countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Feb 13, 2018 14:19:59 GMT -5
Also we are paying for all the people that don't have insurance anyway through their writeoffs and getting it from those that pay. No we sold the house in 2017, so now they will likely kill us next year. We are already going to owe a bunch of capital gains as the thing was at least into 20 years of depreciation, so we are screwed on federal and state taxes this year I think. I know I'm complaining, but we have worked our butts off to have something and I can't seem to keep it anymore. That wouldn't be so bad but you see the top billionaires getting it all and I'm getting resentful. I just want to live comfortably. Hubs says if you are worrying, can you imagine the poor souls that have no savings and a pittance for SS and no money extra. I don't want to think about it, they are totally screwed. And I didn't know that info about paygo either. I need to read. Other countries like New Zealand, Australia and places knew that they were going to have millions of old people to care for and they prepared, from what I've read their fiscal house is in order. We have squandered ours apparently. The politicos have known this population demographic has been coming for decades and now look at what they have done.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Feb 13, 2018 14:28:53 GMT -5
$120 for the Part B, it raised even MIL's did $180 for Plan F Supplement $60 for scripts and not very good, none are $360 The about $200 for scripts for me out of pocket So $560 Hubs is about the same but no scrips So $920 for both of us, almost my whole SS check
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milee
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Post by milee on Feb 13, 2018 14:30:19 GMT -5
I know I'm complaining, but we have worked our butts off to have something and I can't seem to keep it anymore. That wouldn't be so bad but you see the top billionaires getting it all and I'm getting resentful.
But how is this any different than me saying the same thing? I've worked my butt off (and continue to do so) to have something. Why is it reasonable to ask me to pay for you? You have enough money to drive a Cadillac, buy houses for other people and live quite well, it's not like you're suffering. I'm not a "top billionaire" either, but you think it's fair I pay for you? Why? Don't you see that the same logic you use when railing that people who make more than you should pay for your stuff... the people who have less than you (and there are millions of them!) think about you? Either you think people should get to keep what they earn or not, but it's tough to see your argument since it's so hypocritical. You want to keep your "riches" but want the others to give up theirs... doesn't make sense. You get heavily subsidized healthcare (Medicare) and the government picks up the tab to support your disabled daughter. It's not such a raw deal.
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giramomma
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Post by giramomma on Feb 13, 2018 14:38:00 GMT -5
This. I think everyone should be on HDHP insurance for a few years to see how much places charge for things.. My OB clinic charged $250-300 for 20 minute procedures...like a NST and ultrasounds. The NST boggles me... 5 minutes of the nurses time, a yard of paper, gel, and the use of a machine that is not brand new. If I start pricing things out, assuming the nurse earns 60K a year, my treatment ran $10 of her salary, including benefits. We'll say the paper, and ultrasound gel ran $10. The OB office ladies salary during that time ran $25, just pay, no benefits. NST machines run 4k, according to google. We'll say 5k, and they last 5 years. So 1K a year. I'd say it's reasonable to do 100 NSTs a year. So the machine runs $10/use. So here's what I have for expenses: $10 for the machine $10 for supplies $45 for personnel time, including the OB's time $35 for heat/utilities for 20 minutes I'm guessing $100. So, does my OB's office need to make an extra 150 for a 20 minute procedure? I dunno. Your forgetting the cost of liability/malpractice insurance for an OB, it's 300K a year or $143/hour of work, per google and forbes I required 5 minutes of his time. I'm not a whiz, but $13 does not equal 150. My question still stands..
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CCL
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Post by CCL on Feb 13, 2018 14:47:04 GMT -5
Also we are paying for all the people that don't have insurance anyway through their writeoffs and getting it from those that pay. No we sold the house in 2017, so now they will likely kill us next year. We are already going to owe a bunch of capital gains as the thing was at least into 20 years of depreciation, so we are screwed on federal and state taxes this year I think. I know I'm complaining, but we have worked our butts off to have something and I can't seem to keep it anymore. That wouldn't be so bad but you see the top billionaires getting it all and I'm getting resentful. I just want to live comfortably. Hubs says if you are worrying, can you imagine the poor souls that have no savings and a pittance for SS and no money extra. I don't want to think about it, they are totally screwed. And I didn't know that info about paygo either. I need to read. Other countries like New Zealand, Australia and places knew that they were going to have millions of old people to care for and they prepared, from what I've read their fiscal house is in order. We have squandered ours apparently. The politicos have known this population demographic has been coming for decades and now look at what they have done.
But didn't you save on taxes during all those years of depreciation? Maybe even at a higher rate than you are paying now?
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milee
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Post by milee on Feb 13, 2018 14:52:27 GMT -5
Here's what I tell my boys - if you truly think you have identified an anomaly that represents a business opportunity, then consider getting into that business. But be damn sure you actually understand it and not that you just don't have enough information to have a complete picture. So, Gira, you'll have to consider for yourself if you've identified a fantastic business opportunity - run OB/GYN clinics - or you don't have enough understanding of the situation to have a complete picture. My guess is that part of the puzzle is that few docs are collecting $200 for a NST. There is also a huge laundry list of other costs that are difficult to quantify but that mean the doc isn't making out like a bandit - things like scheduling for no-shows, continuing professional education cost and time, etc.
But who knows, maybe I'm wrong and your doc is the next Bill Gates?
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Feb 13, 2018 14:55:52 GMT -5
My Medicare premium is about $110, but I don't have much taxable income which is what our premiums are based on. You must make a ton of money to have a premium that high. I am very fortunate to have a substantial pension, and all of my income is taxable, but it's not all income that shows up in my bank account all ready for spending since a significant chunk is interest and dividends that are reinvested. On the bright side, I can start spending that if things get too expensive, but it's still annoying, especially since my AGI for 2016 (which is what affects the 2018 premiums) just squeaked over the amount that put my premiums at the next level.
And yes, I realize it is a first world problem.
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dannylion
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Post by dannylion on Feb 13, 2018 14:59:45 GMT -5
This. I think everyone should be on HDHP insurance for a few years to see how much places charge for things.. My OB clinic charged $250-300 for 20 minute procedures...like a NST and ultrasounds. The NST boggles me... 5 minutes of the nurses time, a yard of paper, gel, and the use of a machine that is not brand new. If I start pricing things out, assuming the nurse earns 60K a year, my treatment ran $10 of her salary, including benefits. We'll say the paper, and ultrasound gel ran $10. The OB office ladies salary during that time ran $25, just pay, no benefits. NST machines run 4k, according to google. We'll say 5k, and they last 5 years. So 1K a year. I'd say it's reasonable to do 100 NSTs a year. So the machine runs $10/use. So here's what I have for expenses: $10 for the machine $10 for supplies $45 for personnel time, including the OB's time $35 for heat/utilities for 20 minutes I'm guessing $100. So, does my OB's office need to make an extra 150 for a 20 minute procedure? I dunno. Your forgetting the cost of liability/malpractice insurance Isn't OB/GYN one of the practice areas with the highest liability/malpractice costs? I think it is. That probably accounts for a lot of the high cost of OB/GYN care as they surely build that into the pricing structure.
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GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl
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Post by GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl on Feb 13, 2018 15:04:01 GMT -5
I'm not surprised. This is what folks wanted, anyway.
And, I don't think they will be able make cuts drastically to SS, medicare, etc. I'm sure it the cuts won't be a huge cliff for everyone starting the new fiscal year, but rather gradual. I forgot how many billions he wanted to spend on infrastructure. That money has to come from somewhere. At least grandma can move in with family and have them take care of her or buy her food and help pay her bills...our infrastructure doesn't have that option... Well, to be accurate, 3 MILLION more folks didn't want it than the folks who did want it. Trump won on a technicality, not a mandate.
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GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl
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Post by GRG a/k/a goldenrulegirl on Feb 13, 2018 15:06:37 GMT -5
I mean, this is what America voted for. His motives were never hidden. He's always been about making himself richer and his fellow rich people are going to get to take advantage as well. He promised a wall that any idiot had to know was never going to happen and there was no way Mexico was going to pay for it. When you vote in a clown you get a circus. Again, to be more accurate, 3 Million MORE Americans DIDN"T vote for this than did. He won on a technicality, NOT a mandate.
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midjd
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Post by midjd on Feb 13, 2018 15:11:52 GMT -5
Let's keep this money-related lest it be moved to Politics.
-Mid/mod
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Blonde Granny
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Post by Blonde Granny on Feb 13, 2018 15:18:01 GMT -5
My Medicare premium is about $110, but I don't have much taxable income which is what our premiums are based on. You must make a ton of money to have a premium that high. I am very fortunate to have a substantial pension, and all of my income is taxable, but it's not all income that shows up in my bank account all ready for spending since a significant chunk is interest and dividends that are reinvested. On the bright side, I can start spending that if things get too expensive, but it's still annoying, especially since my AGI for 2016 (which is what affects the 2018 premiums) just squeaked over the amount that put my premiums at the next level.
And yes, I realize it is a first world problem.
I know Danny.....I just wanted to be sure that others here understand that the premium charged for Medicare is not just an amount pulled from the sky, it is actually based on income. Therefore, if the income Pat has is far higher than mine, she and her DH will pay way more than me.
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NoNamePerson
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Post by NoNamePerson on Feb 13, 2018 17:14:23 GMT -5
I know I'm complaining, but we have worked our butts off to have something and I can't seem to keep it anymore. That wouldn't be so bad but you see the top billionaires getting it all and I'm getting resentful.
But how is this any different than me saying the same thing? I've worked my butt off (and continue to do so) so have something. Why is it reasonable to ask me to pay for you? You have enough money to drive a Cadillac, buy houses for other people and live quite well, it's not like you're suffering. I'm not a "top billionaire" either, but you think it's fair I pay for you? Why? Don't you see that the same logic you use when railing that people who make more than you should pay for your stuff... the people who have less than you (and there are millions of them!) think about you? Either you think people should get to keep what they earn or not, but it's tough to see your argument since it's so hypocritical. You want to keep your "riches" but want the others to give up theirs... doesn't make sense. You get heavily subsidized healthcare (Medicare) and the government picks up the tab to support your disabled daughter. It's not such a raw deal. Funny how that works.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Feb 13, 2018 17:17:23 GMT -5
You don't pay a higher amount for medicare premiums until as married you make over $175k, we are far from that so its not from income. For a single its $85k before adjusting the premiums. We don't want others to pay for us, I'm not asking that. I don't think even with the sale it will be that high for income as hubs managed to get the house in service last year so we have a big loss on remodeling costs and I think we will be ok, plus all the closing costs. I stress over money, that's what happens when you grew up poor and don't want to be again. And we have to make this last 20 to 30 more years. I just need to finish up my tax prep work so I can get a good idea where we are, I do expect to have to pay bucks for capital gains this year.
I like to know where I am, income and expense wise at all times. And until the last few years never even thought about premiums going out of sight and benefits being cut. Probably an issue in what the last 10 years or so.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Feb 13, 2018 18:36:24 GMT -5
My Medicare Part B premiums are $134 per month, same as my dad's. My income is higher than his.
He receives SS and I don't. My premiums had gone up the last two years while his had not under the "hold harmless" rules.
You have to pay ordinary rate taxes on the depreciation recapture when you sell a rental property because you received a deduction against ordinary income. Tax law has been like that for years and years.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Feb 13, 2018 20:57:56 GMT -5
I am no longer driving a Cadillac, extra truck is gone, and likely the motorhome will be gone in the next year or two. I pretty much figured I couldn't afford to drive it much after hubs retired. Also knew our standard of living would go down quite a lot, not to many surprises in those areas. Hubs is aggravated because I worry but I've always worried.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Feb 13, 2018 21:00:50 GMT -5
We never had any of the others that long, will see what it ends up being. I will pay 20% on capital gains and ordinary taxes on the depn all in one year.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2018 9:07:06 GMT -5
You don't pay a higher amount for medicare premiums until as married you make over $175k, we are far from that so its not from income. For a single its $85k before adjusting the premiums. We don't want others to pay for us, I'm not asking that. My understanding is that you're paying 25% of the actual cost of Medicare B and the Prescription plan. Your Medicare A would also have been subsidized by higher-earners who paid more for it (as a % of earnings) if you or DH weren't in the highest income brackets. It makes sense- given that I was paying $9,000/year for the equivalent of Medicare A, B and the Prescription Plan, the $2,000/year I'm now paying for Medicare B and the prescription plan looks pretty skimpy. Imperfect comparison, of course; my private health insurance had a $6,000 deductible but included hospital care and Medicare B (doctor/outpatient care) has a 20% copayment if you don't buy a supplement- but on its face, $2,000/year isn't enough to cover 80% of the average senior's doctor and outpatient care plus a portion of prescriptions. When I look back at the care DH had in the 13 years we were married, he spent only 3 nights in hospitals- one after getting cardiac stents and two after serious falls. The rest, including all of his polycythemia/cancer treatments, were outpatient. I'm 65 and haven't spent a night in a hospital since I had DS in 1984. They do everything they can to treat on an outpatient basis now. And I see that I'll be in for an IRMAA surcharge when my 2017 AGI is used. Oh, goody. Widowhood sucks, tax-wise.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Feb 14, 2018 16:25:27 GMT -5
I don't know yet on the increased premiums, possible with the duplex sale, we will see. We spent a ton on the kids, we still don't mind, its just kind of an early inheritance to make sure they get something. Our premiums and meds are running about $11,000 a year. We did plan on $1000 a month premiums, but not just 3 years into retirement, we thought it would be later on, now it worries me how much they are going to keep rising.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2018 17:15:02 GMT -5
I don't think America thought about the not so hidden costs of getting what they wanted and voted for.
Hidden schmidden. People think that the cuts should come from the other guy's pork. , I can't have a civil conversation with my Trump loving father who is a Medicaid and food stamp recipient who is mad that the illegal he hired from the street corner went to work for his neighbor who pays him more.
My neighbor was livid when Medicaid found out that she and her sister had switched all of dear old mom's savings to their names during the look-back period and made them return it. She was dumbfounded that her mother would have to pay some part of her nursing home care.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Feb 14, 2018 18:43:15 GMT -5
Lucky they hadn't spent it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2018 19:12:44 GMT -5
My neighbor was livid when Medicaid found out that she and her sister had switched all of dear old mom's savings to their names during the look-back period and made them return it. She was dumbfounded that her mother would have to pay some part of her nursing home care. I know- people grumble that if you have assets in your old age "the government will take them for nursing home expenses". Well, technically, it's the nursing home, not the government, and why shouldn't they? A guy on the Early Retirement Board posted asking for help- MIL and FIL had put all their assets in an irrevocable trust so they couldn't be compelled to use it to pay for nursing home care. Now MIL and FIL were about to close a deal to buy a unit in a nice Independent Living community and they needed that money and-surprise!- they couldn't get to it. (Ummm... did they look up "irrevocable?") Their only hope was to find a lawyer who could somehow invalidate the trust. Prospects were not good.
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Lizard Queen
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Post by Lizard Queen on Feb 14, 2018 19:18:23 GMT -5
It's shitty all around. Nursing homes are such a racket. So sad what little you get for as much as you pay.
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NastyWoman
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Post by NastyWoman on Feb 14, 2018 19:35:11 GMT -5
Hidden schmidden. People think that the cuts should come from the other guy's pork. , I can't have a civil conversation with my Trump loving father who is a Medicaid and food stamp recipient who is mad that the illegal he hired from the street corner went to work for his neighbor who pays him more.
My neighbor was livid when Medicaid found out that she and her sister had switched all of dear old mom's savings to their names during the look-back period and made them return it. She was dumbfounded that her mother would have to pay some part of her nursing home care. We recently had a poster leave in a huff when she was trying to find a way to do just that so mom's kids (and a GK) could keep their inheritance in tact. She did not like when she was called on that.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Feb 14, 2018 23:44:39 GMT -5
Not going to happen, we ran through MIL's money a bit ago, now are using up the VA's back pay. Soon as all of it is gone to pay supplement premiums for the next 3 years or less, we will have to move MIL into an efficiency, then hope it doesn't raise so much we can't afford to continue paying for her clothing, hair, and everything else out of pocket. We had her in an apartment at first and the burn rate was to high, went through more money then we should have. Now she is in sort of an efficiency but she still has a bathroom in her room and a small kitchen but no separate bedroom. It's costing $33,000 a year for it and insurance, not including extras. Her SS and VA almost cover it but not the insurance, so when that money is gone, downsize one more step, there is no further ability to downsize after that. She is outliving her money.
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TheOtherMe
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Post by TheOtherMe on Feb 15, 2018 11:42:48 GMT -5
Every single one of my rep payee clients who were in nursing homes had outlived their money. The one who lived the longest died at 97. She told me so many times that she never thought she would live in to her 90's. So by the time I am paying her bills, she is over 90. At first her health was good but at about age 95 it started going downhill. It was a January when she passed away of pneumonia. Their frail bodies can't deal with that kind of illness.
She never complained about being in the nursing home. She had been married three times but no children. No one who cared about her until she died. Then people came out of the woodwork wanting her money. What money and where were you when she needed someone to pay her bills?
All of my elderly rep payee clients had no money to leave to anyone (although people thought there was money and wanted it) as they had been on Medicaid and the less than $2,000 in their bank accounts went to the state.
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dee27
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Post by dee27 on Feb 15, 2018 15:10:10 GMT -5
Every single one of my rep payee clients who were in nursing homes had outlived their money. The one who lived the longest died at 97. She told me so many times that she never thought she would live in to her 90's. So by the time I am paying her bills, she is over 90. At first her health was good but at about age 95 it started going downhill. It was a January when she passed away of pneumonia. Their frail bodies can't deal with that kind of illness. She never complained about being in the nursing home. She had been married three times but no children. No one who cared about her until she died. Then people came out of the woodwork wanting her money. What money and where were you when she needed someone to pay her bills? All of my elderly rep payee clients had no money to leave to anyone (although people thought there was money and wanted it) as they had been on Medicaid and the less than $2,000 in their bank accounts went to the state. When I was chatting with DD last weekend, we ventured into a discussion about life decisions as we age and the money to fund them. DD's advice was I hope you do not run out of money. From her perspective, as a family practice lawyer she realizes that the best laid plans are interrupted because of major illness or death of a spouse. My father's sister lived into her middle 90s, and her money lasted because she had a lot of physical support from family members where she could age in place in her own home. I hope I can emulate her plan.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2018 17:35:50 GMT -5
We have no family so we've paid for long-term care insurance since 2001. Our current premiums are $700+ a month and, yes, we've given up a lot to afford that. But I've also seen the other side of the picture and it's not pretty and not fair to my fellow citizens either.
The neighbor I mentioned earlier wasn't too upset with her mother's nursing home care for awhile. It was in a small town and everyone knew all the staff and all the patients. THEN a large corporate chain bought the little local place, brought in new staff, and enacted "cost efficiency measures" aka divided the place in to self-pay and Medicaid. After that it got ugly in a hurry.
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countrygirl2
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Post by countrygirl2 on Feb 15, 2018 19:13:10 GMT -5
I wouldn't get long term care, the companies are dropping like flies. People have paid and paid and since most people will need it they can't charge enough to cover so go belly up, hope yours doesn't. MIL is not doing well, she gave them fits at the hospital last night, she pulled out her IV was up and down the hallway and tried to leave, staff had to call doc twice, they gave her 2 different meds and said we could come and get her today. That was a mistake, I had an idea she had to be in for so many days in case she went to a nursing home and then medicare would pick up something like 90 days. She was only there 2 so now if she does its private pay, that will drain the money we were saving to pay for her insurance for 3 more years and she will have to go on Medicaid, when she goes on Medicaid she loses VA, and when she goes on Medicaid she cannot stay in this facility either
She is totally out of it, hubs is staying at the assisted living center with her tonight and doc came in, she has been asleep all day and breathing badly. On her side ok, on her back rattling yet they say her lungs are clear?? He says the pills may last 24 hours. I have been talking to the administrator about what happens if she doesn't come out of it. Hubs is not happy with me over that, I said we need to know. She said she is to far gone to go to the nursing home side that with her wanting to leave and agitation it won't work. Here they have been able to do a balancing act and keep it going. I said so how would we deal with this. We will have to pay for 24 hour care till she leaves or take her home until we can get her in someplace, only available locked units where she could go is maybe 50 miles north of us. She said it could take 2 weeks to a month to get her in a place. OH MY GOD! Dealing with her and DD will kill me. The cost of the other home is $5500 a month, I don't know what the locked unit is but much much more I'm sure. So that would eat up her money in 2 months. We will eventually get her somewhere just how long, like she said she will never come back out and Medicaid will pick up the cost, just lots of money in the interim and people wonder why I worry about money. We have DD yet to deal with and hubs and I, I imagine we will end up penniless long before we ourselves die. I worry about the same thing happening with this assisted living center its really a well managed, employee owned good place, very rare now.
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