Why do people hate lawyers?

[Deleted]

Actually one of the best defenses I've heard for defending a criminal was from a girlfriend's (atty) boss.

My job is to give him the best defense I can as well as the help he needs.

[973beachbum]

Mar 27, 2013 12:09:54 GMT -5 swamp said:

Mar 27, 2013 12:09:13 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

to be serious, I think people hate lawyers because they view them as a force against common sense. Laws cannot be be written to be common sense because some lawyer is going to exploit a hole in the law and twist it and turn it into something it was not meant to be to turn a profit for them and their client.

Then the legislature should write better laws.

Most of Congress are lawyers, just saying.

[swamp]

Mar 27, 2013 17:10:42 GMT -5 973beachbum said:

Mar 27, 2013 12:09:54 GMT -5 swamp said:

Then the legislature should write better laws.

Most of Congress are lawyers, just saying.

They arentn"real lawyers" in that they don't actually practice law. I don't have much use for ivory tower eggheads. 

[Deleted]

Mar 27, 2013 17:16:05 GMT -5 swamp said:

Mar 27, 2013 17:10:42 GMT -5 973beachbum said:

Most of Congress are lawyers, just saying.

They arentn"real lawyers" in that they don't actually practice law. I don't have much use for ivory tower eggheads. 

Don't hate lawyers, Swamp.  It isn't becoming on you.

[Opti]

I was just going to point that out. I think its not all lawyers most people hate just the sleazy ones and certain areas have worse reputations than others.

I think most people are OK with real estate law and other areas that rarely make headlines. The big areas I think are:

Ambulance chasers/Medical malpractice
Divorce lawyers who drag the process out for $$$
Criminal law because sometimes justice isn't done and many more times it is perceived as not being done because of the reasonable doubt threshold
Lawyers who do class action suits and make $$$$

And of course lawyers who become politicans.

[973beachbum]

Mar 27, 2013 17:16:05 GMT -5 swamp said:

Mar 27, 2013 17:10:42 GMT -5 973beachbum said:

Most of Congress are lawyers, just saying.

They arentn"real lawyers" in that they don't actually practice law. I don't have much use for ivory tower eggheads. 

It doesn't matter if they are good or bad lawyers.  Saying it isn't the lawyers fault that the laws were written so badly, is silly to my mind considering they were written by lawyers.

ETA I think this is the one of the real reasons people hate lawyers.  In most of our lives the only lawyers we ever see their work are politicians.

[olderburgher]

Mid and Swamp - There is an old saying about "Never trying to teach a pig to sing because it is a waste of time and annoys the pig." It applies here as to all the lawyer haters.

[Deleted]

Mar 27, 2013 17:17:25 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

Mar 27, 2013 17:16:05 GMT -5 swamp said:

They arentn"real lawyers" in that they don't actually practice law. I don't have much use for ivory tower eggheads. 

Don't hate lawyers, Swamp.  It isn't becoming on you.

Come on, people...  No one took the opportunity to post a becoming on Swamp joke?   I set it right up for you.   I am disappointed.

[happyscooter]

I guess because they get people off on cases such as child molestation or child abuse (you know, 'his daddy whipped him when he was 7 years old for stealing a candy bar, so now he makes a mistake and bashes his 2 month old baby's head into the wall')

[formerroomate99]

Mar 27, 2013 12:09:54 GMT -5 swamp said:

Mar 27, 2013 12:09:13 GMT -5 ArchietheDragon said:

to be serious, I think people hate lawyers because they view them as a force against common sense. Laws cannot be be written to be common sense because some lawyer is going to exploit a hole in the law and twist it and turn it into something it was not meant to be to turn a profit for them and their client.

Then the legislature should write better laws.

The legislature is usually made up of lawyers. 

If you read any user agreement or contract, and you'll get an overly long and incomprehensible version of something that should only take a few sentences in plain English. 

[Sum Dum Gai]

If the evidence is as you've presented, a confession would be unnecessary in order to convict - but yes, it should be excluded. The case would never be thrown out on that basis - all it means is that anything he says CAN'T be used against him in a court of law. It's unlikely his sentence would be reduced on that basis, either.

So his confession gets tossed, he realizes how much prison time he's facing, and his story completely changes.  Now he came home to find his friend there holding a gun to his head looking distraught.  He should have kept it locked up better, but can't change the past.  He tried to talk his friend down.  They sat there and talked for half an hour, but then his friend took the gun out of his lap and put it to his head.  He reached out to try and stop him, but didn't get there on time, and that's why his hands were close enough to get gunpowder residue on them.

Everything after that is a blur.  He must have panicked, but his only thought was that he didn't want his friends mom to see his friend that way, which is why he was trying to clean him up.  He realizes he should have called 911 immediately, but at the time all he could think about was how much blood there was and not wanting his friend to be remembered that way.

Maybe a jury buys his new story, maybe not, but he only needs one to hang it.  If the prosecutor thinks the case is weak enough without the confession, maybe he cuts a deal and pleads to aggravated manslaughter.  His lawyer sits there right next to him knowing full fucking well that he's guilty of murder, and helps him sign his plea deal.  Dude could be free in 5 years.

[Virgil Showlion]

There's merit to the argument that many lawyers prostitute themselves to the paying public (or paying corporations) with the intent of subverting true justice. Lawyers can destroy lives, shield wrongdoers, persecute the innocent, waste money, and foster victim mentalities. I've never been a fan of the adversarial approach in the criminal justice system. As Dark says, it so often puts attorneys in a position where they're required to lie, obfuscate, harass victims in the court, and exploit procedural errors to fulfill their role.

But of the lawyers I know personally, all but one are mindful of justice over and above their legal ethics. One is a crown prosecutor, and a very upright individual. We also mustn't forget that most (all?) judges are selected from among lawyers and appointed to some of the highest positions in our society. Moreover, we're assuming here that all lawyers will face major ethical challenges in their lifetimes and that lawyers will never quit a position if they're asked to do something immoral but legal, but neither of these assumptions is fact. My understanding is that most legal work (if we include tort law, corporate law, constitutional law, family law, etc.) is rote due diligence without many moral/ethical dilemmas creeping in. And who's to say that lawyers don't often sacrifice jobs rather than rationalize injustice?

I do believe lawyers are overpaid for the value they provide to society. And I believe the proverb I posted earlier: lawyers can seek out and exacerbate just as many problems as they fix.

Still, I think it best that we evaluate lawyers on an individual-by-individual basis, treat them as fellow human beings, and hope for the best. And the best advice is to avoid situations where lawyers are needed.

[Tennesseer]

If it hasn't been already said, taking on frivolous lawsuits for complainants with zero common sense.

[Bob Ross]

Mar 28, 2013 11:55:44 GMT -5 Virgil Showlion said:

And the best advice is to avoid situations where lawyers are needed.

Pfft.  But where's the fun in that?

[zibazinski]

Profiting from another's misery is never going to be popular.

[thyme4change]

Mar 28, 2013 12:26:22 GMT -5 zibazinski said:

Profiting from another's misery is never going to be popular.

Someone has to be there.  No one likes a mean lawyer, until they need one.