Muslim Brotherhood agree with American liberals

[ed1066]

How many times have we heard this quote from American lefties trying to rationalize their anti-Semitism? Now the Muslim Brotherhood says the same thing. Read the quote and see if you can tell whether it came from a Muslim extremist or an American liberal:

Morsy added that the[y] “are not against the Jews. We are against Zionism. We are against torturing the Palestinian people.”

www.jpost.com/MiddleEast/Article.aspx?id=206725

[billisonboard]

Feb 4, 2011 18:39:00 GMT -5 @ed1066 said:

How many times have we heard this quote from American lefties ...

Zero.

[Tennesseer]

Sigh

[safeharbor37]

How many times have we heard this quote from American lefties ...

Yep. Pretty much the leftie line. If you haven't heard it you haven't been listening [although I question whether it constitutes "anti-semitism" on their part].
Many Jews, American and other, as well as most "lefties" are anti-Zionist.
[billisonboard and Tennesseer, obviously, have never heard of Helen Thomas ~ who pretty much reflects the "leftie" viewpoint.]

[Tennesseer]

Safeharbor has also earned a very tired sigh.

[vonnie6200]

What is it about Zionism that is a problem?

[ed1066]

billisonboard and Tennesseer, obviously, have never heard of Helen Thomas

No, of course not! And even if they had, they would never remember her saying that the Jews should all go back to "where they came from"...

[safeharbor37]

What is it about Zionism that is a problem?

To me, nothing, but it is the basis of the conflict between Israel and the Arab world.

[vonnie6200]

Feb 4, 2011 19:12:18 GMT -5 @ed1066 said:

billisonboard and Tennesseer, obviously, have never heard of Helen Thomas

No, of course not! And even if they had, they would never remember her saying that the Jews should all go back to "where they came from"...

Well - I remember that very clearly - but isn't Israel their ultimate homeland?

And ironically the homeland of Christianity.

[vonnie6200]

Feb 4, 2011 19:13:15 GMT -5 safeharbor37 said:

What is it about Zionism that is a problem?

To me, nothing, but it is the basis of the conflict between Israel and the Arab world.

I agree with you and I think the Arabs are a little too self centered - and or lying to themselves and everyone else about the history of this piece of real estate

[deziloooooo]

Feb 4, 2011 19:13:15 GMT -5 safeharbor37 said:

What is it about Zionism that is a problem?

To me, nothing, but it is the basis of the conflict between Israel and the Arab world.

Zionist believe that Israel should be the homeland for the Jews..started back in the 1800's , late 1800's I beieve..a answer to the Pogroms of the Tsar and the constant anti semetism of European countries , middle ages, 1492 all Jews to convert or leave Spain, they had lived there for over 500 years, the same happened in Portugal, England, France..believe only place it didn't was the Netherlands..plus the latent anti semitism through out Europe where most of the Jews had been living.
After the second WW and the after math, the few Jews who were left needed a home and no one really wanted them and if would have taken them, the survivors wanted their own Home ..thus Israel came about.
Naturally the Arabs objected , thinking europe was taking advantage of their weakness and unloading their problem and guilt on them..which in a way they were.
That the Jews had a historic claim to the land too was a help, able after 2000 years able to go home was a inducement , especially since Jerusalem , so important in their history didn't hurt.
More to it but that kind of sums it up..Arabs not happy they are there, Jews, the State is there and florishing..just 6 million people for g-d sake and look at what they have accomplished..pretty remarkable.

Sorry Tenn ..have to do it..

Ed , your comment, "American lefties trying to rationalize their anti-Semitism?"

We have done this before but I guess we have to do it again, and again and..

The left is known to be those who have a liberal outlook politically. Most liberals are members of the Democratic party. Jews have a tendency to be , over all, of the Liberal persuasion politically and most of them who are in a political party are Democrats. {so many examples of it's a no brainier, though there are some who are conservative and from the right in their political outlook} since Jews are known to be liberal, Democratic politically, they can be classified as leftest for the majority so why would they support a group , a party that is anti Semitic. It makes no sense, doesn't compute and is not true.

Liberals also are known to be more accepting of tolerance, intolerant of perceived injustices to others especially where race and religion comes into play, differences in people , live and let live and open to trying new ideas..rather then staying with the status quo , something the conservatives are not known to do.

I think where you get confused and mixed up, this is a guess of mine, you seem to think any criticism of Israel and it's policies is a form of anti semitism and a non support of the State, it's people and leadership.

That is not so.

The Israeli's themselves have question of their governments policies, even in their paranoia and they are paranoid in many ways, being surrounded by countries , peoples by the millions who hate them, their existence and would participate in their destruction if given the chance of a success there, so not to be worried and some what paranoid would be a sign of insanity.

One can have questions of the leaders of the state and still fully support them as a right to be a Jewish State and those who do have questions are not anti semetic, anti Zionists.

Safe , their might be some Jews, ultra orthodox who might not look favorable on Israel as a Jewish State, they are few , many have changed their feelings over the decades.

Their feeling was that Israel could only arise again as a Jewish State when the lord itself said so and made it possible.

The problem with that, the Lord above seems to have other things on his plate and so far have left it up to his sons and daughters to do this, possible real busy with his works elsewhere.

Not being a theologian I do not feel comfortable questioning or explaining the Lords work, why he does or doesn't do certain things.

[deziloooooo]

Feb 5, 2011 7:29:51 GMT -5 @toughtimes said:

Many Jews are against "Zionism" too, including the most devote Orthodox Jews and Hasidim. They take this view from biblical prophecy that states that Israel will be divinely restored by God at the end of days. They consider Israel to be a blasphemy and an affront to the divine plan.

Therefore, Jews are anti-Zionist too, although those whose families escaped Hitler by entering Palestine during the Holocaust may beg to differ.

This is a very complex subject and views for and against Israel span both sides of the political divide. I have read memoirs of top CIA officials (presumably Conservative) who would like to saw off Israel and float it off to sea.

My best friend, a Republican, is an Arab whose family hails from Lebanon. Guess where she comes down?

I myself remember my mom's stories of Jews with concentration-camp ink on their arms. I remember that there was a "Voyage of the Damned", the St. Louis, a ship whose passengers were denied asylum and sent right back to die. Franklin Delano Roosevelt was not crazy about offering escaping Jews free passage here, and the tiny nation of the Dominican Republic probably saved more than we did.

LOL, Love the internet...thank you Mr. Google ..you got me thinking on the Dominican Republic....escapes was offered...but few got out...a short interesting article.
---------------------------------------------------
www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Holocaust/sosua.html
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Dominican Republic's Haven
for Jewish Refugees
By Lauren Levy

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In 1938, when no other nation would welcome Jewish refugees, Rafael Trujillo, the Dominican Republic strongman, offered to take in 100,000. Between 1940 and 1945, 5,000 Dominican visas were issued, but only 645 Jews actually made their way to the Dominican Republic. The refugees settled in the tiny seacoast town of Sosua, then just jungle land, that Trujillo had established with funding provided by the American Jewish Joint Distribution Committee.

Upon arrival, every new Jewish settler was given 80 acres of land, 10 cows, a mule and a horse. Although most of the settlers were German or Austrian Jews and had professional or craftsmen's backgrounds, they quickly picked up the agricultural life offered by Sosua and established a successful Jewish cooperative—Productos Sosua—that today produces most of the county's meat and dairy produce.

Trujillo's generosity probably stemmed mainly from his eagerness to have the Western nations overlook his brutal massacre of 25,000 Haitians in 1937, and his desire to "whiten" his race. He believed that the young European men would marry Dominican women and produce light-skinned offspring. He was correct in this in that most settlers were single young men who did marry Dominican women. The children usually considered themselves Jewish and many stayed in Sosua.

Today, only about 30 of the original Jewish families remain in Sosua. By the 1940's, most of the nearly 700 inhabitants had moved to either New York or Miami. Although no longer in the Dominican Republic, the Sosua Jews have maintained a tight-knit community. Until 1980, the town was still entirely Jewish; however, with the opening of the international Puerto Plata airport four miles west of Sosua, the village has turned into a major beach resort.

Today the town has 3,000 full-time residents, with about 70 Jews. Those who did remain in Sosua and held onto their land, have made a fortune. Erik Hauser, an original settler from Vienna, now owns an entire block of the lucrative downtown area, where hotels and restaurants were built on his original 80 acres. He is Sosua's wealthiest resident.

Sosua has one functioning synagogue that holds services every other Shabbat and on the High Holidays. Passover Seders are held in community members homes and an annual Purim carnival is a major community event. The small Jewish community also has a museum dedicated to preserving the history and story of the town's original Jewish settlers.

{ Thanks for the mention of the Dominican..I never knew this }

[vonnie6200]

Thanks Dezi - I learned a bit this morning!

[privateinvestor]

Muslim Brotherhood agree with American liberals


Whoever made that comment needs to do some research about the Muslim Brotherhood or have they ever lived in the Middle East or in Egpyt?? There is so much misinformation being spread lately it is getting to be out of hand and sadly many believe this nonsense.

[privateinvestor]

The Muslim Brotherhood also has chapters here in this country and were active during the 9/11 Mosgue debacle a few months ago in NYC.......but I am not sure if they are on any terrorist lists here in the USA.

[privateinvestor]

Feb 5, 2011 10:35:04 GMT -5 @toughtimes said:

I am sure the FBI keeps a weather-eye out on them. So long as they are not planting bombs, they have the right to believe what they do too, but it is one group I would like to see decamp en-mass from our country.

Yea but the question on everyone's mind lately is the Muslim Brotherhood responsible for the civil unrest in Egypt?? How big of a threat are they to the peace in the Middle East??

[jarhead1976]

Turn the whole area to glass!

[deziloooooo]

Feb 5, 2011 13:14:50 GMT -5 @privateinvestor said:

Feb 5, 2011 10:35:04 GMT -5 @toughtimes said:

I am sure the FBI keeps a weather-eye out on them. So long as they are not planting bombs, they have the right to believe what they do too, but it is one group I would like to see decamp en-mass from our country.

Yea but the question on everyone's mind lately is the Muslim Brotherhood responsible for the civil unrest in Egypt?? How big of a threat are they to the peace in the Middle East??

It's up to the people themselves and the military.... as far as Egypt is concerned..sems thre are a lot of them who have had it with Mubarak and teh one party, corruption and lack of opportunit.
Again, facts are 75 % illiteracy, 40 %, poverty , living on 2/3 $ per day, unemployment at 12 %, food prices risen 17%, educated after graduating..no jobs...police who are brutal...is there any wonder they are looking for a change.
We Give them 1.6 billion a year..of which 1.3 billion is milisry..why? Who is going to go to war with them..we are as much at fault..we gave in to them to keep the militsry happy..of we gave say 1 billion in military, 600 million for aid..education, $ for the people.

[privateinvestor]

Feb 5, 2011 13:47:50 GMT -5 @jarhead1976 said:

Turn the whole area to glass!

Mubarak blames the Muslim Brothehood for the crisis in Egypt....but nobody trusts him anymore so he has to go....

[billisonboard]

Feb 5, 2011 13:47:50 GMT -5 @jarhead1976 said:

Turn the whole area to glass!

The reason we can't trust Iran with nuclear weapons is because of the concern that they will use them.

[jarhead1976]

They will. Against Israel! Then end game. Israel will then solve the whole middle east problem!

[billisonboard]

Feb 5, 2011 14:09:15 GMT -5 @jarhead1976 said:

They will. Against Israel! Then end game. Israel will then solve the whole middle east problem!

Unless we beat them to it?

[privateinvestor]

Feb 5, 2011 14:09:15 GMT -5 @jarhead1976 said:

They will. Against Israel! Then end game. Israel will then solve the whole middle east problem!

Can the US Learn from past mistakes in the Middle East?

[formerexpat]

Unless we beat them to it?

Why do the dirty work when you can get your little brother to do the job for you? Guess the prophecy about 2012 is going to be true. [/size]

[Shirina]

No, of course not! And even if they had, they would never remember her saying that the Jews should all go back to "where they came from"...

I don't remember ever electing Helen Thomas as a "liberal spokesperson."

Does anyone else?

[mmhmm]

*sigh* There's a lot to talk about with regard to this subject; however, it's difficult to rise to a thread title as ignorant as this one. Tell me, Ed, have you ever lived in the Middle East? Do you really know anything at all about these people other than what you read?

[Shirina]

By the way, I love your avatar, mmhmm. It's very cute.

Makes me long to be a cat owner again.

[mmhmm]

Thanks, Shirina. I loved it when I saw it. A home without a cat is just a house, ya know!

[ungenteel]

Same old rightie stuff .. thump the constitution and the principles espoused by the founders ... but when it comes to other countries ... righties want "our" dictators in control and screw democracy and freedom of choice for countries that we need/want under our sphere of influence

[safeharbor37]

Same old rightie stuff .. thump the constitution and the principles espoused by the founders ... but when it comes to other countries ... righties want "our" dictators in control and screw democracy and freedom of choice for countries that we need/want under our sphere of influence.

The problem is that you don't understand the "rightie stuff." "Righties" come in different varieties so a simple answer won't suffice so:
Libertarians, strict Constitutionalists and traditional [isolationist] conservatives tend to be primarily concerned with the US and, like their attitude toward others within the US, they aren't concerned so much with foreign countries, but with the US. Genuine [non-extreme] liberals and conservatives tend to promote liberty and justice [and sometimes democracy] among the nations with with the US interacts.
In general, moderate "righties" would like all countries to be capitalistic democracies so that the mutual interests could minimize the potential for open conflict. This is more of less the foreign policy of the US at least since WWII.
Pragmatically it is sometimes necessary to coexist with totalitarian regimes and it's always preferable that relations are good.~ so it appears that the US supports dictators when in reality, in most cases, dictators are all we have to deal with.
Conservatives don't believe in intervening in the affairs of other countries as much as liberals do, but there is no real difference between the way conservative leaders deal with dictators and the way liberal leaders do. We tend to deal with what we have to deal with. We'd rather deal with countries like Great Britain and post WWII Germany than countries like China or Russia, but it is the interest of the US and the world that we have the best possible relationship with all countries.
Some countries like Iran and North Korea require a different approach, but it's necessary that we have the best possible relations even with them [they may very well be in the same positions that pre WWII Germany and Japan occupied and that may be the best we can do at this time.]
The point is that the primary interest of America and the American people is the primary interest of the US Government. If we can spread the wealth, good. If not, that's OK too.