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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 12:50:35 GMT -5
The recent 20 million dollar donation by alumni to our private school has started an outcry by the community over the money not being given to the struggling public school system instead. They recently had to close two more schools and are dealing with a lot of maintenance issues on the buildings they still have.
While I feel people should be able to give away their money any way they damn well please, I am wondering what the future holds for public education. Some of their points seem valid, the public school is starting to become a dumping ground for the poor and for those with learning disabilities that the private and charter schools don't have the resources for. There are 4 charter schools in our area and now it's hard to get in them. My older son was one of two wait-listed 12 years ago. These days the lists are 30-40 kids long. People sign up for the lotteries in Kindy at all of them and just hope they land a spot. Carrot only got his spot because he had a sibling in the school. Homeschooling is way up and the private school is continuing to attract more and more. It's already a beautiful campus and this new building will only draw more in I'm sure.
On the other hand, people left the public schools for a reason and I'm not sure I can get on the "everyone should go to public and make it work" bandwagon either. I get that more involved parents and more funding would be helpful in making the place better I'm not sure I want to start this movement either. But, yet I might have to with Carrot. I heard the private was already near capacity. What happens when more people apply than they can take in? Raise tuition? Increase the school/class size? Just turn people away? Just some ponderings over lunch while reading a lot of angry Facebook posts.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 11, 2019 13:30:22 GMT -5
... Just some ponderings over lunch while reading a lot of angry Facebook posts. Great ponderings! I did grad work (never got around to finishing a thesis) in Sociology of Education. That, in part, is where such ponderings happen in academia. Love the topic.
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steph08
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Post by steph08 on Apr 11, 2019 13:34:15 GMT -5
I can't answer this, as charter schools, magnet schools, and for the most part, private schools, don't exist in my area. I know one Catholic school that goes through 12th grade, but the other two I know about stop at 8th grade (or earlier).
So around here, all kids go to public school.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 11, 2019 13:39:33 GMT -5
The recent 20 million dollar donation by alumni to our private school has started an outcry by the community over the money not being given to the struggling public school system instead. They recently had to close two more schools and are dealing with a lot of maintenance issues on the buildings they still have.
While I feel people should be able to give away their money any way they damn well please, I am wondering what the future holds for public education. Some of their points seem valid, the public school is starting to become a dumping ground for the poor and for those with learning disabilities that the private and charter schools don't have the resources for. There are 4 charter schools in our area and now it's hard to get in them. My older son was one of two wait-listed 12 years ago. These days the lists are 30-40 kids long. People sign up for the lotteries in Kindy at all of them and just hope they land a spot. Carrot only got his spot because he had a sibling in the school. Homeschooling is way up and the private school is continuing to attract more and more. It's already a beautiful campus and this new building will only draw more in I'm sure.
On the other hand, people left the public schools for a reason and I'm not sure I can get on the " everyone should go to public and make it work" bandwagon either. I get that more involved parents and more funding would be helpful in making the place better I'm not sure I want to start this movement either. But, yet I might have to with Carrot. I heard the private was already near capacity. What happens when more people apply than they can take in? Raise tuition? Increase the school/class size? Just turn people away? Just some ponderings over lunch while reading a lot of angry Facebook posts.
Focusing on just this part...this seems beyond outrageously stupid. If people can afford better, it's simply dumb to "force" them to have worse because they want to make everyone suffer. Likewise I think the idea of "more involved parents" by forcing everyone into public is dumb. Schools are meant to run on their own, not by coercing parents into doing the jobs the schools should be doing. I think there are certainly reasonable arguments to make for how funding should work...but the blanket idea of just forcing people into what they think is a terrible option when they're willing to pay for better is absurd.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 13:48:17 GMT -5
The recent 20 million dollar donation by alumni to our private school has started an outcry by the community over the money not being given to the struggling public school system instead. They recently had to close two more schools and are dealing with a lot of maintenance issues on the buildings they still have.
While I feel people should be able to give away their money any way they damn well please, I am wondering what the future holds for public education. Some of their points seem valid, the public school is starting to become a dumping ground for the poor and for those with learning disabilities that the private and charter schools don't have the resources for. There are 4 charter schools in our area and now it's hard to get in them. My older son was one of two wait-listed 12 years ago. These days the lists are 30-40 kids long. People sign up for the lotteries in Kindy at all of them and just hope they land a spot. Carrot only got his spot because he had a sibling in the school. Homeschooling is way up and the private school is continuing to attract more and more. It's already a beautiful campus and this new building will only draw more in I'm sure.
On the other hand, people left the public schools for a reason and I'm not sure I can get on the " everyone should go to public and make it work" bandwagon either. I get that more involved parents and more funding would be helpful in making the place better I'm not sure I want to start this movement either. But, yet I might have to with Carrot. I heard the private was already near capacity. What happens when more people apply than they can take in? Raise tuition? Increase the school/class size? Just turn people away? Just some ponderings over lunch while reading a lot of angry Facebook posts.
Focusing on just this part...this seems beyond outrageously stupid. If people can afford better, it's simply dumb to "force" them to have worse because they want to make everyone suffer. Likewise I think the idea of "more involved parents" by forcing everyone into public is dumb. Schools are meant to run on their own, not by coercing parents into doing the jobs the schools should be doing. I think there are certainly reasonable arguments to make for how funding should work...but the blanket idea of just forcing people into what they think is a terrible option when they're willing to pay for better is absurd. By "more involved" parents. I didn't necessarily mean directly with the school. There is no denying the private school has a much better record when it comes to pretty much everything academic, test scores, percentage going on to college, number of kids in extracurriculars, etc, but it's really hard to tell how much of that is the quality of the school vs. having parents that are pushing on the other side and you're going to have a much higher percentage of parents of that type in a school where they're paying tuition.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on Apr 11, 2019 13:50:48 GMT -5
Focusing on just this part...this seems beyond outrageously stupid. If people can afford better, it's simply dumb to "force" them to have worse because they want to make everyone suffer. Likewise I think the idea of "more involved parents" by forcing everyone into public is dumb. Schools are meant to run on their own, not by coercing parents into doing the jobs the schools should be doing. I think there are certainly reasonable arguments to make for how funding should work...but the blanket idea of just forcing people into what they think is a terrible option when they're willing to pay for better is absurd. By "more involved" parents. I didn't necessarily mean directly with the school. There is no denying the private school has a much better record when it comes to pretty much everything academic, test scores, percentage going on to college, number of kids in extracurriculars, etc, but it's really hard to tell how much of that is the quality of the school vs. having parents that are pushing on the other side and you're going to have a much higher percentage of parents of that type in a school where they're paying tuition. Ok, but what does that have to do with the school itself? If it's just about the parents at home...how does that make the school in general any better? It makes their individual kids better, but if their only additional involvement is at home...doesn't really help the school. Anytime I hear that schools want "involved parents", it's nearly always about getting parents to volunteer at school events in some way, not just doing stuff at home with their kids.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 13:55:47 GMT -5
I can't answer this, as charter schools, magnet schools, and for the most part, private schools, don't exist in my area. I know one Catholic school that goes through 12th grade, but the other two I know about stop at 8th grade (or earlier). So around here, all kids go to public school. When I was growing up there was one Catholic, one Lutheran and one public school system, and the parochial schools were very small. The public was large. Now there are 4 (maybe 5 charters) in addition to this and the parochial are growing. This is a small town of only 27K people. My class size was over 400 in 1987 and they're less than half that now at the same public school. Part of it is I'm the tale end of the baby boomers babies, but also all the other schools are stealing students.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Apr 11, 2019 13:59:26 GMT -5
The recent 20 million dollar donation by alumni to our private school has started an outcry by the community over the money not being given to the struggling public school system instead. They recently had to close two more schools and are dealing with a lot of maintenance issues on the buildings they still have.
While I feel people should be able to give away their money any way they damn well please, I am wondering what the future holds for public education. Some of their points seem valid, the public school is starting to become a dumping ground for the poor and for those with learning disabilities that the private and charter schools don't have the resources for. There are 4 charter schools in our area and now it's hard to get in them. My older son was one of two wait-listed 12 years ago. These days the lists are 30-40 kids long. People sign up for the lotteries in Kindy at all of them and just hope they land a spot. Carrot only got his spot because he had a sibling in the school. Homeschooling is way up and the private school is continuing to attract more and more. It's already a beautiful campus and this new building will only draw more in I'm sure.
On the other hand, people left the public schools for a reason and I'm not sure I can get on the "everyone should go to public and make it work" bandwagon either. I get that more involved parents and more funding would be helpful in making the place better I'm not sure I want to start this movement either. But, yet I might have to with Carrot. I heard the private was already near capacity. What happens when more people apply than they can take in? Raise tuition? Increase the school/class size? Just turn people away? Just some ponderings over lunch while reading a lot of angry Facebook posts.
I think the issue of funding, and unfunded mandates, needs to be looked at. I don't know what the answers are. Getting pissed off at someone giving away millions to where they want to won't solve the issue. And you really can't have a non-emotionally charged conversation about how to handle the costs of educating special needs kids when compared the the whole, especially when there's little help for these mandates.
I think in education, period, folks don't want to pay money to maintain buildings. Or retro fit them to make them more accessible. Investing in infrastructure isn't fun. You can't tie that to teacher metrics as a way to justify it. Does your school district understand how to serve poor kids? Are they providing meals? Food and clothing pantries in the schools? Opening up a computer lab just for parents...so parents can apply for jobs? This is what it took to stabilize our neighborhood school...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 14:03:00 GMT -5
By "more involved" parents. I didn't necessarily mean directly with the school. There is no denying the private school has a much better record when it comes to pretty much everything academic, test scores, percentage going on to college, number of kids in extracurriculars, etc, but it's really hard to tell how much of that is the quality of the school vs. having parents that are pushing on the other side and you're going to have a much higher percentage of parents of that type in a school where they're paying tuition. Ok, but what does that have to do with the school itself? If it's just about the parents at home...how does that make the school in general any better? It makes their individual kids better, but if their only additional involvement is at home...doesn't really help the school. Anytime I hear that schools want "involved parents", it's nearly always about getting parents to volunteer at school events in some way, not just doing stuff at home with their kids. Exactly. My point is the public may only seem bad because all the "good" students are congregating at this other school throwing all the stats off. I don't know. I can't really test it unless I can go back in time and send my kid to both and see how he does at each.
98% of the students at the private are in extracurriculars. You can damn well be sure that it's parents pushing that. There are 300 kids in the high school and 95 of them are on the speech team! The public school is triple the size and doesn't even have a speech team anymore. When it did it was a half dozen kids at most.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Apr 11, 2019 14:03:25 GMT -5
I can't answer this, as charter schools, magnet schools, and for the most part, private schools, don't exist in my area. I know one Catholic school that goes through 12th grade, but the other two I know about stop at 8th grade (or earlier). So around here, all kids go to public school. When I was growing up there was one Catholic, one Lutheran and one public school system, and the parochial schools were very small. The public was large. Now there are 4 (maybe 5 charters) in addition to this and the parochial are growing. This is a small town of only 27K people. My class size was over 400 in 1987 and they're less than half that now at the same public school. Part of it is I'm the tale end of the baby boomers babies, but also all the other schools are stealing students. Parochial schools are not the end all and be all.
There's some pretty big limitations. Speaking from experience-there are less educational tracks for kids, there are less after school/club opportunities, less sports opportunities, less opportunities for extras like multiple foreign languages and different kinds of music.
So, what is seen as "better" about parochial schools in your area? (I know why we chose ours.)
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Apr 11, 2019 14:08:00 GMT -5
I don't think "more funding" is the answer. I say that even though I am a teacher. I agree with you up to a point. One of our bedroom communities did get a referendum passed to build a second high school. I suppose the school could have gotten creative with staggering class times for groups of kids so that level of overcrowding could be dealt with...but...the teachers' union here is too strong and would never go for that. So, it seems more funding...is a need.
We've also seen other referendums passed for things like making building up to compliance for disabilities, etc.
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Apr 11, 2019 14:09:54 GMT -5
Charter School definition per WIKI: According to the Education Commission of the States, "charter schools are semi-autonomous public schools that receive public funds. They operate under a written contract with a state, district or other entity (referred to as an authorizer or sponsor). This contract - or charter - details how the school will be organized and managed, what students will be expected to achieve, and how success will be measured. Many charters are exempt from a variety of laws and regulations affecting other public schools if they continue to meet the terms of their charters."[34]
Your city apparently has one of the first Charter Schools in the nation. Do your kids go to a Private School or is it a Charter School? If it is a Charter School, and they are essentially a State School anyways, I can see why some people are complaining about how the $$ might be spent. One would think though that with a 20 million donation they could significantly expand the operations and serve more students.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Apr 11, 2019 14:10:25 GMT -5
98% of the students at the private are in extracurriculars. You can damn well be sure that it's parents pushing that. There are 300 kids in the high school and 95 of them are on the speech team! The public school is triple the size and doesn't even have a speech team anymore. When it did it was a half dozen kids at most.
Do you know why the public school doesn't have a speech team anymore? Is it because of funding issues? Is it because the teachers who ran the team sucked? Our district has been cutting funding for music for quite some time now. It has nothing to do with parental involvement. It's purely a financial issue. ETA: I just remembered, too, why strings were cut. They used to start strings in 4th grade. Band was introduced in 5th. Many strings kids dropped strings in favor of band in 5th grade.
There's been some pretty big string teacher turnover at the most sought after middle school in the district. We're talking 3rd teacher in 5/6 years. The kids despise the newest teacher. In part, because he's always hurried/frazzled.. He splits his time between two schools, that are about a 20-25 minute drive from each other in good weather.
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gs11rmb
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Post by gs11rmb on Apr 11, 2019 14:15:48 GMT -5
This debate is also raging in Atlanta but has an awful lot to do with racial and economic segregation. We send our girls to our local (less than a mile away) Title I public school and have been very happy with the education provided. I often read on here of people paying private school tuition and worrying about their budgets but then when I find out how much it actually costs I kind of roll my eyes. My daughter's swim team meets at a private school maybe 5 miles from our house. I just checked their tuition rates: Grades 1-6: $24,650 Grades 7-12: $28,800 If you need academic support services that's an additional $10,900. minnesotapaintlady just curious - why did you send your sons to a private school?
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bean29
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Post by bean29 on Apr 11, 2019 14:20:22 GMT -5
I don't think "more funding" is the answer. I say that even though I am a teacher. I agree with you up to a point. One of our bedroom communities did get a referendum passed to build a second high school. I suppose the school could have gotten creative with staggering class times for groups of kids so that level of overcrowding could be dealt with...but...the teachers' union here is too strong and would never go for that. So, it seems more funding...is a need.
We've also seen other referendums passed for things like making building up to compliance for disabilities, etc.
We also had a city referendum fail for a rural school district, so they are probably going to dissolve the school district and have to absorb the students into surrounding school districts.
www.jsonline.com/story/communities/waukesha/news/eagle/2019/04/02/spring-election-results-voters-say-no-palmyra-eagle-referendum-district-could-dissolve/3336504002/
Absent a higher % of state funding for Rural and Urban school districts, making the #'s work might just be impossible.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 14:30:45 GMT -5
When I was growing up there was one Catholic, one Lutheran and one public school system, and the parochial schools were very small. The public was large. Now there are 4 (maybe 5 charters) in addition to this and the parochial are growing. This is a small town of only 27K people. My class size was over 400 in 1987 and they're less than half that now at the same public school. Part of it is I'm the tale end of the baby boomers babies, but also all the other schools are stealing students. Parochial schools are not the end all and be all.
There's some pretty big limitations. Speaking from experience-there are less educational tracks for kids, there are less after school/club opportunities, less sports opportunities, less opportunities for extras like multiple foreign languages and different kinds of music.
So, what is seen as "better" about parochial schools in your area? (I know why we chose ours.)
-Our parochial and charter schools collaborate with the public and they can do any of the sports/clubs that the public offers if they are not offered at their school. My son was in the Robotics club at the public school last year. We have most sports, but not swimming because no pool, also no weightlifting or wrestling. One of the advantages of being in a small school is you don't have to start training as a toddler to play high school sports because they just need people. You join, you can play. My son has zero interest in sports anyhow, so that didn't matter.
-Small classes and more of a family atmosphere.
-Dedication to the Arts. The public school has drastically cut all music, theater and art classes, but the Catholic school just keeps expanding them. They have an amazing band program.
-I don't know how the Lutheran school works, but the Catholic, has only one track and that's the college prep track. All kids are on that. It's "better" for us, because that's what we wanted him on and this way all his peers were the same and he wasn't being tempted to take classes in hamster care or gardening.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 14:33:40 GMT -5
Charter School definition per WIKI: According to the Education Commission of the States, "charter schools are semi-autonomous public schools that receive public funds. They operate under a written contract with a state, district or other entity (referred to as an authorizer or sponsor). This contract - or charter - details how the school will be organized and managed, what students will be expected to achieve, and how success will be measured. Many charters are exempt from a variety of laws and regulations affecting other public schools if they continue to meet the terms of their charters."[34]
Your city apparently has one of the first Charter Schools in the nation. Do your kids go to a Private School or is it a Charter School? If it is a Charter School, and they are essentially a State School anyways, I can see why some people are complaining about how the $$ might be spent. One would think though that with a 20 million donation they could significantly expand the operations and serve more students.
. Younger is in a charter (first in the US), older in a private parochial. The private is the one that got the donation.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 14:40:40 GMT -5
This debate is also raging in Atlanta but has an awful lot to do with racial and economic segregation. We send our girls to our local (less than a mile away) Title I public school and have been very happy with the education provided. I often read on here of people paying private school tuition and worrying about their budgets but then when I find out how much it actually costs I kind of roll my eyes. My daughter's swim team meets at private school maybe 5 miles from our house. I just checked their tuition rates: Grades 1-6: $24,650 Grades 7-12: $28,800 If you need additional academic support services that's an additional $10,900. minnesotapaintlady just curious - why did you send your sons to a private school? I kind of answered that in the post to gira. It basically just felt like a better fit for us. Also, I had given DS the option of either or. He shadowed at both schools and chose the private.
But yeah... Grades 1-6: $1600/year Grades 7-8: $2,000/year Grades 9-12 $3000/year And all kids that graduate from the high school are guaranteed a 4 year scholarship to college of $1000-$3000/year depending on their GPA/ACT and participation in extracurriculars.
These rates are so low because that same benefactor has a fund set up that is paying half of all student's tuition. Plus, there is a lot of scholarship money out there for those that can't afford the already low tuition, especially if you're actually a Catholic and a member of a parish. That's why I don't quite understand all the complaining. This guy is trying to make a good education affordable to all. If I had 20 million to donate I would not give it to the public school either. It would just be sucked up like a black hole.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 14:46:30 GMT -5
I agree with you up to a point. One of our bedroom communities did get a referendum passed to build a second high school. I suppose the school could have gotten creative with staggering class times for groups of kids so that level of overcrowding could be dealt with...but...the teachers' union here is too strong and would never go for that. So, it seems more funding...is a need.
We've also seen other referendums passed for things like making building up to compliance for disabilities, etc.
We also had a city referendum fail for a rural school district, so they are probably going to dissolve the school district and have to absorb the students into surrounding school districts.
www.jsonline.com/story/communities/waukesha/news/eagle/2019/04/02/spring-election-results-voters-say-no-palmyra-eagle-referendum-district-could-dissolve/3336504002/
Absent a higher % of state funding for Rural and Urban school districts, making the #'s work might just be impossible.
This is what happened here last year. A rural school with only something like 50 kids was shut down and it was this huge travesty. I thought it was stupid they kept those buildings open as long as they did rather than just bus them the 8 miles into town.
Of course the town where the school was closed is devastated to have lost their school and most said they were pulling from the district and enrolling in private or charter...but 50 kids in this school designed for hundreds. It did not make sense to keep it open.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 14:48:42 GMT -5
98% of the students at the private are in extracurriculars. You can damn well be sure that it's parents pushing that. There are 300 kids in the high school and 95 of them are on the speech team! The public school is triple the size and doesn't even have a speech team anymore. When it did it was a half dozen kids at most.
Do you know why the public school doesn't have a speech team anymore?
Is it because of funding issues? Is it because the teachers who ran the team sucked? Our district has been cutting funding for music for quite some time now. It has nothing to do with parental involvement. It's purely a financial issue. ETA: I just remembered, too, why strings were cut. They used to start strings in 4th grade. Band was introduced in 5th. Many strings kids dropped strings in favor of band in 5th grade.
There's been some pretty big string teacher turnover at the most sought after middle school in the district. We're talking 3rd teacher in 5/6 years. The kids despise the newest teacher. In part, because he's always hurried/frazzled.. He splits his time between two schools, that are about a 20-25 minute drive from each other in good weather.
I honestly have no idea. I just realized it last year when DS was competing and the school never showed up on the rosters for any of the meets so I asked DS and he said it had disbanded years ago.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Apr 11, 2019 14:57:46 GMT -5
Similarly, if someone were to donate $20M what is to guarantee me that those funds will not be taken from next year's education budget since the schools received that unexpected cash this year and there are other things on the list that we (the legislators) would like/need to address?
Maybe I am too cynical but if they truly value education they would fund it, yet in many (most?) places they don't.
ETA I have no clue how the first part of my comments ended up in a quote box
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Apr 11, 2019 15:16:44 GMT -5
I live in a small city that has for decades had a large percentage of school aged kids in private schools. I live in the South and a lot of this is due to parents putting their kids in private schools to avoid sending them to schools with blacks (although by now, all the private schools are integrated). There are three very expensive (40 K per year +) private schools, then about 4 religious/less expensive private schools. Even though we don't have many Catholics living in the city, we have a big Catholic private school.
The problem with so many kids (especially upper middle and wealthy kids) going to private schools is it's hard to get the political will required to provide additional funding for the public school system. Ours has a few fairly good public schools, and several that are very underfunded. One of the wealthy guys in town commented that, since we have a tourism economy, having under educated kids graduating from public schools is actually a good thing, since we have a need for low wage hotel cleaning ladies, restaurant workers, etc.
Maybe 15 years ago there was a public feud because one of the wealthy communities raised their own money to build a public school for just students from their mountain community. Opponents argued that, since it was a public school, some public students from other, lower income areas should be able to go. The mountain community insisted they wanted a very small school only for their own students. That's eventually what they got.
It's a complicated problem. I don't know the answer.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Apr 11, 2019 15:26:54 GMT -5
I don't know the answers either, but one of the problems I have with private schools are that the kids with disabilities are sent to the public schools so the public schools absorb the entire cost of educating that child. I believe kids with disabilities who don't graduate can stay in school until age 21.
Here, the public schools are responsible for getting the private/parochial students to school by bus, with no reimbursement other than the regular bus fee. The private schools complain a lot when the schedules don't mesh.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 15:32:57 GMT -5
All our schools use the same bus system. I have no idea what kind of money exchanges hands for that, but I do know at our private high school pretty much nobody rides the bus. I'm sure it's a different story with the younger grades. DS rode it one day and was dropped off after his first hour period started after being on the bus for an hour for going 15 miles. Now he just rides with me. He'd rather get there an hour and a half early than 15 minutes late.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 15:42:13 GMT -5
These rates are so low because that same benefactor has a fund set up that is paying half of all student's tuition. Plus, there is a lot of scholarship money out there for those that can't afford the already low tuition, especially if you're actually a Catholic and a member of a parish. That's why I don't quite understand all the complaining. This guy is trying to make a good education affordable to all. If I had 20 million to donate I would not give it to the public school either. It would just be sucked up like a black hole. And that was my thought- a good deal of that $20 million will probably help make an education at this school available for kids who otherwise would have no options but the public schools. My son was one of the "misfits" who fell through the cracks in the public schools, as I've noted in previous posts. I had to ante up the cost of a new SUV for 4 years at NY Military Academy and it was worth every penny. I'm sure that paying the sticker price meant I was subsidizing some of the scholarship kids and I was happy to do it. The local public school system wasted all over the place- a business manager embezzled over $1 million and they didn't even know till the FBI showed up and confiscated all their computers. They built a new "state of the art darkroom" for the photography classes just before digital took over. One student told me they didn't use all the fancy stuff in the Language Lab because their teacher didnt' know how to use it. The HS restrooms were perpetually out of toilet paper. I donated plenty to NY Military Academy because I knew they were more careful with my money.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Apr 11, 2019 15:42:29 GMT -5
I live in the largest school district in the state by area (not by number of students). It's largely rural and hilly. This school district gets kids to school on time. Yes, the high school kids drive their own cars, which is a different issue and also about money. Poor kids don't have that option.
My sister's farm is on the school district line. From kindergarten on, they were the first kids on the bus and the last ones off the bus. There were many days when her elementary school students had to be woken by the bus driver to be dropped off. I know sister loved the school bus drivers, but that's another area where the public schools are having great difficulty finding bus drivers and the parochial schools don't have to think about it.
Now that I think about it, I think the public school is reimbursed by the state, not families of kids riding the bus. The complaint every year during the legislature is that because of the area covered, the state reimbursement for the bus riding doesn't start to cover the cost.
This district has several elementary schools, one middle school and one high school. Back when my niece and nephews were in school, the Catholic school in the town where my dad lives did not want a public school. There was a kindergarten because the Catholic school didn't offer kindergarten. Then it was being on the bus to a different town for school, not even in the town closest to where you live.
Several parents that sent kids to the Catholic school were on the public school board and wouldn't even let the issue go to a vote. Finally got the make up of the school board changed and the building of a public elementary school in the largest town in the district passed on the first bond issue.
It's getting an addition, starting this summer. The public elementary school in that town was very much needed.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 11, 2019 15:57:44 GMT -5
... Schools are meant to run on their own, not by coercing parents into doing the jobs the schools should be doing. ... Public schools were originally "meant to run on their own" because they were educating the children of immigrants and the elite that was running them wanted to get kids away from their ignorant, illiterate non-English speaking parents. Along the line, it was decided that parents could be involved (at least those parents who were economically successful enough to take the time to so). Modern day, parental involvement is an interesting issue.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Apr 11, 2019 16:36:22 GMT -5
This is what happened here last year. A rural school with only something like 50 kids was shut down and it was this huge travesty. I thought it was stupid they kept those buildings open as long as they did rather than just bus them the 8 miles into town.
Of course the town where the school was closed is devastated to have lost their school and most said they were pulling from the district and enrolling in private or charter...but 50 kids in this school designed for hundreds. It did not make sense to keep it open.
I was on a committee to look at building closure issues. We had one guy tell us that his wife teared up when the four foot along the ground facade on her old rural elementary school was changed (due to deterioration). Of course this hundred year old school had next to zero electrical system so it was extension cord hell for computers. The lunch room in the basement had the kitchen by the only exit door and the window exits were those high small type windows. And the community had no fire fighters as if it mattered because there was not pressurized water system to access. But we were damned when we recommended shutting it down, which they finally did a few years later.
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TheHaitian
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Post by TheHaitian on Apr 11, 2019 17:02:24 GMT -5
I live in DC and starting next year will have to decide if I want to go to the trouble of the charter schools or go private (we are talking middle class private ~15k/year).
Being in DC we do have private schools at 30-40k/year but my wife made a good argument about not wanting our daughter to be the “financial aid” kid or going to school with other kids whose parents gross income is 10 times ours (that was her childhood through high school, she always felt like the poor one among the rich and does not want that for our daughter.
We have 2 charters that we like and we look at the lottery results this year and they each had wait list in the hundreds... not 40-50... we are talking hundreds. Off course I keep on hearing how things move fast between September - October, and some parents do the lottery every year so by the time their kid is in first grade they have been to 3 different schools (too me that is too much work).
We did our research and decided since all the Elementary school charters seems descent, instead of paying for private we will fund the 529 as if we were paying private at ~8k/year starting next year ... the when she approach middle school/high school re-evaluate.
We would really need to be seriously unhappy with the charter school to move by the time she enters kindergarten (selling my home will cost me 1.45% in DC fees) and moving to the suburbs.
Why we are considering charter (or private) vs public? Because DC public school sucks and I am not willing to experiment with my child education. Yes selfish, yes I know, yes I am willing to cut my expenses to the bare bones to send her to the right private school and that include retirement. Yes my wife and I are from the old school of thought that nothing is more important than providing your child with the right education even your own retirement.
Why? Because we are black (strike 1), she is female (strike 2) so we will do anything in our power and within our power to even out the playing field or give her as much of a head start in this life as possible; the same way our parents did the best they could to give us a head start and their parents before them... and we will raise our daughter to understand she owes it to her children the same commitment.
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TheHaitian
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Post by TheHaitian on Apr 11, 2019 17:14:37 GMT -5
Now in regards to public funding one issue we had with public schools when we were in MA.. we lived in a nice upper middle class neighborhood then. The parents wanted an aide added to the class, salary 30k/year. The PTA backed it up and raised that money; guess what the school did ? Since the PTA raised 30k, they slashed the funding by 30k. Money for the aide gone just like that. So the PTA and angry parents the following year had to brainstorm and find a loophole around it; if I remember correctly find a legal way to bypass the school and for them not to be obligated to report the money/give the money to the school and pay that person directly. Why? Why go through so much headache when the parents were the ones year after year going through the trouble to raise that money? And that was the issue with everything... need new instrument for music program? Raise 10k... school slash funding to music department by 10k. WTF!!! Everything turned into a huge political fight between the school board/ admin/dean and PTA. Also when I think parent involvement I think about programs like this one in a neighborhood not too far from my house that another parent thought I might be interest in: petworthcoop.com/about/My wife cousin 3 boys go to Catholic school where the parents are also expected to volunteer/be involved and there is no way around it. And my wife and I agree that people that pay for their kids education are more likely to be involved in that education because they want to get their money worth out of it. Does everyone do it? Probably not... but I am pretty sure that “Suzanne” and “Martha” on the PTA board will keep the teachers on their toes because they are reliving their glory days from their past as executives. Parents may complain about them, but we love us some “Suzanne” and “Martha”’s on the PTA , relentless, overbearing and over-involved. We don’t appreciate them enough!
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