Rukh O'Rorke
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Post by Rukh O'Rorke on Feb 15, 2019 8:39:16 GMT -5
As we can see every liberal on the thread has now gone off tangent and made Virgil the topic because they now realize Mueller has squat. It is over and you people do not have a clue yet. Again, it was Virgil who (again!) shifted focus. So what meta meaning can you plumb from that? (And isn't off tangent on topic?)
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Feb 15, 2019 8:48:27 GMT -5
I didn't go off on Virgil, and I am patiently awaiting Mueller's report, instead of speculating one way or another.
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swamp
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Post by swamp on Feb 15, 2019 8:57:08 GMT -5
As we can see every liberal on the thread has now gone off tangent and made Virgil the topic because they now realize Mueller has squat. It is over and you people do not have a clue yet. squat? The people under indictment and those convicted may disagree with you. We don't know where the investigation is going. Mueller keeps a pretty tight lid on it. Let him do his job.
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Virgil Showlion
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[b]leones potest resistere[/b]
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Feb 15, 2019 10:45:10 GMT -5
This argument didn't sit well with me overnight. tallguy: I'm at fault for breaking the peace between us. On one hand, I can't conceive of how anyone--especially a logically-minded fellow such as yourself--can reconcile the many comments listed in Reply #136 with an eager willingness to share and extol the petty, mean-spirited, and profoundly disrespectful piece by Mr. White (despite whatever kernel of truth may lie within). I was--and still am--profoundly disappointed by your de facto endorsement of the piece. It undermined everything I believed to be true about your views on high-minded political discourse and respect for the office of US President, based on my reasonable interpretation of your comments over the years. On the other hand, I can't help asking "What did I expect would happen after I came out guns blazing with Reply #117?" and coming back with the conclusion that I should have broached the criticism privately or not at all. I didn't immediately provide examples of your past comments for reference. I invoked your criticism of Paul, which I shouldn't have done for several reasons--and for this much I apologize. I was angry. My tone was more hostile and less interrogatory than it should have been, and I didn't give you an 'out' to concede any points without embarrassment. I can't say I would react any differently than you. It was my intent to put you in a position where you had to either justify your conduct or admit misconduct "to me" (to the readership, more generally), and I should know by now that such tactics cause more problems than they solve. We're not parliamentarians. We don't owe each other explanations, and we should tread lightly when trying to compel them. Hence for this too, I apologize. As for the argument itself: it's not worth any more of our time. If, upon sober reflection, you can well and truly reconcile your past and present behaviours, then while I can't understand this, I also can't count the number of political and ethical subjects we disagree on. Such irreconcilable differences are inevitable in any forum for debate. Civil men agree to disagree, and move on. Thank you for your candor. I apologize for my overzealousness. I wish nothing but the best for you and your girlfriend. Have a restful and profitable day.
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happyhoix
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Post by happyhoix on Feb 15, 2019 10:53:54 GMT -5
As we can see every liberal on the thread has now gone off tangent and made Virgil the topic because they now realize Mueller has squat. It is over and you people do not have a clue yet. So you're saying if the posters on this thread do not limit our talk to just Mueller and only Mueller it's an admission that Mueller has squat?
You realize it's a rare thread on this board that does NOT go off into the weeds, often repeatedly?
Wait for Mueller to finally publish his report (if the new AG lets it see the light of day). THEN there will be LOTS of Mueller talk on here....
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Virgil Showlion
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Post by Virgil Showlion on Feb 15, 2019 11:06:21 GMT -5
As we can see every liberal on the thread has now gone off tangent and made Virgil the topic because they now realize Mueller has squat. It is over and you people do not have a clue yet. Again, it was Virgil who (again!) shifted focus. So what meta meaning can you plumb from that? (And isn't off tangent on topic?) She's right, Value Buy. This one's on me--at least partly. The digression started in Reply #97, but would have ended if not for my Reply #117. Not that digressions are the end of the world, but hoc mea culpa.
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mmhmm
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Post by mmhmm on Feb 15, 2019 11:09:43 GMT -5
I'm going to lock this thread for the moment while I do some clean-up work. I'll reopen it as soon as the edits are complete. Thanks for your patience.
mmhmm, Politics Moderator
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mmhmm
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It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
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Post by mmhmm on Feb 15, 2019 12:12:49 GMT -5
This thread is now reopened. Please remain on topic and refrain from name-calling and posting about other posters rather than the subject under discussion. Everyone isn't going to agree but all are entitled to their opinions. Complaints about moderation/moderators belong in the "I've Got a Beef..." thread and not in ongoing discussions elsewhere. Thanks.
mmhmm, Politics Moderator
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Feb 15, 2019 12:27:14 GMT -5
As we can see every liberal on the thread has now gone off tangent and made Virgil the topic ....due to HIS choices. important detail, that.
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mmhmm
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It's a great pity the right of free speech isn't based on the obligation to say something sensible.
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Post by mmhmm on Feb 15, 2019 12:49:13 GMT -5
As I previously asked, please remain on topic and refrain from posting about other posters. Posts that do not comply with that request will, henceforth, be removed.
mmhmm, Politics Moderator
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Icelandic Woman
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Post by Icelandic Woman on Feb 15, 2019 13:52:10 GMT -5
This is a british persons description of trump, can't help but agree. Someone on Quora asked "Why do some British people not like Donald Trump?" Nate White, an articulate and witty writer from England wrote this magnificent response. A few things spring to mind. Trump lacks certain qualities which the British traditionally esteem. For instance, he has no class, no charm, no coolness, no credibility, no compassion, no wit, no warmth, no wisdom, no subtlety, no sensitivity, no self-awareness, no humility, no honour and no grace - all qualities, funnily enough, with which his predecessor Mr. Obama was generously blessed. Link to full article Thanks CG I was going to paste the same article somewhere on this board you just beat me to it. IMHO This is SPOT ON BRILLIANT!! It completely describes the waste of space and oxygen residing in the WH. I couldn't have said it better myself. Gotta love those Brits!
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tallguy
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Post by tallguy on Feb 15, 2019 14:14:21 GMT -5
This argument didn't sit well with me overnight. tallguy : I'm at fault for breaking the peace between us. On one hand, I can't conceive of how anyone--especially a logically-minded fellow such as yourself--can reconcile the many comments listed in Reply #136 with an eager willingness to share and extol the petty, mean-spirited, and profoundly disrespectful piece by Mr. White (despite whatever kernel of truth may lie within). I was--and still am--profoundly disappointed by your de facto endorsement of the piece. It undermined everything I believed to be true about your views on high-minded political discourse and respect for the office of US President, based on my reasonable interpretation of your comments over the years. On the other hand, I can't help asking "What did I expect would happen after I came out guns blazing with Reply #117?" and coming back with the conclusion that I should have broached the criticism privately or not at all. I didn't immediately provide examples of your past comments for reference. I invoked your criticism of Paul, which I shouldn't have done for several reasons--and for this much I apologize. I was angry. My tone was more hostile and less interrogatory than it should have been, and I didn't give you an 'out' to concede any points without embarrassment. I can't say I would react any differently than you. It was my intent to put you in a position where you had to either justify your conduct or admit misconduct "to me" (to the readership, more generally), and I should know by now that such tactics cause more problems than they solve. We're not parliamentarians. We don't owe each other explanations, and we should tread lightly when trying to compel them. Hence for this too, I apologize. As for the argument itself: it's not worth any more of our time. If, upon sober reflection, you can well and truly reconcile your past and present behaviours, then while I can't understand this, I also can't count the number of political and ethical subjects we disagree on. Such irreconcilable differences are inevitable in any forum for debate. Civil men agree to disagree, and move on. Thank you for your candor. I apologize for my overzealousness. I wish nothing but the best for you and your girlfriend. Have a restful and profitable day. Thank you, Virgil. I am gladdened to see that. I will send you a PM later but am out the door again right now. A good day to you as well.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Feb 15, 2019 16:03:26 GMT -5
just stop with the conservative control tactic of foisting extreme emotions on nonconservatives when they voice an opinion The only "extreme emotion" I've attributed to anybody here is hatred of Pres. Trump, and I base this on a litany of comments wishing every kind of evil on the man. "Conservative control tactics" are a partisan fever dream.
What is your definition of 'reason?'
Do you want all the posters here to refrain from criticizing Trump, his family, his WH admin, his company, and all his cronies because it's disrespectful to criticize a president?
If that's what you consider 'reasonable' Canada must have a significantly different type of politics. In the US, our politics have always come hand in hand with disrespect. Jefferson got a lot of crap for his mistress being one of his slaves. Jackson was constantly fighting off insults about his wife being a bigamist. And who can forget all the 'monkey' jokes and cartoons that floated around about the Obamas. If we don't like our elected officials, we tend to be very vocal. It's what we do. You're conflating criticism and hatred. Criticism is when you consider a man guilty after looking at the evidence, make an objective determination at the appropriate time, and speak out against whatever wrongdoing he may be doing, desiring justice. Hatred is when you consider a man guilty regardless of evidence, and boldly prophesy his downfall for 30 straight months. You cobble together any rationale you can to speak evil of him, revile everything he does regardless of merit, and bide your time openly hoping he's found guilty of some crime--any crime. Your interest in justice, if you have any, is suffocated by your zealous--sometimes gleeful--expectancy of his being punished, shamed, and personally ruined. You can't go two days without berating the man or wishing out loud for his enemies to crush him underfoot. You practically idolize the man who's job it is to prosecute him.
I'm not saying you personally meet all these criteria, but some here do, and many others do in part. VB finds it funny. I avoid it entirely except during rare bouts of unthinking optimism. And before you haul the anti-Obama threads of yesteryear out as your defense, I ask you to consider the same question in my last post: How many of the rabid anti-Obama posters are still here? How was hateful rhetoric against Pres. Obama regarded? What was your opinion of that rhetoric? And most importantly: Why should anyone's opinion of wishing evil on Pres. Trump be any different? Why should anyone regard 'orange man' jokes with any less contempt than 'monkey' jokes about Pres. Obama, for that matter?
I think you see more extreme views than actually exist, because you are not someone who dislikes Trump and feels he has hurt the country and the Presidency for likely a long time. I think there are only really two or three posters that dislike Trump so much they are unreasoning about it. The rest vary on how they feel and how they express it. There are several rabid anti-Obama posters still in the ranks. Some post rarely anymore, but more than a couple avoided being banned. Trump chooses to be orange, Obama didn't go to a special tanner to turn black and put special glasses on so his skin remained white around his eyes. Trump's orange is a choice just like some conservatives love to on Hillary's choice of pantsuits. But more importantly I dislike Trump because of what he has done and because of that yes l would enjoy if he got legally caught on some of it. I have less faith than some on the outcome, but I think you ignore the substantial amount of us who don't see a guaranteed end to Mueller's investigation and focus on the opinions you dislike the most.
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Opti
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Post by Opti on Feb 15, 2019 16:08:43 GMT -5
Once again, she lost. I didn't expect it, I was shocked, but I'm over it. Can we please stop talking about her? I don't understand why it's even relevant anymore. It's been over 2 years. I think its because some posters love to bring up "issues" about some people they heard, read, or saw videos about THAT DO NOT POST HERE. Personally I'm sick of that. Anyone who paid the least amount of attention noticed the silence and the worry that hit the boards after Comey did his announcement 10 days or whatever prior to the election. I know I wasn't the only one worried before the final count came in. The 'everyone expected Hillary to win' is just one of the many conservative fairy tales certain people love to trot out simply because I guess they like fairy tales instead of truth. MO.
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thyme4change
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Post by thyme4change on Feb 15, 2019 22:50:41 GMT -5
Once again, she lost. I didn't expect it, I was shocked, but I'm over it. Can we please stop talking about her? I don't understand why it's even relevant anymore. It's been over 2 years. I think its because some posters love to bring up "issues" about some people they heard, read, or saw videos about THAT DO NOT POST HERE. Personally I'm sick of that. Anyone who paid the least amount of attention noticed the silence and the worry that hit the boards after Comey did his announcement 10 days or whatever prior to the election. I know I wasn't the only one worried before the final count came in. The 'everyone expected Hillary to win' is just one of the many conservative fairy tales certain people love to trot out simply because I guess they like fairy tales instead of truth. MO. I recall distinctly when I realized Trump would win. It was the Sunday, October 30th. The night before I had been out with a bunch of people, and I listened to what everyone was saying. I went to bed, woke up, hung over and the first thing I said to my husband was "Trump is going to win, and will a be 2 term President." A piece of me held out hope, but I was in no way confident that Trump would lose.
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