billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 6, 2011 14:02:37 GMT -5
"Education is a responsibility of the states and the BILLIONS and BILLIONS of dollars spent on and by the Department of Education have not improved the quality of education in this country one iota. As a matter of fact, it has only gotten worse!! " True - ... It really hasn't gotten worse but carry on.
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Post by bubblyandblue on Aug 6, 2011 14:04:38 GMT -5
It really hasn't gotten worse but carry on. It certainly can get better! ?
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shelby
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Post by shelby on Aug 6, 2011 14:26:20 GMT -5
"that the unproductively employed capital makes it's way back into the marketplace." Sure, they will say that that capital will make it back into the market but, today, that has not happened - at least not into the US economy nor has it made itself back into the real economy "productive employment of capital that results in economic growth and prosperity" but it has certainly made it into the "parasitic type of capital formation that really produces nothing other than concentration of wealth" yes. trickle down seems plausible, but it actually doesn't work that way. trickle down has resulted in HIGHER wealth disparity. So true yet so few see the reality...or choose to ignore it.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 6, 2011 15:27:12 GMT -5
It really hasn't gotten worse but carry on. It certainly can get better! ? And it is getting better in ways, places, and at times. Other ways, places, and times not as much. In tough economic times, it can certainly break both ways. Those with something going for them see the need to work that much hard to get to the top, those with little going for them can simply give up or take the attitude of, "If I can't be the best of the best, I will be the worst of the worst." (See the thread on the problems in Wisconsin.)
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ameiko
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Post by ameiko on Aug 6, 2011 15:33:00 GMT -5
Of course the wealthy can't cover the deficit, no one in their right mind says they could, but it is also the idea of , allowing those who really can afford it to pay a bit more. I have to disagree. I believe there are millions and millions of people in this country that have heard Obama's rant about the rich not paying their "fair share" over and over and over again, that many people actually believe that taxing the "rich" is THE solution. Is it "fair" that almost 50% of the population in this country pay ABSOLUTELY NO income taxes? I am against raising taxes on the "rich" a single cent until EVERYONE who receives a paycheck pays SOMETHING. What Obama fails to tell the masses is that the "rich" already pay the majority of the taxes that are collected. And yes, you can tax them more, but they will simply find the legal loopholes that will allow them to pay less. One of Obama's favorite examples are those greedy, corporate jet owners. That loophole was part of Obama's STIMULUS package to stimulate the plane-building industry. But he tends to leave that little fact out when he is complaining about all those evil, greedy, corporate jet owners. The problem is compounded by the fact that no matter HOW MUCH revenue the government collects, they always spend MORE and Obama the biggest "spender" in US history, has no intentions whatsoever of cutting back anywhere unless he is FORCED to do so. DH and I are what you would call upper middle class. We would be willing to pay higher income taxes, but only if EVERYONE has to pay SOMETHING and the increased revenue raised went to pay off debt. The problem is that that it never does. +1 Wow, I'm handing out exalts like crazy today! I LOVE all the wisdom here!
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ameiko
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Post by ameiko on Aug 6, 2011 15:36:30 GMT -5
I agree, and thus said, expect we have to increase revenues and in the short term, a few years at least, increased employment, thus more taxes, increase in business fortunes, more received in taxes, not going to happen or be big enough , any increases, and not sure on capital gains from the markets either, so expect increase in taxes , have to increase income, revenue as well as CUT spending..
Disagreeing. As I have pointed out numerous times, and the numbers back me up, is that it's NOT revenue that is the issue but spending, spending, and more spending.
We CAN cut spending to the point where we would not need a single tax hike (which is all that increase in revenue tends to mean in these discussions). It wouldn't be painless but it would work and indeed has worked throughout our history where for the most of it, the federal government stayed out of our business and we propsered mightily.
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ameiko
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Post by ameiko on Aug 6, 2011 15:40:15 GMT -5
The below quote - post is an example of tea partiery lacking any real thought. The taxes collected for these programs can support these programs but, have been usurped by our politicians throughout the decades for other reasons. These programs are paid for like I would pay on lay-away - now you say it is an entitlement program (with a negative conotation) - I am en-titled to what I paid for. Just as I am entitled to take possesion, upon paying off, that which I purchased in a lay-away tranaction - I take title to that which I purchased - its a simple contract. "SS and Medicare have their own special taxes. If these taxes can not support them, then cuts need to be made whether that be increases in age or smaller checks. WHY did you trust a government to care for you in the first place? It is NOT the responsibility of the rich to take care of you. Are you a simpleton, unable to make plans?" "We, the People, are the rightful masters of both the Congress and the Courts. Not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who have perverted it." - Abraham Lincoln And YOUR comments reveal the lack of character in people who rail against the Tea Party. Really, tea partiers? You already reveal your bias. If you truly believe what you wrote, and had some sense, then you would be supporting the Tea Party to toss out those in government who continue to confiscate our wealth and use it to buy votes, as they did with the SS fund. You feel entitled to SS and Medicare? Then you'd better get off your bottom and dop something about it because the generations that follow you will not acccept another hike in those taxes because you and me were too lazy to stop the foxes that have and are raiding the hen house.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 6, 2011 15:52:20 GMT -5
These programs are paid for like I would pay on lay-away - now you say it is an entitlement program (with a negative conotation) - I am en-titled to what I paid for. Just as I am entitled to take possesion, upon paying off, that which I purchased in a lay-away tranaction - I take title to that which I purchased - its a simple contract.
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Post by bubblyandblue on Aug 6, 2011 15:56:03 GMT -5
"worked throughout our history where for the most of it, the federal government stayed out of our business and we propsered mightily."
I cant agree with that statement - just does not equate to the reality. Look - I get that we may be spending too much, however, overlooking the great infrustructure our fathers and their fathers layed down for us put the US ahead. I see that our free-market ideology did nothing but mis-allocate resources in a huge way, inflated bubbles and caused huge economic pain. To think that the economic downturn, our involvement in an unjustified war and speculation in property, derivatives etc. had nothing too do with our current imbalance does not make a logical argument. When you say that are economy got so out of kilter because of public spending is putting the cart before the horse. The Too Big Too Fail Institutions and the Fed (whom made every effort to and, suceeded to take the teeth out of regulation brought us to this point. The TBTF with their bullshit new products brought on the destruction to our real economy and the resultant loss of revenue one gets when so many are tossed out of income producing activity. The spend side, although it could use some trimming IN THE RIGHT AREAS, is not what got us here.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 6, 2011 15:56:13 GMT -5
These programs are paid for like I would pay on lay-away - now you say it is an entitlement program (with a negative connotation) - I am en-titled to what I paid for. Just as I am entitled to take posses ion, upon paying off, that which I purchased in a lay-away transaction - I take title to that which I purchased - its a simple contract.
Just to point out that contract just might change some if the company that your paying goes bankrupt. Now I know what your reply to that would be......I can sue them. Sorry but that doesn't work if the company that you have that contract with goes bankrupt & also makes the laws. Trust me, that's not far fetched. My contract got changed after it was paid in full & it was a very simple matter to cancel the contract & write down new rules. I think that it took 2 votes & a signature.
Oh & SS has already been changed at least twice. One was at what act you could start drawing from it. You can't sue because they are just following the law.....After they change it.
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Post by bubblyandblue on Aug 6, 2011 16:23:09 GMT -5
I am biased - for sure and for reason - I still have my negative opinion about the Tea Party from the many insane ideas that come from them - I won't support a group of lemmings who all feel empowered to lead when that empowerment and leading.. leads to a cliff. I have espoused where the real problem lies and it ain't with capital and labor nor is it with spending on "entitlements". It comes from the foxes who speculate and steal wealth. Steal wealth while not creating wealth. Do you think that by taxing the crap out of harmfull economic practices we could bridge the gap in our revenue system (tax system) spending system. Do you think if we shut down all the loopholes (special privaleges) in our tax system that we could close or revenue/spending gap. Do you suppose that by stopping the scape goating of poor people, working poor people and by stop mislabeling in a simplistic and decietfull manner the SS sytem as an entitlement system (negative conotation) we could become clearer in what we actually spend our dollars on and set our goals more clearly - instead of broad brush indictments. Do you suppose that there is an actual difference in economic actitvity and, that we should differentiate between the two ("productive employment of capital that results in economic growth and prosperity" and "parasitic capital formation that really produces nothing other than concentration of wealth") and when we know the differnce we should Tax the Parasitic into submission and equally alleiviate the tax from the productive side - that should solve the problem. Or - do you prefer a jungle economy (with all the empty bravado that entails) - survival of the fittest - scrap the laws in the name of free-market bull. With the King of England we had taxation without representation - now we have taxation with representation ... we vote. Ought you be more concerned to fight against the special interests who perverted that representation? - The ones who gamed the system but did not participate in the real economy...the parasites. "We, the People, are the rightful masters of both the Congress and the Courts. Not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who have perverted it." - Abraham Lincoln
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Post by bubblyandblue on Aug 6, 2011 16:50:16 GMT -5
Sorry for the rant above but, to continue the analogy. The human species cannot live without our parasites in our body, however, when the different parasites within our body explode unchecked the host will die. We are suffering from a parasitic imbalance and we need to take our medication to controll it. That medication is not a broad spectrum medicine. Its a targeted medication directed at the parisitic infection/imbalance. We have the tech to direct it. I suggest we go after it now. It does not mean targeting ALL the rich for taxes - it means targeting the parasitic rich, the speculators at all levels, the special privalege....we need to rid the bio-accumilation of these parasite.
The poor and those on the dole - the vast majority of your scape-goat biota do not and, have never been, happy in their situation - the exceedingly small sub-population (that you seem to think is every person recieving 'entitlements') that does scam the system - does so for survival in this economic construct - not, as you would have us believe, that they do it out of malice (trite).
So let's hear some real thinking on the topic of spending and revenue. Some real thinking on how we correlate to the real world and continue to be the shinning example in this great experiment in human liberty. Lets hear some real thinking on how we bail our common boat and get this thing floating so all can have equal footing and dignity. Dignity for which you wish to take away from a great number of people for no reason than to excuse yourself from a higher good and a better place for those that come after us.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Aug 6, 2011 16:58:56 GMT -5
We will get real cuts when Gen Y becomes the voting majority and says "screw you, Boomer generation, for using the black card all these years to fund your indulgences. You're not getting paid".
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Post by bubblyandblue on Aug 6, 2011 17:01:39 GMT -5
Civilization is the condition in which one generation pays the last generation’s debts by issuing bonds for the next generation to pay.
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formerexpat
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Post by formerexpat on Aug 6, 2011 17:03:04 GMT -5
Then you should love the Tea party. You've explained the federal government to a T right here; that's exactly what the Tea Party wants to cut!
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cme1201
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Post by cme1201 on Aug 6, 2011 17:07:24 GMT -5
We will get real cuts when Gen Y becomes the voting majority and says "screw you, Boomer generation, for using the black card all these years to fund your indulgences. You're not getting paid". My Generation, first most need to pull their heads out of their asses and actually get involved, with much of the permissiveness of those parents who were wanting to be friends not parents have helped create an entitled mentality of this group just as much as ones that have come before.
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handyman2
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Post by handyman2 on Aug 6, 2011 17:30:48 GMT -5
BubblyBlue: Not to burst your or anyone elses bubble but with or without the Tea Party the situation we are in today would have still materialized. This has been a long time building, long before the tea party.
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billisonboard
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Post by billisonboard on Aug 6, 2011 18:00:36 GMT -5
BubblyBlue: Not to burst your or anyone elses bubble but with or without the Tea Party the situation we are in today would have still materialized. This has been a long time building, long before the tea party. Multiple choice test. The world was perfect until A) January 20th, 2009 B) January 20th, 2001 C) January 20th, 1993 D) January 20th, 1989 E) January 20th, 1981 F) January 20th, 1977 G) August 9th, 1974 H) January 20th, 1969 I) November 22nd, 1963 J) January 20th, 1961 K) January 20th, 1953 L) April 12th, 1945 M) March 4th 1933 N) March 4th 1929 O) August 2nd, 1923 P) March 4th, 1921 Q) August 18th, 1920. R) December 23, 1913 S) March 4th, 1913 T) February 3, 1913.
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Post by BeenThere...DoneThat... on Aug 6, 2011 18:21:08 GMT -5
...we need an animated emoticon of big'ole shrubbery shears... ;D
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Aug 6, 2011 19:24:22 GMT -5
"without the rich and the jobs they provide" I disagree.... most jobs created are in small businesses.... and most small business owners are not rich any measure of the definition... it's not the rich or super rich who create jobs... it's small business...once we get off that band wagon rally cry of the extreme right maybe then we can focus and get back to the middle www.sba.gov/advocacy/7495/8420"How important are small businesses to the U.S. economy? Small firms: •Represent 99.7 percent of all employer firms. •Employ just over half of all private sector employees. •Pay 44 percent of total U.S. private payroll. •Have generated 64 percent of net new jobs over the past 15 years. •Create more than half of the nonfarm private gross domestic product (GDP). •Hire 40 percent of high tech workers (such as scientists, engineers, and computer programmers). •Are 52 percent home-based and 2 percent franchises. •Made up 97.3 percent of all identified exporters and produced 30.2 percent of the known export value in FY 2007. •Produce 13 times more patents per employee than large patenting firms; these patents are twice as likely as large firm patents to be among the one percent most cited." "S&P made it clear the focus had to be on SPENDING" S&P really said the focus should be on spending and revenues... the problem cannot be solved by side of the P&L.... as a small business owner, I focus on keeping my costs as low as possible, but there comes a point when if you cut too much you end up cutting off your nose to spite your face.... sometimes "prices" have to go up.... and prices for the government are user fees and taxes.... Once we get off that bandwagon? Really? Are you out of your freakin' mind? Did you miss the entire TEA Party platform? Did you miss the outrage over TARP, bailouts, and stimulus? Did you miss Joe the Plumber? Did you miss the fact that the conservatives have been pointing out for going on 5 years now that $250K a year isn't "rich" it's SMALL BUSINESS? Hell, it's the "far right" that has been on the side of SMALL BUSINESS throughout this whole economic mess. As a small business owner- if that's even true- you know that YOU are "rich" and YOU are in the crosshairs. $250K is a joke- that's just getting started. And the far LEFT has been painting that-- has been painting YOU as "rich". It ain't the "rich" they're talking about genius-- it's YOU.
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AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP
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Post by AgeOfEnlightenmentSCP on Aug 6, 2011 19:26:43 GMT -5
I am biased - for sure and for reason - I still have my negative opinion about the Tea Party from the many insane ideas that come from them - I won't support a group of lemmings who all feel empowered to lead when that empowerment and leading.. leads to a cliff. I have espoused where the real problem lies and it ain't with capital and labor nor is it with spending on "entitlements". It comes from the foxes who speculate and steal wealth. Steal wealth while not creating wealth. Do you think that by taxing the crap out of harmfull economic practices we could bridge the gap in our revenue system (tax system) spending system. Do you think if we shut down all the loopholes (special privaleges) in our tax system that we could close or revenue/spending gap. Do you suppose that by stopping the scape goating of poor people, working poor people and by stop mislabeling in a simplistic and decietfull manner the SS sytem as an entitlement system (negative conotation) we could become clearer in what we actually spend our dollars on and set our goals more clearly - instead of broad brush indictments. Do you suppose that there is an actual difference in economic actitvity and, that we should differentiate between the two ("productive employment of capital that results in economic growth and prosperity" and "parasitic capital formation that really produces nothing other than concentration of wealth") and when we know the differnce we should Tax the Parasitic into submission and equally alleiviate the tax from the productive side - that should solve the problem. Or - do you prefer a jungle economy (with all the empty bravado that entails) - survival of the fittest - scrap the laws in the name of free-market bull. With the King of England we had taxation without representation - now we have taxation with representation ... we vote. Ought you be more concerned to fight against the special interests who perverted that representation? - The ones who gamed the system but did not participate in the real economy...the parasites. "We, the People, are the rightful masters of both the Congress and the Courts. Not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who have perverted it." - Abraham Lincoln Give me and example of an "insane" idea. And in the interest of "fair warning" and fairness in general-- just be prepared to defend the alternative. For example, if your idea of an "insane idea" is to scrap the tax code-- be prepared to explain how 10,000 + pages of tax code is sane. Got it? Go!
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dancinmama
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Post by dancinmama on Aug 6, 2011 20:34:29 GMT -5
"without the rich and the jobs they provide" I disagree.... most jobs created are in small businesses.... and most small business owners are not rich any measure of the definition... it's not the rich or super rich who create jobs... it's small business...once we get off that band wagon rally cry of the extreme right maybe then we can focus and get back to the middle www.sba.gov/advocacy/7495/8420"How important are small businesses to the U.S. economy? Small firms: •Represent 99.7 percent of all employer firms. •Employ just over half of all private sector employees. •Pay 44 percent of total U.S. private payroll. •Have generated 64 percent of net new jobs over the past 15 years. •Create more than half of the nonfarm private gross domestic product (GDP). •Hire 40 percent of high tech workers (such as scientists, engineers, and computer programmers). •Are 52 percent home-based and 2 percent franchises. •Made up 97.3 percent of all identified exporters and produced 30.2 percent of the known export value in FY 2007. •Produce 13 times more patents per employee than large patenting firms; these patents are twice as likely as large firm patents to be among the one percent most cited." "S&P made it clear the focus had to be on SPENDING" S&P really said the focus should be on spending and revenues... the problem cannot be solved by side of the P&L.... as a small business owner, I focus on keeping my costs as low as possible, but there comes a point when if you cut too much you end up cutting off your nose to spite your face.... sometimes "prices" have to go up.... and prices for the government are user fees and taxes.... Once we get off that bandwagon? Really? Are you out of your freakin' mind? Did you miss the entire TEA Party platform? Did you miss the outrage over TARP, bailouts, and stimulus? Did you miss Joe the Plumber? Did you miss the fact that the conservatives have been pointing out for going on 5 years now that $250K a year isn't "rich" it's SMALL BUSINESS? Hell, it's the "far right" that has been on the side of SMALL BUSINESS throughout this whole economic mess. As a small business owner- if that's even true- you know that YOU are "rich" and YOU are in the crosshairs. $250K is a joke- that's just getting started. And the far LEFT has been painting that-- has been painting YOU as "rich". It ain't the "rich" they're talking about genius-- it's YOU. Not only that, but once Obama convinces the masses that taxing "the rich" is the only answer and that doesn't provide ENOUGH revenue (which it won't), who do ya think they (progressives) are going to look to next for more tax revenue to fund big government? Yep, the not-so-rich middle class!! They will never get enough. Until we cut up Washington's credit card, they will continue borrowing and spending.
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2kids10horses
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Post by 2kids10horses on Aug 7, 2011 0:10:37 GMT -5
bubblyandblue:
One question... is a Retailer a "Speculator"? He buys at wholesale (lower prices) and sells at retail (higher prices).
Is that "speculation"? He adds no value to the products. Other than to make the products more convenient for the consumers.
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shelby
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Post by shelby on Aug 7, 2011 1:30:30 GMT -5
"One question... is a Retailer a "Speculator"? He buys at wholesale (lower prices) and sells at retail (higher prices).
Is that "speculation"? He adds no value to the products. Other than to make the products more convenient for the consumers"
I am pretty sure retailers employ people last I checked quite a few in fact.
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mwcpa
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Post by mwcpa on Aug 7, 2011 6:59:32 GMT -5
"Once we get off that bandwagon? Really? Are you out of your freakin' mind? "
by the opinion of you and the extreme right, yes..... and I feel the same about 90% of your extremist opinions, positions and posts.....
"Did you miss Joe the Plumber?"
and it turns out his story was not totally real, even Fox News found issue with his original story.... he got his 15 minutes, which is all he wanted....just google search him... he did nothing to open a reasonable debate, he, in my opinion, just fueled the fire of extremists.
"Did you miss the outrage over TARP, bailouts, and stimulus"
As a small business owner I was outraged by these programs.... they did nothing to help those who really needed help and the outrage came from all, except those few who benefited, not just the extreme right (some of them benefited) as you suggest.... the banks did not lend as was supposed to be the deal.... this was started by the last administration and expanded in this one, helped those who created the mess (with excessive speculation and creation of exotic securities that were not supported by assets, it was just paper)... a mess that was allowed to happen with the repeal of Glass-Steagall (I remember the days when a bank was a bank, not a peddler of investments, insurance, financial planning, etc., etc.), lack of enforcement of existing regulation in the early 2000s (how many complaints were filed related to Mr. Madoff's scheme), dismantling of the regulators..... in my opinion all of the stimulus provided did nothing but help allow big business to strengthen their balance sheets... while those in the middle and lower struggle....
"Hell, it's the "far right" that has been on the side of SMALL BUSINESS throughout this whole economic mess."
Examples with links please, I know of none that they propose that really will help small business.... the extreme right and the extreme left pander to the middle and answer to the big wigs who fund them....
the extreme right got their "lower" stated tax rates in 2001 and 2003... in my opinion that lead to state and local government to increase the hidden taxes that impact the lower income earners more than the higher ones.... the 2001 and 2003 tax breaks just shifted the burden around by causing increases to "fees" and other hidden taxes..... (again, in my opinion)... and for those who live in a HCOL area, the AMT did away with most (my AMT penalty, due to the high state and local income and real estate taxes I pay, has been 5-6K per year since the tax rate reductions), if not all of the 2001 and 2003 tax rate cuts....
"far LEFT"
As I noted in my post that you tried to rip apart.... "maybe then we can focus and get back to the middle".... some of the far lefts ideas are as ridiculous as the far right....in a true extremist way cut and paste the paste out of context to prop up your point of view...
As my post and replies to it clearly shows.... the extremist (left and right, not just left as you suggest here and in every post you make, in my opinion both extremes are the root of the problem.. 20% extreme left, 20% extreme right... 60% in the middle suffer with their rhetoric and lack of action) points of view are the problem.... we need to compromise them to the middle.... but with both sides entrenched it seems we are on the battle fields of world war I.... when does the mustard gas start getting lobbed back and forth....the extremists and their lack of real compromise and real debate (debate should be civil, not the speaker of the house bad mouthing the President on TV, or the President blaming the other party on tv.... ) are what sealed the deal on the AA+ rating we just got from the S&P.... the uncertainty we face is because both sides forgot about compromise... we will never agree 100%... and we can never have 100% victory for one side without concessions for the other....
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2kids10horses
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Post by 2kids10horses on Aug 7, 2011 8:02:08 GMT -5
Ok, Shelby,
A question for you...
Let's say I am a speculator. I buy gold today, but I don't do anything with it (like making jewlry), I just hold it in coins and bars, and hope the price goes up. To sell it later at a higher price.
But, I have to hire a bookeeper to keep track of my holdings. I hire a security guy to guard the stuff.
Now, I've employed labor.
I guess I'm no longer a "Speculator"! Am I right?
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ugonow
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Post by ugonow on Aug 7, 2011 8:32:54 GMT -5
JMO, but I think the latest buzzwords soaking the rich is a bit misleading.I really don't think cutting the carried interest loophole that allows hedgefund managers to pay taxes on their wages for running the fund at a lower rate than the rate for the average worker is soaking the rich. Either let us everyone pay at the long term capital gains rate or noone.I really don't think cutting, means testing or limiting some subsidises is "soaking the rich" either. But the phrase does have a nice ring to it, kinda like "pleading for their lives in front of death panels". Was there a proposal to tax the rich at 95 percent that I did not hear about in the debt talks?
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ugonow
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Post by ugonow on Aug 7, 2011 8:40:04 GMT -5
You must have been sleeping through it. Just as recently as a couple of months ago the right took big banks side against small business in the swipe fees battle.
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2kids10horses
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Post by 2kids10horses on Aug 7, 2011 9:10:02 GMT -5
I can understand about hedge fund managers needing to pay taxes on their income. (If they have personal INVESTMENTS in the fund, when they sell those shares, they become capital gains.) But, I agree, if it's a salary or equivalent, it should be subject to regular income tax like any other executive.
But, how many hedge fund managers are there? How much money are we talking about that the Government is losing in taxes?
But, you know, you can make an argument about the "fairness" of almost any way of making money. Is it fair to be the "author" of a book (autobiography) and make tons of money on it when there is a ghostwriter doing the work, and putting your name on it so it wil sell?
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ameiko
Familiar Member
Joined: Jan 16, 2011 10:48:22 GMT -5
Posts: 812
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Post by ameiko on Aug 7, 2011 9:19:52 GMT -5
"Yes, they pay "taxes" directly or indirectly, but many of them still pay no INCOME TAXES, yet receive all the benefits that those taxes provide. " The reason they pay no income taxes is because businesses are not withholding them - The businesses are taking advatage of illegal acts of not withholden taxes to undercut their competitors - Don't you think this should be addresses under our current laws - don't you think the USA should go after the true criminal acts. . Where the hell are you getting THAT nonsense from? Not to mention the fact that if the IRS knew that businesses were not with holding and then paying the government those taxes, do you REALLY think that the IRS would just twiddle its thumbs and NOT go after them? REALLY? Wow, dumbest comment I've seen here in at least the last week. Anyway, people aren't paying federal income taxes because legally they are not taxed at those income levels, especially with the various deductions. Indeed, many get the EIC where they actuallt get money from the government.
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