Remodel - am I doing it wrong?

[thyme4change]

My house is dated and has a lot of cheap finishes - some of which are breaking. I was thinking we would remodel. I have had several contractors and 3 different designers come over. I understand the contractors want to present the most work they can do, but I am struggling with these designers.

All 3 designers didn't listen to me at all. One of them gave us a plan where she took out every wall, which makes having a normal refridgerator difficult. I know that is the "in" thing to do, but I had specifically told her I needed to keep one of the walls. When we told her that it was not a functional for us, and not what we wanted she was pissed. The last one I talked to just kept telling me all the ways I could do it on the cheap. And I kept saying "I am not going to replace my cheap cabinets with more cheap cabinets. I will just keep the ones I have." And, she is bringing me an estimate for all new cabinets. And she can do it for 85% less than the bids i have been getting from contractors.

Are designers supposed to listen? Or do you just hire them and accept that they have all the best ideas? And, I notice they all have the same ideas, which seem pretty generic right now. (White cabinets, green tile, no walls, etc.)

Am I doing this wrong?

[Bonny]

No you're not wrong.

Have faith there are good designers out there but many are paid a % of what they sell to you.

They also tend to follow whatever is "trendy".

Where they can be valuable is knowing the different sizes of cabinets and types. My best remodels have been following what colors and features I liked from the outside and incorporated them indoors. So for example in my AZ house I found a Silestone pattern that looked just like the granite outside my kitchen window. I think at the time (2003ish) it was trendy to have black countertops. I thought what a PITA to keep clean!

Kitchen still looks like a classic with beautiful natural wood cabinets and the natural looking Silestone.

I will give the designer credit for suggesting that we arch the square opening into the great room to match the other arched doorways in the house.

But she did "f" up the refrigerator opening and we wound up having to split the cost of cutting down the over fridge cabinet and new doors when we replaced the fridge about a year later.

[Lizard Queen]

Sounds like you've got some shitty designers. I hate when people ignore what you want.

Bring on the pics! Do you have a floor plan to share? We'll give you some ideas! (There's also a forum on city-data you could get input on.) Also, look at kitchen designs at the remodeling stores, grab their catalogs. Try to figure out what you like as far as colors, styles and layouts are concerned. Think of what may go best with your place. For example, my kitchen doesn't get enough sunlight. No way I'd replace my dark cabinets with more of the same! I'm underwhelmed by white cabinets as well. Trends be damned.

That will give whoever you decide to work with a much better starting point.

[alabamagal]

What is trendy now will be out in 10 years. Go with what you like. Leave your walls in and you will be ahead of everyone who is putting walls back to have a separate kitchen.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

A friend of mine uses a designer, and she has pretty much found out what you said.  They do not listen to what you want.  She told me some things that they have done which made my head spin.  

For example, custom drapes were made where my friend chose the fabric from a swatch.  When the drapes arrived, they were the wrong color.  The designer argued with her up one side and down the other, until my friend provided emails of the fabric # she wanted and the swatch.  Designer ordered the wrong fabric.  Then she wanted my friend to split the cost of her mistake.  There were other things done during this remodel which made her never so glad to see the end of it.  

I am not sure what I’d do.  I suspect I’d probably try to design myself.  

[countrygirl2]

We do our own, hubs and I pretty much agree on what we like, that has never been an issue.  Then we do it ourselves.  There have been some things that it would be to hard for him to build so we modified them.  I have made a lot of my own curtains so no mistakes there.  It helps when you can build and furnish yourselves.  Makes me proud to say that.

[CCL]

I wouldn't have the patience for any of those designers. I sure wouldn't give them any of my money for that kind of service.

I'm thinking you could do better on your own.

[crazycat]

I’ve had both designers and contractors try to tell me what they wanted to day vs what we wanted . It is very annoying but I e found that if I stay very calm and firm with telling them exactly what we want , it usually works out .

I think some people just allow designers to do whatever they want because they think they know “better” , are professionals, whatever .

Some can definitely be pushy and think they know best 😜


Good luck and hope you find someone who will work with you and deliver exactly what you want .

[thyme4change]

My neighbor who has a great eye came over yesterday. I told her my ideas, and she validated some, and added 10 other good ideas. I am dumping the designer, dumping the contractor, and figuring this out on my own. I will find a handyman to help me do the work. I'm so over the whole thing.

[Cheesy FL-Vol]

Feb 5, 2019 9:30:49 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

My neighbor who has a great eye came over yesterday. I told her my ideas, and she validated some, and added 10 other good ideas. I am dumping the designer, dumping the contractor, and figuring this out on my own. I will find a handyman to help me do the work. I'm so over the whole thing.

Keep in mind some minor contract work/handyman services are so small that people don't want to do it. We are renovating our house to put on the market, and we needed drywall repairs where walls had to be cut to access pipes for repair. It took us 8 or so drywall repair contacts before someone would actually come in and do the work. Some gave us ridiculous quotes without ever coming in to look at what was needed. Some said they would come out to quote and never showed up. One came out to quote and avoided all communication after that, never returning phone calls.

I guess just expect that some things you need to have accomplished may take longer than you expect if you are handling things yourself. I would never hire a designer, especially after reading the comments here. Like countrygirl, DH and I are fairly in-line on stuff we want to do and so far we are pleased with the results.

[Anne_in_VA]

I used a designer from HD and Lowes to design my new kitchen.  I paid a fee to have them design it and it was very reasonable.  I did tweak some things after discussing them with my DSIL who is building the cabinets , installing them and putting in the new floors.  I knew from the get go that DSIL would be building the cabinets and installing them.  I didn’t tell them that, but since I paid for the design it didn’t matter.

[thyme4change]

Feb 5, 2019 10:06:08 GMT -5 Cheesy FL-Vol said:

Feb 5, 2019 9:30:49 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

My neighbor who has a great eye came over yesterday. I told her my ideas, and she validated some, and added 10 other good ideas. I am dumping the designer, dumping the contractor, and figuring this out on my own. I will find a handyman to help me do the work. I'm so over the whole thing.

Keep in mind some minor contract work/handyman services are so small that people don't want to do it. We are renovating our house to put on the market, and we needed drywall repairs where walls had to be cut to access pipes for repair. It took us 8 or so drywall repair contacts before someone would actually come in and do the work. Some gave us ridiculous quotes without ever coming in to look at what was needed. Some said they would come out to quote and never showed up. One came out to quote and avoided all communication after that, never returning phone calls.

I guess just expect that some things you need to have accomplished may take longer than you expect if you are handling things yourself. I would never hire a designer, especially after reading the comments here. Like countrygirl, DH and I are fairly in-line on stuff we want to do and so far we are pleased with the results.

I have experienced this a lot. I have 2 handymen and my neighbor (different neighbor) has one. My two have always done small stuff for me, but it can take awhile because they are busy. Something that should take two days, will take a while week, sometimes straddling a weekend. But, if I get what I want and save $70,000, I can be patient.

Most of the stuff I need done will come with (for a price) the purchase. Counter tops, range hood installation, etc. I will have to get a plumber and electrician - I've used some recently who have been good. So I may only need a couple days with a handyman.

[bean29]

I was wondering if you could find someone who builds cabinets - since they build what you want, they are more likely to listen to you.

I have worked with Home Depot, Lowes and HOBO (out of business) to design kitchens. You need measurement of your rooms, ceiling height, and window placement. Also you need to note the plumbing and the 220 wiring location or gas location unless you are willing to move it. My DH is also very handy, so I had him do it. DH has not had good experience with self installing counter tops, so he hires that done.

He also ended up bringing in a carpenter to level the cabinets in the basement where the floor was sloped to the drain (he should have leveled before he installed the tile).

It sounded like you wanted a more comprehensive remodel - which makes me think you should look for a contractor and then ask them if they design themselves or give a referral to a designer?

I am not really enchanted with white cabinets either, but they seem to be all the rage now.  I feel like everything is low end now, meant to install, and have you re-do it in a short time.  It is not like we all want to put the energy into redecorating the house every 5 years.  We have been in our current house 13.5 years and I would be willing to redo my kitchen, but my YM self is not allowing it until the existing mortgage is paid off (about 10 years).  I could paint my cabinets white and have the current trendy look, but we never really liked painted cabinets, so I think we would be unhappy in a short time.  The current Home Design HGTV type shows all feature quick, inexpensive refreshes, and I am not sure that will ever change. 

I am curious what is in style right now too, so share your ideas with us please!

ETA:  If you go to homedepot or lowes and the person on duty does not know what they are doing, make an appointment.  I have often been told who to work with - and I happen to know that the Home Depot close to my work has a designer with a boat load of national design awards.  So, going to more than one Home Depot or Lowes might be worth your time.  Even if you intend to do the work yourself, having a designer that knows what they are doing will usually result in better design ideas/suggestions.

[Ryan]

I think you just need an architect to visualize the space and draw it out, a designer in real life is not like a designer on HGTV. 

I think the problem with just dealing with a contractor is that they don't really care much about the function of something.  They'll just do what you ask them to do, even if it doesn't make much sense.  The architect will think through where light switches or closets should go and build them into the plan.  There were so many things that our architect did that I would have NEVER been able to think of.  

We opted to not use a designer.  When we worked with the cabinet company, they told us that designers usually end up making things worse for the homeowner.  They'll choose something that doesn't fit the homeowners style and the homeowners don't want to shoot it down and, more often than not, they'll go with it and figure it will grow on them.  

[Anne_in_VA]

I knew going in what style of cabinets I wanted and had a general idea of placement.  Both HD and Lowes had someone come out to measure the space.  I then met with the designer(s) and went through their layout.  I tool it home and eventually worked with the HD designer to tweak the plans until I had everything I wanted with a couple of exceptions.  She did point out why a couple of things wouldn’t work and came up with alternatives which should work well.  

[nittanycheme]

I worked with a kitchen contractor who also did design work.  Its was a fairly small, family run business.  However, my kitchen needed to be entirely redone as it was mostly the original 1958 kitchen.  I say "mostly" because at some point someone filled in a space between the pennisula and the rest of the U-shaped counters with a white, raised door cabinet with 4 floor tiles on top while the rest of the cabinets were plain door, maple with laminate countertops.  Also, I'm pretty sure that at some point it had built in ovens that were removed and converted to a pantry type cabinet.  Overall, the kitchen layout was really bad, and made the kitchen seem really small.  At the start of the remodel, the one owner did a few layout options for us using some of the 3D design software so it was easy to see what it would look like.  Once we settled on a layout, we went through the finishes - cabinets, new flooring, lighting, etc.  Then his son and grandson actually did the majority of the work and it turned out great.  They did a great job removing all the soffits from the tops of previous cabinets, filling in the spaces, and making the swirls on the ceiling match the existing plaster ceiling.  The layout is so much better than before.  We actually went to a couple of different companies, and 2 had inhouse designers.  They both made layouts we liked, one was just too far above our price point.  We had saved up quite a bit of money to redo the kitchen, as we knew we'd likely only re-do it once.  The one contractor didn't have the designer part as well worked out, and really was going for cheaper finishes, which I was not interested in.  Since we knew we needed to do a full layout change, we couldn't really use the HD and Lowes very effectively as we were going to need to have plaster work, etc done- not just cabinets with some minor electric and plumbing work. 

We had the main bathroom done a few years ago, and I've now decided I hate the shower/tub that's installed so I'm pondering if I should get that part redone, and how to get someone to just do that part.  We got an acrylic combo, and the area where the tub fits is pretty narrow.  It was the narrowest that the company sold, and the problem is that they made the main "wall" side curvy.  The "corners"of the walls are curved, go in a bit, and then curve out again for a small shelf and the grab bar.  That sounded fine until you shower in it for a while, and realize you feel cramped because between the edge of the small shelf and the other side of shower is about 20"....    I don't really want to go through that again.  its such a pain. 

[zibazinski]

Little by little and some not by choice, I’m redoing the kitchen. It’s small and has walls because the house is old. I’ve had to replace the stove due to an angry baby momma taking a part with her and now I’m replacing the microwave. Supposedly all 5 years old. But bought as a set so ss appliances could be advertised. I’m seriously thinking of replacing the refrigerator finally with a counter depth one. It’s huge refrigerator in a small space and sticks out. I can sell the old one to my handyman.
I’d like to replace the cabinets doors because I think they were refaced with something that peels off. But I think next buyer will probably tear down the whole place and build new which is why I’m still debating about replacing roof.

[hoops902]

The only piece I can see you doing wrong is your expectation of designers.  Many (maybe most?) designers have a specific type of design they're good at.  You just need to find one who shares your specific style.

Look at it similar to a clothing designer.  You might design the most fabulous luxury gowns in the world...you might do a horrific job at designing a pleated pair of pants.  Or think of it like an artist...you need to find one that paints a style you like...as opposed to commissioning someone to paint in a style you describe to them.  It's just easier to find one with your style than trying to explain and convince one to use your style when that's not their specialty.

I'm wondering what you hope to get out of a designer.  You seem to have at least some thoughts about what you want/don't want that it may not be worth your time to have one.

[happyhoix]

Feb 5, 2019 12:23:31 GMT -5 bean29 said:

I was wondering if you could find someone who builds cabinets - since they build what you want, they are more likely to listen to you.

I have worked with Home Depot, Lowes and HOBO (out of business) to design kitchens. You need measurement of your rooms, ceiling height, and window placement. Also you need to note the plumbing and the 220 wiring location or gas location unless you are willing to move it. My DH is also very handy, so I had him do it. DH has not had good experience with self installing counter tops, so he hires that done.

He also ended up bringing in a carpenter to level the cabinets in the basement where the floor was sloped to the drain (he should have leveled before he installed the tile).

It sounded like you wanted a more comprehensive remodel - which makes me think you should look for a contractor and then ask them if they design themselves or give a referral to a designer?

I am not really enchanted with white cabinets either, but they seem to be all the rage now.  I feel like everything is low end now, meant to install, and have you re-do it in a short time.  It is not like we all want to put the energy into redecorating the house every 5 years.  We have been in our current house 13.5 years and I would be willing to redo my kitchen, but my YM self is not allowing it until the existing mortgage is paid off (about 10 years).  I could paint my cabinets white and have the current trendy look, but we never really liked painted cabinets, so I think we would be unhappy in a short time.  The current Home Design HGTV type shows all feature quick, inexpensive refreshes, and I am not sure that will ever change. 

I am curious what is in style right now too, so share your ideas with us please!

ETA:  If you go to homedepot or lowes and the person on duty does not know what they are doing, make an appointment.  I have often been told who to work with - and I happen to know that the Home Depot close to my work has a designer with a boat load of national design awards.  So, going to more than one Home Depot or Lowes might be worth your time.  Even if you intend to do the work yourself, having a designer that knows what they are doing will usually result in better design ideas/suggestions.

I found this was true, also, when renting equipment. We rented a tile saw at one Home Depot (the one near the upscale mall) and the guy at the rental counter had only been doing it a week and had no clue what he was doing. When I asked him where the guard for the saw was, he wandered around, found some guards on other pieces of equipment, showed them to me, and asked me what one I thought would work. And he didn't give me the electrical cord required with tile saws. After going back twice to try to get the right accessories, we returned it and went to a different Home Depot, one that apparently specialized in home improvement. I called in advance and when I got there, they already had the saw, all the cords and parts, all gathered up into a large bucket, and he spent ten minutes explaining how to use it and all the safety features (previous guy had not a single clue about any of it). The other Home Depot was jammed with people/contractors coming in and out, renting and returning equipment, while the other one had been a ghost town - I guess all the DIY people in town knows which one has knowledgeable staff and which one doesn't. Now I know too .

[happyhoix]

I'm glad to have read this thread. We want to do a major remodel (both kitchen and master bath) soon, and I was just going to cut out some pictures and show them to the contractor and the custom cabinet maker. Now I'll ask the contractor first if he thinks we need a designer.

DH and I are not DIY at all. Kind of the blind leading the blind here.

[Anne_in_VA]

DH and DSIL are very handy and are doing the majority of the work on the bathroom and kitchen remodels.  DH does the electrical and will help with some of the installation if he can, but DSIL and his two or three helpers will do most of the work.  DSIL does have his own contracting company so that is saving us a ton of money.  He won’t let us pay him, but we do pay his workers an hourly wage and they come in to do the work on their slow days/weeks.  It does take a lot longer that way, but I can live with that when I’m saving so much money.

[Rukh O'Rorke]

Feb 5, 2019 9:30:49 GMT -5 thyme4change said:

My neighbor who has a great eye came over yesterday. I told her my ideas, and she validated some, and added 10 other good ideas. I am dumping the designer, dumping the contractor, and figuring this out on my own. I will find a handyman to help me do the work. I'm so over the whole thing.

I haven't had much luck on the handyman route either. 

But always someone that isn't listening!