djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Dec 31, 2016 17:48:08 GMT -5
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Dec 31, 2016 18:03:47 GMT -5
OK? Are we supposed to do a cheer or what? I will cheer loudly for him on Jan 20th.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Dec 31, 2016 18:04:40 GMT -5
However, funny how his popularity didn't translate into anyone voting for the Dem party! LOL!!!!
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Dec 31, 2016 18:14:12 GMT -5
OK? Are we supposed to do a cheer or what? i was shooting for "acknowledge". but sure, you can cheer, too, if you like.I will cheer loudly for him on Jan 20th. i find that extremely doubtful, but you can do whatever you like, of course. until the Fourth Reich takes over.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Dec 31, 2016 18:15:04 GMT -5
However, funny how his popularity didn't translate into anyone voting for the Dem party! LOL!!!! i disagree. Clinton would have lost by much more without Obama. at least that is what statisticians say.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Dec 31, 2016 18:16:43 GMT -5
for everyone else: i post things that i find interesting. particularly things that are counter-intuitive. one might suspect that Obama was reviled as much as W or Carter.
that is not the case.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on Dec 31, 2016 18:18:48 GMT -5
I still feel dirty about having voted for carter. I never told DH I was so ashamed
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Dec 31, 2016 18:29:09 GMT -5
I still feel dirty about having voted for carter. I never told DH I was so ashamed your secret is safe here. i think he was a good man, and a lousy president. my dad hated Carter with the heat of 1000 suns. that is the environment i grew up in. that is where my roots lie. and that is why i can count the number of times i have voted Democrat on one hand.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on Dec 31, 2016 18:51:01 GMT -5
OK? Are we supposed to do a cheer or what? I will cheer loudly for him on Jan 20th. Who is providing the entertainment? From members of the Mormon Tabernacle Choir to Celine Dion to members of the Rockettes to Elton John to Andrea Bocelli to Justin Timberlake to Katy Perry...all dropping out or turning down his invitation. Maybe Scott Baio will re-enact an episode of Charles In Charge?
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dezailoooooo
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Post by dezailoooooo on Dec 31, 2016 19:38:53 GMT -5
Surprisingly to me Fox approval was at 53%....and the Donald still dissing the man and his accomplishments..One going out on a high note..other coming in from the low one...
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dezailoooooo
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Post by dezailoooooo on Dec 31, 2016 19:56:37 GMT -5
OK? Are we supposed to do a cheer or what? I will cheer loudly for him on Jan 20th. Shooby these figures are incredable even if u won't admit it..I know u realize that as I know for u to so acknowledge it is just to much to ask from u so we just move on from your what evers...
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dezailoooooo
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Post by dezailoooooo on Dec 31, 2016 19:59:32 GMT -5
I still feel dirty about having voted for carter. I never told DH I was so ashamed your secret is safe here. i think he was a good man, and a lousy president. my dad hated Carter with the heat of 1000 suns. that is the environment i grew up in. that is where my roots lie. and that is why i can count the number of times i have voted Democrat on one hand. Thats a lot more then I ever voted for a Republican...think I may have voted for Bush # 1first time or second..but then again may have changed at last minute..can't remember..
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sesfw
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Post by sesfw on Jan 1, 2017 14:26:37 GMT -5
i think he was a good man, and a lousy president. dj, for once here is something we can agree on
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jan 1, 2017 14:28:21 GMT -5
i think he was a good man, and a lousy president. dj, for once here is something we can agree on if we stay off the hot button issues, i think we would find broad consensus, sesfw. i was raised by a conservative, and i have a lot of conservative values, despite the fact that i post from a liberal perspective, and am an unapologetic liberal.
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jan 1, 2017 14:29:22 GMT -5
Surprisingly to me Fox approval was at 53%....and the Donald still dissing the man and his accomplishments..One going out on a high note..other coming in from the low one... FOX uses outside polling when they are not relying on Rasmussen. you should not expect the results to be any different than mainstream polling when they do so.
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Jan 3, 2017 6:20:18 GMT -5
OK? Are we supposed to do a cheer or what? I will cheer loudly for him on Jan 20th. Shooby these figures are incredable even if u won't admit it..I know u realize that as I know for u to so acknowledge it is just to much to ask from u so we just move on from your what evers... Obama's Presidency was all about Obama. He did nothing to promote the Dem Party. He was about self promotion. So, if you wanna cheer him while adding up all your political losses in state, local and federal govt, then party on!!! Woot!!
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Jan 3, 2017 6:21:48 GMT -5
However, applying your standard, you could likewise acknowledge how Trump turned the whole political process upside down and a truly broke down the barriers of the current corrupt system. Or you can carry on as usual while lecturing us! LOL!
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Shooby
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Post by Shooby on Jan 3, 2017 8:44:47 GMT -5
He's ...so ... POP u lar......he's ...so.... POP u lar. Crown him the Prom King! Woot!
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jan 3, 2017 10:14:07 GMT -5
I have to admit that I'm very surprised. But perhaps I'm biased because I don't approve of him?
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jan 3, 2017 12:07:19 GMT -5
I have to admit that I'm very surprised. But perhaps I'm biased because I don't approve of him? this is PRECISELY the observation i was looking for. thank you, MT.
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Jan 3, 2017 12:17:45 GMT -5
I'm not at all surprised. He faced unprecentented opposition from Day 1. He (and his family) endured smears, attacks from every quarter. But he presevered with grace and I think history will judge him well.
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jan 3, 2017 12:25:12 GMT -5
I have to admit that I'm very surprised. But perhaps I'm biased because I don't approve of him? this is PRECISELY the observation i was looking for. thank you, MT. LOL! I am more than willing to admit my shortcomings
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Kolt!
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Post by Kolt! on Jan 3, 2017 12:30:20 GMT -5
The democratic party lost not because of the democratic party but because of the blunt untrust of Hillary Clinton.
Many people that would have voted Bernie Sanders as well went to Trump because they were mad or third party. We had a LOT of third party voters this election.
My parents said they would have voted for Sanders over Trump but could not and would not vote for Clinton. My mom went third party and my dad went Trump.
Obama and Sanders both probably helped Clinton get some of the supporters she got.
And this election was so close with the President only winning the electoral college which is very rare. Clinton actually had more votes for her then Obama had and he won the election. Obama had about has many popular votes as Trump had... roughly 62 million votes whereas Clinton had 65 million votes.
I know a lot of Democratic and Republicans that would still rather take four more years of Obama over risking it with Clinton or Trump...
-- At the end of the day the thing about President Obama is that even if you don't agree that he's a great President...most people do agree he seems like the type of guy that would be a good dude to have over for a dinner party. A lot of people can't think of that with Clinton or Trump. Clinton would be too stand offish with her awkward smiles that make you wonder if she can be trusted while Trump would be loud, and disrespectful to a lot of the dinner guests and think it's okay to make perverted jokes about grabbing a woman's private parts. It's like inviting Professor Umbridge and Lord Voldemort over for dinner and that's in no way me saying Trump is worse then Clinton...it's the same. Many of the Harry Potter fandom actually hated Umbridge more than Voldemort.
Obama would at least know how to behave himself. >.>
-- Heck, honestly so many people rip on Obama Care but that's because some people had there insurance go up. But, he couldn't get free healthcare and something needed to be done. I think some stuff needs to be worked on of course but the idea behind it was good. Even Trump has acknowledged that and says he's keeping it but going to work on changes and OF course he feels the need to change the name.
As someone mentioned it's good that health insurance companies can't deny someone healthcare because of pre-existing issues and children being able to be on insurance until 26 was a good idea too because so many kids have to go to University now and it gives them a chance to complete school and find a job. 4-6 years at University. 2-4 years to find a job and get to supporting themselves.
That and so many people would cry hard up when they got ill and didn't have insurance...
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Gardening Grandma
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Post by Gardening Grandma on Jan 3, 2017 12:52:36 GMT -5
I find it astonishing that anyone who genuinely supported Sanders would cast a vote for a man who was the anthisis of everything Sanders stood for.
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dezailoooooo
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Post by dezailoooooo on Jan 3, 2017 14:38:34 GMT -5
The democratic party lost not because of the democratic party but because of the blunt untrust of Hillary Clinton. Many people that would have voted Bernie Sanders as well went to Trump because they were mad or third party. We had a LOT of third party voters this election. My parents said they would have voted for Sanders over Trump but could not and would not vote for Clinton. My mom went third party and my dad went Trump. Obama and Sanders both probably helped Clinton get some of the supporters she got. And this election was so close with the President only winning the electoral college which is very rare. Clinton actually had more votes for her then Obama had and he won the election. Obama had about has many popular votes as Trump had... roughly 62 million votes whereas Clinton had 65 million votes. I know a lot of Democratic and Republicans that would still rather take four more years of Obama over risking it with Clinton or Trump... -- At the end of the day the thing about President Obama is that even if you don't agree that he's a great President...most people do agree he seems like the type of guy that would be a good dude to have over for a dinner party. A lot of people can't think of that with Clinton or Trump. Clinton would be too stand offish with her awkward smiles that make you wonder if she can be trusted while Trump would be loud, and disrespectful to a lot of the dinner guests and think it's okay to make perverted jokes about grabbing a woman's private parts. It's like inviting Professor Umbridge and Lord Voldemort over for dinner and that's in no way me saying Trump is worse then Clinton...it's the same. Many of the Harry Potter fandom actually hated Umbridge more than Voldemort. Obama would at least know how to behave himself. >.> -- Heck, honestly so many people rip on Obama Care but that's because some people had there insurance go up. But, he couldn't get free healthcare and something needed to be done. I think some stuff needs to be worked on of course but the idea behind it was good. Even Trump has acknowledged that and says he's keeping it but going to work on changes and OF course he feels the need to change the name. As someone mentioned it's good that health insurance companies can't deny someone healthcare because of pre-existing issues and children being able to be on insurance until 26 was a good idea too because so many kids have to go to University now and it gives them a chance to complete school and find a job. 4-6 years at University. 2-4 years to find a job and get to supporting themselves. That and so many people would cry hard up when they got ill and didn't have insurance... No one ever said the afordable care act was flawless...no one said it didn't need tweaking over time.. One of the reasons it came into being if any one wants to remember was that Insurence costs were going up almost/seeming daily..many businesses were opting out of offering coverage to their employees or if still keeping, demanding the employee pick up more and more of the % of the costs..plus Ins companys dropping coverage..also, if I remember correctly , not one Republican crossed the aisle and voted with Dems..on such a bill..not one and don't think any really put their ideas forth either ..possible Dems didn't want their input..doubt that, but not one on such a bill and no crossing..thus u got what u got.. Even now, GOP is in a bind..they have to end it...almost from day one , 1/20..ok maybe give it till the 21st..but must end it BUT I doubt they have a new plan ready...in fact from what I read and understand, to do this properly it will take time.. Also, forgot to mention...those things that the Donald wants to keep..such as children covered till age 26, no pre conditions disqualifing and other parts of....unaffordable unless the young also opt out for carrying the insurance and so far isn't happening in the numbers needed to sustain the care act... For this to succeed , Obama care OR what ever the GOP will want..like SS..if one is working paying taxes..everyone has to participate...What should have been done and said..not back them selves into a corner as they did..just say we are visiting it and we will improve it , we will tweak it where needed and admit both sides need to be on this..but nooo...so it will be, IMHO a real mess for some years and still have high costs..possible every change in Administrations it will be revisited by whichever party is in power..FUBAR
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Miss Tequila
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Post by Miss Tequila on Jan 3, 2017 14:53:47 GMT -5
The democratic party lost not because of the democratic party but because of the blunt untrust of Hillary Clinton. Many people that would have voted Bernie Sanders as well went to Trump because they were mad or third party. We had a LOT of third party voters this election. My parents said they would have voted for Sanders over Trump but could not and would not vote for Clinton. My mom went third party and my dad went Trump. Obama and Sanders both probably helped Clinton get some of the supporters she got. And this election was so close with the President only winning the electoral college which is very rare. Clinton actually had more votes for her then Obama had and he won the election. Obama had about has many popular votes as Trump had... roughly 62 million votes whereas Clinton had 65 million votes. I know a lot of Democratic and Republicans that would still rather take four more years of Obama over risking it with Clinton or Trump... -- At the end of the day the thing about President Obama is that even if you don't agree that he's a great President...most people do agree he seems like the type of guy that would be a good dude to have over for a dinner party. A lot of people can't think of that with Clinton or Trump. Clinton would be too stand offish with her awkward smiles that make you wonder if she can be trusted while Trump would be loud, and disrespectful to a lot of the dinner guests and think it's okay to make perverted jokes about grabbing a woman's private parts. It's like inviting Professor Umbridge and Lord Voldemort over for dinner and that's in no way me saying Trump is worse then Clinton...it's the same. Many of the Harry Potter fandom actually hated Umbridge more than Voldemort. Obama would at least know how to behave himself. >.> -- Heck, honestly so many people rip on Obama Care but that's because some people had there insurance go up. But, he couldn't get free healthcare and something needed to be done. I think some stuff needs to be worked on of course but the idea behind it was good. Even Trump has acknowledged that and says he's keeping it but going to work on changes and OF course he feels the need to change the name. As someone mentioned it's good that health insurance companies can't deny someone healthcare because of pre-existing issues and children being able to be on insurance until 26 was a good idea too because so many kids have to go to University now and it gives them a chance to complete school and find a job. 4-6 years at University. 2-4 years to find a job and get to supporting themselves. That and so many people would cry hard up when they got ill and didn't have insurance... No one ever said the afordable care act was flawless...no one said it didn't need tweaking over time.. One of the reasons it came into being if any one wants to remember was that Insurence costs were going up almost/seeming daily..many businesses were opting out of offering coverage to their employees or if still keeping, demanding the employee pick up more and more of the % of the costs..plus Ins companys dropping coverage..also, if I remember correctly , not one Republican crossed the aisle and voted with Dems..on such a bill..not one and don't think any really put their ideas forth either ..possible Dems didn't want their input..doubt that, but not one on such a bill and no crossing..thus u got what u got.. Even now, GOP is in a bind..they have to end it...almost from day one , 1/20..ok maybe give it till the 21st..but must end it BUT I doubt they have a new plan ready...in fact from what I read and understand, to do this properly it will take time.. Also, forgot to mention...those things that the Donald wants to keep..such as children covered till age 26, no pre conditions disqualifing and other parts of....unaffordable unless the young also opt out for carrying the insurance and so far isn't happening in the numbers needed to sustain the care act... For this to succeed , Obama care OR what ever the GOP will want..like SS..if one is working paying taxes..everyone has to participate...What should have been done and said..not back them selves into a corner as they did..just say we are visiting it and we will improve it , we will tweak it where needed and admit both sides need to be on this..but nooo...so it will be, IMHO a real mess for some years and still have high costs..possible every change in Administrations it will be revisited by whichever party is in power..FUBAR My issue with Obamacare is that is did absolutely nothing to curtail the cost of healthcare. I'm on the healthcare committee at work and I see our loss runs (obviously not the names of the employees). It is freaking crazy how expensive everything is. It isn't the insurance companies, it is the actual cost of healthcare. That is what I want addressed. Until we solve the cost of care issue we will never solve the insurance issue.
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dezailoooooo
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Post by dezailoooooo on Jan 3, 2017 15:16:15 GMT -5
No one ever said the afordable care act was flawless...no one said it didn't need tweaking over time.. One of the reasons it came into being if any one wants to remember was that Insurence costs were going up almost/seeming daily..many businesses were opting out of offering coverage to their employees or if still keeping, demanding the employee pick up more and more of the % of the costs..plus Ins companys dropping coverage..also, if I remember correctly , not one Republican crossed the aisle and voted with Dems..on such a bill..not one and don't think any really put their ideas forth either ..possible Dems didn't want their input..doubt that, but not one on such a bill and no crossing..thus u got what u got.. Even now, GOP is in a bind..they have to end it...almost from day one , 1/20..ok maybe give it till the 21st..but must end it BUT I doubt they have a new plan ready...in fact from what I read and understand, to do this properly it will take time.. Also, forgot to mention...those things that the Donald wants to keep..such as children covered till age 26, no pre conditions disqualifing and other parts of....unaffordable unless the young also opt out for carrying the insurance and so far isn't happening in the numbers needed to sustain the care act... For this to succeed , Obama care OR what ever the GOP will want..like SS..if one is working paying taxes..everyone has to participate...What should have been done and said..not back them selves into a corner as they did..just say we are visiting it and we will improve it , we will tweak it where needed and admit both sides need to be on this..but nooo...so it will be, IMHO a real mess for some years and still have high costs..possible every change in Administrations it will be revisited by whichever party is in power..FUBAR My issue with Obamacare is that is did absolutely nothing to curtail the cost of healthcare. I'm on the healthcare committee at work and I see our loss runs (obviously not the names of the employees). It is freaking crazy how expensive everything is. It isn't the insurance companies, it is the actual cost of healthcare. That is what I want addressed. Until we solve the cost of care issue we will never solve the insurance issue. You may be right..on the cost of, or u may be wrong..we'll never know what the cost would be if it hadn't been enacted..If u go to the beginning of my thread above u will see I mention that costs were skyrocketing when the act was considered..they thought it would control costs but it didn't and they dropped that boast pretty quickly..It did add millions to the rolls of having insurance, be able to have a reguler doctor for tests..good health instead of useing emergency rooms for their medical needs..inefficient, no follow up care and way to expensive plus clogging up space needed for real emergencys... I have great coverage..medicare AND a suppliment policy that covers the 20% I am responsible for plus allows me to see any doctor, no referrals..Having a stroke this year very aware of costs..one week in hospital, no special care, np operations..$150,000..no they wearn't paid that by medicare but what they billed.. I believe all should have coverage..hope u do too/ One of the problems of skyrocketing costs is that to keep costs in check everyone needs to be covered and paying into the system and that means the youngest who will need coverage usually the least..didn't say never...they too get hurt, accidents..so many.and real illnesses..just not as much do to their age.. Methinks your dissing of obama care was more that u didn't like the messenger.. My issue with Obamacare is that is did absolutely nothing to curtail the cost of healthcare.} thus better to shoot him . Medical costs will always be high...the Donald and friends will soon find that out and we probably see many now covered dropped from the rolls too...including so many I believe who were the ones who supported the loudest...won't that be a bitch...[no not happy about that at all]
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jan 3, 2017 15:28:17 GMT -5
this is PRECISELY the observation i was looking for. thank you, MT. LOL! I am more than willing to admit my shortcomings see, you ARE in the 1%. that is a VERY admirable trait. do you also know what you are good at?
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djAdvocate
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Post by djAdvocate on Jan 3, 2017 15:29:48 GMT -5
No one ever said the afordable care act was flawless...no one said it didn't need tweaking over time.. One of the reasons it came into being if any one wants to remember was that Insurence costs were going up almost/seeming daily..many businesses were opting out of offering coverage to their employees or if still keeping, demanding the employee pick up more and more of the % of the costs..plus Ins companys dropping coverage..also, if I remember correctly , not one Republican crossed the aisle and voted with Dems..on such a bill..not one and don't think any really put their ideas forth either ..possible Dems didn't want their input..doubt that, but not one on such a bill and no crossing..thus u got what u got.. Even now, GOP is in a bind..they have to end it...almost from day one , 1/20..ok maybe give it till the 21st..but must end it BUT I doubt they have a new plan ready...in fact from what I read and understand, to do this properly it will take time.. Also, forgot to mention...those things that the Donald wants to keep..such as children covered till age 26, no pre conditions disqualifing and other parts of....unaffordable unless the young also opt out for carrying the insurance and so far isn't happening in the numbers needed to sustain the care act... For this to succeed , Obama care OR what ever the GOP will want..like SS..if one is working paying taxes..everyone has to participate...What should have been done and said..not back them selves into a corner as they did..just say we are visiting it and we will improve it , we will tweak it where needed and admit both sides need to be on this..but nooo...so it will be, IMHO a real mess for some years and still have high costs..possible every change in Administrations it will be revisited by whichever party is in power..FUBAR My issue with Obamacare is that is did absolutely nothing to curtail the cost of healthcare. I'm on the healthcare committee at work and I see our loss runs (obviously not the names of the employees). It is freaking crazy how expensive everything is. It isn't the insurance companies, it is the actual cost of healthcare. That is what I want addressed. Until we solve the cost of care issue we will never solve the insurance issue. healthcare inflation is actually at a 50 year low. it is not "lower healthcare costs", but it beats having them go up double digits.
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dee27
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Post by dee27 on Jan 3, 2017 15:34:43 GMT -5
Healthcare is expensive and I think hospitals and doctors are not concerned about the cost to the patient especially if that patient is insured. It drives me nuts when I ask how much a treatment will cost and the doctor has no idea. Would I go to a car mechanic who has no idea what the repair job would cost? No way! However, the medical field treats procedure costs like they are a hidden formula. Without transparency for the cost of the treatment, how can consumers (patients) make the best decision about their treatment.
Medicare is testing a different model in large urban areas for cardiac patients and orthopedic patients who may need knee/hip replacement. Medicare wants doctors to emphasize the less costly treatments like exercise plans and physical therapy instead of surgery, but PT coverage is less than 2K/year and prescribed exercise plans are out of pocket for the patient. Rather than controlling treatment costs, Medicare is shifting the responsibility of paying for the treatment to the patients. This method might save money for Medicare, but historically many patients will stop treatments they cannot afford just like they do with drugs they cannot afford. Historically, there are a number of patients who will not follow through with home exercise prescribed by PT. The impact to the patients is if they do not improve, they would eventually need the expensive surgery which Medicare does cover. If Medicare wants to prove that the suggested model will help patients become healthier, they need to pay for the prescribed treatments.
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