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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2012 22:15:07 GMT -5
OK. And, Hippa is definately a big deal. I think we all understand and want medical privacy. Yeah, you might not have anything to "hide' but maybe you don't want everyone to know if you are having hemorrhoids out or something like that. And, there are other medical issues that can really create issues if known by others. I find it objectionable that you have to disclose things to employers if you want to take some sick time for a surgery or something like that. Not sure why i should have to explain that i am getting my gallbladder out or my bunion or whatever. I think the fact that you have a medical slip from the doctor stating you need something done should be enough.
As for the OP's friend, i guess my point is that this episode doesn't make him a "bad" person. Unless there was some evil intent, i am assuming it was a offhand comment or something like that leading to the problem. And, if we fired everyone in medicine who ever made a mistake, there would be no one left to take care of anyone.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 21, 2012 22:30:47 GMT -5
Error in judgment could mean so many things, though. Like someone else said, if he can't keep his mouth shut, this isn't the profession for him. He could be the nicest guy in the world but this isn't a mistake you'd want anyone making twice.
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2012 22:32:01 GMT -5
OP - Tell your friend to just fall on his sword. Because people are unforgiving and if he doesn't they are going to lynch him anyway.
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hoops902
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Post by hoops902 on May 21, 2012 22:35:15 GMT -5
::As for the OP's friend, i guess my point is that this episode doesn't make him a "bad" person. Unless there was some evil intent, i am assuming it was a offhand comment or something like that leading to the problem. And, if we fired everyone in medicine who ever made a mistake, there would be no one left to take care of anyone.::
I think you can certainly be a "bad" person without having "evil intent". The simplest way is in acting recklessly even without evil intent. If I choose to let my kids play with knives and drugs because I'm simply irresponsible...I might not have any intent that they do anything bad...I just don't care. Apathy towards important issues which you control can definitely make someone "bad". I'm not in the medical field, but I am in the financial field. If I choose to leave your personal information, ssn, PIN, bank acct # lying around for anyone...my disregard for your information is bad, even if I have no particular intent that I want someone to use it against you.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2012 22:36:04 GMT -5
Refer to reply #80
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Post by findingdeadbeats on May 21, 2012 23:42:26 GMT -5
I worked in health care. If the OP walks into a job interview and mentions they were fired over HIPPA violation, but went and took a class and are sorry, the new employer is going to thank them for coming in and they will get the dreaded letter in the mail that they hired a different candidate.
The only way past something that bad is to not mention it and hope the potential employer doesn't know and doesn't find out. Period.
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weltschmerz
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Post by weltschmerz on May 22, 2012 3:24:48 GMT -5
No, I don't understand why people get so nutted up over this. And I don't understand why people don't.
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on May 22, 2012 7:08:17 GMT -5
Shooby, speaking for myself, I wasn't talking about anything you said- I was referring to people specifically stating they didn't understand why HIPPA was a big deal, like Doxie and lone. I haven't read anything in the OP that indicates the friend will never be able to follow HIPAA guidelines. I'm just blown away that people can say that the requirements are unnecessary. Speaking as someone who was passed over for promotion because I was pregnant, its a damn good thing that I was the one that told my employer. Also, employers don't usually want to know details of surgeries and what not. If you talk with HR instead of your direct supervisor you'll typically get someone who understands how few details they really want on what is going on. Your direct supervisor and co-workers are usually going to cross the line into friend/acquaintance and feel that you should share what the procedure is for.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 22, 2012 7:13:38 GMT -5
Really? I wouldn't like it bandied all over town that I was tested for communicable diseases for two years after my divorce because my then husband slept around like he had only a short time to get laid by as many women as possible. As my doctor said, it's the innocent that get hurt. But what the record would say was that I was the SLUT not him. Why else would I be getting checked all the time? Well, it felt like all the time at the time.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 22, 2012 7:17:27 GMT -5
Never thought of it until now but I am out of HR and have been for many years. I'd probably be doing a little giggle every time someone asked me for an STD!
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 22, 2012 7:27:58 GMT -5
;D
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Wisconsin Beth
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Post by Wisconsin Beth on May 22, 2012 7:42:09 GMT -5
Hi Sroo! How are you doing? I haven't seen you around much lately so I'm guessing you've been busy. I still would like to meet you for coffee/tea/walk sometime. Back to the HIPAA discussion.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 22, 2012 9:40:06 GMT -5
shooby, huh? How was my post #80 a call to lynch this guy? I'm sure he feels terribly about what he did and depending on exactly what that was, maybe another chance makes sense- but it's equally possible that all things considered, this isn't the right field for him.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2012 9:41:22 GMT -5
Based on one mistake?
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2012 9:42:28 GMT -5
Well, don't lynch him, just ensure he has a lifetime of financial ruin instead. Got it. So it isn't possible in your mind to make a mistake and learn from it?
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 22, 2012 9:42:46 GMT -5
::As for the OP's friend, i guess my point is that this episode doesn't make him a "bad" person. Unless there was some evil intent, i am assuming it was a offhand comment or something like that leading to the problem. And, if we fired everyone in medicine who ever made a mistake, there would be no one left to take care of anyone.:: I think you can certainly be a "bad" person without having "evil intent". The simplest way is in acting recklessly even without evil intent. If I choose to let my kids play with knives and drugs because I'm simply irresponsible...I might not have any intent that they do anything bad...I just don't care. Apathy towards important issues which you control can definitely make someone "bad". I'm not in the medical field, but I am in the financial field. If I choose to leave your personal information, ssn, PIN, bank acct # lying around for anyone...my disregard for your information is bad, even if I have no particular intent that I want someone to use it against you. Karma- this is why I say that intent matters very little to me. If harm is committed, it doesn't usually matter whether someone MEANT to harm you or not.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 22, 2012 9:47:01 GMT -5
Well, don't lynch him, just ensure he has a lifetime of financial ruin instead. Got it. So it isn't possible in your mind to make a mistake and learn from it? We don't know what that "one mistake" was. What if it got someone else fired? Or blacklisted, or simply embarrassed him/her? Learning from your mistakes is all well and good, but it doesn't mean there are no consequences when you make a serious mistake. If I commit premeditated murder but I'm really sorry and I learn from my mistake, that won't stop swamp from prosecuting me, nor a jury from convicting me and "ruining my life." Sometimes dumb mistakes have major consequences. Being sorry doesn't make those consequences go away.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2012 9:48:33 GMT -5
He HAD consequences. He lost his job. Sheesh.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2012 9:49:21 GMT -5
BTW peeps, dont' ever make a mistake in life because then you are going to compared to a murderer, child rapist, terrorist and so forth.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 22, 2012 9:54:51 GMT -5
I'm not comparing him to a murderer. Sheesh. That was just another example of a "dumb mistake" with the potential to change the course of the rest of your life. I don't think this guy is a bad person, I don't think he should go to jail- I'm just suggesting this might not be the profession for him. Maybe I'm wrong- as Lena says, I've been wrong before. But this sounds like a pretty unforgivable offense in this industry and that makes good sense to me. If the "only" consequence is him getting fired and finding another profession (as opposed to being sued and maybe even prosecuted) I'd actually say he's getting off pretty easily.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 22, 2012 9:57:23 GMT -5
What I can't understand is why so many people don't think it's all that big a deal. Somehow I bet you'd feel differently if it was YOUR private information being traded so lightly.
Although to be fair, we don't know what he did and maybe it really wasn't so bad. But maybe it was.
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Waffle
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Post by Waffle on May 22, 2012 10:00:01 GMT -5
Having to find another profession when you owe more than 6 figures of debt for the schooling for the one you originally chose, doesn't sound like getting off easy. Of course, since we don't know exactly what he did - it's really hard to say (for me anyway) whether or not the punishment fit the "crime".
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raeoflyte
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Post by raeoflyte on May 22, 2012 10:07:13 GMT -5
The fact that the employer is letting him resign instead of firing him, indicates to me that it was a mistake that he can recover from.
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zibazinski
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Post by zibazinski on May 22, 2012 10:15:59 GMT -5
Ask the person who had her ex given her new address for no good reason whatsoever if privacy laws are meaningless. I'm sorry just doesn't cut it, and yet, it's out there. No recovering from it.
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Firebird
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Post by Firebird on May 22, 2012 11:12:45 GMT -5
Having to find another profession when you owe more than 6 figures of debt for the schooling for the one you originally chose, doesn't sound like getting off easy.
I think it would be worse if he also had to forfeit his house to come up with $1mm and pay off a legal fine, or spend a couple years in prison or whatever (I don't know the potential penalties for HIPPA violations other than you can apparently be personally sued, but I'm assuming if the breach is bad enough you can probably also go to prison).
Ask the person who had her ex given her new address for no good reason whatsoever if privacy laws are meaningless. I'm sorry just doesn't cut it, and yet, it's out there. No recovering from it.
That's the part people seem to be missing. This guy can be as sorry as he wants and in a way I do feel bad for him, but wrongside said herself that this wasn't an innocent mistake, it was an error in judgment. And the fact of the matter is that when you make a mistake that causes permanent damage, that permanent damage is still there no matter how much you regret your mistake.
You just can't unring certain bells. A lot of people probably don't think insider trading is all that big a deal either. Yet if I learn certain proprietary information through my job, and I release it to the media, I would not only lose my job, I'd more than likely go to prison. It wouldn't matter how "sorry" I was once the information was out there. So knowing that, I'd be very, very careful not to ever breach that seal.
Even if you DO think HIPPA is silly and people take it way too seriously, the consequences for violating it ought to keep most people from actually doing so.
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NomoreDramaQ1015
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Post by NomoreDramaQ1015 on May 22, 2012 11:19:06 GMT -5
He HAD consequences. He lost his job. Sheesh " Yes he did but the thing with HIPPA violations is that any "mistake" is not acceptable. Technically you are supposed to get fired for ANY HIPPA violation.
Now that doesn't always happen, there is usually a hearing before that and common sense can come into play.
The fact he lost his job suggests to me this wasn't a small HIPPA violation that could be solved with a slap on the wrist and retraining.
He knows the risks that come with violating HIPPA. I don't even work in the hospital a nd I have to take yearly HIPPA courses. I know the medical staff has much more involved training.
It sucks but those are the rules. It's what you sign up for.
I agree with everyone else that his best bet would probably be to find a rural area taht is in desparate need of doctors and would be willing to overlook past violations.
If it is anything like around here even with several different hospital chains, often people work at more than one hospital and people talk. His days of working here would be over.
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Post by findingdeadbeats on May 22, 2012 11:24:16 GMT -5
The issue isn't about judging this person for a "mistake." The problem is that HIPPA violations are no allowed in any form in health care and he has probably been warned/trained about that for the last however many years he worked in health care.
What if he was a doctor and let slip to a relative that you have herpes, or hiv, or something like that? What if he let it slip to your employer and they found a way to fire you over it? He very well may have ruined someone else's life. That will determine, IMHO, whether or not he is ever employable again in that field.
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gawgagranny
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Post by gawgagranny on May 22, 2012 11:27:21 GMT -5
Nasgul, if my computer would allow it, I would definitely give you a great big karma for your post--I could not possibly have said it better myself! For some reason, the "exalt" button does not seem to be working right now on this computer....oh well...
HIPPA is no joke. It is the elephant in the room, so to speak, a lot of the time these days in the health care world. For example, I am a health care professional myself and my DS2 is still on my health insurance--but I cannot get any info about him in regards to any health care he may have received because of HIPPA--even though I am his mother AND the one paying the bills. While he was still in college, the school could not even verify his schedule or anything like that--all they could do was verify that he was enrolled for the current semester--because of the privacy laws.
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Post by findingdeadbeats on May 22, 2012 11:27:36 GMT -5
I had labs drawn prior to having my hysterectomy. The local hospital used to have a lab tech onsite at my docs office a couple days a week. When she called my name, with the door open, she loudly said "So, looks like we are trying to decide why you are having hormonal problems today. Possibly a hysterectomy in your future?"
When I left the room, everyone there knew why I was at the doctor. Everyone.
I mentioned this to the doctor the next time I saw him, because I didn't appreciate an entire room full of strangers, here in our small town, knowing my medical situation. What if I had a job interview with one of them the next week?
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Post by The Walk of the Penguin Mich on May 22, 2012 11:44:51 GMT -5
The fact that the employer is letting him resign instead of firing him, indicates to me that it was a mistake that he can recover from. Actually, I would imagine that the institution was looking to avoid being fined. A $1.5 million fine could be difficult to swallow for some instances of breaching HIPAA guidelines and the hospital is trying to sweep it under the carpet ASAP, before the hammer comes down on them. So I would think it is the opposite.
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