Green New Deal proposal started by Alexandria Ocasio Cortez

[Great]

So much to discuss about this proposal, Green New Deal, has been in the news a lot the last few days. 
2020 Presidential Candidates have endorsed/co-sponsored &/or at least expressed interest in it, Cory Booker, Kamala Harris, Elizabeth Warren, Kirsten Gillibrand and others.

This is the link to the proposal in full.
assets.documentcloud.org/documents/5729035/Green-New-Deal-FAQ.pdf

Overview
 We will begin work immediately on Green New Deal bills to put the
nuts and bolts on the plan described in this resolution (important to
say so someone else can’t claim this mantle).
 This is a massive transformation of our society with clear goals and
a timeline.
o The Green New Deal resolution a 10-year plan to mobilize every aspect
of American society at a scale not seen since World War 2 to achieve
net-zero greenhouse gas emissions and create economic prosperity for
all. It will:
 Move America to 100% clean and renewable energy
 Create millions of family supporting-wage, union jobs
 Ensure a just transition for all communities and workers to
ensure economic security for people and communities that have
historically relied on fossil fuel industries
 Ensure justice and equity for frontline communities by
prioritizing investment, training, climate and community
resiliency, economic and environmental benefits in these
communities.
 Build on FDR’s second bill of rights by guaranteeing:
 A job with a family-sustaining wage, family and medical
leave, vacations, and retirement security
 High-quality education, including higher education and
trade schools
 Clean air and water and access to nature
 Healthy food
 High-quality health care
 Safe, affordable, adequate housing
 Economic environment free of monopolies
 Economic security for all who are unable or unwilling to
work

FAQ
Why 100% clean and renewable and not just 100% renewable? Are you
saying we won’t transition off fossil fuels?
Yes, we are calling for a full transition off fossil fuels and zero greenhouse gases.
Anyone who has read the resolution sees that we spell this out through a plan that
calls for eliminating greenhouse gas emissions from every sector of the economy.
Simply banning fossil fuels immediately won’t build the new economy to replace it –
this is the plan to build that new economy and spells out how to do it technically. We
do this through a huge mobilization to create the renewable energy economy as fast
as possible. We set a goal to get to net-zero, rather than zero emissions, in 10 years
because we aren’t sure that we’ll be able to fully get rid of farting cows and
airplanes that fast, but we think we can ramp up renewable manufacturing and
power production, retrofit every building in America, build the smart grid, overhaul
transportation and agriculture, plant lots of trees and restore our ecosystem to get
to net-zero.

(bolded was done by myself)

So what do members of this board think about the New Green Deal proposal?

[OldCoyote]

Not going to happen,

Even Cali is starting to realize that there is an end to the money.

www.visaliatimesdelta.com/story/news/2019/02/12/california-governor-abandons-high-speed-rail-project-but-not-here/2850229002/

[billisonboard]

Idealistic starting point.

[djAdvocate]

Feb 13, 2019 10:51:24 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

Not going to happen,

Even Cali is starting to realize that there is an end to the money.

www.visaliatimesdelta.com/story/news/2019/02/12/california-governor-abandons-high-speed-rail-project-but-not-here/2850229002/

actually, that is not true. if we agree that time is endless, then so is money.

[Tennesseer]

Feb 13, 2019 12:10:02 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Feb 13, 2019 10:51:24 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

Not going to happen,

Even Cali is starting to realize that there is an end to the money.

www.visaliatimesdelta.com/story/news/2019/02/12/california-governor-abandons-high-speed-rail-project-but-not-here/2850229002/

actually, that is not true. if we agree that time is endless, then so is money.

just what the board needs: A discussion on the science of time on top of climate change.

[Deleted]

Yes !


The modern conception of time is based on Einstein's theory of relativity, in which rates of time run differently depending on relative motion, and space and time are merged into spacetime, where we live on a world line rather than a timeline. In this view time is a coordinate. According to the prevailing cosmological model of the Big Bang theory time itself began as part of the entire Universe about 13.8 billion years ago.


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_in_physics

[Deleted]

Feb 13, 2019 10:51:24 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

Not going to happen,

Even Cali is starting to realize that there is an end to the money.

www.visaliatimesdelta.com/story/news/2019/02/12/california-governor-abandons-high-speed-rail-project-but-not-here/2850229002/

Your definitely not a Democrat, as the going belief is there never is an end, to other peoples money.  

[thyme4change]

The right suggest huge changes that would take us very far to the right. The left suggest huge changes that would take us very far to the left. If everything works as it should we will end somewhere in the middle.

[Great]

All the 'New Green Deal' sounds like (to me) is a take over of all aspects of life as we know it, a managed economy under total government control.  I don't even know where to start on how flawed this proposal is.
Not even a hint of a mixed economy between private and public.

Its impossible to be able to provide "Economic security for all who are unable or unwilling to work" 
Unwilling to work? Pay nothing into the system yet able to take advantage of all the free stuff. 
We can't even control illegal immigration  and implementation of this proposal will be inviting the world to take advantage of free income, health care, education, housing etc.. as listed in the OP Overview.  
I suspect the USA wouldn't be inviting any longer to those who want to go through a merit based legal immigration process. 

Not sure how to fully get rid of airplanes in 10 years? farting cows? 

I was reading an article, no link, but the Unions are worried it would cause poverty among its members.

This has to be the dumbest proposal, and yet some Dem Presidential candidates are endorsing it? 
 

[ednkris]

Feb 13, 2019 16:05:46 GMT -5 Great said:

All the 'New Green Deal' sounds like (to me) is a take over of all aspects of life as we know it, a managed economy under total government control.  I don't even know where to start on how flawed this proposal is.
Not even a hint of a mixed economy between private and public.

Its impossible to be able to provide "Economic security for all who are unable or unwilling to work" 
Unwilling to work? Pay nothing into the system yet able to take advantage of all the free stuff. 
We can't even control illegal immigration  and implementation of this proposal will be inviting the world to take advantage of free income, health care, education, housing etc.. as listed in the OP Overview.  
I suspect the USA wouldn't be inviting any longer to those who want to go through a merit based legal immigration process. 

Not sure how to fully get rid of airplanes in 10 years? farting cows? 

I was reading an article, no link, but the Unions are worried it would cause poverty among its members.

This has to be the dumbest proposal, and yet some Dem Presidential candidates are endorsing it? 
 

What a bunch of crap, this is why i'm going to love this next election. All these dem candidates are the same. You would think they would learn. Ehhh maybe another presidential election cycle or 2. 

[tbop77]

Conservatives embraced a candidate in 2016 that said he was going to build a wall and Mexico is going to pay for it.....oh wait!

[dondub]

You would think they would learn.

They learned enough in 2018 to ride a blue tsunami all the way to Washington, DC. Perhaps they are not the ones that need the lessons.

[ednkris]

Feb 13, 2019 16:59:07 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Conservatives embraced a candidate in 2016 that said he was going to build a wall and Mexico is going to pay for it.....oh wait!

he didn't say how

[ednkris]

Feb 13, 2019 17:15:29 GMT -5 dondub said:

You would think they would learn.

They learned enough in 2018 to ride a blue tsunami all the way to Washington, DC. Perhaps they are not the ones that need the lessons.

this makes it all the better.... its going to be great

[dondub]

Yes, even more Demos will be elected. Glad you are seeing things more clearly now.

[tbop77]

Feb 13, 2019 17:18:13 GMT -5 ednkris said:

Feb 13, 2019 16:59:07 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Conservatives embraced a candidate in 2016 that said he was going to build a wall and Mexico is going to pay for it.....oh wait!

he didn't say how

What part of all the chanting he did at every rally that he was going to "build a wall and who is going to pay for it" and the crowd would cheer MEXICO do you not understand?

[Tennesseer]

Feb 13, 2019 17:18:13 GMT -5 ednkris said:

Feb 13, 2019 16:59:07 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Conservatives embraced a candidate in 2016 that said he was going to build a wall and Mexico is going to pay for it.....oh wait!

he didn't say how

Define 'One time payment". Hint: it isn't $20 a week.

Introduction: The provision of the Patriot Act, Section 326 -the "know your
customer" provision, compelling financial institutions to demand identity
documents before opening accounts or conducting financial transactions is a
fundamental element of the outline below. That section authorized the
executive branch to issue detailed regulations on the subject, found at 31 CFR
130.120-121. It's an easy decision for Mexico: make a one-time payment of $5-
10 billion to ensure that $24 billion continues to flow into their country year
after year. There are several ways to compel Mexico to pay for the wall
including the following:

Pay For The Wall

The Many Ways Trump Has Said Mexico Will Pay for the Wall

[ednkris]

Feb 13, 2019 17:23:07 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Feb 13, 2019 17:18:13 GMT -5 ednkris said:

he didn't say how

What part of all the chanting he did at every rally that he was going to "build a wall and who is going to pay for it" and the crowd would cheer MEXICO do you not understand?

And again HOW?

[ednkris]

Feb 13, 2019 17:31:05 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Feb 13, 2019 17:18:13 GMT -5 ednkris said:

he didn't say how

Define 'One time payment". Hint: it isn't $20 a week.

Introduction: The provision of the Patriot Act, Section 326 -the "know your
customer" provision, compelling financial institutions to demand identity
documents before opening accounts or conducting financial transactions is a
fundamental element of the outline below. That section authorized the
executive branch to issue detailed regulations on the subject, found at 31 CFR
130.120-121. It's an easy decision for Mexico: make a one-time payment of $5-
10 billion to ensure that $24 billion continues to flow into their country year
after year. There are several ways to compel Mexico to pay for the wall
including the following:

Pay For The Wall

The Many Ways Trump Has Said Mexico Will Pay for the Wall

a good list of options not specifically how

[Tennesseer]

Feb 13, 2019 17:34:38 GMT -5 ednkris said:

Feb 13, 2019 17:31:05 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Define 'One time payment". Hint: it isn't $20 a week.

Pay For The Wall

The Many Ways Trump Has Said Mexico Will Pay for the Wall

a good list of options not specifically how

Sooooo, "make a one time payment" means what exactly to you? "One time payment."

[dondub]

  HOW? By convincing all the Repo drones that more debt should be incurred to keep the homeland safe from all the teeming hordes of criminal children seeking asylum

in those cages he's keeping them in. Or better yet having Betsy DeVos sell them off to enrich herself with 'closed' adoptions Argentinian dissapearo style.

 In the meantime, 90% of all contraband coming through the border is at points of entry (you know, those places with walls) and a vast majority of drugs captured are by

the Coast Guard out on the unwalled part of the ocean.

[ednkris]

Feb 13, 2019 17:36:07 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Feb 13, 2019 17:34:38 GMT -5 ednkris said:

a good list of options not specifically how

Sooooo, "make a one time payment" means what exactly to you? "One time payment."

the article didn't say he only said that was the only way. Very typical pick one thing and twist it 

[weltschmerz]

Feb 13, 2019 17:18:13 GMT -5 ednkris said:

Feb 13, 2019 16:59:07 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Conservatives embraced a candidate in 2016 that said he was going to build a wall and Mexico is going to pay for it.....oh wait!

he didn't say how

Of course he did!

"Who's going to pay for the wall? Mexico!!"
"Who's going to pay for the wall? Mexico!!"
"Who's going to pay for the wall? Mexico!!"

“When I said Mexico will pay for the wall in front of thousands and thousands of people, obviously they’re not going to write a check,” he said.



Except that’s pretty much what he claimed on the campaign trail. During his 2016 presidential bid, a plan to make Mexico pay for the wall was actually one of the few specific things he laid out — including, essentially, the Mexican government writing a check for it.



“It’s an easy decision for Mexico: make a one-time payment of $5-10 billion,” a campaign document titled “Pay for the Wall” from his presidential bid reads.

www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/1/10/18177058/trump-mexico-wall-pay-shutdown-mcallen

[tbop77]

Feb 13, 2019 17:33:55 GMT -5 ednkris said:

Feb 13, 2019 17:23:07 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

What part of all the chanting he did at every rally that he was going to "build a wall and who is going to pay for it" and the crowd would cheer MEXICO do you not understand?

And again HOW?

Don't worry about it, that playing dumb don't work with me, hun.

But, if I were you, I'd worry about my own party and the new deal they are pulling over your eyes.  I never in my lifetime thought I'd see conservatives run trillion dollar deficits and like Micks says, nobody cares!  You remember Mick Mulvaney, the deficit hawk a few years back.

Just put it on the credit card!  No worries!   

[ednkris]

Feb 13, 2019 17:39:05 GMT -5 dondub said:

  HOW? By convincing all the Repo drones that more debt should be incurred to keep the homeland safe from all the teeming hordes of criminal children seeking asylum

in those cages he's keeping them in. Or better yet having Betsy DeVos sell them off to enrich herself with 'closed' adoptions Argentinian dissapearo style.

 In the meantime, 90% of all contraband coming through the border is at points of entry (you know, those places with walls) and a vast majority of drugs captured are by

the Coast Guard out on the unwalled part of the ocean.

confusing asylum with boarder jumpers hummm very nice twist. 

I'll put it straight if 500000 children gets denied entry to stop one illegal from killing a United States Citizen its worth it

[ednkris]

Feb 13, 2019 17:41:15 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Feb 13, 2019 17:33:55 GMT -5 ednkris said:

And again HOW?

Don't worry about it, that playing dumb don't work with me, hun.

But, if I were you, I'd worry about my own party and the new deal they are pulling over your eyes.  I never in my lifetime thought I'd see conservatives run trillion dollar deficits and like Micks says, nobody cares!  You remember Mick Mulvaney, the deficit hawk a few years back.

Just put it on the credit card!  No worries!   

ya'll worry about the 2T that Trump added but don't care what Obama added. Such hyprocrites

[dondub]

It's Trump that has railed on and on about the caravans isn't it ed. And that's just what those caravans are...asylum seekers. So the confusion is in the head of your King.

 In the meantime I guess you think these 500,000 children are killers. The real killers in America are disaffected white males with automatic weapons usually with

far rightwing belief systems

[dondub]

No, Repo-Cons don't care about the trillions Trump will add while hounding Obama about his debt. Those are the hypocrites ed.

www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=&oq=paul+krugman&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4RVEB_enUS687US716&q=paul+krugman+seattle+times&gs_l=hp..3.0j0i131j0l3.0.0.0.6333...........0.NcrBxdbnxa0

[Tennesseer]

Feb 13, 2019 17:39:19 GMT -5 ednkris said:

Feb 13, 2019 17:36:07 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Sooooo, "make a one time payment" means what exactly to you? "One time payment."

the article didn't say he only said that was the only way. Very typical pick one thing and twist it 

The article stated "one time payment" no matter how many times you try to change it's meaning.

[tbop77]

Feb 13, 2019 17:45:46 GMT -5 ednkris said:

Feb 13, 2019 17:41:15 GMT -5 tbop77 said:

Don't worry about it, that playing dumb don't work with me, hun.

But, if I were you, I'd worry about my own party and the new deal they are pulling over your eyes.  I never in my lifetime thought I'd see conservatives run trillion dollar deficits and like Micks says, nobody cares!  You remember Mick Mulvaney, the deficit hawk a few years back.

Just put it on the credit card!  No worries!   

ya'll worry about the 2T that Trump added but don't care what Obama added. Such hyprocrites

At his official campaign launch address in 2015, Trump told supporters he would apply his business acumen to federal fiscal policy, right from the get-go, saying he would “reduce our $18 trillion in debt, because, believe me, we’re in a bubble.”

thinkprogress.org/trump-promises-reduce-debt-treasury-report-increase-22-trillion-58cd816be744/

Well, there is another promise made/promise broken!