than this woman. I know it will be difficult for my wife to “share” holidays and what not but it is life.
I know my wife is not the typical Haitian girl my mom would have wanted me to marry (my wife barely speak creole - native language - and she is more American than Haitian) but my mom tries her best and love her still : she would have preferred my wife saw her as a mother (and for them to have a mother / daughter kind of relationship) but I have explained and she has accepted that my wife is not the one - very introvert and very “leave me alone”.
But my mom has continued to make efforts, shown love/affection and has back off some and I admit I have been at times frustrated that my wife has not tried harder. But my mom and MIL have a great relationship between the two of them and speak regularly to each other. Now I am mostly working on my mom having a relationship with my daughter...
I know she is saddened that she is not as close to our daughter as MIL is and in passing she has mentioned last week that if she was close to Carlie and we had asked, she would have been more than happy to take some time off, come down and spend a week with Carlie while MIL was in Haiti.
It never occurred to me to ask and I could feel the sadness in her voice. Haitian grandmothers want to spoil their grandkids and she does not get he chance to do so as often as she would want; and she was sad that Carlie did not want to be with her when she was here last.
So yeah I promised myself to drive up to NJ at least once a month and spend the day/weekend with my mom so her and Carlie can bond. And next time MIL goes out of town; I will invite my mom to come stay a couple of days with us (even if I take off but her being there with Carlie they can bond).
My wife never tried to interfere between my mother and I because I made it clear from the get go it was a none starter. I don’t care if she loves my mother but she will respect her and treat her with respect, same way I do her mom... I will not stand for anything less and would not be married to anyone that believe anything less would be acceptable. And same for my mom but she is my mom so I never doubt that she would would any woman I married with respect and love.
That is why my next move (if there is one) will probably to be closer to NY/NJ as my brother leave for college next year and my sister the year after... it will be hard for my mom to adjust to an empty nest. So her grandbaby(ies) being close by may help...
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Apr 11, 2019 20:09:47 GMT -5
I didn’t get this at all from the post. That she was the mother and mother in law from hell.
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haapai
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Post by haapai on Apr 11, 2019 20:27:33 GMT -5
FWIW, the link isn't to an article but to a transcript of an interview. There's no explanation of how heavily it has been edited or redacted.
Knowing that what appears in print is the product of an interview helps explain it's illogical and unpersuasive structure. I'm somewhat baffled as to why it wasn't more clearly labeled.
Although the above makes it sound like I am defending the interviewee, I'm not. I suspect that if I saw a less heavily edited transcript or heard the actual audio, the hair on the back of my neck would rise and I would loathe the speaker.
Most people learn how to recognize certain conversational tics and avoid trusting the persons using them. I suspect that this woman would trip my "avoid her" sense.
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Bonny
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Post by Bonny on Apr 11, 2019 20:58:48 GMT -5
Here's some Friday Eve fodder from the MSN homepage: (and it's kind of money related - the parents PAID for everything for their children (mom dedicated her life to them!) - even the trip so the son could propose to his girlfriend all that money spent and the relationship still went sour.) www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/voices/i-dedicated-my-whole-life-to-my-kids-%E2%80%94-then-my-son-abandoned-me/ar-BBRgCyk?li=BBnb7KzI think I'm a horrible awful person. I found myself cringing and silently screaming to her son "Run Away!!! Run Away!!!" almost from the moment I read the title. Many of the mom's narrations of her behavior (and her son's flight responses) made me really cringe. I'm sure much of the story is missing (as I'm not quite sure what happened that caused the Groom's mom and dad not to go to the Wedding (surely, the Bride's family declining the rehearsal dinner without a "polite" reason wasn't the reason?). I did feel some relief for the son by the end of the article, though. He escaped. And, yeah, I kind of felt relief for the mom too. She's come to terms with the new arrangement and I get that it will always be painful. I'm sure she will always wait for her son to apologize for his betrayal. I suspect she and her son will be forever 'estranged' - well, maybe on her deathbed something will change. I don't think grandkids will fix this. And I'm not sure if it's fixable with the rest of the family after she's dead. I also feel really bad for her hubby and other kids, too. Caught in the middle and having to choose sides. And it's will NEVER go away. ::sigh:: I don't think my take away from this article was the intended take away. I'm not sure what I'm suppose to take away from this article. It's like Pride and Prejudice - I need someone to explain it to me... What exactly is going on in this article? What am I suppose to take away from it? Cause I think I fell into the trap of "it's a two way road and gee, Mom, some of this is on you". Yeah. There is only one side presented there. None of that happened in a vacuum. The mom may not want to acknowledge what led to the estrangement, but there was definitely a reason, probably lots of them over a long period of time. Lots and lots of info left out. I'm guessing the son was o.k. with the question "Do you want to marry her?" given the context but I bet when he told the fiancée she took it as a personal insult/disapproval.
The first words my MIL said to me were not "Hi nice to meet you" but "Does this mean I finally get my grandchildren? You don't have to marry her".
That should have been a clue. She says stuff thinking she's funny and it can be incredibly cruel and insensitive. She finally started going to counseling a couple of years ago because she doesn't understand why people don't like her. But at 84 she's not going to change. Now that she's starting to have memory issues it's even worse.
People like the woman in the article love playing the martyr and are clueless to how their own insensitivity to others is why they have relationship problems.
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Knee Deep in Water Chloe
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Post by Knee Deep in Water Chloe on Apr 11, 2019 21:03:15 GMT -5
I didn’t get this at all from the post. That she was the mother and mother in law from hell. I found the article/post confusing. The author doesn't seem to know what happened or why her son doesn't want to talk to her anymore. Something happened right before the wedding, but heck if I know what it is.
I do understand that her relationship with her son currently has no contact. I also understood that she had decided to live her life anyway and stop being "stuck" in an emotional spot of depression? that her son stopped speaking to her.
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dannylion
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Gravity is a harsh mistress
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Location: Miles over the madness horizon and accelerating
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Post by dannylion on Apr 11, 2019 21:15:50 GMT -5
I didn’t get this at all from the post. That she was the mother and mother in law from hell. I found the article/post confusing. The author doesn't seem to know what happened or why her son doesn't want to talk to her anymore. Something happened right before the wedding, but heck if I know what it is.
I do understand that her relationship with her son currently has no contact. I also understood that she had decided to live her life anyway and stop being "stuck" in an emotional spot of depression? that her son stopped speaking to her. There is apparently more to this story that was not in the article. The Reddit link justme cited indicated there was a considerable back story that paints a different picture of the mom and her role in the estrangement. There were big gaps in the narrative in the article. No mention of what happened to make the bride's family decide not to attend the rehearsal dinner, no mention of what happened to make the son disinvite his parents to the wedding. Those things did not just happen out of the blue. Something happened, and since the mother did not explain what it was, one can be forgiven for thinking something she did or said (probably more than one something) was the reason. People who are otherwise sane and relatively normal do not disinvite their parents to their wedding for trivial reasons. If whatever happened was not caused by the mom, one would have expected her to explain what it was. Just my take on the situation based on the limited information available.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Apr 11, 2019 21:26:24 GMT -5
I didn’t get this at all from the post. That she was the mother and mother in law from hell. Well, I think it depends on the lens. The thing that threw me off, actually, was not all the wedding stuff..but this:
This is what I count on my husband for. Emotional support. Helping me adult. I've never asked my kids these things. Nor would I.
Only because I was asked to be my mom's emotional support, her closest friend, etc. when I was a child, and I realized as an adult it wasn't appropriate.
My mom is only interested in being with folks that want to be in a dysfunctional, codependent relationship with her. She's not interested in trying to be in a healthy relationship. She would rather give me the silent treatment than respect my boundaries, all the while saying I've abandoned her.
My mom also put me first, with the expectation that I would do the same. Even after I married. Even after I had kids. Really. Once when I was still in high school, I dared to tell my mom I couldn't promise her that I'd be able to quit my job, move home and take care of my parents when they were old. That was enough to cause her to stop talking to me for a while, and again worry about abandonment. Like everything else...the truth is somewhere in the middle.
I haven't abandoned my parents. I only ask that they respect my (healthy) boundaries. My mom has patently turned me down. I'm not sure what else I'm supposed to do. The other thing that bothered me was the mom inserting herself into the proposal like that. As a mom of a son, myself, I can't imagine hearing about his plans to propose, calling up DH, and then saying "here's what we decided we are going to do." I mean, that doesn't really seem the time to insert myself into a situation without being asked. And this language:
I correct my minor kids. Actually I don't even "correct" DS all that much. I find it very off-putting that the mother decided that her adult son needed parenting like a 8 year old. We have these conversations with our kids all the time. I am not "stunned" by them. My kids get the usual answer "Every family makes their own choices. There's no right or wrong. It's just what works best for families. When you are older and have your own family, you'll get to make your own decisions." The wedding mishap, I'm more inclined to not pass judgement on. We don't know if the DIL was a bridezilla or what. But the other stuff...that has nothing to do with the wife, and everything to do with the mother and the son.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Apr 11, 2019 21:34:23 GMT -5
I also wanted to say...growing up...my mom did see my moving into adulthood as abandoning her. She really did want me to be someone that she could always actively parent, like a kinder gardener. There wasn't allowances for when I might not want or need that. My parents did celebrate a few milestones/accomplishments with me.
But the underlying message from my mom was "I'm sad you are growing up. Because you will leave me." I am acutely aware that my kids will also leave me. But watching them grow up is not sad. It's exciting to see them grow and change, discover who they are. That's a gift, and one I am grateful for. I was a little sad when DS started HS. But, I'm like, dude, it's about time. It seemed so natural. I'm not sad about #2 growing up. She's always been far older than her age. I feel like now, her body is growing into the person she's always been, even from preschool. I am looking forward to seeing what they do with their lives, as much as I can. And I hoping I'm a part of it. I don't demand it. I don't expect it. I want them to be in a relationship with me because they want to, too. Not because they are afraid of me not talking to them for an undetermined length of time.
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lurkyloo
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“Time means nothing now,” said Toad. “It is just the thing that happens between snacks.”
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Post by lurkyloo on Apr 11, 2019 22:02:00 GMT -5
Here's some Friday Eve fodder from the MSN homepage:Wait....it's FRIDAY? Did I just sleep for a day and and a half? Is it wrong that this is basically my dream right now?
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haapai
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Character
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Post by haapai on Apr 11, 2019 22:43:40 GMT -5
FWIW, the link isn't to an article but to a transcript of an interview. There's no explanation of how heavily it has been edited or redacted.
Knowing that what appears in print is the product of an interview helps explain it's illogical and unpersuasive structure. I'm somewhat baffled as to why it wasn't more clearly labeled.
Although the above makes it sound like I am defending the interviewee, I'm not. I suspect that if I saw a less heavily edited transcript or heard the actual audio, the hair on the back of my neck would rise and I would loathe the speaker.
Most people learn how to recognize certain conversational tics and avoid trusting the persons using them. I suspect that this woman would trip my "avoid her" sense.
I'd like to run away from my own words.
I've been re-reading the link and the same questions keep coming up.
What the hell am I reading? Where's the context? Why should I bother reading something that has been so heavily redacted and likely self-censored from the beginning.
The link is to a dialogue that has been transformed into a monologue. All of the interviewer's questions have been omitted as well as any responses or requests for clarification. In other words, what we are reading is a response to questions and prompts that we can't hear or see.
It's also obvious upon several re-readings that the speaker is going to great pains not to identify any of the other characters in the drama. She's given her son a pseudonym but everyone else in the drama is not given a name or even much of a personality. This has the effect of making her sound narcissistic as hell, but it also does preserve some of their privacy.
I'm come to the conclusion that what I am reading has been so severely edited and deliberately shorn of context that any attempt to make sense of it is sorta dangerous.
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justme
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Post by justme on Apr 11, 2019 23:09:02 GMT -5
I found the article/post confusing. The author doesn't seem to know what happened or why her son doesn't want to talk to her anymore. Something happened right before the wedding, but heck if I know what it is.
I do understand that her relationship with her son currently has no contact. I also understood that she had decided to live her life anyway and stop being "stuck" in an emotional spot of depression? that her son stopped speaking to her. There is apparently more to this story that was not in the article. The Reddit link justme cited indicated there was a considerable back story that paints a different picture of the mom and her role in the estrangement. There were big gaps in the narrative in the article. No mention of what happened to make the bride's family decide not to attend the rehearsal dinner, no mention of what happened to make the son disinvite his parents to the wedding. Those things did not just happen out of the blue. Something happened, and since the mother did not explain what it was, one can be forgiven for thinking something she did or said (probably more than one something) was the reason. People who are otherwise sane and relatively normal do not disinvite their parents to their wedding for trivial reasons. If whatever happened was not caused by the mom, one would have expected her to explain what it was. Just my take on the situation based on the limited information available. Actually there's nothing to say son disinvited her. He told her his in laws weren't coming to the rehearsal dinner due to what she said/did at the bridal shower. And then he called to confirm she really wasn't coming. To me that means she threw a fit, likely about the rehearsal dinner, and said she wasn't coming to the wedding and he was calling to see if she was holding to that. Given her statement of crying every day until she dies to him I think that's likely.
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justme
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Post by justme on Apr 11, 2019 23:14:35 GMT -5
I also wanted to say...growing up...my mom did see my moving into adulthood as abandoning her. She really did want me to be someone that she could always actively parent, like a kinder gardener. There wasn't allowances for when I might not want or need that. My parents did celebrate a few milestones/accomplishments with me.
But the underlying message from my mom was "I'm sad you are growing up. Because you will leave me." I am acutely aware that my kids will also leave me. But watching them grow up is not sad. It's exciting to see them grow and change, discover who they are. That's a gift, and one I am grateful for. I was a little sad when DS started HS. But, I'm like, dude, it's about time. It seemed so natural. I'm not sad about #2 growing up. She's always been far older than her age. I feel like now, her body is growing into the person she's always been, even from preschool. I am looking forward to seeing what they do with their lives, as much as I can. And I hoping I'm a part of it. I don't demand it. I don't expect it. I want them to be in a relationship with me because they want to, too. Not because they are afraid of me not talking to them for an undetermined length of time.
I don't recall which if the links said it, but I liked what they said. Children can't abandon parents because they aren't supposed to take care of their parents and by definition are supposed to go off on their own. Parents can abandon children and you can likely say a spouse/partner can abandon you.
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alabamagal
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Post by alabamagal on Apr 12, 2019 6:32:35 GMT -5
This could have been written by my sons MIL! She has mental issues and is a narcissist. She posts crap like this on Facebook all the time - well she did until she banned me and my family.
Despite losing custody of her only child ( my very awesome DDIL) and having very little to do raising a child, she will post advice to other parents.
She will play martyr when people don’t talk to her due to her own actions.
She once posted that a certain date was the worst day in her life. I did some math and figured it was the day she met her first husband and soon after conceived DDIL - how does that make my DDIL feel? DDIL is so awesome that she just ignores her mother’s antics and rarely has any interaction with her.
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