Waffle House refuses to serve uniformed soldier carrying gun

[Deleted]

Waffle House refuses to serve uniformed soldier carrying gun
2:49 PM, SEPTEMBER 29, 2015

NICHOLASVILLE, Ky. — A social media post about an armed soldier who was refused service at a Kentucky restaurant is going viral.

According to WLEX, Billy Welch is an Army National Guard soldier. Welch says he always keeps his gun holstered to his side for safety reasons. But that gun was the source of an issue on Sunday.

Welch says around 1:30 a.m. he stopped at the Waffle House in Nicholsville wearing his military uniform with his gun by his side.

After ordering his food, he said a waitress signaled for him to come over.

“I got up and I walked over to them, asked them how they were doing and stuff, and they said I’d have to take my firearm outside,” Welch told WLEX. “I don’t feel comfortable taking my firearm away from me. I always keep it with me and they said, ‘it’s one of our policies.’”


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More here: WEBPAGE LINK - WGN TV (Independant Station)

[Deleted]

What the hell, Waffle House?

Refusing to serve a SERVICE MEMBER is seriously un-cool. I will be following this story to see how Waffle House (corporate and the local one) responds.

[Deleted]

He should have said he was gay.

[Deleted]

What the hell would that have to do with anything?

[mroped]

Unless said soldier was on duty-tracking a fugitive, escorting something/someone, etc- there was no reason to have a gun in a public place such as Waffle House.
All due respect to him and his service but the "I don't feel safe without my gun" is a bit lame.
He was at least asked first to remove it inside the establishment so if he really wanted waffles all he had to do was remove the weapon!
Or find an alternate place to eat!

[Deleted]

Sept 30, 2015 17:58:37 GMT -5 mroped said:

Unless said soldier was on duty-tracking a fugitive, escorting something/someone, etc- there was no reason to have a gun in a public place such as Waffle House.
All due respect to him and his service but the "I don't feel safe without my gun" is a bit lame.
He was at least asked first to remove it inside the establishment so if he really wanted waffles all he had to do was remove the weapon!
Or find an alternate place to eat!

I don't think store owners should have any right to say anything about their customers.  It should be disinterested people with no cash in the business or ownership in the business and no risk in the business, those are the people who should decide how the business operates.

[Tennesseer]

What is Waffle House's policy on weapons in their restaurants?

Also keep in mind military uniforms, whole or in part, can be bought by anyone.  Maybe the restaurant was not sure who a lone individual was at 0130 hours.  Waffle House erred on the side of caution.

ETA: I see the restaurant(s) have a no firearms policy. From the provided link:

“For many years we have had a ‘No Firearms’ policy in place in our restaurants. We continue to believe this is the best policy for the safety of our customers and associates.”

[zibazinski]

He'd have been smarter to have it concealed . I carry in there and plenty of other places where it says "no-no!" My attitude is "bite me."

[mroped]

What it bothers me most is the "I don't feel safe without my weapon" part.
He is a soldier. On the U.S. territory we are at peace. If he doesn't feel safe here, home and he needs to carry a weapon, what would he do in a conflict zone? Carry a Gatling Gun around?
I believe him to be one of the " look at me I'm a soldier and I have a weapon strapped to my hip!" kind.
Ive never seen a soldier carrying a weapon unless he was on assignment. Does he feel the need to be different?
And regardless if they have or not a policy of "no weapons" in the restaurant, he was asked to remove it, he wasn't asked to vacate the premises because he is carrying a weapon. 
From all, a soldier should understand best that a visible weapon could make people uneasy!

[deziloooooo]

Sept 30, 2015 17:35:25 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

What the hell, Waffle House?

Refusing to serve a SERVICE MEMBER is seriously un-cool. I will be following this story to see how Waffle House (corporate and the local one) responds.

After reading the article..if that was all there was to it, IMHO..badly written article. To many questions unanswered.

In this particuler incident...was the individual..National Guardsman..on active service...even active drill day...was the weapons authorized to be carried...Military personnel don't just decide on their own to decide " I think I will carry my weapon today.." Doesn't work that way....With all the firepower in typical military unit..even non combat branches...there is tight controls over weapons and definitely ammunition..Items are under lock and key..authorization from commanders to release them..

I am guessing Waffle House makes exceptions for law enforcement personnel..also if a activated National Guard unit was in area during civil emergencies and authorized to carry weapons , exception would be made if units came in to eat..{ Possible larger weapons might be carried or possible stacked under guard though personnel weapons..hand guns..would most likely be carried..If in a training  mode ..say weekend drill, National Guard or Reserve unit..doubt if any ammunition would be issued..no need..

This sounds to me as if the Guardsman has a carry license...thats a personal thing..and doubt he would have his own personnel weapon to be carried when on duty..just not the way military works...

Poorly written article IMHO...

PS  I actually miss the Waffle House chain...Great place for Breakfast and stuff ...especially late at night ...none in my area I believe...

[Deleted]

Sept 30, 2015 17:58:37 GMT -5 mroped said:

Unless said soldier was on duty-tracking a fugitive, escorting something/someone, etc- there was no reason to have a gun in a public place such as Waffle House.
All due respect to him and his service but the "I don't feel safe without my gun" is a bit lame.
He was at least asked first to remove it inside the establishment so if he really wanted waffles all he had to do was remove the weapon!
Or find an alternate place to eat!

Just out of curiosity... where did you see the bolded. I read the article several times and couldn't find it.

[Deleted]

Sept 30, 2015 18:06:49 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

What is Waffle House's policy on weapons in their restaurants?

Also keep in mind military uniforms, whole or in part, can be bought by anyone.  Maybe the restaurant was not sure who a lone individual was at 0130 hours.  Waffle House erred on the side of caution.

ETA: I see the restaurant(s) have a no firearms policy. From the provided link:

“For many years we have had a ‘No Firearms’ policy in place in our restaurants. We continue to believe this is the best policy for the safety of our customers and associates.”

Found this on a blog as a supposed reply to an e-mail... so it may or man NOT be true:

Waffle House policy on firearms:
No fire arms, guns, knives or other potentially dangerous weapons of any kind are allowed on Waffle House property except in the possession of a law enforcement officer or a security guard (in uniform).

Worthy of note: we do not know that the serviceman was not on duty (they have to eat, and at that time it could have been a "meal break" for him). We do not know his MOS (job), he could have been an MP (which would allow him to wear a sidearm while in uniform, on or off base).

[Tennesseer]

[djAdvocate]

a Waffle House can refuse to accommodate for ANY non-discriminatory reason.

ANY.

[973beachbum]

I'm confused.  I know lots of people who were in the military and they weren't allowed to carry their firearm off base period.  Most I don't think were even issued one.  My dad was in the medical core and my BIL was a supply sgt.  Why exactly would they have needed to be armed in Ma or De type of places??  If it was his own personal gun it makes me wonder why he is allowed to just strap it on and not be "out of uniform"?   Maybe one of our members who was in the military can answer.  Sum Dum Gai maybe?

As far as random people being armed it does surprise me when I see them and some I have knows for years.  There is a man who is a security gaurd for nj DMV.  He comes in the GC almost every night in uniform with his gun.  Other than that only police officers in uniform have guns and since this is NJ very few people have carry permits that aren't. 

My PSA for the day is to warn people that you really shouldn't come to NJ and expect that your state's permit to carry will be honored.  The laws for guns are very strict and they don't care if you are Mother Theresa.  If you don't have a NJ permit you better not be caught carrying a firearm unless you really want to see the inside of a jail.

[Politically_Incorrect12]

Sept 30, 2015 19:42:58 GMT -5 973beachbum said:

I'm confused.  I know lots of people who were in the military and they weren't allowed to carry their firearm off base period.  Most I don't think were even issued one.  My dad was in the medical core and my BIL was a supply sgt.  Why exactly would they have needed to be armed in Ma or De type of places??  If it was his own personal gun it makes me wonder why he is allowed to just strap it on and not be "out of uniform"?   Maybe one of our members who was in the military can answer.  Sum Dum Gai maybe?

As far as random people being armed it does surprise me when I see them and some I have knows for years.  There is a man who is a security gaurd for nj DMV.  He comes in the GC almost every night in uniform with his gun.  Other than that only police officers in uniform have guns and since this is NJ very few people have carry permits that aren't. 

My PSA for the day is to warn people that you really shouldn't come to NJ and expect that your state's permit to carry will be honored.  The laws for guns are very strict and they don't care if you are Mother Theresa.  If you don't have a NJ permit you better not be caught carrying a firearm unless you really want to see the inside of a jail.

The only time I remember carrying a weapon off base was either in a combat zone or on the way to training (and we didn't stop at a public place to eat in between).

[❤ mollymouser ❤]

It sounds like that was his personal weapon (as opposed to a military-issued one) and that he chose to open carry it at 1:30am into a restaurant. He wasn't carrying a military weapon off base as part of his job. (And he most likely ISN'T allowed to carry his personal weapon onto base.)

And, in all fairness to the wait staff, just because someone armed walks in wearing camouflage ~ that doesn't mean that they are ACTUALLY in the military and/or aren't up to no good. In this day and age, I'd certainly be cautious around such a person.

[Tennesseer]

There are fake soldiers out there (and in this article, fake Medal of Honor recipients too).



Is it a crime for a fake veteran to lieabout the medal of honor?

[fishy999]

Sept 30, 2015 17:35:25 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

What the hell, Waffle House?

Refusing to serve a SERVICE MEMBER is seriously un-cool. I will be following this story to see how Waffle House (corporate and the local one) responds.

Do they have special rights that the other customers do not?   They are not law enforcement- they are citizens that happen to be in the military and are subject to store policy.

This is not refusing service to a service member, this is asking a customer to leave their weapon in the car if they want shitty food.

[Mardi Gras Audrey]

I'm a vet and this guy seems to be out of control. I agree with the Waffle House staff.  They are dealing with someone who is armed at 2AM, someone who had been in a fight at their business a few weeks earlier (Waffle House says he was actively involved, he says he was attacked... either way, he was in it).

Just because someone is military or a vet, doesn't mean that they deserve special treatment. People forget that the military gets their people from the general population.  So, like the general population, there are members who are bullies, thugs, nuts, etc.  Yes, they try to weed them out but, at the end of the day, there is still a component that are the people that have issues, just like in the general public.

If this guy is saying he doesn't feel safe without a gun while stateside at a restaurant, he needs some help.  Either some help to calm himself down/deal with anxiety issues or some help in improving his judgement and not putting himself in situations where he is/feels unsafe. Anyone with good judgement would avoid a place where they feel unsafe if not armed. If he was hungry, he could always go to a 24 hr drive thru (I assume they have them in KY... I know other states have Steak & shake, WHite Castle, Jack in The Box, Whataburger, etc), a grocery store/Walmart, or grab something at a convenience store.

This guy had lots of options but he chose the worst one. Someone with that kind of judgement shouldn't be armed.

Here is some additional info.

www.lex18.com/story/30149876/waffle-house-releases-2nd-statement-on-incident-with-national-guard

[Mardi Gras Audrey]

FWIW, it sounds like he didn't really have a need to be in uniform, either.  When I was in, we were told to be low profile and try to blend in with the surrounding population. Wandering around at 2 AM in uniform with a gun is definitely not "blending in".  He should have been in civvies if he wasn't actually working. A quick change can be done in the car or the nearest bathroom. I did it many times.  We were also told to respect the areas we were at and their rules.  If a business says no guns, that means no guns.  Not "I'm a special snowflake military member, let me carry". 

[Tennesseer]

From Mardi Gras Audrey's link:

"Several people have questioned whether Welch was allowed to have his personal weapon on him while in uniform and off duty. A spokesperson for the Kentucky National Guard said Welch was authorized to do so because he had his concealed carry and was not brandishing the weapon. However, Welch also had to comply with the "no firearms" policy at Waffle House."

[mroped]

Ok Richard, he said " I don't feel comfortable taking my firearm from me..." 
One feels comfortable when is safe so there you have it: it's all Greek!

Regardless, being in uniform doesn't give him special rights aside from aforementioned cases. Also if he had a CAC permit, why did he have it holstered in plain view?
Does "concealed" mean anything for him? Or maybe in Kentucky words have different meanings.
Or maybe this guy is just after his 15 minutes of fame?!

[Deleted]

Sept 30, 2015 20:40:41 GMT -5 fishy999 said:

Sept 30, 2015 17:35:25 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

What the hell, Waffle House?

Refusing to serve a SERVICE MEMBER is seriously un-cool. I will be following this story to see how Waffle House (corporate and the local one) responds.

Do they have special rights that the other customers do not?   They are not law enforcement- they are citizens that happen to be in the military and are subject to store policy.

This is not refusing service to a service member, this is asking a customer to leave their weapon in the car if they want shitty food.

"Special rights"? No. How about "special respect" though.

[mroped]

"Special respect" as in ...it's all good! You can do whatever you want, rules don't apply to you!
Any person, soldier or otherwise gets respect and gratitude as the result of his/ her actions.
Asking for special rights doesn't earn you special respect!

[Deleted]

For the record (if anyone cares) Kentucky is an "open carry" state. He was legally within his rights to have it holstered and in view, in public, due to that fact.

But... more importantly. According to the link provided by Mardi Gras Audrey in Reply #19, he's proven to be a serviceman and authorized to carry. I guess that solves the "what if he was just a wacko dressed up as a soldier?" and "did he even have the right to be armed?" questions...

[Tennesseer]

Sept 30, 2015 21:55:45 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

For the record (if anyone cares) Kentucky is an "open carry" state. He was legally within his rights to have it holstered and in view, in public, due to that fact.

But... more importantly. According to the link provided by Mardi Gras Audrey in Reply #19, he's proven to be a serviceman and authorized to carry. I guess that solves the "what if he was just a wacko dressed up as a soldier?" and "did he even have the right to be armed?" questions...

Richard-you forgot this part of Audrey's link:

"A spokesperson for the Kentucky National Guard said Welch was authorized to do so because he had his concealed carry and was not brandishing the weapon. However, Welch also had to comply with the "no firearms" policy at Waffle House.""

[Deleted]

Ohhhh Research strikes again!

Found this little tid-bit while looking for Kentucky's open-carry status:

Guns Allowed Nearly Everywhere

Under the new law, only schools and colleges are exempt from the sweeping changes. Everywhere else, from the State Capitol to city halls, council chambers, community centers and libraries, guns are allowed.

When asked if the law includes public transportation, like buses, Damron didn’t flinch.

“Someone riding that bus has to have the ability to protect themselves,” he said.

Transit Authority of the River City Executive Director Barry Barker told WLKY guns on buses are still prohibited, while TARC studies the law.

In open spaces, like zoos and parks, the law goes further, preventing any local ban on concealed weapons.


Source

(bolding everywhere except the title is mine)

[Tennesseer]

I would imagine if you are in a military uniform, you must follow military rules until you are no longer in uniform.

[Deleted]

Sept 30, 2015 21:58:34 GMT -5 Tennesseer said:

Sept 30, 2015 21:55:45 GMT -5 @richardintn said:

For the record (if anyone cares) Kentucky is an "open carry" state. He was legally within his rights to have it holstered and in view, in public, due to that fact.

But... more importantly. According to the link provided by Mardi Gras Audrey in Reply #19, he's proven to be a serviceman and authorized to carry. I guess that solves the "what if he was just a wacko dressed up as a soldier?" and "did he even have the right to be armed?" questions...

Richard-you forgot this part of Audrey's link:

"A spokesperson for the Kentucky National Guard said Welch was authorized to do so because he had his concealed carry and was not brandishing the weapon. However, Welch also had to comply with the "no firearms" policy at Waffle House.""

I forgot nothing. I was addressing questions of him even being a soldier and questions of him being allowed to be armed in the first place... I was not addressing his being armed while inside the Waffle House. Re-read what I posted (and you quoted) for confirmation.

Note the italicized/bolded. I didn't say I was addressing the "did he have the right to be armed in a Waffle House?" question... just the "did he even have the right to be armed?" one.