Exam cheating, parents paying 6.5m for elite college admiss

[oped]

I think its a little better today? Or maybe just depends on the individual.  The schools run some joint transportation and security things. Son went to the Penn Museum to look at something?  Anyway.  They say Penn = Status, but Drexel = Jobs... but then i guess that's what second string would say, huh 

[ken a.k.a OMK]

Old Drexel story. We were taking Fortran IV computer class. Punching our program on to IBM cards on classic model 28 teletype machines. They got wrapped up and sent electronically to Penn overnight to run on their IBM 360. Guess we were too poor to have one. 

[Cookies Galore]

Mar 13, 2019 14:04:22 GMT -5 oped said:

I think its a little better today? Or maybe just depends on the individual.  The schools run some joint transportation and security things. Son went to the Penn Museum to look at something?  Anyway.  They say Penn = Status, but Drexel = Jobs... but then i guess that's what second string would say, huh 

I love the Penn Museum! One of my favorites!
Both are great schools but I think Penn has the food truck/restaurant advantage. At least that's what I care about!

[Tennesseer]

I imagine Lori Loughlin is now beating her head against a wall remembering her daughter' s comments.

Lori Loughlin's daughter said she doesn't 'really care about school,' only interested in 'game days' and 'partying'

Lori Loughlin’s daughter entered college with a degree of indifference, despite the extra strings her parents allegedly pulled to get her there.

“The Full House Star’s” daughter, who goes by Olivia Jade on her YouTube channel, shrugged off her upcoming college education during a question and answer video shared to her page back in August 2018.

In the clip she discussed how she would be required to jet off to Fiji during her first week of classes and then later to New York for engagements to build her social media career. The 19-year-old influencer admitted that it would be a challenge to balance both her online life and her college studies, but was very clear on where her priorities fall.

“I don’t know how much of school I’m going to attend, but I’m going to go in and talk to my deans and everyone and hope that I can try to balance it all,” she told her viewers. “But I do want the experience of game days, paryting — I don’t really care about school, as you guys all know."

Complete article here. Lori Loughlin's daughter said she doesn't 'really care about school,' only interested in 'game days' and 'partying'

[gs11rmb]

Does anyone know if the students will be removed from their schools?  I don't think that's actually fair as I doubt very few of these kids knew what was happening behind the scenes.  This has got to be humiliating but, as long as they are making the required grades, I think they should be allowed to stay.

[haapai]

Mar 14, 2019 8:13:30 GMT -5 gs11rmb said:

Does anyone know if the students will be removed from their schools?  I don't think that's actually fair as I doubt very few of these kids knew what was happening behind the scenes.  This has got to be humiliating but, as long as they are making the required grades, I think they should be allowed to stay.

There was a flurry of frankly boring press releases and statements from universities last night.  They appear to be handling the cases individually, attempting to gauge the amount of deceit practiced by the student and remaining cognizant that many of the students were minors at the time. 

ETA:  Here's a synopsis of school responses from BI

[trippypea]

You would think there will have to be more people who get charged in this. Take the SAT part, where they are having someone else take the test for their kid. In order to do it, they had to get special accommodations from the College Board. You don't just ask and get them, you have to apply months in advance and have a documented disability to back it up. For example, my daughter is deaf, so we had to provide an audiogram and info from the audiologist to prove she was deaf.

So what disability did these students use? What doctor signed off on it knowing the student didn't have said disability? And because the student wouldn't have an IEP at school (since they do not really have a disability), that should trigger a documentation review from College Board, since there was no previous need for extended test time. Why didn't that happen? In addition, when SAT accommodations are approved the high school is also notified. So why didn't the kids' high school raise questions when they got accommodation approval for a disability they knew the kid didn't have?

[gs11rmb]

Mar 14, 2019 9:45:18 GMT -5 trippypea said:

You would think there will have to be more people who get charged in this. Take the SAT part, where they are having someone else take the test for their kid. In order to do it, they had to get special accommodations from the College Board. You don't just ask and get them, you have to apply months in advance and have a documented disability to back it up. For example, my daughter is deaf, so we had to provide an audiogram and info from the audiologist to prove she was deaf.

So what disability did these students use? What doctor signed off on it knowing the student didn't have said disability? And because the student wouldn't have an IEP at school (since they do not really have a disability), that should trigger a documentation review from College Board, since there was no previous need for extended test time. Why didn't that happen? In addition, when SAT accommodations are approved the high school is also notified. So why didn't the kids' high school raise questions when they got accommodation approval for a disability they knew the kid didn't have?

Obviously I have no idea what actually happened in these circumstances but I did watch a Netflix documentary about Adderall called "Take Your Pills".  It appeared to be shockingly easy to obtain a diagnosis of ADHD from a physician.  These are not necessarily corrupt pill-pushing doctors but if a students fills out a questionnaire with the right answers then... here's your prescription.

Also, I doubt these kids are at public high schools.  A high school junior or senior who is privately tested could submit documentation without having to go through their school, especially if the testing takes place in another facility.

[haapai]

Mar 14, 2019 9:45:18 GMT -5 trippypea said:

So why didn't the kids' high school raise questions when they got accommodation approval for a disability they knew the kid didn't have?

Are you joking?  First someone would have to notice that a particular kid was not scheduled for the usual Saturday in the gym or the kid would have to spill the beans themselves.  Then  the school official would have to be a damn fool to raise any kind of stink.  Who wants to trip up parents with that kind of wealth and ambition, especially when there are disability and privacy issues thrown in there?

I'm fairly certain that folks in the high schools that noticed something fishy was going just thanked G-- that whatever was going on was on someone else's plate. 

[trippypea]

Mar 14, 2019 8:13:30 GMT -5 gs11rmb said:

Does anyone know if the students will be removed from their schools?  I don't think that's actually fair as I doubt very few of these kids knew what was happening behind the scenes.  This has got to be humiliating but, as long as they are making the required grades, I think they should be allowed to stay.

If someone robs a bank and gives you a bag of cash, you don't get to keep it because you didn't commit the actual crime.

While I get that the kids themselves are not necessarily responsible for what their parents did, the kids should be forced to leave school because they are benefiting from the criminal acts of someone else. They did not earn their spot in those schools, and in fact, stole that spot from a much more deserving student. Not to mention that with higher SAT/ACT scores, you are likely to earn more scholarship money. So not only did they get in on someone else's merits, the cheater could be paying less in tuition than the guy who would have gotten that scholarship if the cheater hadn't scammed their way in. So any monies given to these student's on the basis of their SAT score or athletic prowess should have to be paid back.

[trippypea]

Mar 14, 2019 10:07:26 GMT -5 haapai said:

Mar 14, 2019 9:45:18 GMT -5 trippypea said:

So why didn't the kids' high school raise questions when they got accommodation approval for a disability they knew the kid didn't have?

Are you joking?  First someone would have to notice that a particular kid was not scheduled for the usual Saturday in the gym or the kid would have to spill the beans themselves.  Then  the school official would have to be a damn fool to raise any kind of stink.  Who wants to trip up parents with that kind of wealth and ambition, especially when there are disability and privacy issues thrown in there?

I'm fairly certain that folks in the high schools that noticed something fishy was going just thanked G-- that whatever was going on was on someone else's plate. 

I suppose you're right, since my experience is with NORMAL high schools, ha ha, not the high schools uber rich kids would go to. My point is, other people would have to have known and purposely looked the other way in order for this kind of thing to happen.

[haapai]

I hardly think that these kids were scholarship material, at least not at the schools that they attended.  A few of them may have picked up National Merit Scholarships worth a couple of grand a year, but the odds are pretty good that whoever they bumped would have gotten a similar scholarship. 

None of these kids were getting need-based aid.  That's for damn sure. 

[gs11rmb]

Mar 14, 2019 10:10:26 GMT -5 trippypea said:

Mar 14, 2019 8:13:30 GMT -5 gs11rmb said:

Does anyone know if the students will be removed from their schools?  I don't think that's actually fair as I doubt very few of these kids knew what was happening behind the scenes.  This has got to be humiliating but, as long as they are making the required grades, I think they should be allowed to stay.

If someone robs a bank and gives you a bag of cash, you don't get to keep it because you didn't commit the actual crime.

While I get that the kids themselves are not necessarily responsible for what their parents did, the kids should be forced to leave school because they are benefiting from the criminal acts of someone else. They did not earn their spot in those schools, and in fact, stole that spot from a much more deserving student. Not to mention that with higher SAT/ACT scores, you are likely to earn more scholarship money. So not only did they get in on someone else's merits, the cheater could be paying less in tuition than the guy who would have gotten that scholarship if the cheater hadn't scammed their way in. So any monies given to these student's on the basis of their SAT score or athletic prowess should have to be paid back.

What makes you think any of these students received scholarship money?

I guess I'm fine in allowing the students to stay if they are not failing.  I think it's appalling what the parents did but I also think it's illogical to assume that every student in a school 'deserves' to be there.

[haapai]

Mar 14, 2019 10:14:06 GMT -5 trippypea said:

I suppose you're right, since my experience is with NORMAL high schools, ha ha, not the high schools uber rich kids would go to. My point is, other people would have to have known and purposely looked the other way in order for this kind of thing to happen.

You do have a point there.  I can see why the high schools aren't saying much (privacy) but I do have to wonder why we haven't heard a peep from the College Board yet.  Aren't they supposed to have some sort of internal controls against exam cheating? 

[trippypea]

Mar 14, 2019 10:17:45 GMT -5 gs11rmb said:

What makes you think any of these students received scholarship money?

I guess I'm fine in allowing the students to stay if they are not failing.  I think it's appalling what the parents did but I also think it's illogical to assume that every student in a school 'deserves' to be there.

I'm not saying they DID receive scholarship money, I'm saying if they did, they should have to return it.

[TheOtherMe]

Lori Loughlin’s Daughter Vacationed On USC Trustee’s Yacht As Scandal Broke


www.huffpost.com/entry/lori-loughlin-daughter-usc-yacht_n_5c8a16cee4b0fbd76620e44f

Trustee's daughter is also a USC student, but still....

[gs11rmb]

I'll admit to rolling my eyes when I read this story:  www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/college-cheating-scandal-first-lawsuits-filed-students-elite-schools-n983211

If future employers Google their names I think they'll be passed over in favour of less whiny candidates  .

[happyhoix]

Mar 14, 2019 8:28:11 GMT -5 haapai said:

Mar 14, 2019 8:13:30 GMT -5 gs11rmb said:

Does anyone know if the students will be removed from their schools?  I don't think that's actually fair as I doubt very few of these kids knew what was happening behind the scenes.  This has got to be humiliating but, as long as they are making the required grades, I think they should be allowed to stay.

There was a flurry of frankly boring press releases and statements from universities last night.  They appear to be handling the cases individually, attempting to gauge the amount of deceit practiced by the student and remaining cognizant that many of the students were minors at the time. 

ETA:  Here's a synopsis of school responses from BI

I read about one of them that said any students newly accepted would have their acceptance revoked, and they would be doing an individual review of every student who had been there a while, to see if they merited their place or had one foot out the door already.

That seems fair, I guess. If the kid can cut it, he should stay.

[happyhoix]

Mar 13, 2019 20:41:00 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

I imagine Lori Loughlin is now beating her head against a wall remembering her daughter' s comments.

Lori Loughlin's daughter said she doesn't 'really care about school,' only interested in 'game days' and 'partying'

Lori Loughlin’s daughter entered college with a degree of indifference, despite the extra strings her parents allegedly pulled to get her there.

“The Full House Star’s” daughter, who goes by Olivia Jade on her YouTube channel, shrugged off her upcoming college education during a question and answer video shared to her page back in August 2018.

In the clip she discussed how she would be required to jet off to Fiji during her first week of classes and then later to New York for engagements to build her social media career. The 19-year-old influencer admitted that it would be a challenge to balance both her online life and her college studies, but was very clear on where her priorities fall.

“I don’t know how much of school I’m going to attend, but I’m going to go in and talk to my deans and everyone and hope that I can try to balance it all,” she told her viewers. “But I do want the experience of game days, paryting — I don’t really care about school, as you guys all know."

Complete article here. Lori Loughlin's daughter said she doesn't 'really care about school,' only interested in 'game days' and 'partying'

I wonder what kind of GPA this kid manages to pull?

At least it sounds like she won't be too broken hearted if she gets asked to leave the school. Plenty of other places to party and enjoy game day. She will be upset if she loses her internet sponsors, though. I heard that one has backed out, I don't know if any others will.

[Tennesseer]

Satire from The Borowitz Report

Betsy DeVos Suggests That Bribing Colleges Helps Students Learn Math
By Andy Borowitz

WASHINGTON (The Borowitz Report)—Offering an upbeat assessment of the headline-grabbing college-admissions scandal, Betsy DeVos said on Thursday that bribing colleges gave students “a really neat opportunity” to learn math.

The Secretary of Education suggested that, rather than keeping children in the dark about the bribes that enable their college acceptances, “Parents should sit around the kitchen table with their kids and work on some fun math problems together.”

“Let’s say it’ll cost Amber seventy-five thousand dollars to get into Stanford, and it’ll cost her twin brother Dylan seventy-five thousand to get into Georgetown,” she said. “How much money total will their parents have to wire?”

Complete article here: Betsy DeVos Suggests That Bribing Colleges Helps Students Learn Math

[chiver78]

I did a quick scan and didn't see this posted in the thread already. some of the quotes in here sound familiar, though. 

anyway, this was an interesting read for me this am. gets into why all of this is coming back to federal court in Boston. that was surprising for me on the news last night. 

Boston investigators were working on an entirely different case, and then....

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Mar 14, 2019 11:37:39 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

Mar 13, 2019 20:41:00 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

I imagine Lori Loughlin is now beating her head against a wall remembering her daughter' s comments.

Lori Loughlin's daughter said she doesn't 'really care about school,' only interested in 'game days' and 'partying'

Lori Loughlin’s daughter entered college with a degree of indifference, despite the extra strings her parents allegedly pulled to get her there.

“The Full House Star’s” daughter, who goes by Olivia Jade on her YouTube channel, shrugged off her upcoming college education during a question and answer video shared to her page back in August 2018.

In the clip she discussed how she would be required to jet off to Fiji during her first week of classes and then later to New York for engagements to build her social media career. The 19-year-old influencer admitted that it would be a challenge to balance both her online life and her college studies, but was very clear on where her priorities fall.

“I don’t know how much of school I’m going to attend, but I’m going to go in and talk to my deans and everyone and hope that I can try to balance it all,” she told her viewers. “But I do want the experience of game days, paryting — I don’t really care about school, as you guys all know."

Complete article here. Lori Loughlin's daughter said she doesn't 'really care about school,' only interested in 'game days' and 'partying'

I wonder what kind of GPA this kid manages to pull?

At least it sounds like she won't be too broken hearted if she gets asked to leave the school. Plenty of other places to party and enjoy game day. She will be upset if she loses her internet sponsors, though. I heard that one has backed out, I don't know if any others will.

She also has a gig with Sephora, and people are suggesting a boycott of there until she and her products are removed.

I really don’t see how those kids didn’t know that strings were being pulled on their behalf.  Kids are not stupid.  I was listening to Kelly Ripa on and she was describing her kid’s admission into college as brutal for everyone.  

So I wonder exactly where do you stop this?  Does Kushner’s contribution to get Jared into Harvard count?  How about Trump’s contributions to U Penn for his kids?  Legacy admissions?  Because a parent got in, does their child deserve to get in?  These are not far steps away from the flat out cheating.

[oped]

SAT is given at the school but not BY the school...

[souldoubt]

Mar 14, 2019 12:25:19 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Mar 14, 2019 11:37:39 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

I wonder what kind of GPA this kid manages to pull?

At least it sounds like she won't be too broken hearted if she gets asked to leave the school. Plenty of other places to party and enjoy game day. She will be upset if she loses her internet sponsors, though. I heard that one has backed out, I don't know if any others will.

She also has a gig with Sephora, and people are suggesting a boycott of there until she and her products are removed.

I really don’t see how those kids didn’t know that strings were being pulled on their behalf.  Kids are not stupid.  I was listening to Kelly Ripa on and she was describing her kid’s admission into college as brutal for everyone.  

Obviously anyone who got unlimited time to take the SAT, had someone else helping them cheat on the test and so on knows what was going on.  I'm curious to know if any of the kids legitimately applied and think they got in after their parents pulled strings without their knowledge.  If any of them didn't know I actually feel some sympathy for them because they're going to be social pariahs at school through no fault of their own.  Lori Laughlin's daughter on the other hand I have zero sympathy for as she epitomizes the rich kids who get away with doing pretty much whatever they want.  The sad thing is someone said she's considered an "influencer" which if that's true you've got other kids following her who look up to her.  People being famous for no reason other than being famous is nothing new but social media has only made it about 10x worse. 

[alabamagal]

Mar 14, 2019 10:14:06 GMT -5 trippypea said:

Mar 14, 2019 10:07:26 GMT -5 haapai said:

Are you joking?  First someone would have to notice that a particular kid was not scheduled for the usual Saturday in the gym or the kid would have to spill the beans themselves.  Then  the school official would have to be a damn fool to raise any kind of stink.  Who wants to trip up parents with that kind of wealth and ambition, especially when there are disability and privacy issues thrown in there?

I'm fairly certain that folks in the high schools that noticed something fishy was going just thanked G-- that whatever was going on was on someone else's plate. 

I suppose you're right, since my experience is with NORMAL high schools, ha ha, not the high schools uber rich kids would go to. My point is, other people would have to have known and purposely looked the other way in order for this kind of thing to happen.

SATs are normally given at an a central location, not at each high school. No one at a high school would notice that any individual student went somewhere else to take a test. Also there are multiple dates.

My kids went to a rich kids private school and took their SAT at one of the public schools. Even in a small city, no one at the school where the SAT was given had any clue who my kids are. They did have to show picture ID though.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Mar 14, 2019 12:56:16 GMT -5 alabamagal said:

Mar 14, 2019 10:14:06 GMT -5 trippypea said:

I suppose you're right, since my experience is with NORMAL high schools, ha ha, not the high schools uber rich kids would go to. My point is, other people would have to have known and purposely looked the other way in order for this kind of thing to happen.

SATs are normally given at an a central location, not at each high school. No one at a high school would notice that any individual student went somewhere else to take a test. Also there are multiple dates.

My kids went to a rich kids private school and took their SAT at one of the public schools. Even in a small city, no one at the school where the SAT was given had any clue who my kids are. They did have to show picture ID though.

This is how I remember it, back in the dark ages.  Since I went to a small, private HS, I wound up going to the large public HS to take the test.  Some of my class was there, and as 90% of my HS class went onto college, I assumed that those who weren’t there took them on other dates.

[chapeau]

I’m not even sure that a kid who wasn’t paying attention to his or her scores would necessarily notice if an “extra” score (one taken by someone else in his or her name) showed up in their record. Kids who care monitor that stuff. Kids who don’t...

The SAT was given at my high school on some of the dates, and we had tons of kids from other schools show up. We were encouraged to take them at our school, something like home field advantage.

[TheOtherMe]

We took the SAT at the high school, on a Saturday morning.

It's now given at the school, on a school day and the other students are dismissed for the day.

[teen persuasion]

Mar 14, 2019 12:25:19 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Mar 14, 2019 11:37:39 GMT -5 happyhoix said:

I wonder what kind of GPA this kid manages to pull?

At least it sounds like she won't be too broken hearted if she gets asked to leave the school. Plenty of other places to party and enjoy game day. She will be upset if she loses her internet sponsors, though. I heard that one has backed out, I don't know if any others will.

She also has a gig with Sephora, and people are suggesting a boycott of there until she and her products are removed.

I really don’t see how those kids didn’t know that strings were being pulled on their behalf.  Kids are not stupid.  I was listening to Kelly Ripa on and she was describing her kid’s admission into college as brutal for everyone.  

So I wonder exactly where do you stop this?  Does Kushner’s contribution to get Jared into Harvard count?  How about Trump’s contributions to U Penn for his kids?  Legacy admissions?  Because a parent got in, does their child deserve to get in?  These are not far steps away from the flat out cheating.

I just saw on ABC national news that Lori Loughlin was dropped from whatever project she's in now, and her daughter was dropped by Sephora.

[weltschmerz]

Mar 13, 2019 20:41:00 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

I imagine Lori Loughlin is now beating her head against a wall remembering her daughter' s comments.

Lori Loughlin's daughter said she doesn't 'really care about school,' only interested in 'game days' and 'partying'

Lori Loughlin’s daughter entered college with a degree of indifference, despite the extra strings her parents allegedly pulled to get her there.

“The Full House Star’s” daughter, who goes by Olivia Jade on her YouTube channel, shrugged off her upcoming college education during a question and answer video shared to her page back in August 2018.

In the clip she discussed how she would be required to jet off to Fiji during her first week of classes and then later to New York for engagements to build her social media career. The 19-year-old influencer admitted that it would be a challenge to balance both her online life and her college studies, but was very clear on where her priorities fall.

“I don’t know how much of school I’m going to attend, but I’m going to go in and talk to my deans and everyone and hope that I can try to balance it all,” she told her viewers. “But I do want the experience of game days, paryting — I don’t really care about school, as you guys all know."

Complete article here. Lori Loughlin's daughter said she doesn't 'really care about school,' only interested in 'game days' and 'partying'

??

Influencer? What the hell is that?