Car plows into counter-protesters, one dead.

[Deleted]

No need. I already know exactly what you are...

[OldCoyote]

Aug 12, 2017 22:08:50 GMT -5 oped said:

Who had the torches? Who plowed people down with a car? Who killed a woman and sent 19 to the hospital, et. Yes. The white sipremisist domestic terrorists are responsible for the violence. 

Really hmmmm, every video I seen was pretty equal in the level of violence,,

The person driving the car will pay,, Deservedly!

[OldCoyote]

Aug 12, 2017 22:11:23 GMT -5 oped said:

No need. I already know exactly what you are...

Annnd, that is??

Go ahead and spit it out,

Now don't hurt O.C. feelings.

[Opti]

Aug 12, 2017 21:54:26 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

Aug 12, 2017 15:36:33 GMT -5 steff said:

thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/346326-david-duke-charlottesville-protests-about-fulfilling-promises

Former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke appeared at the "Unite the Right" rally in Charlottesville, Va. prior to Saturday's violent clashes, saying that the event represented fulfilling the promises of President Trump.

"This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back, we're going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump, and that's what we believed in, that's why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he's going to take our country back and that's what we gotta do," Duke said.



Fuck every god damn one of you who voted for this.  And YES, you did vote for this.   Can't blame Hillary, can't blame Obama.  This is on fucking trump & his base.  

I read your post I am glad I voted for Trump!

If it wasn't for the fact that the Political Correct Liberals that wants to rewrite history, by removing statures, changing street names or schools for no other reason than political correctness.

None of this would have happened, So instead of blaming Trump and anyone that supported him or did not like Hillary,  Go look in the mirror!

You are just as responsible for this as anyone!!

Not true. This event was organized to get the pro white racists to organize and think in sync. The statue stuff was mostly an excuse. MSN even has a nice article on the organizer that I probably referenced in this thread or the other one.

[busymom]

I've been watching politics for years, and have NEVER heard a candidate, up until Trump, advocate beating up people. (Of course I'm referring to a presidential candidate.  Maybe the following article will refresh some memories.)



www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-trump-campaign-protests-20160313-story.html

[OldCoyote]

Aug 12, 2017 22:13:47 GMT -5 Opti said:

Aug 12, 2017 21:54:26 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

I read your post I am glad I voted for Trump!

If it wasn't for the fact that the Political Correct Liberals that wants to rewrite history, by removing statures, changing street names or schools for no other reason than political correctness.

None of this would have happened, So instead of blaming Trump and anyone that supported him or did not like Hillary,  Go look in the mirror!

You are just as responsible for this as anyone!!

Not true. This event was organized to get the pro white racists to organize and think in sync. The statue stuff was mostly an excuse. MSN even has a nice article on the organizer that I probably referenced in this thread or the other one.

So, if it had nothing to do with the statue, They showed up to make trouble? the other side only showed up to make it a peaceful gathering ?? Did I get that right??

[Virgil Showlion]

Aug 12, 2017 19:05:09 GMT -5 Gardening Grandma said:

Aug 12, 2017 19:02:45 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

It's the weekend. In all likelihood, neither one is here.

FWIW, I condemn the violence.

Thank you, VS.  I did note that your condemnation did not come until your second post and after I pointed out the lack of conservative participation in this thread.  But even a prompted condemnation is something.

I'm a card carrying member of the "Not every act worthy of denunciation need be explicitly denounced." club on YMAM. Case in point: when an individual runs down dozens of protestors in his car, my reasonable belief is that any poster discussing the crime condemns it unless (s)he expressly claims otherwise.

There's also the issue of redundancy. When a poster declares "Those protestors had it coming." and gets taken to task for his opinion, I typically won't pile on unless I have something new to add to the conversation. A good message board is one where members take the time to read and digest thread contents to avoid asking questions that have already been asked or making allegations that have already been made.

It seems to me this particular thread falls into the "Don't overgeneralize" category on YMAM. "Don't overgeneralize" threads usually start with condolences, condemnation, and some finger-pointing, and end with most posters agreeing that the condemnation owed a single individual or handful of individuals shouldn't be broadly extrapolated beyond those individuals. Not everybody agrees with the consensus, but most do. For example, very few posters held Democratic voters responsible when the mentally retarded boy was kidnapped and assaulted last year, and it would surprise me if any more held Republican voters responsible for this latest act of terrorism. This is the crux of what Opti has been saying.

[Deleted]

Condemning the white supremissists is overgeneralizing? Suggesting that the Nazis and the counter protesters aren't equal is ?

[Deleted]

Republicans will be held responsible. Why do you think so many are telling trump to man up and condemn this domestic terrorism. 

[Virgil Showlion]

Aug 12, 2017 22:22:26 GMT -5 oped said:

Condemning the white supremissists is overgeneralizing? Suggesting that the Nazis and the counter protesters aren't equal is ?

Optimist and others are talking about "Trump voters". Few posters would be comfortable generalizing to this degree.

A few more would be willing to generalize to the degree of "right-wing demonstrators at the protest", but the number would still be small since not every demonstrator was a white supremacist.

A few more than this would be willing to generalize to "white supremacists", although not all white supremacists are neo-Nazis or condone violence.

I believe the majority would generalize to "neo-Nazis" since neo-Nazism tolerates political terrorism. Since the act of terror is consistent with this doctrine, the neo-Nazis at the demonstration are culpable in a sense, even if they didn't participate in the act.

In any case, these threads tend to follow this progression of honing down from sweeping generalizations to modestly-sized groups.

[Peace Of Mind]

This is on fucking trump & his base. 

Trump absolutely did his part in revealing this mess and encourages it and has made it acceptable and that's despicable.  There are a sizeable amount of people that are misinformed, bigoted, and full of hate that now feel they have permission to let their disgusting behavior be shown.  It's because they think it's now okay and what they are doing will be without repercussions. They are small minded miserable people that don't have the critical thinking skills to realize they themselves are their real problem. But they’d rather hate and blame other’s that are different from them for the ills of their world instead of fixing themselves and their problems – usually of their own making.

We're in a sad state of affairs right now - in many ways.

Like I said last year, Trump's campaign for the Presidency made a lot of hateful people bold enough to openly reveal what's in their hearts. The ugliness was still around, it was just hidden. 

      You said it better than I.  

[weltschmerz]

Aug 12, 2017 19:48:10 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

I saw this on the news. This is disgusting and stupid... and my suggestion of punishment would be for the driver to be run over (if I could pick the punishment. I believe that violent criminal acts should be punished with equal violence).

But I won't blame "all Trump supporters" because many of Trump's supporters simply didn't, in their opinion, have a better choice. Hillary was going to continue Obama's legacy, and would have nominated liberal judges, and she was/is corrupt. This is just my opinion, but I believe that most of those that voted for Trump are just conservative in their beliefs... and part of living in a free country is respecting people that believe differently.

I give no support to violence though. None whatsoever. There's no excuse for violence just because someone believes differently than you or has different color skin or has different values than you do, or has different body parts than you or dresses differently than you think that they should dress.




*note: any "yous" or "yours" are all meant in the general sense and are not directed at anyone here.

The bodies aren't even cold yet, and you're on your anti-Hillary soapbox.

Bad form, Richard.

[Deleted]

Actually I'm not on any "soap-box". I gave a legitimate reason that had nothing to do with racist hate for people to vote for Trump. It's not "anti-Hillary" to point out reality of people having those reasons.

There are a lot of people out there (anti-Trumpers... whom I bet you didn't make the same "the bodies aren't even cold yet..." BS comment to) that say some variation of "Well, you Trumpers got what you wanted!". Hell some of them are HERE on this board and on this thread... and no... most people that voted for him didn't WANT this. They just wanted a conservative and an end to Obama's policies.

[Deleted]

You might buy a jacket made by children in sweat shop so that you personally can stay warm... but you are fooling yourself if you think that you don't own a piece of that sweat shop also by perpetuating the environment. 

You picked trump. This was foreseeable. He told you exactly who he was and where he was headed. You get to own a piece of that too.

If you don't want to, may I suggest resistbot. And visiting your representatives regularly to explain what you won't tolerate. 

[Opti]

Aug 12, 2017 22:19:07 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

Aug 12, 2017 22:13:47 GMT -5 Opti said:

Not true. This event was organized to get the pro white racists to organize and think in sync. The statue stuff was mostly an excuse. MSN even has a nice article on the organizer that I probably referenced in this thread or the other one.

So, if it had nothing to do with the statue, They showed up to make trouble? the other side only showed up to make it a peaceful gathering ?? Did I get that right??

Did you get that right? No.

I think the organizer did this meetup in public as a show of force. Perhaps you missed the pics showing some of the pro white racists with guns, helmets, and armor on. They aren't dressed that way to have nice respectful discussions on how to preserve white culture.

I think some of the counter protestors intended a peaceful counter demonstration and some went to beat on pro white racists.

[Deleted]

I love when intentions backfire www.wdrb.com/story/36123063/a-kentucky-mayor-pushes-to-remove-2-confederate-statues

[Opti]

Aug 12, 2017 22:38:17 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

Aug 12, 2017 22:22:26 GMT -5 oped said:

Condemning the white supremissists is overgeneralizing? Suggesting that the Nazis and the counter protesters aren't equal is ?

Optimist and others are talking about "Trump voters". Few posters would be comfortable generalizing to this degree.

A few more would be willing to generalize to the degree of "right-wing demonstrators at the protest", but the number would still be small since not every demonstrator was a white supremacist.

A few more than this would be willing to generalize to "white supremacists", although not all white supremacists are neo-Nazis or condone violence.

I believe the majority would generalize to "neo-Nazis" since neo-Nazism tolerates political terrorism. Since the act of terror is consistent with this doctrine, the neo-Nazis at the demonstration are culpable in a sense, even if they didn't participate in the act.

In any case, these threads tend to follow this progression of honing down from sweeping generalizations to modestly-sized groups.

Actually I think quite a few people would be comfortable generalizing to that degree which is why I posted. Trump embraced the pro white racist coalition to win. This is why he won't speak out against them, probably ever while  in office. It is also why David Duke feels comfortable calling him out publicly. Trump didn't lose the popular vote because of illegals, but he did win the EC because of pro white racists groups.

He's painfully aware of that which is why it took so long for a statement to be crafted he felt he could deliver safely. MO.

I don't want to make all Trump voters responsible for this, however, most people knew things like this would happen if Trump won.

[zibazinski]

That shoe sure pinches when it's on the other foot.

[Deleted]

What shoe is that? What foot? The nazi foot?

[zibazinski]

😇

[OldCoyote]

Aug 13, 2017 5:29:33 GMT -5 Opti said:

Aug 12, 2017 22:19:07 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

So, if it had nothing to do with the statue, They showed up to make trouble? the other side only showed up to make it a peaceful gathering ?? Did I get that right??

Did you get that right? No.

I think the organizer did this meetup in public as a show of force. Perhaps you missed the pics showing some of the pro white racists with guns, helmets, and armor on. They aren't dressed that way to have nice respectful discussions on how to preserve white culture.

I think some of the counter protestors intended a peaceful counter demonstration and some went to beat on pro white racists.

If we had three anti protestors show up with good intention, That makes it ok for all the rest of the anti protestors to block the streets throw thing and get into fights with the protestors?

There no innocent people in this, From the politically correct that want to rewrite history, to the one's that showed up to protest that, to the ones that showed up to protest the protestors!

Each one is equally guilty in this!

opt4ft, you are going out of the way to present a reasonable argument,  without a bunch of hysteria.

[OldCoyote]

The person that used his car as a weapon will pay for that,

If it had been a left leaning person had climbed into a semi truck, ran down a bunch of the White Nationalist,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Wooooooould you have been as quick to condemn that action??

[Shooby]

The driver of the car should be tried and executed.  Not 20 yrs from now, but justice should be swift.  Instead these criminals languish on death row for decades.  That is ridiculous.  Have the trial, feed him a last meal, then send him to the electric chair.

[Deleted]

Every single fucking time.

[OldCoyote]

Aug 13, 2017 8:02:46 GMT -5 Shooby said:

The driver of the car should be tried and executed.  Not 20 yrs from now, but justice should be swift.  Instead these criminals languish on death row for decades.  That is ridiculous.  Have the trial, feed him a last meal, then send him to the electric chair.

Ahhhh Geeees shooby, Now you are going to be the target of the left side of this board because you are now supporting the death penalty!

[busymom]

This isn't a group that appears to be dressing for a march only (yes, it's the Nazi-KKK side).  They came to fight.  (Notice all of the protesters wearing helmets in the crowd behind this group in front with the shields?  I've also seen other images with people carrying baseball bats.)

[Shooby]

Yes.  And, you call in the Riot Police to stand guard.  Just like they do for all other protests.  

[OldCoyote]

Aug 13, 2017 8:28:53 GMT -5 busymom said:

This isn't a group that appears to be dressing for a march only (yes, it's the Nazi-KKK side).  They came to fight.  (Notice all of the protesters wearing helmets in the crowd behind this group in front with the shields?  I've also seen other images with people carrying baseball bats.)

which side is which??

[Tennesseer]

Aug 13, 2017 8:34:58 GMT -5 OldCoyote said:

Aug 13, 2017 8:28:53 GMT -5 busymom said:

This isn't a group that appears to be dressing for a march only (yes, it's the Nazi-KKK side).  They came to fight.  (Notice all of the protesters wearing helmets in the crowd behind this group in front with the shields?  I've also seen other images with people carrying baseball bats.)

which side is which??

Those are your guys, the white nationalists.

[Shooby]

OK, well here are "your guys" at Berkley: