so much for that wall....

[chiver78]

test of steel prototype for border wall showed it could be sawed through

[Cheesy FL-Vol]

I guess theoretically if someone really wanted to get through a big beautiful concrete wall, it could be reduced to rubble with explosives too. 

[chiver78]

exactly. 

[kadee79]

Jan 10, 2019 9:18:24 GMT -5 Cheesy FL-Vol said:

I guess theoretically if someone really wanted to get through a big beautiful concrete wall, it could be reduced to rubble with explosives too. 

Depending on the configuration of the concrete...some could be breached with a ram of some kind too or running an end loader (bulldozer) into it.  And if the ground under it isn't stable...it's going to come down on it's own at some point.

[grumpyhermit]

Right. But what is more readily available? Hack saws, or explosive and battering rams? If his argument is that the border MUST BE SECURE, "compromising" on a steel slatted fence is almost as non-nonsensical as his insistence that it's needed in the first place.

How about we enforce the laws we have, and really start cracking down on the people that are employing the people they know to be here without the proper paperwork? Let's see what that does to the flow of people across the southern border, and the ones overstaying their Visas.

[Tennesseer]

Texas land owners on the border are going to fight the wall.


Texas landowners prepare wall fight; Trump to visit border

[kadee79]

Jan 10, 2019 9:31:49 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

How about we enforce the laws we have, and really start cracking down on the people that are employing the people they know to be here without the proper paperwork? Let's see what that does to the flow of people across the southern border, and the ones overstaying their Visas.

This right here should slow illegal immigration down faster than any other means!
But boy, would my area howl....farm/field workers here!

[NastyWoman]

Jan 10, 2019 9:12:38 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

test of steel prototype for border wall showed it could be sawed through

Meh, we can fix that easily: just attach stickers to the steel slats forbidding the use of saws on the wall.  You know those round red circles with a saw on it an it line through the saw (maybe Tennesseer can find an example of that) and that would stop the problem in its tracks. 

[billisonboard]

Jan 10, 2019 18:29:13 GMT -5 NastyWoman said:

Jan 10, 2019 9:12:38 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

test of steel prototype for border wall showed it could be sawed through

Meh, we can fix that easily: just attach stickers to the steel slats forbidding the use of saws on the wall.  You know those round red circles with a saw on it an it line through the saw (m)aybe Tennesseer can find an example of that) and that would stop the problem in its tracks. 

No gun zones.

(just to beat them to it)

[Tennesseer]

Jan 10, 2019 18:29:13 GMT -5 NastyWoman said:

Jan 10, 2019 9:12:38 GMT -5 chiver78 said:

test of steel prototype for border wall showed it could be sawed through

Meh, we can fix that easily: just attach stickers to the steel slats forbidding the use of saws on the wall.  You know those round red circles with a saw on it an it line through the saw (m)aybe Tennesseer can find an example of that) and that would stop the problem in its tracks. 

[steff]

If he really thinks Texans are going to willingly hand over their land without a fight, he's in for a very rude awakening.  If he thinks he's going to just take their land the someone might want to show him the battle flag from the Battle of Gonzales & then tell him how that turned out.

and to those talking heads that have referred to this as his "Alamo", someone should tell them that the Mexicans won the battle for the Alamo. 

[djAdvocate]

Jan 10, 2019 9:18:24 GMT -5 Cheesy FL-Vol said:

I guess theoretically if someone really wanted to get through a big beautiful concrete wall, it could be reduced to rubble with explosives too. 

yes.  in fact, a fertilizer bomb could be driven right up to such a wall, which is a serious design defect.

[djAdvocate]

Jan 10, 2019 9:31:49 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

Right. But what is more readily available? Hack saws, or explosive and battering rams? If his argument is that the border MUST BE SECURE, "compromising" on a steel slatted fence is almost as non-nonsensical as his insistence that it's needed in the first place.

How about we enforce the laws we have, and really start cracking down on the people that are employing the people they know to be here without the proper paperwork? Let's see what that does to the flow of people across the southern border, and the ones overstaying their Visas.

you ever read Doonsbury (sic)?  one of the running gags was fad diets.  the reply was always this:

"how about eating less and exercising".

of course, the fad dieter never listened.

this is what it feels like to not be a Trumpster.

[billisonboard]

Jan 11, 2019 7:35:07 GMT -5 deminmaine said:

... Design?  There really is no design, and certainly no engineering behind the "plans" for the wall.
...

You mean:

Published 4 days ago ... Trump said he planned to call the heads of American steel companies in hopes of coming up with a new design for the barrier link

[dezii]

Jan 10, 2019 9:31:49 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

Right. But what is more readily available? Hack saws, or explosive and battering rams? If his argument is that the border MUST BE SECURE, "compromising" on a steel slatted fence is almost as non-nonsensical as his insistence that it's needed in the first place.

How about we enforce the laws we have, and really start cracking down on the people that are employing the people they know to be here without the proper paperwork? Let's see what that does to the flow of people across the southern border, and the ones overstaying their Visas.

So who is going to pick and harvest the crops..grains, soybeans, fruits. berries...and milk the cows...clean the stalls...

the care givers who care for our parents as they age...are in the hospitals siblings, friends ….just so many nurses and their salaries...deservably so...very high...need the lower paid to do the slut work...care for the patients..clean the rooms, halls, offices...

Then there are those who do the slaughtering  of the cattle and the swine and chickens...

The yardwork, the roofers, pouring the concrete...working in unskilled construction jobs...

I suggest watch what you wish for....you might find yourself complaining of not being able to pay the costs for many of the things I mentioned above and many more not mentioned or if able to afford them...just no one around to do those jobs  right away and when u get someone..you will be shoked at the cost...called supply and demand. Ever had to call a plumber a electrician ...hell...even a automobile repair bill....Just saying.

[grumpyhermit]

Jan 11, 2019 9:44:37 GMT -5 dezii said:

Jan 10, 2019 9:31:49 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

Right. But what is more readily available? Hack saws, or explosive and battering rams? If his argument is that the border MUST BE SECURE, "compromising" on a steel slatted fence is almost as non-nonsensical as his insistence that it's needed in the first place.

How about we enforce the laws we have, and really start cracking down on the people that are employing the people they know to be here without the proper paperwork? Let's see what that does to the flow of people across the southern border, and the ones overstaying their Visas.

So who is going to pick and harvest the crops..grains, soybeans, fruits. berries...and milk the cows...clean the stalls...

the care givers who care for our parents as they age...are in the hospitals siblings, friends ….just so many nurses and their salaries...deservably so...very high...need the lower paid to do the slut work...care for the patients..clean the rooms, halls, offices...

Then there are those who do the slautering of the cattle and the swine and chickens...

The yardwork, the roofers, pouring the concrete...working in unskilled construction jobs...

I suggest watch what you wish for....you might find yourself complaining of not being able to pay the costs for many of the things I mentioned above and many more not mentioned or if able to afford them...just no one around to do those jobs  right away and when u get someone..you will be shoked at the cost...called supply and demand. Ever had to call a plumber a electrician ...hell...even a automobile repair bill....Just saying.

So your answer is to exploit unpaid, foreign labor with few legal protections since they are here illegally?

As a country, we don't get to have it both ways. We don't get to vilify "illegal aliens", blame them for all our ills, and then turn around and exploit them to maintain a way of life we can't actually afford. If you support a crackdown on illegal immigration, go after the source of why they are coming here - money.

I don't think the President actually cares, or wants to stop the flow of undocumented workers (for many of the reasons you outlined above.)  I think he wants to APPEAR to be against immigration so he can beat his chest and rile his racist base.

He can put up a useless, visual spectacle of a wall, and claim job done. Meanwhile ignoring all of the undoubted breaches of said wall, and all environmental impacts. Ignoring facts and reality is his strong suit after all.

[dezii]

Jan 11, 2019 10:22:14 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

Jan 11, 2019 9:44:37 GMT -5 dezii said:

So who is going to pick and harvest the crops..grains, soybeans, fruits. berries...and milk the cows...clean the stalls...

the care givers who care for our parents as they age...are in the hospitals siblings, friends ….just so many nurses and their salaries...deservably so...very high...need the lower paid to do the slut work...care for the patients..clean the rooms, halls, offices...

Then there are those who do the slautering of the cattle and the swine and chickens...

The yardwork, the roofers, pouring the concrete...working in unskilled construction jobs...

I suggest watch what you wish for....you might find yourself complaining of not being able to pay the costs for many of the things I mentioned above and many more not mentioned or if able to afford them...just no one around to do those jobs  right away and when u get someone..you will be shoked at the cost...called supply and demand. Ever had to call a plumber a electrician ...hell...even a automobile repair bill....Just saying.

So your answer is to exploit unpaid, foreign labor with few legal protections since they are here illegally?

As a country, we don't get to have it both ways. We don't get to vilify "illegal aliens", blame them for all our ills, and then turn around and exploit them to maintain a way of life we can't actually afford. If you support a crackdown on illegal immigration, go after the source of why they are coming here - money.

I don't think the President actually cares, or wants to stop the flow of undocumented workers (for many of the reasons you outlined above.)  I think he wants to APPEAR to be against immigration so he can beat his chest and rile his racist base.

He can put up a useless, visual spectacle of a wall, and claim job done. Meanwhile ignoring all of the undoubted breaches of said wall, and all environmental impacts. Ignoring facts and reality is his strong suit after all.

These foreign workers who do the jobs I listed...and so many more...are not unpaid...They are willing to work for those wages because there is little work in their own country and wages are much, much less  and they don't find the work offered distasteful...That the country should recognize the importance of the work they do and offer certain basic protections so they are not exploited is a given..possible Congress will tackle this problem some day..just not while our current POTUS is in office but that too shall pass.

[swamp]

Assume an inpenetrable barrier is put up.  

so what is to stop someone from coming through a legal point of entry (I'm going to visit my friend Luis for a weekend) and just staying?   

[justme]

Jan 11, 2019 13:54:09 GMT -5 swamp said:

Assume an inpenetrable barrier is put up.  

so what is to stop someone from coming through a legal point of entry (I'm going to visit my friend Luis for a weekend) and just staying?   

Wait. You mean Mexicans can legally enter the US whenever they want to visit?!?! Shut your mouth. I thought they could only crawl through the desert to get here and there was a special white-people  I mean US only crossing for all the drunks partying in Mexico. 

[NastyWoman]

Jan 11, 2019 9:44:37 GMT -5 dezii said:

Jan 10, 2019 9:31:49 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

Right. But what is more readily available? Hack saws, or explosive and battering rams? If his argument is that the border MUST BE SECURE, "compromising" on a steel slatted fence is almost as non-nonsensical as his insistence that it's needed in the first place.

How about we enforce the laws we have, and really start cracking down on the people that are employing the people they know to be here without the proper paperwork? Let's see what that does to the flow of people across the southern border, and the ones overstaying their Visas.

So who is going to pick and harvest the crops..grains, soybeans, fruits. berries...and milk the cows...clean the stalls...

the care givers who care for our parents as they age...are in the hospitals siblings, friends ….just so many nurses and their salaries...deservably so...very high...need the lower paid to do the slut work...care for the patients..clean the rooms, halls, offices...

Then there are those who do the slaughtering  of the cattle and the swine and chickens...

The yardwork, the roofers, pouring the concrete...working in unskilled construction jobs...

I suggest watch what you wish for....you might find yourself complaining of not being able to pay the costs for many of the things I mentioned above and many more not mentioned or if able to afford them...just no one around to do those jobs  right away and when u get someone..you will be shoked at the cost...called supply and demand. Ever had to call a plumber a electrician ...hell...even a automobile repair bill....Just saying.

The master stable genius himself; as soon as he is done sweeping the federal forest floors in California of course (oh and I want my broom back when he is done. If that thing isn't worn down to a nub he won't have done a passable job and can bloody well redo it with a new broom)

[djAdvocate]

Jan 11, 2019 13:54:09 GMT -5 swamp said:

Assume an inpenetrable barrier is put up.  

so what is to stop someone from coming through a legal point of entry (I'm going to visit my friend Luis for a weekend) and just staying?   

nothing.

so, here is an ancillary question:

it seems to me that this wall will stop the LEAST dangerous and most worthy travelers (those seeking asylum),

whereas the MOST dangerous ones will continue doing what they do now- flying or driving in with fake or real passports and visas.

so, from where I sit, all this does is DISTILLS the problem that Trump claims he is solving.

that begs a second question:

if they don't know that, why?

and if they do, what are they trying to stop?

[weltschmerz]

Jan 11, 2019 18:55:31 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Jan 11, 2019 13:54:09 GMT -5 swamp said:

Assume an inpenetrable barrier is put up.  

so what is to stop someone from coming through a legal point of entry (I'm going to visit my friend Luis for a weekend) and just staying?   

nothing.

so, here is an ancillary question:

it seems to me that this wall will stop the LEAST dangerous and most worthy travelers (those seeking asylum),

whereas the MOST dangerous ones will continue doing what they do now- flying or driving in with fake or real passports and visas.

so, from where I sit, all this does is DISTILLS the problem that Trump claims he is solving.

that begs a second question:

if they don't know that, why?

and if they do, what are they trying to stop?

They do know it.

However, fear makes great sound bytes, and if Trump can keep his base fearful and energized, they'll vote for him again.

[djAdvocate]

Jan 11, 2019 19:03:26 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

Jan 11, 2019 18:55:31 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

nothing.

so, here is an ancillary question:

it seems to me that this wall will stop the LEAST dangerous and most worthy travelers (those seeking asylum),

whereas the MOST dangerous ones will continue doing what they do now- flying or driving in with fake or real passports and visas.

so, from where I sit, all this does is DISTILLS the problem that Trump claims he is solving.

that begs a second question:

if they don't know that, why?

and if they do, what are they trying to stop?

They do know it.

However, fear makes great sound bytes, and if Trump can keep his base fearful and energized, they'll vote for him again.

do they?  I mean, I would assume that anyone of even AVERAGE intelligence would know that.  and yeah, I DO tend to think that "those folks" are at least average in terms of intelligence.

so, what are they trying to stop?  nothing?  because that is what follows, for me.  that, or "Democrats".

[thyme4change]

Jan 10, 2019 9:31:49 GMT -5 grumpyhermit said:

Right. But what is more readily available? Hack saws, or explosive and battering rams? If his argument is that the border MUST BE SECURE, "compromising" on a steel slatted fence is almost as non-nonsensical as his insistence that it's needed in the first place.

How about we enforce the laws we have, and really start cracking down on the people that are employing the people they know to be here without the proper paperwork? Let's see what that does to the flow of people across the southern border, and the ones overstaying their Visas.

We would have to open the government to use eVerify first.

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Jan 11, 2019 13:54:09 GMT -5 swamp said:

Assume an inpenetrable barrier is put up.  

so what is to stop someone from coming through a legal point of entry (I'm going to visit my friend Luis for a weekend) and just staying?   

This is the source of 70-80% of the illegal immigrants (depending upon what report you read).

I just read that there are over 1 million illegal Americans in Mexico....

[The Walk of the Penguin Mich]

Jan 11, 2019 18:55:31 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Jan 11, 2019 13:54:09 GMT -5 swamp said:

Assume an inpenetrable barrier is put up.  

so what is to stop someone from coming through a legal point of entry (I'm going to visit my friend Luis for a weekend) and just staying?   

nothing.

so, here is an ancillary question:

it seems to me that this wall will stop the LEAST dangerous and most worthy travelers (those seeking asylum),

whereas the MOST dangerous ones will continue doing what they do now- flying or driving in with fake or real passports and visas.

so, from where I sit, all this does is DISTILLS the problem that Trump claims he is solving.

that begs a second question:

if they don't know that, why?

and if they do, what are they trying to stop?

At this point, I think it is just an ego point for tRump.  He needs something that he built.

[Gardening Grandma]

Jan 11, 2019 20:26:15 GMT -5 The Walk of the Penguin Mich said:

Jan 11, 2019 18:55:31 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

nothing.

so, here is an ancillary question:

it seems to me that this wall will stop the LEAST dangerous and most worthy travelers (those seeking asylum),

whereas the MOST dangerous ones will continue doing what they do now- flying or driving in with fake or real passports and visas.

so, from where I sit, all this does is DISTILLS the problem that Trump claims he is solving.

that begs a second question:

if they don't know that, why?

and if they do, what are they trying to stop?

At this point, I think it is just an ego point for tRump.  He needs something that he built.

Nail. On. Head.  A multi billion dollar boondoggle

[Tennesseer]

Jan 11, 2019 18:55:31 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

Jan 11, 2019 13:54:09 GMT -5 swamp said:

Assume an inpenetrable barrier is put up.  

so what is to stop someone from coming through a legal point of entry (I'm going to visit my friend Luis for a weekend) and just staying?   

nothing.

so, here is an ancillary question:

it seems to me that this wall will stop the LEAST dangerous and most worthy travelers (those seeking asylum),

whereas the MOST dangerous ones will continue doing what they do now- flying or driving in with fake or real passports and visas.

so, from where I sit, all this does is DISTILLS the problem that Trump claims he is solving.

that begs a second question:

if they don't know that, why?

and if they do, what are they trying to stop?

The only thing trump is trying to stop is the lose of his voters if the wall, any type of wall, is not built.

#SAD

[weltschmerz]

Americans top the list of illegal foreign workers caught by CBSA

OTTAWA – The United States was the number one source of unauthorized foreign workers in Canada last year, at least of those who were caught.

globalnews.ca/news/364043/americans-top-the-list-of-illegal-foreign-workers-caught-by-cbsa/

Oh dear! We need to shut the whole thing down until we can build a behemoth White Elephant of a wall.....that the USA will pay for!

[Deleted]

Jan 11, 2019 19:03:26 GMT -5 weltschmerz said:

Jan 11, 2019 18:55:31 GMT -5 djAdvocate said:

nothing.

so, here is an ancillary question:

it seems to me that this wall will stop the LEAST dangerous and most worthy travelers (those seeking asylum),

whereas the MOST dangerous ones will continue doing what they do now- flying or driving in with fake or real passports and visas.

so, from where I sit, all this does is DISTILLS the problem that Trump claims he is solving.

that begs a second question:

if they don't know that, why?

and if they do, what are they trying to stop?

They do know it.

However, fear makes great sound bytes, and if Trump can keep his base fearful and energized, they'll vote for him again.

Politicians have been using Americans' fears against us for years. They've used fear to convince us to give up our privacy. They've used fear to feed the ideas of the weak minded that anyone that doesn't look like them is a threat and give those same weak minded people excuses to mistreat and harm people just because they are different from them.

Fear is a powerful emotion and can be quite the motivator. It also tends to make people easy to manipulate. If you feed a person's fears about other people and things well enough, you can keep them busy enough that they miss the fact that you are just using them to suit your own purposes and you really don't give a fuck about them and their silly little lives.