Why Do You Want Trump To Show His Tax Returns?

[happyhoix]

Apr 8, 2019 13:35:11 GMT -5 kadee79 said:

#2
#4
#6...because I'm nosy too.  And I'll bet most of us can understand the basics of his returns...we aren't as dumb as he is.  I've done our taxes myself for years...when we had businesses and when we didn't.  Most questions can be answered some place in the IRS web site...you just have to keep searching until you find what you need.

Yep. Most of us don't pronounce 'origins' as 'oranges.'  

Multiple times in a  row, so we can be sure it wasn't just a momentary flap of the lip.

[phil5185]

""same question I asked phil: do you want him to show his tax returns?""

I'm good either way.  I would expect that he pays very low taxes, if any, as he accumulates and depreciates assets (golf courses). And that will set off a bunch of whining that the rich don't pay enough. Followed by endless debates about changing the tax code.

It is his right to share publicly, or keep it private - his choice.  Nixon was the first to share - and that was because someone leaked his Returns to the Press.

[PK Bucko]

I have no interest in him showing or not showing his returns. The issue to me is meh.

Any resources spent trying to force the issue is time and money that could be better used elsewhere. 

[happyhoix]

Apr 8, 2019 14:00:55 GMT -5 phil5185 said:

""same question I asked phil: do you want him to show his tax returns?""

I'm good either way.  I would expect that he pays very low taxes, if any, as he accumulates and depreciates assets (golf courses). And that will set off a bunch of whining that the rich don't pay enough. Followed by endless debates about changing the tax code.

It is his right to share publicly, or keep it private - his choice.  Nixon was the first to share - and that was because someone leaked his Returns to the Press.

I agree with you.

However, my problem is that he originally promised to reveal his tax returns when he got elected, when he was on the campaign trail. Then, he said as soon as they weren't being audited, he would release them. Now, his lawyers claim they will never see the light of day.

He should have said from the start that he wouldn't release his taxes. There is no obligation to do it. I doubt anyone who voted for him would have changed their mind and refused to vote for him if he had said that.  And now, there wouldn't be all this hubbub about him refusing to release his taxes, because he would have made it clear, from day 1, that he wouldn't.

When he does shit like this, and it does it all the time (refer back to 'I won't golf when I'm POTUS, I'll be too busy', 'cheap and fabulous health care' and 'tax break for the middle class') he erodes what little faith most of us had in him to begin with.

He shouldn't promise things he has no intention of doing - it's not like he would gladly release his tax records but the evil dems are preventing him from doing it. He never intended to release them. He's a liar. And I have a problem with that.

[grumpyhermit]

#3 - because everyone other major candidate has, and transparency is important.

While I won't delude myself into believing the presidency is anything more than a cult of personality at this point, I don't know how the American people are supposed to vet a candidate without access to actual information. We are electing a person to the highest office in the land with no official screening process. Hell, my employer probably did more of a background screening on me than is done for President.

If you don't disclose your financial ties and business dealings, how are we to know when there is a conflict, or potential conflict of interest?

That said, I think that ship has probably already sailed.I suspect Democrats will still release their taxes as a form of virtue signaling, but I doubt that will matter to anyone outside the party.

I just want Republicans to remember this the next time they howl about the transparency (or lack thereof) of a Democratic candidate. Sorry, if you don't care when it's your guy, you can shut the fuck up about it when it's someone from the other side.

[djAdvocate]

Apr 8, 2019 14:00:55 GMT -5 phil5185 said:

""same question I asked phil: do you want him to show his tax returns?""

I'm good either way.  I would expect that he pays very low taxes, if any, as he accumulates and depreciates assets (golf courses). And that will set off a bunch of whining that the rich don't pay enough. Followed by endless debates about changing the tax code.

It is his right to share publicly, or keep it private - his choice.  Nixon was the first to share - and that was because someone leaked his Returns to the Press.

ok. so then you are #6. thanks.

[djAdvocate]

Apr 8, 2019 14:08:26 GMT -5 PK Bucko said:

I have no interest in him showing or not showing his returns. The issue to me is meh.

Any resources spent trying to force the issue is time and money that could be better used elsewhere. 

if it wasn't clear, this thread is for people who actually do care.

I didn't say "IF" in the OP, I asked WHY you care.  you don't care.  got it.  but this thread is not for you.

[djAdvocate]

Apr 8, 2019 14:23:44 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

#6 - because everyone other major candidate has, and transparency is important.

While I won't delude myself into believing the presidency is anything more than a cult of personality at this point, I don't know how the American people are supposed to vet a candidate without access to actual information. We are electing a person to the highest office in the land with no official screening process. Hell, my employer probably did more of a background screening on me than is done for President.

If you don't disclose your financial ties and business dealings, how are we to know when there is a conflict, or potential conflict of interest?

That said, I think that ship has probably already sailed.I suspect Democrats will still release their taxes as a form of virtue signaling, but I doubt that will matter to anyone outside the party.

I just want Republicans to remember this the next time they howl about the transparency (or lack thereof) of a Democratic candidate. Sorry, if you don't care when it's your guy, you can shut the fuck up about it when it's someone from the other side.

that is actually #3.

thanks for your response.

[grumpyhermit]

Apr 8, 2019 14:48:41 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Apr 8, 2019 14:23:44 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

#3 - because everyone other major candidate has, and transparency is important.

While I won't delude myself into believing the presidency is anything more than a cult of personality at this point, I don't know how the American people are supposed to vet a candidate without access to actual information. We are electing a person to the highest office in the land with no official screening process. Hell, my employer probably did more of a background screening on me than is done for President.

If you don't disclose your financial ties and business dealings, how are we to know when there is a conflict, or potential conflict of interest?

That said, I think that ship has probably already sailed.I suspect Democrats will still release their taxes as a form of virtue signaling, but I doubt that will matter to anyone outside the party.

I just want Republicans to remember this the next time they howl about the transparency (or lack thereof) of a Democratic candidate. Sorry, if you don't care when it's your guy, you can shut the fuck up about it when it's someone from the other side.

that is actually #3.

thanks for your response.

Whoops. I managed to skim right over that.

[NastyWoman]

#6: I would like to see them (multiple years) because I would like to see a baseline to judge whether, and how much, he has used the presidency to enrich himself WHILE IN OFFICE!

And while I hate dealing with taxes I am also quite certain that I would be able to get a pretty good idea from looking at them → one of my degrees is in accounting and I have taken several classes on the subject.

[djAdvocate]

so far we have:

#1 = 2
#2 = 11
#3 = 7
#4 = 10
#5 = 3
#6 = 6

so, it is 2, 4, 3, 6. kadee79 is a good reflection of the consensus.

edit: NOTE: my whole reason to post this was to show that we were not fixated on tax fraud.

i think this result (so far) demonstrates that nicely.

[countrygirl2]

All the above but I don't think they will ever release enough to draw any conclusions.  If done correctly I'm sure they are very complicated.  But there are people that can sift through them. I believe he has committed insurance fraud and this might help them in that claim.

[Lizard Queen]

2,3 and 6) because he said he would. I expect people to keep their word.

[laterbloomer]

All of the above. My #6 is mainly to pissy him off now. There is something there he doesn't want everyone to know. I suspect it's that he is not that wealthy. I'd love to see him embarrassed.

[countrygirl2]

You know what, I don't think he can be embarrassed, he lives in his own reality.

[laterbloomer]

Apr 9, 2019 19:38:08 GMT -5 countrygirl2 said:

You know what, I don't think he can be embarrassed, he lives in his own reality.

I think he can. I think knowing that Oprah has more money than him AND she had no leg up from a rich Daddy embarrasses him. I think having people call him a wannabe embarrasses him. I think being a one term President will kill him. Especially if Obama makes cracks about it. I think it's the stupid stuff that embarrasses him.

[weltschmerz]

Apr 9, 2019 21:08:39 GMT -5 laterbloomer said:

Apr 9, 2019 19:38:08 GMT -5 countrygirl2 said:

You know what, I don't think he can be embarrassed, he lives in his own reality.

I think he can. I think knowing that Oprah has more money than him AND she had no leg up from a rich Daddy embarrasses him. I think having people call him a wannabe embarrasses him. I think being a one term President will kill him. Especially if Obama makes cracks about it. I think it's the stupid stuff that embarrasses him.

I don't think embarrassment is in his wheelhouse.
Things piss him off, but narcissists don't embarrass easily, if ever.

[tallguy]

He is tremendously petty and vindictive.  He tried to buy his way into the NFL many years ago.  They wouldn't have him.  He invested in the USFL to try and force a merger and get into the NFL that way.  The only thing he succeeded in doing was destroying the league.  Killed a lot of jobs for players, cost many, many millions of dollars for his fellow owners, and a lot of enjoyment for fans.  All because of his ego and his pettiness. 

Worse for him, he forced the lawsuit against the NFL for antitrust violations.  Everything was going well, until Trump got on the stand.  He was so unhinged, so untruthful, and so unlikable that he pretty much single-handedly turned the jury against the USFL.  The final result was that the jury found for the USFL, that the NFL had in fact been guilty of antitrust violations, but the jury award was for $1.  One...dollar.  Trump's ruining of both the league and the trial was complete.  One...dollar.  Three because damages are trebled in antitrust cases.  Biggest...idiot...in...history.     

[djAdvocate]

Apr 9, 2019 23:05:35 GMT -5 tallguy said:

He is tremendously petty and vindictive.  He tried to buy his way into the NFL many years ago.  They wouldn't have him.  He invested in the USFL to try and force a merger and get into the NFL that way.  The only thing he succeeded in doing was destroying the league.  Killed a lot of jobs for players, cost many, many millions of dollars for his fellow owners, and a lot of enjoyment for fans.  All because of his ego and his pettiness. 

Worse for him, he forced the lawsuit against the NFL for antitrust violations.  Everything was going well, until Trump got on the stand.  He was so unhinged, so untruthful, and so unlikable that he pretty much single-handedly turned the jury against the USFL.  The final result was that the jury found for the USFL, that the NFL had in fact been guilty of antitrust violations, but the jury award was for $1.  One...dollar.  Trump's ruining of both the league and the trial was complete.  One...dollar.  Three because damages are trebled in antitrust cases.  Biggest...idiot...in...history.     

90% of what he does is out of spite.

is there a worse way to live than that?

I am having trouble thinking of one.

[happyhoix]

Apr 9, 2019 23:05:35 GMT -5 tallguy said:

He is tremendously petty and vindictive.  He tried to buy his way into the NFL many years ago.  They wouldn't have him.  He invested in the USFL to try and force a merger and get into the NFL that way.  The only thing he succeeded in doing was destroying the league.  Killed a lot of jobs for players, cost many, many millions of dollars for his fellow owners, and a lot of enjoyment for fans.  All because of his ego and his pettiness. 

Worse for him, he forced the lawsuit against the NFL for antitrust violations.  Everything was going well, until Trump got on the stand.  He was so unhinged, so untruthful, and so unlikable that he pretty much single-handedly turned the jury against the USFL.  The final result was that the jury found for the USFL, that the NFL had in fact been guilty of antitrust violations, but the jury award was for $1.  One...dollar.  Trump's ruining of both the league and the trial was complete.  One...dollar.  Three because damages are trebled in antitrust cases.  Biggest...idiot...in...history.     

And now, years later, he makes a big deal of NFL players being patriotic towards the anthem and flag.

He claims it's because it's unpatriotic, but Trump stirring up that shit caused the NFL to lose a lot of money. A coincidence? Not likely. Trump always has to figure out how to fuck his opponents over, even decades later.

Especially shitty because the whole reason the players did it was to protest violence against black men and had nothing to do with patriotism, until Trump jumped on that band wagon and beat it to death.

[tallguy]

Apr 10, 2019 7:26:09 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Apr 9, 2019 23:05:35 GMT -5 tallguy said:

He is tremendously petty and vindictive.  He tried to buy his way into the NFL many years ago.  They wouldn't have him.  He invested in the USFL to try and force a merger and get into the NFL that way.  The only thing he succeeded in doing was destroying the league.  Killed a lot of jobs for players, cost many, many millions of dollars for his fellow owners, and a lot of enjoyment for fans.  All because of his ego and his pettiness. 

Worse for him, he forced the lawsuit against the NFL for antitrust violations.  Everything was going well, until Trump got on the stand.  He was so unhinged, so untruthful, and so unlikable that he pretty much single-handedly turned the jury against the USFL.  The final result was that the jury found for the USFL, that the NFL had in fact been guilty of antitrust violations, but the jury award was for $1.  One...dollar.  Trump's ruining of both the league and the trial was complete.  One...dollar.  Three because damages are trebled in antitrust cases.  Biggest...idiot...in...history.     

And now, years later, he makes a big deal of NFL players being patriotic towards the anthem and flag.

He claims it's because it's unpatriotic, but Trump stirring up that shit caused the NFL to lose a lot of money. A coincidence? Not likely. Trump always has to figure out how to fuck his opponents over, even decades later.

Especially shitty because the whole reason the players did it was to protest violence against black men and had nothing to do with patriotism, until Trump jumped on that band wagon and beat it to death.

Would have been pretty much a non-issue except for him bleating about it and his supporters being too damn stupid to realize they were being played.  Before Trump got involved there were something like six players involved.  The week after he opened his mouth there were more than 200, including some full teams.  Biggest...idiot...in...history.  Well, except for the people who support him, apparently.

[tallguy]

Oh, and by the way, #2, 3, 4, and 5, but mostly #4. The American public absolutely does have a right to know if the president is compromised by ties to foreign countries, and particularly by ties to our adversaries.  And it would be nice to have the scope of his lies made public, so that even his mindless supporters have to take notice.  If that causes him embarassment, so much the better. 

[djAdvocate]

Apr 10, 2019 7:26:09 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Apr 9, 2019 23:05:35 GMT -5 tallguy said:

He is tremendously petty and vindictive.  He tried to buy his way into the NFL many years ago.  They wouldn't have him.  He invested in the USFL to try and force a merger and get into the NFL that way.  The only thing he succeeded in doing was destroying the league.  Killed a lot of jobs for players, cost many, many millions of dollars for his fellow owners, and a lot of enjoyment for fans.  All because of his ego and his pettiness. 

Worse for him, he forced the lawsuit against the NFL for antitrust violations.  Everything was going well, until Trump got on the stand.  He was so unhinged, so untruthful, and so unlikable that he pretty much single-handedly turned the jury against the USFL.  The final result was that the jury found for the USFL, that the NFL had in fact been guilty of antitrust violations, but the jury award was for $1.  One...dollar.  Trump's ruining of both the league and the trial was complete.  One...dollar.  Three because damages are trebled in antitrust cases.  Biggest...idiot...in...history.     

And now, years later, he makes a big deal of NFL players being patriotic towards the anthem and flag.

He claims it's because it's unpatriotic, but Trump stirring up that shit caused the NFL to lose a lot of money. A coincidence? Not likely. Trump always has to figure out how to fuck his opponents over, even decades later.

Especially shitty because the whole reason the players did it was to protest violence against black men and had nothing to do with patriotism, until Trump jumped on that band wagon and beat it to death.

actually, associating violence against black people with patriotism is pretty much what he does. 

it is just a more scabby and obvious demonstration of his core belief than most.

[countrygirl2]

We are having comparisons of he and Hitler coming up on my facebook.  I agree with what is being said about the similarities.

And think about it without pre existing condition coverage and dropping insurance for millions, it will be like their getting rid of the disabled, elderly, and people they didn't like. It will just be done in a slightly different manner. I think by the time we wake up to what is happening, it may be to late. It's like homeland security. We are supposed to have agencies that are a buffer and able to function. We are not meant to be a one man government as is happening more and more. I hope we have no serious incident as everything is in disarray right now.


Do you think he will really leave if he is not re elected?  Steve Miller reminds me of the Nazi types, he even looks like one, scary dude.

[weltschmerz]

Why Do You Want Trump To Show His Tax Returns?

For the same reason Trump was losing what little mind he has, about Obama showing his real birth certificate.

[weltschmerz]

In 2010, at the urging of Donald Trump's lawyer Michael Cohen, the National Enquirer began promoting a potential Trump presidential campaign, and with Cohen's involvement, the tabloid began questioning Obama's birthplace and citizenship.[131]



In March 2011, during an interview on Good Morning America, Donald Trump said he was seriously considering running for president, that he was a "little" skeptical of Obama's citizenship, and that someone who shares this view should not be so quickly dismissed as an "idiot"[132] (as Trump considers the term "birther" to be "derogatory"[133]). Trump added, "Growing up no one knew him",[132] a claim ranked Pants-on-Fire by Politifact.[134] Later, Trump appeared on The View repeating several times that "I want him [Obama] to show his birth certificate." He speculated that "there [was] something on that birth certificate that [Obama] doesn't like"


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama_citizenship_conspiracy_theories#Donald_Trump

...and by the same token, there's something in Trump's tax returns that the bloated ignoramus doesn't like.

[happyhoix]

Well, Trump got his lap dog Mnunchin to sit on his tax returns - the IRS says they won't 'immediately' release them.  So now there will be a long legal battle.

www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/treasury-dept-declines-house-request-for-trumps-tax-returns/ar-BBVOOou

NY may do an end run around that, though - they're working on passing a law that allows legislators to see state tax filings for political figures, if there is a good reason to see them. Since Trump lives in NY and his business is located there, his state taxes should be very similar to the federal ones.

I think Trump is making a big mistake with this - I'm betting there isn't much that will be revealed in his taxes except that he claims to be a lot wealthier than his tax filings will indicate. Something a lot of other people do, and certainly not something his loyal 40% would care about. By digging in his heels and making this into a big stink, however, it's making it into a bigger deal than it would be if he just released them and let them drop to the bottom of the news cycle.

[djAdvocate]

what he is demonstrating is that he is a certified liar and obstructionist.

of course, we all know that. even Mueller.

[Value Buy]

Apr 11, 2019 8:46:10 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

what he is demonstrating is that he is a certified liar and obstructionist.

of course, we all know that. even Mueller.

Has anyone considered the fact Trump knows the MAJORITY OF AMERICANS dislike and distrust the IRS.
Could he be using this as a ruse to drum up support for him?
Since the Justice system failed in their coup attempt against him, the democrats think they can still bring this guy down via tax statements. Ain't happening.
By pushing this agenda that will also fail, they are pushing him closer to re-election in 2020.

[djAdvocate]

Apr 11, 2019 10:31:27 GMT -5 Value Buy said:

Apr 11, 2019 8:46:10 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

what he is demonstrating is that he is a certified liar and obstructionist.

of course, we all know that. even Mueller.

Has anyone considered the fact Trump knows the MAJORITY OF AMERICANS dislike and distrust the IRS.

because they refuse to hand over his taxes?