AZ. Cand. Appeals English Ability Court Decision

[Tennesseer]

This is where San Luis, Arizona is located. San Luis Rio Colorado, Mexico is on the other side of the U.S./Mexico border.

[dumdeedoe]

Well - only about 1/3rd of San Luis lives above the poverty line. The place isn't really luxurious.

Yes but their lawns and gardens are immaculate....

[EVT1]

Feb 1, 2012 23:36:56 GMT -5 dumdeedoe said:

Well - only about 1/3rd of San Luis lives above the poverty line. The place isn't really luxurious.

Yes but their lawns and gardens are immaculate....

[EVT1]

Feb 1, 2012 22:11:32 GMT -5 billisonboard said:

Feb 1, 2012 22:05:44 GMT -5 formerexpat said:

...

Yes, there should be a basic literacy test - who the hell knows what this person would agree to if they don't understand the language when a contract is written in English.

So every person running for any elective office in the United States should pass a basic literacy test (written, administered, and scored by ) to be eligible?

Yes- literacy tests! More 100% bullshit!

[EVT1]

Feb 1, 2012 22:33:12 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

There's no grounds for an appeal. This case was cut and dried. What most articles leave out is that the judge had no choice but to follow the law and Arizona law requires public office holders to know English. Period. She's claiming hearing problems and other excuses for not understanding questions and following the dialogue in court, but the simple fact of the matter is she was born and raised in Mexico City and really doesn't have sufficient command of the English Language. If they have a problem with it, they'll have to change the law.

Some more bullshit here.....

[Tennesseer]

I am still waiting for the Mexico City proof.

[EVT1]

Feb 1, 2012 22:34:48 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

Feb 1, 2012 16:37:35 GMT -5 handyman2 said:

Why don't some go to a spanish speaking country while speaking little or no spanish and try to run for political office and see what happens. Or France or Germany for that matter. etc

I've done business in Panama, Costa Rica, and Dominican Republic-- in all three, contracts WILL be in Espanol, or they're void.

Not a specialist in international law- but my money is on even more bullshit from our most prolific provider. Freaking basic contract law has nothing to do with a particular language. You have 'done business' huh? What, did you require an English bill before you paid your tab?

[vandalshandle]

I've Been to Yuma, and frankly, as far as I am concerned, they should give it back to Mexico.

[floridayankee]

Feb 1, 2012 22:33:12 GMT -5 AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP said:

There's no grounds for an appeal. This case was cut and dried. What most articles leave out is that the judge had no choice but to follow the law and Arizona law requires public office holders to know English. Period.

She does know English. The law bars "a person who is unable to speak, write and read the English language" from holding public office. It does not state the proficiency required, just that the candidate know English.

I know the English language but I am far from an English major as most of you can probably tell. I could, in essence, be bared from running for office simply by moving the goal posts. This ruling sets a dangerous precedent and opens the door for abuse by activist judges with an agenda. I say let her run and let the people she is representing pick their own damned leaders.

[Tennesseer]

"Cabrera, a U.S. citizen graduated from Kofa High School in Yuma. She apparently dominates the Spanish language, but does know enough English to defend her right as an American to run for public office and stand her ground against all odds.

Cabrera’s challenge to determine, if she can actually understand, speak and write English to hold public office was first brought up by Mayor Juan Carlos Escamilla. Escamilla filed a complaint in court claiming Cabrera lacks sufficient English skills to hold a four-year San Luis City Council position. All the work such as city ordinances, minutes, public agenda, legal documents, committee and council meetings are done in the English language. Cabrera, if elected could struggle to understand some of the council’s work, but could very well represent those who elected her.

At least 90 percent of the population in San Luis City can speak both languages, English and Spanish. But Spanish is the dominent daily life language for a majority of people living in San Luis. Spanish is used and spoken in stores, restaurants, churches, and many other areas of the city due to close proximity to the Mexican border.

Cabrera’s plight to run for the city council began after she initiated a recall against Mayor Escamilla for approving a utility price hike and laying off 12 city employees inorder to balance the city budget deficit. She plans to continue to campaign for office, despite the lower court challenge."

hngwiusa.wordpress.com/2012/01/31/cabrera-files-appeal-with-arizona-supreme-court-to-vacate-lower-court-decision-to-keep-her-off-the-ballot/

[cme1201]

Arizona Supreme Court affirms ruling barring woman from running for city council because of English skills


Read more: www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/02/08/arizona-supreme-court-affirms-ruling-barring-woman-from-running-for-city/?test=latestnews#ixzz1lo5ZuwyY

Sociolinguistics expert William Eggington presented the court with results of three different tests he administered to Cabrera, who graduated from Kofa High School in Yuma. One measured her English-speaking skill, another was to determine if she reads the language, and the third was to assess her level of English comprehension.

Eggington's report said Cabrera's English skills did not meet the level of language proficiency needed to serve on the council.

[ugonow]

Eggington's report said Cabrera's English skills did not meet the level of language proficiency needed to serve on the council.

Seems pretty subjective to me. The story did get me wondering what the response would be here if the roles werereversed and a transplant from the US ran for office in a community of mostly English speakers [of which there are quite a few in Mexice as it is a cheap retirement spot] and the government said he couldn't because they did not like his Spanish. Just playing devil's advocate here, not knowing actually how much of a barrier this lady presents.

[cme1201]

Feb 8, 2012 11:46:22 GMT -5 ugonow said:

Eggington's report said Cabrera's English skills did not meet the level of language proficiency needed to serve on the council.

Seems pretty subjective to me.

Actually it would depend on the test. Considering it was done by a a sociolinguist with no ties to the state or case makes it compelling.

Professor William Eggington, originally from Australia, is an applied sociolinguist, a field that involves the study of how people use language in natural settings. He has co-edited three books that generally focus on the role of the English language nationally and internationally, and has published numerous journal articles and book chapters in volumes published by major national,
international and professional association presses. Details of his books and articles are available from his C.V. His commitment to TESOL International, the major English as a second language professional organization, includes chair of the Sociopolitical Concerns Committee, chair of the Applied Linguistics Interest Section and Local Chair of the 2002 TESOL Convention. He currently teaches graduate and undergraduate English linguistics and sociolinguistics. Professor
Eggington has been a consultant to various law firms and an expert witness in civil and criminal, federal and state cases involving trade name/generic name issues, evaluation of English language proficiency, language policy legislation as well as disputes involving the grammar and meaning of contracts and wills. He has also been heavily involved in language services provision (interpreting and translating) for the Atlanta, Nagano, Sydney and Salt Lake City Olympic Games.

Areas of Expertise: Applied sociolinguistics with research interests in inter-cultural
communication, second language acquisition and learning, discourse and conversational analysis, and language planning and policy.

[ugonow]

Wouldn't the test have to prove her skills would be a barrier? If it is a mostly Spanish speaking community, couldn't someones sspanish speaking skills be just as easily considered a barrier?

[Tennesseer]

Feb 8, 2012 11:46:22 GMT -5 ugonow said:

Eggington's report said Cabrera's English skills did not meet the level of language proficiency needed to serve on the council.

Seems pretty subjective to me. The story did get me wondering what the response would be here if the roles werereversed and a transplant from the US ran for office in a community of mostly English speakers [of which there are quite a few in Mexice as it is a cheap retirement spot] and the government said he couldn't because they did not like his Spanish. Just playing devil's advocate here, not knowing actually how much of a barrier this lady presents.

Ugonow-your example is not the same. This woman was born, raised and attended schools in southern Arizona.

I have to wonder though would a U.S. citizen who was hearing or sight impaired be banned from running for office? A hearing impaired person could require a sign language assistant. A sight impaired person would require documents in braiile and someone sitting next to them to describe items such as maps or building designs being reviewed during meetings.

A hearing or sight impaired candidate could offer as much as any other member of a council.

[Virgil Showlion]

As for Newt's comments, there were plenty of ghetto's that spoke many different languages in the past. It's a reference to pockets of current, most prevalent immigrants and how we should immerse them into society - not exclude them (including language).

This is correct.

"We should replace bilingual education with immersion in English so people learn the common language of the country and so they learn the language of prosperity, not the language of living in a ghetto,"

As expat says, a "ghetto" is simply a pocket of different culture existing among a majority culture—an unassimilated community.

Mr. Gingrich's comments indicate that he believes English is a superior language. I don't consider this to be hubris, since most people believe their language to be superior to others. (Most will admit it.)

It also seems clear that he's referring specifically to Spanish when talking about "the language of living in a ghetto" (he refers to "the" language, and he 's talking about bilingual education).

Is there a problem of ghettoization of Spanish-speaking communities in the US? I don't know.

Ghettos can exist, they can be a function of language (i.e. language can be a barrier to assimilation), and their existence can pose a problem. They can cause poverty, isolation, employment barriers, education barriers, mistrust of authority, ethnic tensions, lack of nationalism, and a host of other social issues. Furthermore, the language of a ghetto is likely the greatest impediment to assimilation. How can a community disperse among the greater population if the latter can't understand the former?

Hence if Mr. Gingrich believes that ghettos are a problem, that forcing a ghettoized people to learn English is the surest way to tear down the ghetto walls, and that (like him) the citizens of Spanish-speaking ghettos believe their language is superior and will not be persuaded to assimilate by kind, multiculturalish words, then one might be persuaded to accept the logic of his statement, political incorrectness and all.

Some big 'if's, I admit. But worth thinking about.

[handyman2]

Just looking at the names involved most protesting her running for office are of some Spanish decent. So she apparently cannot say it is an anti Spanish language bias.
I have worked on construction jobs where there were so many Spanish only speaking workers they had to have interpreters on the job just to get the work done. Not speaking adequately the language of a country can be a negative in business. Especially where legalese is involved.